Do you hear what I hear (bit perfect files sounding different)?

[manueljenkin]

Looks like my external hard drive has failed. It makes some buzzing noise after getting connected but the light doesn't turn on. The windows environment detects the name of the hard drive unit but doesn't show up in either my computer or partition manager.

 

Any idea if there's an easy way to access and recover the files. Many of the codes and results relating to the above were stored in it (thankfully I got some of my code preserved in my local drive, so even if I couldn't recover it'll just be the re run that will be pending).

[One and a half]

13 minutes ago, manueljenkin said:

Looks like my external hard drive has failed. It makes some buzzing noise after getting connected but the light doesn't turn on. The windows environment detects the name of the hard drive unit but doesn't show up in either my computer or partition manager.

 

Any idea if there's an easy way to access and recover the files. Many of the codes and results relating to the above were stored in it (thankfully I got some of my code preserved in my local drive, so even if I couldn't recover it'll just be the re run that will be pending).

The hard drive might still be OK and the controller connected to the USB maybe faulty or the USB in your computer is faulty.

Easiest, to change to another USB port or another computer.

Suggest to prize out the hard drive which is probably a 2.5in SATA unit from the case and install it into another USB HDD adapter and try for the data again.

If windows can't read that, then there's expensive data recovery services to consider.

[manueljenkin]

29 minutes ago, One and a half said:

The hard drive might still be OK and the controller connected to the USB maybe faulty or the USB in your computer is faulty.

Easiest, to change to another USB port or another computer.

Suggest to prize out the hard drive which is probably a 2.5in SATA unit from the case and install it into another USB HDD adapter and try for the data again.

If windows can't read that, then there's expensive data recovery services to consider.

Thank you. I tried most of the trivial choices, and tried with another PC too. All my other drives work fine in both this and the other PC. I found a decent resource on this topic : https://www.flashbackdata.com/hard-drive-clicking/ . I need to think about recovery services but I don't think I have enough funds for that. Maybe just would have to code a few things again from scratch.

 

Funny that a hard drive is unhappy about assessment of another hard drive!! It shows up on my PC but when I press the eject option most of the time it throws up an error, and in very rare occasions safely ejects the drive. In the device manager, it shows that the driver and device is working properly but I am unable to access any of the storage properties.

[fas42]

I have this box of tricks, https://vantecusa.com/products_detail.php?p_id=52 ... has saved my bacon on a number of occasions; very handy to have on hand, 🙂.

[One and a half]

1 hour ago, manueljenkin said:

Thank you. I tried most of the trivial choices, and tried with another PC too. All my other drives work fine in both this and the other PC. I found a decent resource on this topic : https://www.flashbackdata.com/hard-drive-clicking/ . I need to think about recovery services but I don't think I have enough funds for that. Maybe just would have to code a few things again from scratch.

 

Funny that a hard drive is unhappy about assessment of another hard drive!! It shows up on my PC but when I press the eject option most of the time it throws up an error, and in very rare occasions safely ejects the drive. In the device manager, it shows that the driver and device is working properly but I am unable to access any of the storage properties.

Good luck with all that, when you depend on technology the greatest, the more it lets you down 😒

 

For music backups, the drives are turned on and off as needed. After the backup, all power is removed. There's two drives, both portable and are backed up at the same time there's a new album in the library. Tedious sometimes, but I just don't trust portable drives to be on 24/7. The heat buildup eventually ruins them.

[idiot_savant]

This is, indeed, unfortunate. But if you were to recover the data, would it still be optimised?

 

 

 

 

your friendly neighbourhood idiot 

[manueljenkin]

1 hour ago, idiot_savant said:

This is, indeed, unfortunate. But if you were to recover the data, would it still be optimised?

 

 

 

 

your friendly neighbourhood idiot 

Unfortunately no, as the player at present doesn't support optimization for external usb drives.

[manisandher]

On 6/16/2021 at 7:33 AM, idiot_savant said:

... I can see no plausible reason to think this will do anything apart from reduce the life of the disk with the page file on it...

 

8 hours ago, manueljenkin said:

Looks like my external hard drive has failed...

 

Any connection?

 

Mani

[manueljenkin]

1 hour ago, manisandher said:

 

 

Any connection?

 

Mani

No. This is my external drive. It has nothing to do with the internal drive wearing process. This happens due to a variety of reasons and can be random.

[OldHardwareTech]

7 hours ago, manueljenkin said:

Unfortunately no, as the player at present doesn't support optimization for external usb drives.

Edit: Quoted wrong post but I'm sure y'all will get it.

 

Exactly, I've seen drives last 2 weeks and I've got a 1TB drive in my server that's been thru 3 systems in 10 years and it's still going strong. This is THE reason you keep backups of important stuff, you never know when somethings going to fail.  I have my music collection in 3 places, 1 in my server, 1 on a 128 GB thumb drive and another on a 128 GB thumb drive at my daughters house 2500 miles away. A bit off subject I know but I've been preaching about backups for 40 years.  Some people still don't get it and some actually get mad when I can't wave a magic wand over their drive and restore their data. 

[idiot_savant]

8 hours ago, manueljenkin said:

10 hours ago, idiot_savant said:

 

Unfortunately no, as the player at present doesn't support optimization for external usb drives

Why not?

 

as for wear, the “scintillate” process doesn’t write a huge amount of data

 

 

 

your friendly neighbourhood idiot 

[manueljenkin]

7 hours ago, OldHardwareTech said:

Edit: Quoted wrong post but I'm sure y'all will get it.

 

Exactly, I've seen drives last 2 weeks and I've got a 1TB drive in my server that's been thru 3 systems in 10 years and it's still going strong. This is THE reason you keep backups of important stuff, you never know when somethings going to fail.  I have my music collection in 3 places, 1 in my server, 1 on a 128 GB thumb drive and another on a 128 GB thumb drive at my daughters house 2500 miles away. A bit off subject I know but I've been preaching about backups for 40 years.  Some people still don't get it and some actually get mad when I can't wave a magic wand over their drive and restore their data. 

I do maintain a backup of my most important files. This was a temporary work, so I was waiting to finish it off before backing up and it went off 😅.

[manueljenkin]

59 minutes ago, manueljenkin said:

I do maintain a backup of my most important files. This was a temporary work, so I was waiting to finish it off before backing up and it went off 😅.

Thankfully this wasn't among my most critical stuff.

[OldHardwareTech]

 

9 hours ago, manueljenkin said:

I do maintain a backup of my most important files. This was a temporary work, so I was waiting to finish it off before backing up and it went off 😅.

 

I wasn't insinuating that you didn't, and I apologize if you took it that way. I tend to "get up on my soapbox" when it comes to backups, and it doesn't help that I have a friend who's drive died this week who got quiet upset with me when I couldn't magically restore his data.  He said "I see them do it all the time on TV, you just take the drive apart and read it manually".  I don't think he really understood just how dense the data on a hard drive platter is even though I tried to explain how unlikely he was to get even part of his data back with a drive head on a popsicle stick. He'll get over it, I have a shrimp boil planned for next Saturday. lol.

[manueljenkin]

Don't worry, I didn't take it the wrong way. Its kinda scary that the recovery price is like atleast 5x the price of a hard drive. Better buy 3-4 hard drives for that case.

[EdmontonCanuck]

On 6/18/2021 at 2:05 AM, manueljenkin said:

Unfortunately no, as the player at present doesn't support optimization for external usb drives.

 

On 6/18/2021 at 10:41 AM, idiot_savant said:

Why not?

 

 

Why not indeed. This is a good question. If it operates on the file, then it shouldn't matter what local media it's stored on. If it optimizes the "system" for file access, then why run the optimizer on individual files? Also, why would running the optimizer several times on a single file supposedly improve *that* file only? And perhaps I missed it mentioned somewhere, but what if the file is moved to another location post optimization? Is the optimizer required to be re-run?

[Archimago]

35 minutes ago, EdmontonCanuck said:

 

 

Why not indeed. This is a good question. If it operates on the file, then it shouldn't matter what local media it's stored on. If it optimizes the "system" for file access, then why run the optimizer on individual files? Also, why would running the optimizer several times on a single file supposedly improve *that* file only? And perhaps I missed it mentioned somewhere, but what if the file is moved to another location post optimization? Is the optimizer required to be re-run?

 

If hard drive sector location is important, imagine taking the time to optimize hundreds or even thousands of songs on one's hard drive and then someone goes and defragments the drive!

 

Suddenly some music will become de-optimized and one would never know which ones! 😭

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

Manuel has left the building (voluntarily) and is no longer moderator of this thread. 

[kumakuma]

5 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

Manuel has left the building (voluntarily) and is no longer moderator of this thread. 

 

I hate to speak ill of the departed but I have to say that I found his "dog ate my homework" story hard to believe.

[Allan F]

3 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

I hate to speak ill of the departed but I have to say that I found his "dog ate my homework" story hard to believe.

 

Well, Labs are known to chew on just about anything. 🙂

[EdmontonCanuck]

Glad to see at least one of my deleted posts has been restored. Thanks Chris 🙂.

 

I guess we won't be hearing the results of the OP's "research" now, but at least we can now continue to debate the claims of the software (in a respectful but critical manner, of course).

 

[OldHardwareTech]

I haven't said much but I've been following along and was looking forward to the results of OP's testing.  Coincidentally I saw a saying on a shirt yesterday that seems to apply. lol.

 

"There are two kinds of people in this world:

 

1. Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data"

[Archimago]

Thanks Chris for opening this back up. And more importantly "undeleting" comments.

 

I think it's important to maintain the ability to freely discuss on forums without fear of censorship especially if all participants are simply interested in discussing, addressing, and exploring to find truths.

 

Obviously, audiophilia is but a small microcosm of what's out there... But hey, if we can just clean up misunderstandings in this hobby, we will have at least done a small bit of service in this screwed up world. 😉

 

Admittedly, I was curious to see what @manueljenkin was looking into; not just the results, but more importantly, the method.

[March Audio]

22 hours ago, Archimago said:

Thanks Chris for opening this back up. And more importantly "undeleting" comments.

 

I think it's important to maintain the ability to freely discuss on forums without fear of censorship especially if all participants are simply interested in discussing, addressing, and exploring to find truths.

 

Obviously, audiophilia is but a small microcosm of what's out there... But hey, if we can just clean up misunderstandings in this hobby, we will have at least done a small bit of service in this screwed up world. 😉

 

Admittedly, I was curious to see what @manueljenkin was looking into; not just the results, but more importantly, the method.

It's good it's been opened up again, but I suspect there will be very little, if anything, further to say.

 

Can anyone come up with a cogent explanation as to why the software might improve sound quality after reading @idiot_savant description of what it actually does?

[Archimago]

1 hour ago, March Audio said:

It's good it's been opened up again, but I suspect there will be very little, if anything, further to say.

 

Can anyone come up with a cogent explanation as to why the software might improve sound quality after reading @idiot_savant description of what it actually does?

 

I agree @March Audio, there will likely be little to say because... it's bitperfect and lossless 👍.

 

Opening this up for final comments I think is more for closure than anything else. That here in mid-2021, a bunch of audio people talked about this, thought about this, and ultimately (likely) there was nothing more to say or do because it is what it is. And software that claims to achieve something technologically "magical" with no cogent explanation has (likely) been rejected unless those who claim that this makes sense step up and explain.