The Computer Audiophile Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 View full article HalSF 1 Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
Ran Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 Hopefully Apple will provide an open API so application developers can integrate this service. lucretius 1 Link to comment
The Computer Audiophile Posted May 17, 2021 Author Share Posted May 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Ran said: Hopefully Apple will provide an open API so application developers can integrate this service. Agree, this would be nice. Another option is always a good thing and more competition is better for us. Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
Popular Post firedog Posted May 17, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2021 Happy to note: no MQA. Puts a pretty big hole in their argument that MQA is necessary for hi-res streaming. Also emphasizes that MQA has yet to really break through in the market. Maybe some manufacturers will now wake up to the fact that they don't have to kowtow to MQA. Users have more and more choices for streaming hi-res and lossless that don't include MQA. katools, The Computer Audiophile, Confused and 4 others 7 Main listening (small home office): Main setup: Surge protector +>Isol-8 Mini sub Axis Power Strip/Isolation>QuietPC Low Noise Server>Roon (Audiolense DRC)>Stack Audio Link II>Kii Control>Kii Three (on their own electric circuit) >GIK Room Treatments. Secondary Path: Server with Audiolense RC>RPi4 or analog>Cayin iDAC6 MKII (tube mode) (XLR)>Kii Three . Bedroom: SBTouch to Cambridge Soundworks Desktop Setup. Living Room/Kitchen: Ropieee (RPi3b+ with touchscreen) + Schiit Modi3E to a pair of Morel Hogtalare. All absolute statements about audio are false Link to comment
Popular Post The Computer Audiophile Posted May 17, 2021 Author Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2021 Reading through Apple release again, I'm reminded of what I dislike most from Apple, it's lack of details and transparency with respect to technical items. The talk of Dolby Atmos is cool and I love what it can do, but it may be like pulling teeth to get Apple to talk about how to play this audio on non-Apple hardware. We see statements such as, "By default, Apple Music will automatically play Dolby Atmos tracks on all AirPods and Beats headphones with an H1 or W1 chip, as well as the built-in speakers in the latest versions of iPhone, iPad, and Mac." I certainly agree that this press release isn't the place for technical details, but I just have this feeling it won't be simple to figure out all the details when the time comes. I guess that's job security for guys like me :~) Confused and Mark Dirac 2 Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
Marco Klobas Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 Agree, Apple is usually tight lipped with press releases or even keynotes. Consequently a flood of speculations and questions arise around the web. With this Apple Music update (very welcome upgrade, BTW) I see already questions about AirPods/HomePod/AppleTV compatibility, Bluetooth, AirPlay 2 etc. Link to comment
new_media Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 So I'll be the old guy and ask whether iTunes downloads will be available in lossless or hi-res. That's the best way to know exactly what is getting fed to my DAC. Link to comment
ecwl Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 I have to admit I don't totally get the rationale for Apple Music to go lossless. Most of their devices playback music wirelessly via lossy AAC anyway. That said, when I listen to an AAC/mp3 track off a wireless AAC headphones, it sounds worse than a lossless ALAC file going to a wireless AAC headphones. I'm just not sure how many people would notice or even truly use the full lossless stream. I do Airplay lossless files to HomePods but is that something most people would notice? Not sure. But as our great leader @The Computer Audiophile likes to say, "I like options". In Canada, Tidal is my only option with Roon and it has been driving me nuts with all the MQA tracks. So if Apple Music has Roon integration, maybe I'll switch to Apple Music? Or maybe I'll switch to Hang Loose Convolver from Accurate sound for playback with Apple Music? Not sure yet. lucretius 1 Link to comment
MikeyFresh Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 23 minutes ago, new_media said: So I'll be the old guy and ask whether iTunes downloads will be available in lossless or hi-res. That's the best way to know exactly what is getting fed to my DAC. A previous report had suggested that lossless and hi-res lossless would indeed also be available for download too, however I didn't see any mention of that in the official release. Boycott HDtracks Boycott Lenbrook Boycott Warner Music Group Link to comment
Marco Klobas Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 A tweet by Chris Welch (The Verge) informs that lossless audio will be exclusive to Apple Music. Not for purchases or iTunes Match. MikeyFresh 1 Link to comment
Confused Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 1 hour ago, The Computer Audiophile said: Reading through Apple release again, I'm reminded of what I dislike most from Apple, it's lack of details and transparency with respect to technical items. The talk of Dolby Atmos is cool and I love what it can do, but it may be like pulling teeth to get Apple to talk about how to play this audio on non-Apple hardware. Like this I guess: How can I listen to Dolby Atmos music? .....or by connecting your Apple TV 4K to a compatible TV or audiovisual receiver. (So Apple TV via HDMI only I think) Windows 11 PC, Roon, HQPlayer, Focus Fidelity convolutions, iFi Zen Stream, Paul Hynes SR4, Mutec REF10, Mutec MC3+USB, Devialet 1000Pro, KEF Blade. Plus Pro-Ject Signature 12 TT for playing my 'legacy' vinyl collection. Desktop system; RME ADI-2 DAC fs, Meze Empyrean headphones. Link to comment
BrownMagic Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 This is great news! And it must sending some shivers to the competition. What I an eager is to know how do we stream in high res to our dac? Airplay 2 is not the answer since it not lossless and it goes through the device hence draining battery. So is Airplat 3 in the works? Are we getting an Apple Connect? HalSF 1 Link to comment
The Computer Audiophile Posted May 17, 2021 Author Share Posted May 17, 2021 17 minutes ago, Confused said: Like this I guess: How can I listen to Dolby Atmos music? .....or by connecting your Apple TV 4K to a compatible TV or audiovisual receiver. (So Apple TV via HDMI only I think) Yes, with Apple hardware. I'm thinking about other ways and the nuances that are bound to appear. For example, finding an official Apple statement about which audio is supported over AirPlay is like pulling teeth. Sure, it can be done usually, but it isn't easy. Confused 1 Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
Account Closed Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 Idea. If someone here has a Mac Mini M1 and an Apple Music account, please try using the Black Hole program to connect Apple Music and HQPlayer together on the Mini M1 and see if it works. This would be one way to to do it. Link to comment
R1200CL Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 27 minutes ago, BrownMagic said: What I an eager is to know how do we stream in high res to our dac? Use CCK with an iDevice ?😀 Link to comment
The Computer Audiophile Posted May 17, 2021 Author Share Posted May 17, 2021 30 minutes ago, BrownMagic said: This is great news! And it must sending some shivers to the competition. What I an eager is to know how do we stream in high res to our dac? Airplay 2 is not the answer since it not lossless and it goes through the device hence draining battery. So is Airplat 3 in the works? Are we getting an Apple Connect? This will be a journey. Without integration into products from Roon, Aurender, Lumin, Audirvana, etc... it will be really tough. Apple Music won't change the sample rate automatically, so we are back to the Audio Midi issues of 2007. Sonos may eventually get lossless or 48 kHz from Apple Music, but that's not incredibly exciting. Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
katools Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 Great news all round, except for Tidal, Qobuz, Roon & mqa 🤣 Link to comment
firedog Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 The Amazon announcement means that Tidal is clearly an inferior offering. More trouble for MQA/Tidal. MikeyFresh 1 Main listening (small home office): Main setup: Surge protector +>Isol-8 Mini sub Axis Power Strip/Isolation>QuietPC Low Noise Server>Roon (Audiolense DRC)>Stack Audio Link II>Kii Control>Kii Three (on their own electric circuit) >GIK Room Treatments. Secondary Path: Server with Audiolense RC>RPi4 or analog>Cayin iDAC6 MKII (tube mode) (XLR)>Kii Three . Bedroom: SBTouch to Cambridge Soundworks Desktop Setup. Living Room/Kitchen: Ropieee (RPi3b+ with touchscreen) + Schiit Modi3E to a pair of Morel Hogtalare. All absolute statements about audio are false Link to comment
Marco Klobas Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 Quite a few things to understand how hi-res will be handled. Will Airplay 2 be updated to support up to 192 kHz? Technically it's feasible (it's a WiFi/Ethernet protocol after all – bandwidth isn't a problem). Is to be seen if Apple is interested... Actually, even AirPlay 1 cloud be pushed to 192 kHz if only Apple would be interested. Who knows, maybe at the upcoming WWDC there will be some news for AirPlay. Many streamers implement AirPlay through Shairport-Sync, which is an AirPlay 1 only reverse engineering project. No AirPlay 2 on the horizon. The Mac-DAC link (via USB or whatever) and its sampling rate managed by Audio MIDI Setup, as @The Computer Audiophile pointed out, is another issue. Let's wait a few weeks and hope that Apple Music Hi-Res Lossless will somehow fit for audiophiles. Link to comment
Popular Post Josh Mound Posted May 17, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2021 Very happy to see no MQA. Hopefully this deals a death blow to it as a format. As of now, though, I don't see Apple as likely to overtake Qobuz in quality. (See Amazon HD.) Unless Apple 1) demonstrates that they're actually streaming lossless hires, 2) creates a quality standalone app, and 3) allows developers to integrate the service into audiophiles players like Audirvana, it's not going to be an option for serious audiophiles. It's hard to say whether that matters at all to Apple, though. This is, however, a belated victory for Neil Young, who tried to convince Steve Jobs to go the lossless hires route pre-Pono. Rosewind, HalSF, The Computer Audiophile and 2 others 4 1 🔊 The Best Version Of... 🎧 Link to comment
firedog Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 20 minutes ago, JoshM said: Very happy to see no MQA. Hopefully this deals a death blow to it as a format. As of now, though, I don't see Apple as likely to overtake Qobuz in quality. (See Amazon HD.) Unless Apple 1) demonstrates that they're actually streaming lossless hires, 2) creates a quality standalone app, and 3) allows developers to integrate the service into audiophiles players like Audirvana, it's not going to be an option for serious audiophiles. It's hard to say whether that matters at all to Apple, though. This is, however, a belated victory for Neil Young, who tried to convince Steve Jobs to go the lossless hires route pre-Pono. The hard core audiophiles will stay with services like Qobuz, Deezer, or Primephonic, who all offer quality hi-res or lossless streaming. For more "average" people who just want quality sound, the Amazon and Apple offerings (and upcoming Spotify) will be all they need. I don't think Tidal is going to be attractive to them at all, the way it is currently structured. Of course, the tiny number of MQA fanboys will stay there. But they are a drop in the bucket and insignificant. Main listening (small home office): Main setup: Surge protector +>Isol-8 Mini sub Axis Power Strip/Isolation>QuietPC Low Noise Server>Roon (Audiolense DRC)>Stack Audio Link II>Kii Control>Kii Three (on their own electric circuit) >GIK Room Treatments. Secondary Path: Server with Audiolense RC>RPi4 or analog>Cayin iDAC6 MKII (tube mode) (XLR)>Kii Three . Bedroom: SBTouch to Cambridge Soundworks Desktop Setup. Living Room/Kitchen: Ropieee (RPi3b+ with touchscreen) + Schiit Modi3E to a pair of Morel Hogtalare. All absolute statements about audio are false Link to comment
Popular Post ChipotleCoyote Posted May 17, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2021 1 hour ago, The Computer Audiophile said: Apple Music won't change the sample rate automatically, so we are back to the Audio Midi issues of 2007. I think it's a little early to be sure of that -- Apple Music won't change the sample rate automatically in its current incarnation, but it hasn't had any pressing reason to from Apple's POV yet. The press release you quoted specifically calls out (albeit in a footnote) the need for an external DAC to get 24/192 playback, though, so Apple is at least now admitting bit rates are a thing. I wouldn't be surprised to see an iTunes Music.app update that gives it the ability to switch bit rates automatically when streaming, although I also wouldn't be surprised if that update leaves people with local high bit rate tracks in the lurch. 1 hour ago, The Computer Audiophile said: Without integration into products from Roon, Aurender, Lumin, Audirvana, etc... it will be really tough. That'll be the big trick I'm curious about. Apple obviously already has an Apple Music API used by Sonos, Amazon Alexa, and their web player, and the proliferation of Apple TV+ clients suggests they've become much more open to the idea of "the more places our streaming services are the better." (I also noticed KEF's LS50 Wireless II page now lists the Apple Music in addition to the AirPlay 2 logo, making me wonder if they have, or plan to, integrate it directly.) But IIRC, Roon has observed in the past that for services the size of Spotify and AM, their entire user base is virtually a rounding error, so I'm not optimistic. (Apple also doesn't have a real great reputation for catering to developers.) I'm already both a Tidal and Apple Music subscriber—Tidal because I wanted lossless in some circumstances, using Roon and now Audirvana and Tidal Connect, and AM because there are other circumstances I'm not really that concerned about the drop to AAC 256kbps (in the car, background music, etc.) and because I find AM's radio stations and playlists, particularly the human-curated ones, to be way better than Tidal's. The chances are I won't give up Tidal and go AM-only, but I'm definitely curious to see where it goes. (I do have an Apple TV, and I suspect its next update will provide support for this service…which means I'll technically have hi-res Apple Music streaming everywhere I'd want to listen to it.) spin33 and The Computer Audiophile 2 Life was so much cheaper when I couldn't hear a difference between these things. Link to comment
The Computer Audiophile Posted May 17, 2021 Author Share Posted May 17, 2021 47 minutes ago, JoshM said: This is, however, a belated victory for Neil Young, who tried to convince Steve Jobs to go the lossless hires route pre-Pono. Wow, that's right! HalSF 1 Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
The Computer Audiophile Posted May 17, 2021 Author Share Posted May 17, 2021 3 minutes ago, ChipotleCoyote said: I also noticed KEF's LS50 Wireless II page now lists the Apple Music in addition to the AirPlay 2 logo, making me wonder if they have, or plan to, integrate it directly. My guess is that KEF is using a StreamUnlimited card, so this service comes with the card as an option. If HiFI companies want Apple Music lossless etc.. this is probably the way to get it. Working with a much larger vendor who can work with Apple. ChipotleCoyote 1 Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
Popular Post The Computer Audiophile Posted May 17, 2021 Author Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2021 You gotta love competition. Currawong and HalSF 2 Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
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