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Very Disappointed with Tekton Double Impacts


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16 minutes ago, PhilBarone said:

 

My friend used to write for an audio magazine and he tells me flat out not to believe them, at all.  I'd like to meet the people that traded in their 30K speakers for the DI's.  

I don't mean to stir up stuff Phil or be offensive. I've read your listing on FB  to sell your Tektons and found it to be as questionable as allegedly dishonest reviewers... . 
Don't get me wrong, I realize it wouldn't help you selling your D.I.s if you posted that they sounded like crap in your listing. All I am saying is that not all reviewers make something from reviewing gear by the manufacturer. However, if we are going to speculate about everybody's motive or intent it probably be most consistent to exhibit the same optimism towards anyone including ourselves that lists their gear to sell. 
I know one particular reviewer that buys his own gear unaided financially by audio companies and then sells his reviews to a major publication. Matter of fact he recently purchased D.I.s and wrote a review which is awaiting publication now. 
I'll be sure to post a link here to that review when it is published. 

SMSL M400 DAC
Bluesound Node 2i

Sony 65 inch OLED A8G, Sony 4k Blue Ray X700

Parasound Halo A31 Amplifier

Tekton Ulfberht Speakers w/ Be high frequency upgrade [4 ohms ea.]
Two Tekton Active [300 watts rms] 4-10 Subwoofers

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I don't read reviews.  Why bother?  The audio review system is compromised.  Is the system 50% corrupt?   60%  75%?  I don't know. 

Funny how you see an ad for the same equipment that is featured on the web site or the magazine.  Funny how a reviewer can always snag an "industry accommodation price"  and then resell the equipment for a modest profit......

 

Even if the review is honest, it is worthless because the equipment will sound different in your listening room.  So payola and physics.

 

Once you find something you like, better keep it.  My AR3a's are almost 50 years old.   No problems here.

 

In any dispute the intensity of feeling is inversely proportional to the value of the issues at stake ~ Sayre's Law

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1 hour ago, bluesman said:

I appreciate it, but I'm 'way too old to try to keep my chops up on wind instruments.  After playing piano for 70 years and guitar for 65, I'm finally developing some grace on both.  So I've chosen to focus my energy on further development of those skills.    😉

 

My use of trumpet and sax is probably of interest (and amusement) to you and many AS people, and it's consistent with the thrust of my AS article series on realism vs accuracy in audio systems.  I've probably played 2000+ weddings, Bar Mitzvahs, etc and at least as many jazz dates.  But I love to play the blues, and I've been fortunate enough to be a sideman for some outstanding national and international acts over the years.  Mosst bluespeople love to feel a horn section riffing behind them, but most bluespeople can't afford to pay one.  So I found a few ways to solve that problem.

 

I learned to play trumpet and sax when I was in high school because I was writing tunes and arranging other people's music with no regard at all for how difficult it might be to play what I wrote.  Not playing wind instruments, I had no knowledge or experience to guide me.  This was made clear when I handed out my chart for the theme song to the TV show "That Was The Week That Was", and the horn players (high schoolers for sure, but more than decent because Atlantic City High was big and had a diverse student body) all screamed "nobody could play this chart".  So I borrowed a trumpet to find out what was what, following that up with an alto a few months later once I had some facility.  It was a evelation to play instruments that let me add my breathing to the factors that shaped my sound - and it taught me about phrasing, because guitar and piano players don't have to stop to take a breath.  I loved it!

 

Fast forward to the introduction of the vocal harmonizer (which, for you nonmusicians, is an electronic box that adds harmonized notes to whatever you sing into a microphone connected to it).  I bought one, played a horn into it, and a horn section came out of my amplifier!  So I brought it on a gig with a Louisiana bluesman, who loved it - and it got me a lot of gigs.  You have to set it for the scale and harmonies you want and the key in which the tune is being played.  Sometimes, you have to fudge the key setting to accommodate some different scales and harmonies, as necessary.  But the bottom line is that it works really well.

 

This meant having to keep up my chops on both sax and trumpet, to provide whatever the bandleader or contractor wanted.  For those of you who have never played a wind instrument, let me assure you that playing the sax or trumpet well is HARD!!  Maintaining strong enough facial muscles, wind power, etc to play well for a few hours is very difficult, and you have to practice every day (or, at least, I did).  But it gets worse...........I discovered that I could play the trumpet with my right hand and a keyboard with my left at the same time, which got me even more gigs but threw one big monkey wrench in the works.  A trumpet is a "B flat" instrument, which means that a C on the trumpet is a B flat on the piano.  This means playing different music in the same song at the same time on two instruments in two different keys.  Since you can't play much on a saxophone with one hand, I had to default to the trumpet.

 

I did that until the first good guitar synthesizer came along (the Roland, in about 1995), at which point I put Roland pickups on my working guitars, started playing the horn section parts from my guitar, and hung up my horns.  Between the harmonizer and the synthesizer, I've been the horn section on hundreds of club dates, concerts, and videos - and no one has ever noticed that the horns don't sound quite right.  The vocal harmonizers at the bottom of the price range are far from SOTA audio electronics.  And in addition to the imperfections in synthesized intrumental sounds, there's a slight delay in the guitar synthesizer.  So I had to learn to lead the beat just enough to be close to perfectly synch'ed with the band.

 

Interesting times for sure!

Imagine playing in the style of Warne Marsh and those guy, there's no gigs outside of Europe. Are you from AC? My best friend and incredible tenor player Frank Vicari used to gig there all the time.  When those gigs dried up he ended up helping me in the shop.  Very sad story given that he played with Maynard, Buddy Rich and tons of others and a tremendous friend and great guy which is probably why he didn't make much money.  

 

Maybe you should tell me which speakers to buy if I don't like the Klipsch Fortes I just bought.  If they don't work out I'm considering the Harbeth but now we're getting into much more money.   

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2 hours ago, Shimei said:

I don't mean to stir up stuff Phil or be offensive. I've read your listing on FB  to sell your Tektons and found it to be as questionable as allegedly dishonest reviewers... . 
Don't get me wrong, I realize it wouldn't help you selling your D.I.s if you posted that they sounded like crap in your listing. All I am saying is that not all reviewers make something from reviewing gear by the manufacturer. However, if we are going to speculate about everybody's motive or intent it probably be most consistent to exhibit the same optimism towards anyone including ourselves that lists their gear to sell. 
I know one particular reviewer that buys his own gear unaided financially by audio companies and then sells his reviews to a major publication. Matter of fact he recently purchased D.I.s and wrote a review which is awaiting publication now. 
I'll be sure to post a link here to that review when it is published. 

You don't?

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56 minutes ago, PhilBarone said:

 

 

Maybe you should tell me which speakers to buy if I don't like the Klipsch Fortes I just bought.  If they don't work out I'm considering the Harbeth but now we're getting into much more money.   

Our local Naim dealer also carries PrimaLuna. The speakers they carry are Spendor, Dynaudio, Harbeth, ATC and Audio Physics. I swear by my Audio Physics (they do a great disappearing act, highly musical and detailed, and aren't too concerned about the room) but could be hard to source for audition in the US. Harbeth's always a bit too polite for my taste, and ATC's are great but need a lot of power. Dynaudio I'm not familiar with and Spendor's divide lot of people. Lots and lots of other choices out there beyond that. But if the Klipsch's don't work you must go audition, and I wouldn't worry about the amp, anything tube or otherwise the dealer  has on hand would at least give you a good impression. 

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2 hours ago, PhilBarone said:

Imagine playing in the style of Warne Marsh and those guy, there's no gigs outside of Europe. Are you from AC? My best friend and incredible tenor player Frank Vicari used to gig there all the time.  When those gigs dried up he ended up helping me in the shop.  Very sad story given that he played with Maynard, Buddy Rich and tons of others and a tremendous friend and great guy which is probably why he didn't make much money.  

 

Maybe you should tell me which speakers to buy if I don't like the Klipsch Fortes I just bought.  If they don't work out I'm considering the Harbeth but now we're getting into much more money.   

AC born and raised!  Back in the '50s and early '60s, the old boardwalk hotels had a lot of dances for kids and parties year 'round.  I wasn't in that social circle, but I'd been playing locally at our community centers etc from the time I was about 10 - so I was known to (and apparently liked by) the group that did go to them. Between classmates who went to those events and their parents who knew my family and trusted me, I was able to get regular work playing them with drums, bass and tenor.  

 

Then I got my band a regular gig my first year in high school playing for radio station WMID.  We opened their record hops (run by a DJ named Larry Keen, aka "the fat cat in recordland") and had regular work for the next 2+ years in addition to the parties etc.  And when we were old enough (and good enough musicians to pull it off), we started playing local clubs.  The summer of '64 was a dream time for me.  I'd just graduated from high school and landed a 7 night a week gig for the opening season of the Golden Inn in Avalon.  The owner wanted piano, bass & drums - so that's how we auditioned and got the gig.  But we then convinced him he'd be better off with an organ-guitar-drum trio, so he bought a B3 with Leslie and we had an absolute blast!!

 

There have been many world class players who can't secure the stability and recognition they deserve.  I played with the biggest and best society office in Philly from summer '69 to December '73 (when I got married and passed my chair on to an 18 year old Mike Sembello)  - we did weddings, Bar Mitzvahs, commercial gigs like fashion shows and big charity events.  There were 5 "major" leaders, about 10 lesser ones, and over 200 regular sidemen.  I can't tell you how disheartening it was to be playing a wedding with guys who'd just been on the road with Basie - I played a few affairs with Al Grey in the band!  Even the guys who made it big had to struggle much too hard.  I felt terrible playing Sunday jazz brunches at local restaurants with true greats like Jeff Lee Johnson, Gerald Veasley, and Eddie Green.

 

As for what speakers you "should" get, I don't believe in the concept of "the best" of anything.  It depends on what kind of sound you like.  I'm a Focal guy - I love the character of their speakers.  I'm truly old school and still love the Rogers LS3/5as I bought new in 1975.  These are ideal for the PL amps and have a combination of clean analytical sound and tight upper bass that makes my music pop.  They image beautifully and are amazingly realistic even on big band stuff (like Rob McConnell's Umbrella direct-to-disc double album, which I strongly urge anybody to find).  They don't do deep bass, but down to 55 or so they're killer - and there's so much of the second harmonic in the bass that even the octave below that is there and tight.   When I first got my Prima Luna amp, I was so happy with the sound into the Rogers that I disconnected my subwoofer and haven't used it with them since then.  There are several LS3/5a clones today from Harbeth, Falcon, Spendor, Stirling, and Chartwell (among others) that are still available new and are similar in character to the originals with some minor but audible improvements ovr the years.

 

But our living room system uses a PL Prologue Premium driving Focal 726 towers (which are well within your price range - you could even go up to the 8 series, although I personally didn't need the minor bass extension the 826s had on bass heavy music).  In truth, I could live happily with any of several currently made speaker systems.  I even love the little powered monitors in my recording setup (JBL SLR 305s) - they sound mighty fine on their own, and I stuck my sub in that system when I want a big kick.  But see how you like the Klipsches - they're also wonderful speakers.

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  • 5 weeks later...

Phil, you need to figure out what sound you are looking for instead of keep buying speakers blindly and bashing them. It is possible it is your amp too. Did you change the Chinese stock tubes? Did you try the 4ohm or 8ohm? Try Triode or Ultra Linear? Both speakers and your amp have distinct sounds and might not match to your liking. 

 

I had Martin Logans and Definitive Technology in my theater, now I have 13 Tektons and I love them. I have Parasound and ATI amplifiers to power all of them. In my art room I have a pair of Tekton mini Lore Monitors driven by a Willsenton R8 with rolled tubes. Fantastic combo.

 

I watched your few unboxing videos and you seem like a nice guy but a little "Technology enept".

 

Both your speakers have lots of fans. Learn more about setting up speakers and your equipment before selling or buying anything else.

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1 hour ago, UNICRON-WMD said:

Phil, you need to figure out what sound you are looking for instead of keep buying speakers blindly and bashing them. It is possible it is your amp too. Did you change the Chinese stock tubes? Did you try the 4ohm or 8ohm? Try Triode or Ultra Linear? Both speakers and your amp have distinct sounds and might not match to your liking. 

 

I had Martin Logans and Definitive Technology in my theater, now I have 13 Tektons and I love them. I have Parasound and ATI amplifiers to power all of them. In my art room I have a pair of Tekton mini Lore Monitors driven by a Willsenton R8 with rolled tubes. Fantastic combo.

 

I watched your few unboxing videos and you seem like a nice guy but a little "Technology enept".

 

Both your speakers have lots of fans. Learn more about setting up speakers and your equipment before selling or buying anything else.

I’m in total agreement.  I’m not an audiophile and nor do I want to be and I definitely don’t want to spend months trying to find the right location for the speakers especially an 118 pound speaker.  I just wanted a good stereo and I didn’t want to get drawn into something that I had no interest in.

 

It could be my amp but Eric over at Tekton said it was good but I don’t know at this point so I’m thinking about a solid state amp and if the Tektons don’t work out than I’ll try the Klipsch and if they don’t work than I’m listening to a guy who sold audio for a long time and tells me to buy Harbeths but after that I am DONE redwing around. 
 

Eric over at Tekton agreed to have me set them up but they’re in my basement and given their size and weight I’m not in a big rush and where the Klipsch sit they sound better than the Tektons.  For what it’s worth, they were both in the same spots and I have limited space.  
 

I understand that I can break them in by facing them toward each other, reversing the polarity on one, throwing a blanket over them and cranking bass heavy music.  Is that true? 
 

I know I’ll never replicate the sound of my vintage Steinway but I spent ten grand and expected to be floored, thus the negative post and video. I don’t know, I’m so disgusted with the whole thing but thank you.  Phil

 

 

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On 5/7/2021 at 1:16 AM, Bill Brown said:

 

(deleted, but I don't know how to clear the editor and remove the quote...)

 

To the OP, I'm not sure how many of us started out as wanting to be audiophiles, but I certainly didn't. I wanted good sound for a reasonable price. I learned more about what I considered to be "good sound" by trying things. I didn't want that, I never bought 1 item with the intention of hunting around and trying things, I bought them to listen to music. I learned along the way, and in that time "became" an "audiophile". 

 

I'm not sure how else you can get something satisfactory unless you pay someone who does know a thing or two to come to your house and -do it for you-. Otherwise, you've got to put in the time or just plan on getting lucky🎸🎸

 

As for Eric, I have also dealt with him and seen similar comments in reviews about him. He doesn't provide the kind of customer experience that I like from a small business owner. 

 

Good luck 🙂

 

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Tektons are a love/hate type of speakers - so are Zu. I have heard both and to me, they were not worth the money, but that is me.

 

I am not an audiophile - I have a tin ear (my wife says so 😁 ).

 

That said, you need to think what type of sound you want out of a speaker. I have been slowly looking and for I found my Revel M126Be's and using 2 REL 7/ti subs for the bottom end. For me, it sounds exactly what I wanted. It took a while for me to find this combo.

 

Just keep looking.

 

Questions

1. Budget?

2. Music types listened to?

3. Volume?

4. Room size?

 

I try to fill these in first and then look to see what fits for me. I also go to listen, if I can. I am lucky to be in the Northern Chicago suburbs  and there are many dealers here. 

 

I don't believe in speaker break in. It usually takes very little to break in (that is from a material science point of view). IF you didn't like them at the beginning, no amount of 'break in' will change that.

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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17 hours ago, botrytis said:

Tektons are a love/hate type of speakers - so are Zu. I have heard both and to me, they were not worth the money, but that is me.

 

I am not an audiophile - I have a tin ear (my wife says so 😁 ).

 

That said, you need to think what type of sound you want out of a speaker. I have been slowly looking and for I found my Revel M126Be's and using 2 REL 7/ti subs for the bottom end. For me, it sounds exactly what I wanted. It took a while for me to find this combo.

 

Just keep looking.

 

Questions

1. Budget?

2. Music types listened to?

3. Volume?

4. Room size?

 

I try to fill these in first and then look to see what fits for me. I also go to listen, if I can. I am lucky to be in the Northern Chicago suburbs  and there are many dealers here. 

 

I don't believe in speaker break in. It usually takes very little to break in (that is from a material science point of view). IF you didn't like them at the beginning, no amount of 'break in' will change that.

Ya know, maybe I didn't give them a fair shake, everyone says that they're placement picky and I'm not spending four months like some people say to find the best spots in my room not to mention that my space is limited so I can't move them around that much anyway.  I mean that's  ridiculous but from all the info I've gathered I'm getting the feeling that I didn't buy the right amp (PrimaLuna EVO 300) and a better choice would have been a solid state amp with more watts.  

 

I have an extremely knowledgeable person advising me now and he advised me to buy Proac Response 3's which I did  so I'm picking them up Saturday.  

 

I listen to classical and jazz

Budget for total system $20,000

Low to medium volume

Room-25 X 17 feet

 
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17 hours ago, Ben-M said:

(deleted, but I don't know how to clear the editor and remove the quote...)

 

To the OP, I'm not sure how many of us started out as wanting to be audiophiles, but I certainly didn't. I wanted good sound for a reasonable price. I learned more about what I considered to be "good sound" by trying things. I didn't want that, I never bought 1 item with the intention of hunting around and trying things, I bought them to listen to music. I learned along the way, and in that time "became" an "audiophile". 

 

I'm not sure how else you can get something satisfactory unless you pay someone who does know a thing or two to come to your house and -do it for you-. Otherwise, you've got to put in the time or just plan on getting lucky🎸🎸

 

As for Eric, I have also dealt with him and seen similar comments in reviews about him. He doesn't provide the kind of customer experience that I like from a small business owner. 

 

Good luck 🙂

 

Yeah, exactly but it would be cheaper to have someone to come over and advise me than buying and selling all kinds of stuff all the time.  

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Small Room - Small speakers with lots of BOOM ( really the subs are dialed in very low) :D  My very cheap room treatments (at least they aren't paper...). They work.

 

 

20210609_183709[1].jpg

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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23 hours ago, Ben-M said:

(deleted, but I don't know how to clear the editor and remove the quote...)

 

To the OP, I'm not sure how many of us started out as wanting to be audiophiles, but I certainly didn't. I wanted good sound for a reasonable price. I learned more about what I considered to be "good sound" by trying things. I didn't want that, I never bought 1 item with the intention of hunting around and trying things, I bought them to listen to music. I learned along the way, and in that time "became" an "audiophile". 

 

I'm not sure how else you can get something satisfactory unless you pay someone who does know a thing or two to come to your house and -do it for you-. Otherwise, you've got to put in the time or just plan on getting lucky🎸🎸

 

As for Eric, I have also dealt with him and seen similar comments in reviews about him. He doesn't provide the kind of customer experience that I like from a small business owner. 

 

Good luck 🙂

I just bought some Proac Response III's.  

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1 hour ago, PhilBarone said:

I bought a completely rebuilt pair for 3200.  

I had a hunch the Klipsche wouldn't suit, not linear enough. Hope you like the Proacs! 

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On 6/9/2021 at 10:14 PM, PhilBarone said:

Ya know, maybe I didn't give them a fair shake, everyone says that they're placement picky and I'm not spending four months like some people say to find the best spots in my room not to mention that my space is limited so I can't move them around that much anyway.  I mean that's  ridiculous but from all the info I've gathered I'm getting the feeling that I didn't buy the right amp (PrimaLuna EVO 300) and a better choice would have been a solid state amp with more watts.  

 

I have an extremely knowledgeable person advising me now and he advised me to buy Proac Response 3's which I did  so I'm picking them up Saturday.  

 

I listen to classical and jazz

Budget for total system $20,000

Low to medium volume

Room-25 X 17 feet

 

Speaker and amp matching is a very difficult problem and people with money and time do a lot of experimenting, as this is part of the fun if one can afford it.
I am not an audiophile either but I do love listening to music and I can tell what sound I like when I hear it.

After several different passive speakers I decided to go for an active speaker system and bought my ATC SCM 20A Pros way back in 1998. Never looked back since and I just upgraded my ATC actives to bigger models over time. 


I simply concentrate on enjoying listening to music by getting a decent source and discover new music via many streaming services available.
The actual room and positioning also play an important role in achieving satisfactory results.
Just try and listen to different speakers/systems and decide which satisfies you the most.  There are many modern DSP aided active speakers that work better in difficult rooms.

Good luck.

 

Audirvana+3.0 / Qobuz Studio / Mac Mini (256GB SSD - 16GB RAM)

Lindemann Musicbook: 20 DSD, ATC EL 150ASL

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9 hours ago, mevdinc said:

Speaker and amp matching is a very difficult problem and people with money and time do a lot of experimenting, as this is part of the fun if one can afford it.
I am not an audiophile either but I do love listening to music and I can tell what sound I like when I hear it.

After several different passive speakers I decided to go for an active speaker system and bought my ATC SCM 20A Pros way back in 1998. Never looked back since and I just upgraded my ATC actives to bigger models over time. 


I simply concentrate on enjoying listening to music by getting a decent source and discover new music via many streaming services available.
The actual room and positioning also play an important role in achieving satisfactory results.
Just try and listen to different speakers/systems and decide which satisfies you the most.  There are many modern DSP aided active speakers that work better in difficult rooms.

Good luck.

Thank you,  wasn’t anticipating getting this heavy into it, just wanted something great especially since my time is limited.

 

 I think I’m going to be happy with the Proacs and from what I understand I might have to add a sub  but that’s okay.  
 

I’m beginning to think that I listened to the advertising and people reviewing the Tektons and it could be like a McDonalds vs. something more refined not that I didn’t live to eat McDonalds but it will mess you up but of course the masses go for it but I never went in the same direction as the pack, no way.  
 

Thank you, thanks everyone for your help.  I guess I have my work cut out for me   Phil

 

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@PhilBaroneThe most important thing in this hobby is to enjoy the music After all, that is ultimately what we put these systems together for, anyway. 

 

Everyone has different likes and dislikes. There is only the method and equipment that works best for you that is important.

 

I hope you will enjoy the ProAc's - Let us know how it goes.

 

Dave a.k.a The Fun-Gi 🤣

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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Can't speak for the double impacts but have a set of Lores and they punch way above their price point . I have owned and listened to many different Klipsch speakers and own 3k$ monitors listed on the "speakers to lust for" page  ,  Lores beat them in almost all manners , deliver life like  energy and texture with zero fatigue. Lores get close to 30hz as well .  

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