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Room Treatment - New video from GIK


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A new video from GIK.

I found the extent by which a large null was reduced with room treatment to be both interesting and perhaps a little surprising.  That said, they have added a LOT of room treatment for this demonstration, far more that most would do for a domestic room. (Presumably).

The "before and after" recordings are also interesting.  Is it me, or does the "after" recording sound perhaps a little dead?  Maybe you can go too far with these things?

This is a short video, and well worth the time to watch I think.

 

 

 

Windows 10 PC, Roon, HQPlayer, SOtM sMS-200Ultra, tX-USBultra, Paul Hynes SR4 (x2), Mutec REF10, Mutec MC3+USB, Devialet 1000Pro, KEF Blade.  Plus Pro-Ject Signature 12 TT for playing my 'legacy' vinyl collection.

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I'd guess you could get good results with fewer panels: corner bass traps, 2-4 panels on the back wall, a panel on each side wall. Also, move the speakers even a short distance from the front wall.

That would flatten the curve enough enough that some judiciously applied DRC would result in great sound. 

Main listening (small home office):

Main setup: Surge protector +_iFi  AC iPurifiers >Isol-8 Mini sub Axis Power Conditioning+Isolation>QuietPC Low Noise Server>Roon (Audiolense DRC)>Stack Audio Link II>Kii Control>Kii Three >GIK Room Treatments.

Secondary Listening: Server with Audiolense RC>RPi4 or analog>Matrix Element i Streamer/DAC (XLR)+Schiit Freya>Kii Three .

Bedroom: SBTouch to Cambridge Soundworks Desktop Setup.
Living Room/Kitchen: RPi 3B+ running RoPieee to a pair of Morel Hogtalare. 

All absolute statements about audio are false :)

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A GIK diffuser (well, four) helped a mild compression of the highs in our room.  I placed them between the speakers, centered on the wall behind the speakers because they wouldn't look out of place.  The height was chosen by ear and some luck.  They can be painted to match your room.  Folks who visit think they are art.  All in all, the price was reasonable and well worth the investment and time/effort to spray paint them (not fun, but rewarding).  

Mola Mola Tambaqui / Kubala-Sosna XLR / Mola Mola Kaluga / KS biwire / B&W 803 D3

Ethernet:  iMac/Roon > ... in-wall 5e ... > Sonore opticalModule [Sonore 5V LPS] > UpTone EtherREGEN + Cybershaft OP13 [UpTone JS-2 LPS] > Tambaqui ( = DAC/Roon Endpoint/preamp)

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8 minutes ago, Confused said:

This was just about one year ago now, and I have done nothing since.  Time to start progressing this one I think.

With your great system, you will reap the rewards!  As you have heard yourself, room treatments do what equipment cannot.  

Mola Mola Tambaqui / Kubala-Sosna XLR / Mola Mola Kaluga / KS biwire / B&W 803 D3

Ethernet:  iMac/Roon > ... in-wall 5e ... > Sonore opticalModule [Sonore 5V LPS] > UpTone EtherREGEN + Cybershaft OP13 [UpTone JS-2 LPS] > Tambaqui ( = DAC/Roon Endpoint/preamp)

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Remember the vid is just one example and how it would translate to your room and dimensions isn't cut n dry.  It would a lot of broadband to kill a room and I think many times people think adding a few "panels" will deaden the room - not so.  Not at all.  You can still have a "live" sounding space, but until one hears a proper room, I think its easy to be "used to what one knows". 

 

It takes a massive amount just in trapping to even start getting a hold of the sub freq and rarely is that done in most domestic rooms.  The 6"-8" traps (straddled or better yet floor to ceiling ) can do a really good job, but depending on the issues of the room, sub freq are the hardest to tame/address correctly

 

Again room dims are critical in how a room responds overall (w/o any treatments).  If your able to treat your space with a good balance of broadband, diffusion and traps, it can do wonders compared to none. Proper setup of speakers and the like go without saying.

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21 minutes ago, MarkusBarkus said:


Of course, you could hire a pro, but where's the fun in that? Happy listening...

Given all that, your Sweetie is a keeper!

Mola Mola Tambaqui / Kubala-Sosna XLR / Mola Mola Kaluga / KS biwire / B&W 803 D3

Ethernet:  iMac/Roon > ... in-wall 5e ... > Sonore opticalModule [Sonore 5V LPS] > UpTone EtherREGEN + Cybershaft OP13 [UpTone JS-2 LPS] > Tambaqui ( = DAC/Roon Endpoint/preamp)

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On 2/18/2021 at 7:24 PM, MarkusBarkus said:

@Confused I have added a lot of room management and it has helped the sound *a lot.*
 

I designed and built my room with an ear to adding hifi, but it is an odd room and I have to share it with Sweetie for Netflixian evenings.

 

Full disclosure: I have NOT measured my room "acoustically." I have added treatments slowly, listening as I went along.

 

I know, and others have been right to point out: measuring it will provide insight into issues, which I'm sure are there. 
 

Actually, I plan to order that Umik2 mic and load REW software to test.

 

When I started on the room, I did exhaustive reading and thinking. Based on some info, I should have just given up, as the room would never sound good. But it does!
 

I have many treatments throughout the room. Some are pressure based, sealed boxes; some are velocity based "traps."

 

Some are DIY and some commercial, including by GIK. I sent some room info to one of their guys, and it was OK, but not greatly helpful.

 

I should also note: nothing is being trapped, so it's an awkward word, but what we seem to use. Those low freq. waves aren't stopping for (almost) nothing. I just wanted to mix up their reflections and absorption rates. As noted previously, moving the chair and/or speakers has great potential.

 

For the real acoustic honchos here, feel free to yuk it up on my account, as I will post pics for your entertainment. 
 

The big take-away in my view is you can really add to the quality of your room sound with a few, or as many as you need, of these products. Sorry the pics are quick, cell camera items.

 

Looking back to listening position. Many would not choose a diffusor here, and say it is too close. 6-10 feet is more typical, but this works (about 3'). Mega-trap below. About 165 lbs.!
All three built from Acoustic Fields plans:

CDF8B32E-C89B-42DB-9812-C31BE51F7C57.thumb.jpeg.9dc4eb907dce75086ff99ddf9e2195c4.jpeg

 

Looking front. All room corners are trapped. I have GIK diffusors up front, and pressure membrane DIY traps. That front sub is on a DIY platform too:

774630B6-3916-412C-93A1-6C36E1D3719D.thumb.jpeg.e2c14e25c1f263c812d2a7ff942ee0a2.jpeg

Side wall. GIK 3-D diffusors.
 

Behind wooden panel there are two inches of rigid fiberglass panels the entire length (panel is fir-ed out and sealed. I built the ceiling cloud too. Room is "short" and this helps a lot:63C299F6-29C4-43A1-BFCC-DA911F971977.thumb.jpeg.37fd286e21e53b9fc51d3fd16f669006.jpeg 

B7D7ED9F-85AD-4FA5-8F02-7FF64D949823.thumb.jpeg.6f6caf4860611cfe8db39176583ac373.jpeg


The naughty side of the room can create an imbalance. If I want to get kooky with listening, I can slide these additional pieces into place from their hiding spot.
72B867D0-E822-4542-93E9-8ADC2B3C010B.thumb.jpeg.be996a5df435e514faf8d483f78ab6e7.jpeg
They look odd in place, but they serve to balance the sound a bit more, even without the mass of a wall.

 

Additionally, I chose to do more of a near-field sound field. About 8' out. It lacks a bit of expanse in the soundstage, but I listen to mostly jazz and small set music, not big band and full-orchestral pieces. They sound fine too, but lack the great image presence in the room. 

 

I have some rags under the speakers and the stand on the floor, awaiting some new stuff. Snow storm delays.


Honestly, the big take-away I would like to express is that room management makes a big difference, and that it is OK to experiment a bit. The plants you see are fake. I like the look, and they will scatter some high frequency "rays."
 

Of course, you could hire a pro, but where's the fun in that? Happy listening...

y

 

Thanks for the pictures, if nothing else it reinforces my own issues with getting room treatment sorted out.  I look at the pictures, I should be thinking about room treatments, and then I end up thinking "oh look, some VU meters".  Yes, those strange little things that do nothing much at all for audio reproduction, why do I love them so?  

 

Anyway, I was interested in your comment that the advice from GIK was not that helpful.  The GIK guy I spoke to at the show I mentioned was incredibly helpful and knowledgeable.  As it happens, I recognised him from a hifi  in London show maybe 3 or 4 years ago.  At the show they has a seminar area, where they had someone doing some kind of talk or presentation each hour.  I attended a talk about room treatments and it was the same GIK guy who did the presentation, and it was a very good presentation, this guy knew his topic..  I guess if you send a manufacturer a lot of information for advice, there is a degree of luck as to who gets to respond, and how much time they have to spend on your particular query.  Which makes me think that when I get around to making the effort to compile REW measurements, room sketches, photographs etc. it might be a good idea to send it to maybe two or three companies.  I could then compare and contrast the responses, combined with a bit of my own research.  

 

Looking at my own room, I will have some challenges. the location of one door is not ideal, plus one side wall at "first reflection point" is a wall, but on the other side it is a window.  Yet there ae some "easy hits" I think.  For example, the corners of the room behind the speakers are just empty corners, dead space with literally nothing in them.  One step at a time, I'll get there eventually.

Windows 10 PC, Roon, HQPlayer, SOtM sMS-200Ultra, tX-USBultra, Paul Hynes SR4 (x2), Mutec REF10, Mutec MC3+USB, Devialet 1000Pro, KEF Blade.  Plus Pro-Ject Signature 12 TT for playing my 'legacy' vinyl collection.

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4 hours ago, Confused said:

Anyway, I was interested in your comment that the advice from GIK was not that helpful. 

In all fairness to GIK, I think it's difficult to get too detailed via email and telephone. IMO, GIK was professional and the fella I spoke with was knowledgeable...it was just very basic, which is OK. After all, it was free. 
 

Although I *think* my room sounds good...or, music sounds good in my room, through my ears, made by the musicians that live in my gear...it really is up to me to test/measure. Thanks for the chat and good luck.

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8 hours ago, shum3s said:

When I built my dedicated room some distance from my house, and made my own treatment, it put the end to my bad case of up grading equipment.  It has been the most rewarding element in the pursuit of great sound. Compare to most people system, mine is quite modest, but the impact this room has on my musical enjoyment is beyond I ever dreamed of.  Just wanted to share and acknowledge that in my view the room has the greatest impact than any other component in the audio chain.  
    
  Thank you, Sam

Looks great.  Did you place the treatments by ear or measurement or both?

Mola Mola Tambaqui / Kubala-Sosna XLR / Mola Mola Kaluga / KS biwire / B&W 803 D3

Ethernet:  iMac/Roon > ... in-wall 5e ... > Sonore opticalModule [Sonore 5V LPS] > UpTone EtherREGEN + Cybershaft OP13 [UpTone JS-2 LPS] > Tambaqui ( = DAC/Roon Endpoint/preamp)

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