Giesemann OCXO Ref 10M Master Clock Listening Impression

[Johnnydev]

Thanks to the audiophilestyle, EtherRegen, this forum and the good, friendly advice and helpfulness of Adrian from AfterDark i took the plunge and have the following on order at AfterDark:

 

- EMPEROR GIESEMANN EVA 75OHM SPECIAL EDITION.
- ClayX Black River Carbon Fiber Woven 75ohm BNC Clock Cable.
- AfterDark. Black Modernize LPS x GIESEMANN OCXO 10M Edition.

- AfterDark. Project ClayX Progressive Carbon Fiber Shielding (CFS) Duelund Audio DC Power Cable 0.8 Meter.

- AfterDark. AudiophileMAT Forest Series 1 4 pieces / Rosewood / Wooden Board
- AudiophileMAT Carbon Fiber for Extreme EMI Shielding.

 

I went for the highest segment and I am very curious. It is the top flagship model and is very limited supply. This is according to Adrian the best oxco we can get in today technology. Afterdark can only made one per month.

 

It take a few more weeks before I receive it.

I will keep you informed of the developments and listening impressions. do you guys have any recommendations or tips?

 

 

[JonD]

I ordered the same clock and cable at the weekend as @Johnnydev

 

- EMPEROR GIESEMANN EVA 75OHM SPECIAL EDITION.
- ClayX Black River Carbon Fiber Woven 75ohm BNC Clock Cable.

 

I just hope I'm ahead in that queue :D

 

I also have a Farad Super3 on order as well.

 

Looking forward to hearing how it all sounds. 

 

 

[Johnnydev]

Oh that's nice. @JonD
 

The farad super3 is a very good choice. great LPS. in my case better then the paul hynes SR4T.

 

I now have 3 farads super 3 in use, on the ER, modem and router. So I can try for a comparison with the Black Modernize LPS x GIESEMANN OCXO 10M Edition.

 

Did you order the level 2 DC powercable (copper) with the farad?  is a perfect match. The orange fuse and furutech inlet is also recommended.
The Farads also combine very well with an audioquest Monsoon power cable.

 

I think we can make a big step with the afterdark Giesemann evo special edition. 👌

[JonD]

I also have a Paul Hynes SR5T on order, but was planning to use it for something else.

 

I did get the upgraded Furutech inlet and Orange Fuse; but plan on trying it with the two spare Chord Power cables that I have. One of them is a Chord Signature.

 

All of this will be plugged into an AQ Niagara 3000 that itself has an AQ Hurricane HC connecting it to the wall outlet.

 

So I think my Giesemann OCXO will be well set up to give its best performance 🙂

 

 

[Johnnydev]

2 hours ago, Johnnydev said:

Oh that's nice. @JonD
 

The farad super3 is a very good choice. great LPS. in my case better then the paul hynes SR4T.

 

I now have 3 farads super 3 in use, on the ER, modem and router. So I can try for a comparison with the Black Modernize LPS x GIESEMANN OCXO 10M Edition.

 

Did you order the level 2 DC powercable (copper) with the farad?  is a perfect match. The orange fuse and furutech inlet is also recommended.
The Farads also combine very well with an audioquest Monsoon power cable.

 

I think we can make a big step with the afterdark Giesemann evo special edition. 👌

I would say also try the AQ Z3, Monsoon and blizzard from your AQ niagara 3000 to your LPS

[Johnnydev]

Hi JonD,

any news from you about the gieseman EVA etc.?

I hope to get him in this week. :-)

[patatras]

Hello I ordered on March 18th an Emperor Double Crown with a cable and an impedance adapter and I hope to receive it this week.

I keep you informed of the listening results.

 

Pierre

 

[SethARider]

My EVA was sent middle week so it should be at the US customs now.

I have square queen EtherRegen version for a month. It changed my SQ a lot so I have high hopes regarding this top of the line product.

 

From a little experience I have I would say don’t ignore BNC cable and vibration control.

[Johnnydev]

On 3/15/2021 at 1:38 PM, Johnnydev said:

Thanks to the audiophilestyle, EtherRegen, this forum and the good, friendly advice and helpfulness of Adrian from AfterDark i took the plunge and have the following on order at AfterDark:

 

- EMPEROR GIESEMANN EVA 75OHM SPECIAL EDITION.
- ClayX Black River Carbon Fiber Woven 75ohm BNC Clock Cable.
- AfterDark. Black Modernize LPS x GIESEMANN OCXO 10M Edition.

- AfterDark. Project ClayX Progressive Carbon Fiber Shielding (CFS) Duelund Audio DC Power Cable 0.8 Meter.

- AfterDark. AudiophileMAT Forest Series 1 4 pieces / Rosewood / Wooden Board
- AudiophileMAT Carbon Fiber for Extreme EMI Shielding.

 

I went for the highest segment and I am very curious. It is the top flagship model and is very limited supply. This is according to Adrian the best oxco we can get in today technology. Afterdark can only made one per month.

 

It take a few more weeks before I receive it.

I will keep you informed of the developments and listening impressions. do you guys have any recommendations or tips?

 

 

I received everything except the AudiophileMAT carbon fiber for extreme EMI Shielding (which Adrian will send on) last Thursday.
Everything neatly, but above all cleverly packaged. ;-)

 

I also ordered the mini circuit 75 Ohm from Adrian.

 

Last Friday I installed everything and connected it to my EtherRegen, which is powered with a Farad super3, level 2 copper DC cable and Audioquest Monsoon powercable.
The afterdark black modernize LPS is also powered with an audioquest monsoon powercable. all connected to an audioquest niagara 1200.
 

At first I had some doubts whether it was worth the purchase cost, but I will not anticipate my further observations and will wait for everything to burn in properly.

 

However, I can now already say that it is going to promise a lot! :-)

[Qstik]

OK - I've had my Emperor Double Crown (50 ohm) since Monday.  It has been burning in constantly since then (5 days now).  But, a concentrated A-B-C comparison just now has convinced me that the improvements going from A (no EtherREGEN or Emperor Double Crown Master Clock) to B (EtherREGEN only) to C (with both EtherREGEN and Emperor Double Crown Master Clock) are not subtle and that I could easily rank order A, B, and C configurations in a true double blind test.  I realize that Adrian says that the burn-in period could take up to a month, but I thought it important to get my initial comments out there.

 

Here is my system as a key point of reference:

WAN (direct from router - no other switches in signal path) or LAN (NAS) > Uptone Audio EtherRegen powered by Uptone Audio LPS 1.2 @12v with AfterDark Emperor Double Crown 10 MHz External Master Clock powered by AfterDark Modernize LPS > RPi4b/Pi2AES running Volumio as end point using Spotify Desktop App or JRiver > I2S over ethernet UTP > Metrum Onyx NOS DAC > balanced AES/EBU > PS Audio SGC Preamp > balanced AES/EBU > Parasound A23 > NHT Classic Towers with dual sealed NHT subwoofers using miniDSP digital xover  My listening room has very good acoustical qualities with almost a constant 400 ms reverberation time versus frequency and few room resonances which need to be controlled.

 

I believe my system is somewhat unique in that I use a RPi4 with a Pi2AES add-on card as my streamer with I2S native output to a non-oversampling ladder DAC.  See a review of the RPi4/Pi2AES here:  https://youtu.be/Jvu_doQfAI0

 

What I hear when I add the AfterDark Emperor Double Crown Master Clock to my EtherREGEN: 

- reverb and soundstage are better defined, wider and deeper.  Vocalists in reverberant spaces are easier to separate and locate.

- bass is tighter and more defined.  Some bass passages have a texture that wasn't noticed before.

- pianos have improved timbre, sound more resonant, sound more "natural"

- I find that brass instruments, which have suffered the most from digital harshness to my ears, are now non-irritating and very natural sounding

- Overly hot and harsh sounding cymbals are now tamed in some recordings

- I can now play music at lower levels without seeming to lose clarity and definition

- I can now play music at higher volumes without being turned back by glare and harshness

- This is a strange one - I can now listen to music playing while I am in other rooms of my house and it still sounds great.  I guess that improved fidelity and musicality are true regardless of distance.

  

In general, the Emperor Double Crown significantly (noticeably) improves on all things that the EtherREGEN by itself improves.

 

Normally I am not one to risk being on the "bleeding edge" of technology, but I took a chance with my AfterDark Master Clock purchase in spite of relatively few reviews to go by.  However, as you can see from my comments above, I, for one, am very pleased with my Emperor Double Crown purchase.  Your mileage may vary- depending on your system, its setup, room acoustics, musical preferences, hearing abilities, etc., etc.

 

I do not have the Mini-Circuit filter yet.  It is on back order.  I will report later if I find that it makes a difference.

 

[MartinT]

I agree with some of the key improvements listed above.

 

Particularly acoustics and natural note decay, bass texture, cymbal shimmer, sibilance on voice, striking percussive dynamics. All are indications of a reduced noise floor from a low phase noise clock.

[Cazzesman]

Emperor Double Crown and the AfterDark LPS have been in situ for 10 days now.  Subjective listening is always difficult, as the Audio memory fades from one upgrade to the next.

 

I will try and explain what I am hearing now with the first words that come to mind      Liquid and effortless presentation.   Fullness and richness to vocals and the bottom end.     Audio at my normal 84-86 listening levels now burst out into my room.   No flab.   There is a clarity and a sense of stress free listening.    

 

25 days to go for the full 35 day effect.    If it continues to improve from here then yippee I will be one happy camper!!!!   

 

After 10 days, I am very pleased I made the right call spending the $, which compared to other Companies pricing, is amazingly cheap IMHO.     If you have a Mutec device and looking for where to go next with your system, then give AfterDark serious consideration.

 

I am not affiliated with AD in any way shape or form.

 

Regards Cazzesman

[MartinT]

Now that my Giesemann King has got a week on it, these are my system impressions with the AfterDark feeding my Mutec and the ER (temporarily) set to internal clock.

 

Every piece of familiar music I've played since hooking it up sounds different. The key areas that strike me are the incredibly fluid and dynamic portrayal of voice, which is more focussed than before but pops into my room, uncannily real on some recordings. Sibilance on voice is just history now, except where it was present in a recording that's been too closely mic'd.

Very natural soundstaging and imaging that has had me looking around, thinking that someone had entered the room. Last night there was a triangle almost to the right of me. With my eyes closed, I pointed to it and then looked. It was way outside of the right-hand speaker. Most uncanny.

The detail and delicacy within instruments is wonderful. I hear taps on cymbals and long shimmer on standard 16/44 material, never mind hi-res, that had never been apparent before.

Bass is so tight and potent that I've found air pressures in songs I hadn't realised contained much bass information at all. There is no need whatsoever to turn up the volume. Room shaking comes as standard on some material without stressing the amp unduly.

Percussive dynamics are apparent in many songs and it is this that has surprised me the most. Even great songs that contain mostly a wash of sound (e.g. Mazzy Star's Fade Into You) are full of strummed guitar and tambourine detail that make it sound like a remaster. On more blatantly rhythmic material, the boogie factor is off the scale.

 

I've been so impressed with the King that I have decided to order an Emperor Triple Crown, which will feed the Mutec while I move the King to feeding the ER.

[R1200CL]

@MartinT

Wouldn’t the Cybershaft splitter do the trick?

[MartinT]

19 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

@MartinT

Wouldn’t the Cybershaft splitter do the trick?

 

I'm not sure and I wanted to take advantage of a better model while the prices hold low.  This gives me flexibility and the chance to optimise every component in the chain.

[GMG]

Wouldn’t you benefit more from the triple out model? You will then have the ER and Mutec synced to the same clock. 

[R1200CL]

3 minutes ago, GMG said:

Would t you benefit more from the triple out model? You will then have the ER and Mutec synced to the same clock. 

The outputs isn’t isolated. No benefit in syncing. A splitter will be equal. 

[Iving]

58 minutes ago, MartinT said:

I've been so impressed with the King that I have decided to order an Emperor Triple Crown, which will feed the Mutec while I move the King to feeding the ER.

 

What will you do with spare isolated outs from the Triple? Default would be to dispose of/sell the King (lower specs) and hook up 2 or 3 devices to the TC? The King is Sine and the Triple is Square ... some a priori thinking about this? You know you want a Sine for one device (ER) and Square for another (Mutec)? It can't be because you're determined to use a filter with the ER!

 

The combined cost must be in the order of a REF10?

[GMG]

16 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

The outputs isn’t isolated. No benefit in syncing. A splitter will be equal. 

I think isolation and sync are 2 separate things. 
Isolation is for keeping devices isolated from each other’s noise. Sync is to have both device synced to the exact same clock signal. 
 

as long as the devices are well designed and use quality PS (which is the case for Martin) the benefit of synced clocks is far greater then perhaps some noise leakage. 
at least this is my understanding

[R1200CL]

@gmc one of us has misunderstood the concept of synced clocks 😀.  Or a master clock. This is not a master clock. 

[GMG]

10 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

@gmc one of us has misunderstood the concept of synced clocks 😀.  Or a master clock. This is not a master clock. 

Ok, maybe. 
I was under the impression there is a single OCXO in the box which provides a synced signal to 3 outputs (isolated or not)

Perhaps @AfterDark. can clarify. 

[MartinT]

I have thought about this very carefully. I already have the AfterDark King and my old BG7TBL. I've tried all combinations of waveforms and know exactly what I want, which is an AfterDark Emperor Triple Crown. Both 75 Ohm, both sinewave. Different power supplies, no breaking the moat. The best clock where it matters the most, into the Mutec.

[Iving]

17 minutes ago, MartinT said:

I have thought about this very carefully. I already have the AfterDark King and my old BG7TBL. I've tried all combinations of waveforms and know exactly what I want, which is an AfterDark Emperor Triple Crown. Both 75 Ohm, both sinewave. Different power supplies, no breaking the moat. The best clock where it matters the most, into the Mutec.

 

I see. I don't have a moat issue clocking the ER and Mutec from the same AD box.

 

I understood all Triples were Square. Is yours a special commission or did Adrian find it easy to accommodate - Sine Triple no problem.

[MartinT]

I don't have a Triple output!

[Iving]

1 minute ago, MartinT said:

I don't have a Triple!

 

Doh Triple Crown

 

mea culpa

 

apols.