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Article: Reality Quest: Power and Digital Audio with the Sean Jacobs DC4 and Sound Application PGI TT-7 (Part 2 of 2)


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That's good info to calibrate.  My suggestion is plug things into the wall.  If dynamics and speed go up, but you get harshness, it's time for a PLC.  There are lots of ways to clean power, but usually come at a cost with dynamic current. You'll hear one as noise floor or fatigue, and the other as dynamics and soundstage.  Better home wiring and power cords and going direct to wall will give you max dynamics.  Going through filters and transformers will give you max clean.  By hopping back and forth, you can calibrate where the right balance is for you (and whether slogging up that hill is worth it to you)

ATT Fiber -> EdgeRouter X SFP -> Sonore opticalModule -> Taiko Audio Extreme -> Chord DAVE -> Voxativ 9.87 speakers w/ 4D drivers

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Alas no Frank.  These single drivers are very directional. so it is hard for me to apply that test (if I go too much to the left or right levels get way out of balance).  

ATT Fiber -> EdgeRouter X SFP -> Sonore opticalModule -> Taiko Audio Extreme -> Chord DAVE -> Voxativ 9.87 speakers w/ 4D drivers

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5 hours ago, Exocer said:

What are others using in the $1000 - $1500 range?

 

3 hours ago, Downtheline said:

I used a passive device previously that was better than regular power strips, I then bought a used p5 power conditioner from ps audio.  That was a major step up, and was one of the only times my wife commented on the audio quality improvement without promoting. So perhaps a used p5 or p3 stellar. 

 

FWIW, my Ref TT-7 replaced a PS Audio P20, their biggest and best power regenerator. And I never looked back.

I am expecting my 240V TT-7 now and expect that to be another big step from the Ref TT-7.

Affiliated with Sean Jacobs

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19 minutes ago, Nenon said:

Ref TT-7 replaced a PS Audio P20, their biggest and best power regenerator. And I never looked back

Interesting data point and comparison. I always have wondered how these ps audio products compare to other power conditioning products. I think the comparisons are challenging, and I have seen few published. Any other passive line conditioners out there others think are contenders?

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3 hours ago, Nenon said:

FWIW, my Ref TT-7 replaced a PS Audio P20, their biggest and best power regenerator. And I never looked back.

I am expecting my 240V TT-7 now and expect that to be another big step from the Ref TT-7.

Nenon, if you could elaborate a bit on the difference between the TT-7 and the PS Audio power regenerator, that'd be much appreciated. I've got a PS Audio P10 and it's pretty good but I feel I'm missing some dynamics and perhaps more (I do have dedicated AC runs to the box for my home).

Also, have you ever tried any of the Ansuz "power distributor" products? https://ansuz-acoustics.com/products/power-products/power-and-ground-distribution. Lots of folks feel these are really good and I'm wondering how they might compare to the Sound Application power conditioners.

 

Lastly, what are your thoughts on ferrites on power cables? Seems that they wouldn't do much damage to the relatively low frequencies that "dynamic power demands" require (like maybe 100s of KHz or so, but not multi MHz), but would get rid of some RF. That's been my experience in general, but you've gone way further in this realm. Thanks!

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Nenon, that's great that the P20 was very good (although not at the TT-7 level) and that you didn't find the need to go "direct to the wall socket" with various gear to avoid any sonic anomalies. Thanks! 

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5 hours ago, Downtheline said:

Any other passive line conditioners out there others think are contenders?

 

I can recommend GigaWatt. I use a smaller model Power Line Conditioner GigaWatt PC-2 EVO+ and it doesn't hold back any power for my T + A M10 Monos.

 

 

37681664vc.jpeg

 

Grigg Audio Solutions Owner

StreamFidelitys Setup

Sonus Faber Amati Futura | T + A M10 | T + A SDV 3100 HV | fis Audio PC | HFX RipNAS Solid V4 | GigaWatt PC2-EVO + | Solidsteel HJ-3 / HY-A

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16 hours ago, Exocer said:

Excellent write-up! I am embarrassed to discuss what I use for power conditioning 😁. Hint - it costs less than $200 and is most likely the weakest link ib my system at this point. Your write-up is encouraging me to upgrade this unit sooner rather than later. Ive considered DIY means (replacing sockets with higher end units, upgrading internal wiring etc) but filtering wise, I would prefer not to go DIY there, as I am not knowledgeable enough.

 

@ray-dude - have you tried any reasonable lower cost units in your journey? 😁

 

What are others using in the $1000 - $1500 range?

 

Cheers!

-Rob

Look into PI Audio UberBuss

 

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On 1/21/2021 at 2:20 PM, MarkusBarkus said:

For folks using high-gauge wire runs from the panel to audio-feed outlets: how are you terminating into the outlets?

 

Crimp-on terminals? Please don't say you're pig-tailing them. Are you?

 

Any outlets I recall ever seeing, audiophile or other, max-out at 10 gauge, and even that can be a pain to fasten and get neatly into your gang box (outlet box), though manageable with care.

 

I have a 12ga. homerun to the panel for audio gear, and 10ga. homerun for network gear. Not sure what I was thinking there, although I have added gear since I pulled the dedicated line a couple of years back, and the network line is new.

 

I plan to pull another run for the audio gear, so I could do 8ga. instead of 10ga., if I sort out termination at the plug-end. Panel is NP/usual breaker stuff. Thanks!

If you don’t have Jim’s outlet. Use Furutech NCF. I use 6awg to my audio consumer unit, then 10awg from CU to Furutech sockets. I appreciate that’s a drop down in size but my socket are located 200mm away from the CU. Smaller being better. 
 

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For a short run, even my 25' panel-to-outlet, 10ga. is pretty good. JW said to me it's most of the way there. "There" being the 6ga. cable experience. He was uncertain about delivery time, (30-60 days?), so I may just run 10/2 Romex. Depends how jerky I get scratching hifi itches. Thanks for the comment, BTW. I do use/like NCF stuff...

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14 hours ago, happybob said:

Also, have you ever tried any of the Ansuz "power distributor" products? https://ansuz-acoustics.com/products/power-products/power-and-ground-distribution. Lots of folks feel these are really good and I'm wondering how they might compare to the Sound Application power conditioners.

Also I would be interested to hear impressions from a comparison of the TT7 (or the P20) to say an Ansuz Mainz8 D or higher/newer.

Apple Powerbook G4 15\", iTunes, Metric Halo LIO-8, active speakers

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On 1/21/2021 at 3:58 PM, ray-dude said:

 

aaaahhhh.  i have the Shahen Shah album and love it.  i never paid attention to what the first track was named!  i agree, it is brilliant 9_9

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On 1/21/2021 at 6:59 PM, ray-dude said:

 

 

The Topaz Isolation transformers dropped the background level a huge amount.  These can be had used for several hundred $$.  Dynamics slowed (esp. as I upgraded to the Extreme), but it was a huge win as I was working up the ladder.

 

 

 

Ray,  From a dedicated line, I'm using a P.I Audio UberBuss passive conditioner in front of my amp and server (Extreme) and a Plixir BAC (balanced transformer) in front of my DAC.

 

I have a Topaz laying around doing nothing, but wondered if it would be theoretically useful in front of my Network which is on another circuit .  (Topaz > modem > Sonore OM > fiber > Extreme).   

 

Your thoughts appreciated!

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It is certainly worth trying (and shouldn't cause any issues).  The IT does a great job of filtering noise, but it stunts current dynamics.  With your modem, not really an issue, and it isn't impacting the Extreme (where it is an issue)

 

 

ATT Fiber -> EdgeRouter X SFP -> Sonore opticalModule -> Taiko Audio Extreme -> Chord DAVE -> Voxativ 9.87 speakers w/ 4D drivers

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I'm wondering if a "best possible" power solution (price no object) might not be essentially a super-version of a power regenerator? (like the PS Audio PerfectWave regenerators, but with much more current delivery capability). Trying to clean up existing power like so many of the solutions out there is of course a very worthy and clearly audible benefit, but I imagine perhaps a DIY project with huge energy storage (and with design such that dynamic current could be extremely high - much higher than the AC power from the wall can ever be - perhaps using supercapacitors like the EV race cars do). Certainly this would not be cheap or likely small, but it seems to me that super highend power delivery is increasingly a big part of the focus of products like the Taiko Extreme server, or the DC4 power supply for DACs, and many pieces of gear.

 

And that said, the external single super highend-LPS approach to power might increasingly catch on - either directly with products or in an aftermarket approach. Why have super high capacity and very clean AC power that then gets delivered to a modest AC to DC conversion stage in a component (transformers, rectifiers, etc.) which basically throttles the great AC coming in? This approach would also allow many good (but not great) components to be much much better simply by bypassing their power supply and connecting to their DC rails from a super highend (and perhaps somewhat universal with a variety of DC voltages supplied) DC power supply. Not an easily accomplished task, but perhaps might be increasingly embraced for the ultrahighend... 

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Pertaining to Orange Fuses:

Does anyone have experience with dual-fuse IEC inlets where a second Orange Fuse was inserted after listening to just one? I haven't found any information on SRs website or any forums or reviews pertaining to multiple fuses in line on the same circuit. 

 

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