Article: Review | Buchardt Audio A500 Speaker System

[lolligagger]

On 11/20/2020 at 2:30 AM, bobfa said:

Ted,

 

Thanks for the note.  I am sort of casual in what I do.   We have to have fun with it.  And there is a surprise coming in the next couple of weeks! 

 

I am starting a thread on the site in a bit discussing all of the software issues with related equipment that I had trouble with this summer. Roon and everybody else.

 

Bob

 

 

Bob,

I have the A500 and I am thoroughly happy with it. I really appreciated your review and I really like your writing style... quite different and refreshing!  

 

Can you please tell me why you did not try and report on the A500 built in DSP room correction?

I did read where you state that your Auralic Altair G1 offers room correction. But that would only be relevant to those who have an Altair G1.... nd since this is a review of the A500/hub, and since the DSP room correction is a featured option of this system (Mads is quite thrilled with it) that many would use.... not reviewing it seems like an oversight. 

 

Please allow me to correct something that you wrote. You said that the room correction works on frequencies 300Hz and below. Mads told me that it functions from 400Hz and below. And this can clearly be seen on the graph after the correction is done.

Please know, however, that you are not the only one to make a mistake in regards to this. Another reviewer said that it functions on frequencies 500Hz and below. 

 

You mention that there is a ''surprise coming in a few weeks.''

Are you, by any chance, referring to the new Buchardt proprietary hub? This hub, according to Mads will have improved WiSA functioning, a seriously improved preamp for even better sound quality, its own DAC and several other improvements. It will also allow for the hub to be directly XLR connected to the A500 speakers. 

As with the present hub, the price when purchased with the speakers will be significantly lower than the price if purchased separately.  

However for those who already have the present hub, they will be able to purchase the new one for the lower price (as if it were purchased with the speakers)... AND they will be offered a further discount equal to the amount that they paid for the present hub. 

 

But I was told that this won't be available for about 6 months, so perhaps you were not referring to this as the ''surprise.'' 

 

What I WAS told, is that in the next few weeks a manually operated EQ function will be added to the Buchardt hub for those who wish to further refine the room correction to their own tastes. 

Buchardt are also going to release a proprietary microphone for the room correction. But I find that my iPhone 6S works perfectly well for effecting the correction so I don't think I will be purchasing it. But I will definitely be buying the new hub when it comes out.

 

Thanks again for the great review!

[lolligagger]

1 hour ago, bobfa said:

How are you listening to the A500?  What software?  I am REALLY interested.

 

Ok, I understand why you didn't report on the DSD room correction. 

 

I am not sure I understand the question about what software I am using. The software for the room correction is the Buchardt app which works well for me. 

 

My set-up is as follows: MacMini with Pure Music (local library), Tidal, Audirvana (local library and Tidal) > A500 hub via USB cable or Wifi then WiSA out to the speakers. 

Alternatively I have the MacMini USB connected to a  Chord MScaler > Chord Dave > Crayon CIA 1T integrated whose preamp outs are RCA connected to the hub. Then the hub drives the speakers via WiSA. 

 

To be truthful, I do not think that the MScaler/Dave/CIA 1T/hub configuration sounds any better than the USB/hub configuration. This may be because no matter what DAC you use before the hub/speakers, in the speakers the analogue signal gets converted back to digital and then converted back to digital by the speakers internal DACs. 

This, to me, means that the characteristics of the sound are determined by the last DACs in the chain... not the Chord products. 

Mads, however,  told me that in that configuration, the characteristics of the stand alone DAC (Chord) would be maintained but I don't see how this is possible. He explained it to me, but I don't remember what he said. 

 

However, if it is true that the characteristics of the MScaler/Dave are preserved AND the A500 system sounds just as good when not using the Chord/Crayon configuration, then the DACs in the speakers must be really good. My Chord MScaler/Dave set-up is retail valued at $15,000 and is considered one of the best out there. 

The last passive speakers I was using with this system were the Buchardt S400 Special Edition. This sounded really good, but the A500 system, no matter the configuration, sounds much better. 

 

In order to see if there is a qualitative difference I need to run an analogue signal (created by the Chord equipment) into the A500 speakers' analogue XLR inputs. I haven't tried this yet because  1) I have been enjoying my A500 system al lot, just the way it is and 2) I don't have any XLR adapters or an RCA/XLR cables.  

I am considering getting a pair of Mogami cables. Any thoughts about their quality? 

 

I probably did not answer your question about which software I am using, but I confess that I don't know what you're referring to. 

The only music server software that I use, is Tidal... both in Audirvana and also separately. I do not use Qobuz, Spotify or any of the others. 

Is that what you wanted to know? 

 

 

[lolligagger]

10 hours ago, bobfa said:

 

 

Have you tried the balanced output of the Dave directly to the A500's?  I have been using my Altair G1 direct to the A500s with a set of AudioQuest Water cables.

 

How do you have the Mac and Audirvana setup via USB?  I am fussing over the volume control not working right.  I have not spent any real time figuring it out. I read something in the hub manual about how it locks the volume control on USB so that you can use the computer to set volume.  Audirvana is not working right for that.  IT is either all the way up or it drops to zero.  

 

On a separate note, how to you feel about the room correction?

 

I have not tried the balanced inputs at all. As I wrote in my last post, I have been enjoying my A500 system just as it is so I haven't been inclined to try the balanced inputs... also because it eliminates DSP room correction.

After reading what you had to say, which corresponds to that which another reviewer said, I think that I would like to try the balanced connection.

I have two options... either from the Dave's preamp or from the CIA 1T preamp. But, first I need to purchase a pair of RCA/XLR cables. As I told you I am considering Mogami cables. Do you have any thoughts about the quality of those? Which ones do you use? 

 

Bu the way, I am not a believer in balanced connection. My Crayon CIA 1T...  which is a superb integrated... does not have XLR outputs. No Crayon Audio amplifier has them. When asked about this, the designer told me that XLR is only for very long distance connection.  I have researched this on line and I have talked to sound engineers and the answer has always been the same. Balanced connections are for long... VERY long  (from 30 to 100 ft and, theoretically up to 1000ft)... connections. In the context of our home stereo they offer no advantage whatsoever.

This was corroborated also by two reviewers that I trust. In fact I found no one at that level of knowledge who did not say the same thing. 

One on line source says that up to 30 feet RCA does not attenuate the signal.

Some other sources say that a very good RCA can carry signal up to 100 ft without loss of signal quality. And yet another source says that 16ft is the limit for RCA. In my system, RCA has to transmit a signal for no more than a foot and a half.  

 

Prior to this I had a very good amplifier that had XLR. I AB-ed XLR versus RCA performance and I heard absolutely no difference at all. That is why I began doubting and researching. 

 

But, of course, with the A500 I have no option but to use the balanced inputs. 

 

So why do so many manufacturers/designers include them in their products? Because that is what an uninformed client base wants. There is a lot of ''The Emperor's New Clothes'' in our hobby. And many manufacturers who want to sell their products to the greatest number of clients possible know it is smart to not deny them anything. 

 

I hope that I am not blowing your bubble here, Bob. But if you do the research you will find that what I am saying is true. 

 

I had the same problem with the Audirvana's volume. At one point, raising the volume on the A500 remote was having practically no effect. I would get sound that was super low with the remote's volume set on max. Then I noticed the low volume setting in Audirvana. But when I tried to bring it up, it would immediately go back to off. So I stopped listening to it USB to hub and went to listening through my other system.

THEN one day I bringing the Audirvana volume all the way up and it worked. Since that day about 6 weeks ago, I have had no problem with it whatsoever. 

The strange thing is that it was happening in Pure Music as well. And when it corrected in Audirvana, it was also corrected in Pure Music. So, it wasn't just an Audirvana problem. However, to this day I haven't the slightest idea what was causing it. 

But I am having other problems with Audirvana. It totally wiped out all of my personal playlists that I had imported from iTunes. I still have them in Pure Music and also in Bit Perfect (which I sometimes use). So this is indeed an Audirvana issue. 

Have you tried removing Audirvana and then loading it again? I think that is what I will do with mine, but I want to talk to Audirvana about it first. 

 

I really like the room correction. It really tamed the bass in my room. This is the first time that I have had automatic room correction capability.  I have FabFilter Pro Q as a plug in... both in Pure Music and also in Audirvana. I have been using that manually to manage the bass response in my room. It worked fairly well... up to a point. I found that because I was doing it by ear, I would need to reset it for different albums. So I created a list of presets which I could quickly choose. 

The A500 DSP room correction eliminated that need because it corrected the bass across the entire frequency range from 400Hz down. Here is the graph of my room correction. The very flat line at the far right is above the 400Hz point. 

[lolligagger]

17 hours ago, bobfa said:

That is what surprises are, things to keep you guessing..

Good answer! 😃

How will we know when this surprise comes out? Is Mads going to send out emails about it? 

[lolligagger]

I attached that image of the room correction graph in one post. Then when I posted a second time, that image was attached again. Is it going to be attached to every post I make from now on? 

[lolligagger]

Well, I guess not, since it wasn't attached to this last one, perhaps it will only be attached to all subsequent posts sent directly to bobfa.

[lolligagger]

3 hours ago, ShawnC said:

I have used Mogami Gold RCA to XLR for a center channel amp I had.  Worked perfect and sounded great.  Most of the time when it comes to apples to apples, RCA and XLR can sound the same.  XLR has advantages with distance and that they usually lock into the sockets.  RCA can suffer from terminal exposure and lead to long term tarnish on the ends.  XLRs usually come with better sheathing reducing RF interference.  Think of the rats nest behind most peoples audio systems.  All those wires crisscrossing each other can create hiss in the signal path.  That's why their ubiquitous in studios and professional settings.  

Good point... that about the rats nest. Thanks

[lolligagger]

2 hours ago, bobfa said:

I said that "I" have a surprise.  Not Mads.......🤐😇

I misinterpreted!  Thanks for setting me straight. I would have been waiting for the surprise to come from Buchardt. 🤣🤣 

[lolligagger]

3 hours ago, bobfa said:

 The Mogami are around $100 or less and the AuudioQuest are at around $1000.  Are the $$ worth it.

 

    

Are you asking if it is worth a $1000 for the cables? I don't know. if the cables are clearly superior, then I guess it is worth it. 

I have the Light Harmonic Lightspeed USB cable, which retails at $999. But I bought it when it was being offered as a perk on Indiegogo so I got it for a really good price. And recently I bought Wave Audio BNC cables to connect my Chord MScaler to my Chord Dave. You need two of them. These are the ones that, apparently, Rob Watt uses. Normally they cost about $1000. But these happened to be a demo pair, practically brand new, so I got a really great price on them as well. Would I have spent the whole retail price on these cables? Probably not. 

The Mogani are used by pros. They are supposed to be very good sounding cables. And they are very reasonably priced. So I think I will go with those. 

[lolligagger]

By the way, here is something I wanted to say earlier but I forgot to do so. 

I have heard Kii 3 speakers several times at HiFi shows and I never liked them. They always sounded too analytical to me. 

This, in my opinion makes the music sound cerebral. 

To my ear, the A500 system sound more musical and more emotionally involving.

 

Also the bass is extraordinary for such small speakers. 

I have many tracks with powerful bass lines and I can definitely feel that bass in my body and in the couch I sit on. They serve also for watching films. Last night during the credits of a film there was music with a deep continuous bass. I could feel the continuous vibration in my couch. 

So, not only does the bass go deep, but it also moves some air. 

[lolligagger]

10 hours ago, bobfa said:

You have seen what good cables can do.  That is not the core question in my mind.  

 

I have the speakers and the Hub and on the “side” have the AURALiC Altair G1 part of the system.  The G1 is really amazing for the price.  The G1 does double the total cost of ownership of the system.   ($1500 in cables, $2800 for the G1 and $600 for 4TB of storage)  

 

For me the Question of the Day is Hub VS G1.    The similarities between the two are rather interesting.  

 

The Hub will be driven by a Mac Mini using a Transparent USB cable until I can get UPnP working right.  On the Mac I will use Audirvana. I will use my NAS for music storage.  

 

Another 20 or 30 hours of listening will help determine that.    

 

 

The way you describe it, the Auralic Altair G1 seems like a very good product. You have a lot invested in it. I think you said that it even offers room correction.

The only thing missing is the WiSA connection. But the Altair G1 has a preamp which is how you send an analog signal to the speakers XLR inputs. 

So, if it will do almost everything that the present Hub will do, why would you even consider this Hub? Is it because you want the WiSA capability? That would make sense if, as you said, you are interested in more simple solution. 

 

The new hub looks like it is going to be quite something: 

Here are some of the things that Mads wrote to me: 

1) ''Our hub would be able to remove all the wireless errors so it would be much easier to find the error for customers. Usually its WiFi based issues we see people have, but with ours we can have customers to just plug in wires both to speaker and internet. 

And the fact that we would go with a BlueOS streaming module which is both better but also more stable as Google cast does seems to be a bit of a struggle for some.'' 

2) ''I also can't wait for our own hub as it would be a more smooth solution and it should work much better! :)''

3)  ''The new hub has a DAC yes. The hub you have now does not. 

The limitations of the resolution is WiSA, the speakers upsample to 24/192, with the new hub you could wire the speakers to the hub for 24/192 like you also can today with another preamp.''

4)  ''The limitations of the resolution is WiSA, the speakers upsample to 24/192, with the new hub you could wire the speakers to the hub for 24/192 like you also can today with another preamp. ''

5) ''No matter the connection type to the speakers, you can not bypass the speakers internals, and this is the same with all active speakers that uses Digital Signal Processing (DSP) 

So when a signal gets to the A500 it goes like this : if digital : DSP - DAC - AMP. Each driver has its own DAC and AMP which is why the a500 has 3 x dacs and 3 x amps in each speaker. 

If the signal is Analog then its ADC - DSP - DAC - AMP. 

The only reason for using the new hub dac would be either for using it in a passive setup as a preamp, or if you want to use cables to the A500. ''

 

So as you can see from this,  amongst other improvements, the Hub will have improved WiSA connection... and this might bridge the gap that people like yourself are reporting between the WiSA sound quality of the present hub and the sound quality of the direct XLR correction.

And having also superior preamp to the one in the present hub, this might also bridge the sound quality gap because the improved sound quality that you and the other reviewer are getting when using XLR direct may be due to the fact that your preamps are superior to the one in the present hub. 

I am not sure why you are wanting to compare the present hub with your G1 but if it were me, I would enjoy my Altair G1 and wait for the new hub to do the comparison. 

As a matter of fact I realize that I am talking myself out of spending the money for RCA/XLR cables at least until I hear what the new hub is capable of. 

 

 

 

 

 

[lolligagger]

3 hours ago, bobfa said:

@lolligagger 

 

I have not yet said that the XLR inputs of the A500 actually sound better than through the HUB.  With a stable input to the Hub using Audirvana (I think I got it working), I can do some serious comparison.

 

That will start today!

 

In your review you said this:

''I used the Hub and the G1 as two Roon Zones in my testing, comparing the WiSA path vs. the Analog XLR path into the A500 speakers.  

For a few days, I used both sighted and blind to expose the difference between the two paths.  The Altair G1 has a better presentation than the Hansong Hub. The G1 has a tighter presence and more clarity. The overall feeling of the music with the G1 is striking. I have had two friends visits, masks on windows open.  Both were really surprised by the A500's.  One vote for G1 being a lot better.  The other was an abstain as we did not have enough time. For me the Buchardt A500 is the clear winner here.   I can enhance them with my Altair G1 and that has been three steps forward for me.''

 

Unless I am completely misunderstanding what you are saying here, it seems to me that you were using the Altair G1 connected to the A500 XLR inputs and that you found the sound to be better than that of the Hub using WiSA. One of your friends found it to be a ''lot'' better. 

 

This is what another reviewer found to be true as well... although he didn't say it was a lot better.