Conversion of a Chord DAVE to DC power using two Uptone Audio JS-2s

[ecwl]

1 minute ago, DAVE JS2 said:

Thanks for the thought @ecwl; thats actually exactly what I did after I got my room as good as I could the 'old fashioned' way, and had only minor uplifts corresponding to the room L, W, & H.

 

I found that I couldn't really tell any difference with the parametric EQ in or out, so decided to leave it off.

 

I'm pretty certain now that I'm going to swap Blu Mk II for Hugo MScaler and use a JS-2 for power, I think there were RFI improvements to it compared to Blu Mk II.

Sounds like you just don’t have any major problematic bass peaks. Usually if you have peaks more than 5dB, an exact parametric EQ to tune it out would make a pretty obvious difference. Correcting troughs usually don’t work.

 

And yes, I suspect in your system, JS-2 + HMS probably would sound better than Blu Mk II. Even without the JS-2, the USB input of the Blu Mk II is not galvanically isolated whereas the HMS one is. So that alone would probably gives a bit of improvement. Although maybe not because you already have lots of ferrites on your dual BNC cables. I don’t use ferrites. I think Rob Watts thinks adding ferrites between HMS and DAVE actually makes things worse? Whereas ferrites between Blu2 and DAVE are better.

[DAVE JS2]

2 hours ago, skatbelt said:

 

I won't start a psychological discussion... :)

 

There is a whole thread in this sponsored forum about isolation transformers, infused by - who else? - John Swenson:

 

 

 

When implemented properly it will reduce high frequency common mode noise on the AC line. All details can be found in the thread. It is quite a read so in short you'll need an isolation transformer that has enough headroom to power the needed wattage behind it and one that has extreme low so called interwinding capacitance. You need to power all components behind the transformer from one power strip and make this part of the system a closed group in electrical terms. So, no copper connections with powered components that aren't part of the group to prevent from leakage currents.

 

I have mine wired for balanced power. It is a moderate 1KVA model but this plenty enough to power a dCS Network Bridge, DAVE and a Lyngdorf TDAI-3400. The uptream network components are isolated via an etherREGEN and a separately powered subwoofer is isolated via a Jensen transformer.

 

I perceived implementing this as a full component upgrade with added tranquility, ease and realness and at the same time more details in sound reproduction. The difference between balanced/symmetrical vs. asymmetrical was quite shocking to stay in your terms... :)

 

 

 

Thanks so much for taking the time to explain all that @skatbelt, I really appreciate it.

 

I'll definitely dig into that thread in the coming weeks for the details.

 

I heard changes like the ones you describe when I switched to a separate power line, but I'd imagine there is still noise on there. I'm still working out how to measure the noise to see what the extent of any further gains might be...

[DAVE JS2]

3 minutes ago, ecwl said:

Sounds like you just don’t have any major problematic bass peaks. Usually if you have peaks more than 5dB, an exact parametric EQ to tune it out would make a pretty obvious difference. Correcting troughs usually don’t work.

 

And yes, I suspect in your system, JS-2 + HMS probably would sound better than Blu Mk II. Even without the JS-2, the USB input of the Blu Mk II is not galvanically isolated whereas the HMS one is. So that alone would probably gives a bit of improvement. Although maybe not because you already have lots of ferrites on your dual BNC cables. I don’t use ferrites. I think Rob Watts thinks adding ferrites between HMS and DAVE actually makes things worse? Whereas ferrites between Blu2 and DAVE are better.

 

Ah thanks for the info on HMS - sounds like he learned some lessons from Blu Mk II then! I did not know that about the USB.

 

At least ferrites on vs. off the BNC cables is a pretty easy A/B to do!

[ecwl]

4 minutes ago, DAVE JS2 said:

 

Ah thanks for the info on HMS - sounds like he learned some lessons from Blu Mk II then! I did not know that about the USB.

 

At least ferrites on vs. off the BNC cables is a pretty easy A/B to do!

As i said in my first response in this thread, Rob Watts has this funny idea that if your USB streamer needs galvanic isolation, that’s your streamer’s problem, not the Blu2/DAVE problem. Now that’s an exaggeration because DAVE USB input does have galvanic isolation.

 

When Blu2 came out, I think Rob Watts was expecting most people to just play CDs. And if they’re going to use the USB, they’ll use it like he does which is to play it off a laptop off batteries (which would not require galvanic isolation). So the only thing he did was to have galvanic isolation with the dual BNC output of the Blu2 into the DAVE. Which when you’re playing CDs, is at least IMHO just fine (even without the ferrites on your BNC cables).

 

Except Chord at the time did not have HMS so people like me ended up buying Blu2 and not use the CD transport just to get the million taps. And a lot of users on Head-Fi gave feedback that better dual BNC cables sound better and how different USB streamer sound totally different through the Blu2. Some people also noticed, like me, that going through Blu2 sounds better even without the upsampling, probably because my old USB streamer leaks so much noise that it used to overwhelm the galvanic isolation of the DAVE so going through the better galvanic isolation of Blu2 dual BNC made the sound better. So Rob Watts looked into it some more, thought about what the next generation product should be like. So he ended up keeping the dual BNC galvanic isolation in HMS and added USB galvanic isolation AND added additional ferrites within HMS to remove the extra RF noise that can leak into the HMS. 

 

With all these changes, some users found that they no longer have to do any modifications to DAVE/HMS or their USB streamers. But there are still some people who do. As @asdf1000 said, proper grounding of the system to minimize leakage current noise is not always straight forward. At least that’s why I think people still do all the different modifications.

 

I think it’s also important to keep in mind that with other DACs that I’ve listened to, they’re often more sensitive to these issues. Part of the problem is that other DACs tend to have other distortions that would overwhelm the more subtle differences the leakage current noise make. I would argue DAVE is too revealing so these subtle changes are more easily audible. But I would listen to a stock DAVE hooked up to a noisy USB streamer any day over another DAC hooked up to a better streamer and with better power supply. Of course, I’m sure lots of people on this forum would disagree with me. But to each their own.

[MarkusBarkus]

1 hour ago, ecwl said:

Ithink Rob Watts thinks adding ferrites between HMS and DAVE actually makes things worse? 

...actually, I think I recall reading in his posts that he personally used Wave dual BNC cables, which are heavily "ferrited" between HMS and DAVE due to RF "issues." 

[ecwl]

3 minutes ago, MarkusBarkus said:

...actually, I think I recall reading in his posts that he personally used Wave dual BNC cables, which are heavily "ferrited" between HMS and DAVE due to RF "issues." 

Oh yeah... I got confused. You’re right. He initially didn’t think it matters but lately has noticed that Wave dual BNC cables does make the sound slightly better. Haha... Maybe I should just go back to USB into HMS and then switch the dual BNC cables... And get the LPS-1.2... The more I participate in the forums, the more ways I can come up with to spend money

[DAVE JS2]

Thanks @ecwl and @MarkusBarkus, very useful.

 

As I understand it the USB interface on the Blu Mk II itself was a last minute addition based on dealer feedback on the prototypes, so perhaps there wasn't time for a thorough job.

 

I believe the 'RFI' on those BNCs is derived from the clock frequency of the FPGA in the Blu and HMS. It sounds like I should be prepared to keep the ferrite cores on my BNCs regardless (but I will experiment of course!). I wonder if there is any form of optical replacement of BNC cables that someone out there in internet land has tried? That would probably end up being a minefield of noise from the transceivers, power supply angst etc... in itself, but probably worth a Google at some point, though.

 

edit: hah: https://audiobacon.net/2020/02/22/audiowise-opto-dx-the-rf-noise-killer/

[asdf1000]

12 hours ago, ecwl said:

As i said in my first response in this thread, Rob Watts has this funny idea that if your USB streamer needs galvanic isolation, that’s your streamer’s problem, not the Blu2/DAVE problem. Now that’s an exaggeration because DAVE USB input does have galvanic isolation.

 

Let's not forget the time Rob said the Audioquest Jitterbug made a difference to DAVE's USB input !! 😃

 

For any technical disagreements please direct them to Rob, not me !

 

 

[skatbelt]

1 hour ago, asdf1000 said:

 

Let's not forget the time Rob said the Audioquest Jitterbug made a difference to DAVE's USB input !! 😃

 

For any technical disagreements please direct them to Rob, not me !

 

 

 

These are exactly the kind of topics that led me to ban USB a long time ago. In my experience, even USB cables alone make huge differences. This connection type is so brittle. I settled with AES/EBU in on DAVE and have yet to hear a better combo than with the dCS Network Bridge. May be something like a Grimm MU1 will top this but I like to keep things simple and minimalistic and like to keep as much as computer hardware far away from the DAC as possible in noise injecting terms.

 

The discussion about RFI and the apparent need for expensive cables with certain ferrite-configurations has also prevented me from trying out M Scaler technology yet. But may be this is a stupid choice and I don't know what I'm missing...

[DAVE JS2]

Oh my goodness @ecwl @skatbelt @asdf1000

 

This epic Head-Fi review / article / journey is incredibly comprehensive and touches on pretty much all the topics we have all talked about / around in this thread.

 

Recommended reading, when you've got a fair amount of spare time, and its worth getting through to the end. Also worth reading his linked piece about his DIY 'Ferrite Cable of Shame' as background.

[skatbelt]

1 hour ago, DAVE JS2 said:

Oh my goodness @ecwl @skatbelt @asdf1000

 

This epic Head-Fi review / article / journey is incredibly comprehensive and touches on pretty much all the topics we have all talked about / around in this thread.

 

Recommended reading, when you've got a fair amount of spare time, and its worth getting through to the end. Also worth reading his linked piece about his DIY 'Ferrite Cable of Shame' as background.

 

This was mid 2019 and Ray progressed to the following. Note that he returned to USB but with the use of a low cost optical isolation system and he eliminated the M Scaler:

 

 

 

 

[DAVE JS2]

Thanks @skatbelt, looks I've got more reading ahead to catch up with everyone!!

 

This is all fascinating, I'm delighted to be learning so many new things.

[kennyb123]

I have a ton of respect for the folks at Chord.  Rob is a genius when it comes to converting bits into live music.  He really gets sampling theory.  He also understands human hearing and particularly our sensitivity to timing.  His understanding places him amongst a very small group of experts.

 

Having said all that, I’d rather have someone other than Rob design the power supply for his digital products.  Guys like John Swenson, Paul Hynes, Sean Jacobs and Mattijs Vries may be to power supplies what Rob is to D-to-A conversion.  Both my Chord devices (TT2 and HMS) were massively improved with Farad power supplies.  Thus I’m not at all surprised the DAVE gained hugely from an improved power supply.

 

The other essential component when using an HMS is the OPTO-DX.  I can’t speak highly enough about this product.  I know Chord doesn’t think anything like this is needed, but I’ve benefited from tuning them out on this the same way I have tuned them out on power supplies and music servers.  I love Chord to death, but I think the breadth and depth of understanding needed to get everything to the point of being exceptional is a bit too much to expect from one or two guys.  We have to look to multiple experts and try our best to pull it all together in a way that works best for us.  

[skatbelt]

3 hours ago, kennyb123 said:

I have a ton of respect for the folks at Chord.  Rob is a genius when it comes to converting bits into live music.  He really gets sampling theory.  He also understands human hearing and particularly our sensitivity to timing.  His understanding places him amongst a very small group of experts.

 

Having said all that, I’d rather have someone other than Rob design the power supply for his digital products.  Guys like John Swenson, Paul Hynes, Sean Jacobs and Mattijs Vries may be to power supplies what Rob is to D-to-A conversion.  Both my Chord devices (TT2 and HMS) were massively improved with Farad power supplies.  Thus I’m not at all surprised the DAVE gained hugely from an improved power supply.

 

The other essential component when using an HMS is the OPTO-DX.  I can’t speak highly enough about this product.  I know Chord doesn’t think anything like this is needed, but I’ve benefited from tuning them out on this the same way I have tuned them out on power supplies and music servers.  I love Chord to death, but I think the breadth and depth of understanding needed to get everything to the point of being exceptional is a bit too much to expect from one or two guys.  We have to look to multiple experts and try our best to pull it all together in a way that works best for us.  

 

With all due respect, but the TT2 (and HMS) are designed for other market segments and scaled down versions of their big brothers. The choice for cheaper (Chinese) external SMPS power supplies fits this thought. I can even imagine that Chord already assumed that many of their customers would experiment with better power supplies and therefore equipped them with a DC input.

 

I am not saying that DAVE cannot take advantage of a very good external power supply but I suspect that the delta is determined by how well this supply is able to suppress mains noise and instabilities relative to the built-in supply. In this line of thought, this delta can possibly also be achieved by offering cleaner/better power to a 'stock' DAVE.

 

I briefly mentioned the broadly acclaimed Grimm MU1 in a previous post. This unit also has a purposely designed SMPS. The development of the MU1 took over 2 years and every component was careful optimised for SQ. Would they have opted for an SMPS if a LPS had been the better choice? 

[kennyb123]

23 minutes ago, skatbelt said:

 

I briefly mentioned the broadly acclaimed Grimm MU1 in a previous post. This unit also has a purposely designed SMPS. The development of the MU1 took over 2 years and every component was careful optimised for SQ. Would they have opted for an SMPS if a LPS had been the better choice? 

There are many reasons why they could have selected the supply they chose.  Maybe it was as simple as their biases leading them to believe that it’s simply a matter of “suppressing mains noise”.  As John Swenson pointed out earlier in this thread, that’s only part of it.  Low impedance is something the better power supply designers understand the importance of.  I have not seen, for example, much mention of this from Rob Watts.  John Swenson has mentioned a number of times that digital circuits that aren’t supplied sufficient current to support instantaneous demands will dump noise on the ground plane and this noise can cause jitter.  Maybe the Grimm designer has yet to observe this.  Engineers are a stubborn bunch and have biases just like the rest of us.  It’s wrong to assume anything from what they (or anyone) didn’t choose to do.  
 

The Chord products deliver a heck of a value.  To include a custom power supply would increase their retail price considerably.  All their DACs except DAVE were designed to hit a certain price point.  I’m glad Rob applied very little of his budget to the power supply - but still designed it in a way that allows us to choose a better supply if we’d like.

 

You should note that I thus far avoided power supply kinds, like LPS and SMPS.  As I see it, there are only two kinds of power supplies - good ones for digital audio and then the other kind.  The good ones are not cheap.

[DAVE JS2]

15 hours ago, kennyb123 said:

I have a ton of respect for the folks at Chord.  Rob is a genius when it comes to converting bits into live music.  He really gets sampling theory.  He also understands human hearing and particularly our sensitivity to timing.  His understanding places him amongst a very small group of experts.

 

Having said all that, I’d rather have someone other than Rob design the power supply for his digital products.  Guys like John Swenson, Paul Hynes, Sean Jacobs and Mattijs Vries may be to power supplies what Rob is to D-to-A conversion.  Both my Chord devices (TT2 and HMS) were massively improved with Farad power supplies.  Thus I’m not at all surprised the DAVE gained hugely from an improved power supply.

 

The other essential component when using an HMS is the OPTO-DX.  I can’t speak highly enough about this product.  I know Chord doesn’t think anything like this is needed, but I’ve benefited from tuning them out on this the same way I have tuned them out on power supplies and music servers.  I love Chord to death, but I think the breadth and depth of understanding needed to get everything to the point of being exceptional is a bit too much to expect from one or two guys.  We have to look to multiple experts and try our best to pull it all together in a way that works best for us.  

Thanks for your comments @kennyb123, I totally agree with you - 'We have to look to multiple experts and try our best to pull it all together in a way that works best for us."

 

Every time I listen to music I'm glad I switched out that SMPS from the DAVE for JS-2s, and a HMS, JS-2 for power and OPTO DX with appropriate power are now firmly in my sights, plus want to investigate an isolation transformer (I'd be all in, except as I understand it I'd need a 5.6kW one for my power amp alone :/ ).

 

Although new to the forum I've had my learning fast-tracked by everyone on this thread, plus I found @ray-dude's posts about his experiences to be very helpful. Overall I now realise I i) am not alone, ii) am not crazy and iii) at least vaguely going along the right track! 

 

Cheersll

[DAVE JS2]

16 hours ago, skatbelt said:

I suspect that the delta is determined by how well this supply is able to suppress mains noise and instabilities relative to the built-in supply

 

Agree, on noise, isolation and regulation, but I also think the ability to deliver significant current very quickly is key.

 

[JohnSwenson]

5 hours ago, DAVE JS2 said:

 

Agree, on noise, isolation and regulation, but I also think the ability to deliver significant current very quickly is key.

 

The important parameters there are PSRR (Power Supply Rejection Ratio), which is again a graph over frequency. High numbers mean what is on the input gets attenuated by that amount. But this can vary radically with frequency. The next is output impedance over frequency, this relates to how fast the supply output voltage can track changing load currents. A low impedance at high frequencies means it can keep the voltage steady even when the load changes are very quickly which happens a LOT with digital circuitry. The other end is also important. If the load triples its current draw and keeps it there for a long time can the supply keep it there without drooping, then going back up. Both are important for digital audio.

 

Then there is output noise, which gets a lot of attention since it is usually specified as one number (but again it should be a graph over frequency) is actually the least important parameter. Modern designs almost always have local regulators driving the circuitry and the noise of THOSE is usually the determining factor. For an external AC mains supply the first two are usually of primary importance. Of course practically nobody actually specifies these and they usually DO specify the output noise so that is what most people focus on.

 

John S.

[ray-dude]

10 hours ago, DAVE JS2 said:

Thanks for your comments @kennyb123, I totally agree with you - 'We have to look to multiple experts and try our best to pull it all together in a way that works best for us."

 

Every time I listen to music I'm glad I switched out that SMPS from the DAVE for JS-2s, and a HMS, JS-2 for power and OPTO DX with appropriate power are now firmly in my sights, plus want to investigate an isolation transformer (I'd be all in, except as I understand it I'd need a 5.6kW one for my power amp alone :/ ).

 

Although new to the forum I've had my learning fast-tracked by everyone on this thread, plus I found @ray-dude's posts about his experiences to be very helpful. Overall I now realise I i) am not alone, ii) am not crazy and iii) at least vaguely going along the right track! 

 

Cheersll

 

Well timed!  I actually have a loaner Sean Jacobs DC4 in house for testing/review (I've had a Sean Jacobs DC3 on my DAVE for years, and consider it one of the most impactful system upgrades I've done).  Hopefully by the end of the year I'll have a (one part ;) write up on the impact of power quality on DACs like the Chord DAVE.

 

Thank you for posting your experiences

 

[JohnSwenson]

7 minutes ago, JohnSwenson said:

The important parameters there are PSRR (Power Supply Rejection Ratio), which is again a graph over frequency. High numbers mean what is on the input gets attenuated by that amount. But this can vary radically with frequency. The next is output impedance over frequency, this relates to how fast the supply output voltage can track changing load currents. A low impedance at high frequencies means it can keep the voltage steady even when the load changes are very quickly which happens a LOT with digital circuitry. The other end is also important. If the load triples its current draw and keeps it there for a long time can the supply keep it there without drooping, then going back up. Both are important for digital audio.

 

Then there is output noise, which gets a lot of attention since it is usually specified as one number (but again it should be a graph over frequency) is actually the least important parameter. Modern designs almost always have local regulators driving the circuitry and the noise of THOSE is usually the determining factor. For an external AC mains supply the first two are usually of primary importance. Of course practically nobody actually specifies these and they usually DO specify the output noise so that is what most people focus on.

 

John S.

I forgot leakage current. The leakage current is also important. Leakage current can cause low level voltage variations across the ground plane which can increase jitter. (see the ER white paper for details on how this works). Whether this is an issue is very system dependent since there needs to be a connections that forms the leakage loop and that depends on the system connections.

 

John S.

[Nenon]

On 11/18/2020 at 3:55 PM, DAVE JS2 said:

Doing this will void your warranty on the DAVE, goes against the advice of Rob Watts (designer) and Chord, your experience could differ from mine for a host of reasons, and you are of course entirely responsible for any damage you do to your equipment (or anything else) in the process. I also realise it’s not exactly a solution that’s available to all.

 

Notwithstanding all that, I wanted to share this in case it was of interest / use to anyone, as I have found the results to be excellent, and well beyond my expectations. I got what I consider to be a big step change up, not a small evolution.

What did I do?

Replaced the onboard SMPS within my Chord DAVE using two JS-2s (each factory modded to offer 15V from one output). There’s a link to a full description at the end of this post.

 

The actual conversion was well planned in advance, but was a pretty quick & easy thing to do on the day; I am not the most experienced at this type of thing (its the first time I have ever opened up a bit of HiFi kit), and its entirely reversible if you’re even minimally careful.

Why did I do it?

I’ve been hearing for myself the extent of the role of the quality of AC and DC power in sound quality, and in the process finding the DAVE to be very sensitive to power noise & RFI.

 

I’d read on another forum a post about having good results from doing the DC conversion. It made a lot of sense to me and felt it was worth a shot.

How does the DC-converted DAVE sound?

I thought it was already very good, but I’ve noted the following significant qualitative improvements:

 

Performances are more toe-tappingly engaging, completely effortless to listen to, of greater clarity but also with greater smoothness, a very sophisticated sound, the performers and instruments properly feel like they are in the room with me, and I am compelled to listen to my whole library again.

 

I perceive it as a significant step up rather than a small increment. I’m hearing new things in, and new aspects of, every track. I feel it liberates the rest of the DAVE, the SMPS was really holding it back. Its real music.

 

To attempt to use hifi-reviewer vocabulary to describe what aspects of the sound changed:

Much faster transients, highly detailed, better bass depth, weight and focus, instrument separation, even wider soundstage. It removes a sheen of harshness, sibilance is gone. All this is in the context of real musical coherence, rather than ‘hifi’.

 

This improvement was independently verified by my good friend and fellow hifi ‘victim’ who came over to help me with the mod, and my eye-rollingly sceptical wife who says the overall effect of the new detail & in-the-room ‘presence’ is “creepy” - which I’ve taken as an endorsement 😉

What were my expectations?

Given my experiences with the ferrite cores on the BNCs and AC power cables to the Chord kit (see below), I felt / knew the DAVE was sensitive to electrical noise.

 

So I was hoping for improvements to the classic symptoms of electrical noise e.g. reduced harshness & sibilance.

 

What I wasn’t prepared for was the transient speed, bass depth & control and soundstage / presence improvements; ironically I felt these were already good (they’d been improved a lot by a mains spur & thick direct-wired power leads - again, see below).

What’s the rest of the system?

To give some context:

 

Speakers and listening position are in equilateral alignment and care has been taken with siting in the room.

The room has been acoustically treated (by me not a professional) to give a pretty flat frequency response. [Incidentally; in the past I used DIRAC room correction, and I’ve found doing it ‘au naturelle’ eventually gave much better soundstage / presence.]

 

I use Roon with ethernet data going through a couple of Uptone etherRegens, the second one in the listening room and linked via SFP fiber to a Sonore opticalRendu, a single JS-2 powering both.

 

The Sonore USB out feeds a Chord Blu Mk II for WTA upsampling, the output of which goes via Chord’s dual BNC connection to the DAVE [several ferrite cores were needed here to reduce noise from the FPGA in the Blu Mk II corrupting the analog section of the DAVE - its a known issue, ferrites are Rob Watts recommended work-around].

 

An Uptone UltraCap 1.2 feeds 5V to the USB ports of both the Blu Mk II (I use a dual headed iFi Gemini cable into the Blu Mk II) and the DAVE [This is because i) their USB interfaces use USB 5V to power an internal USB clock; and ii) I have found by experimenting that sound quality is directly related to the ‘quality’ of power on those USB interfaces - even on the unused USB port on the DAVE].

 

Balanced output from the DAVE (used in pre-amp mode) goes to a Krell FPB700cx which drives a bi-wired pair of B&W 800 D3s.

 

There is a dedicated 40A mains spur to power the kit in the room, no fuses in the way to the main bits of equipment (there are RCDs and MCB of course). There is a combination of iFi active noise cancellation and ferrite cores on the AC power leads (which I made up myself from 6mm2 cables). [I put the ferrite cores on the DAVE and Blu Mk II power leads because I had some left over left over from the BNC ‘fix’, I got curious and tried it, and harshness / sibilance was improved.]

How did I do the conversion?

I’ve described it in this linked Google doc (with photos!) to try and keep this post to a vaguely manageable length.

 

Special thanks go to Alex at Uptone for his patience when answering my questions and taking the time from his busy schedule to verify the JS-2s would do what I was asking of them before he allowed me to buy them :)

 

Thanks for reading, hope it was of some interest!

 

 

I can confirm that replacing the stock SMPS on the DAVE DAC with a good LPS makes a big difference. I have a DAVE DAC running next to my reference DIY DAC. I did not like the DAVE DAC in its stock form. Without going into too much details, it just sounded too digital to me. My goal has always been to make my digital sound as analog as possible. After replacing the stock SMPS on the DAVE and doing some more changes on my server, the DAVE completely transformed from an average DAC to exceptionally good. It's proudly sitting side by side next to my reference DAC and I am starting to appreciate the DAVE more and more as the power supply is burning in. I don't use the Uptone Audio JS-2 LPS on mine, but I will leave it at that, because this is an Uptone sponsored forum. 

[asdf1000]

23 minutes ago, Nenon said:

It's proudly sitting side by side next to my reference DAC

 

What is your reference DAC ?

[Nenon]

2 minutes ago, asdf1000 said:

What is your reference DAC ?

 

As I mentioned above it's a DIY DAC. It's something I have been working on for 2+ years. I have spent more on parts than a used DAVE goes for. But the DAVE in its current state is superior in almost everything. My DIY DAC still sounds more analog, it has a tone that I like better, and arguably more air around the instruments. That's most likely because of the excellent quality tube analog section. But it does not have the speed, clarity, dynamics, transparency, transients, and everything else the DAVE does. 

[skatbelt]

I have an idea! Why not send the SMPS that you @DAVE JS2 have taken out of DAVE and is now unemployed to @JohnSwenson with the intention to test it on the important properties of a power supply he mentioned above. I think a very large group (DAVE owners but also others) is interested in the outcome and maybe it also says something in general about the state of purposely built SMPSs in high end audio products. I am sure John will take on this challenge!

[asdf1000]

27 minutes ago, skatbelt said:

I have an idea! Why not send the SMPS that you @DAVE JS2 have taken out of DAVE and is now unemployed to @JohnSwenson with the intention to test it on the important properties of a power supply he mentioned above. I think a very large group (DAVE owners but also others) is interested in the outcome and maybe it also says something in general about the state of purposely built SMPSs in high end audio products. I am sure John will take on this challenge!

 

To make it worth his while, send him the entire DAVE DAC ... He can't listen to a state of the art DAC with just it's PSU ! LOL

 

It would be cruel to just ask him to measure and deny him a chance to listen 😢