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Buffalo GS20xx - Bypass 12V stage via 3 external PSs

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Hi tgb

Thanks for starting this thread. 

I'm waiting for my gs2016 from Japan and will have to replace the 100v mains supply and feed 12vdc directly to the pcb to get it up and running. 

Any idea if the 12v input is strictly necessary or can it be lower as the 3.3 / 1.5 / 1VDC regulators surely don't need a 12v input. 

Or maybe there are other regs on the board that need the 12v?  

Thx.

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Has anyone Emailed buffalo tech support, its always worth a try..

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Hi Tims,

if you simply want to replace the internal PS, just plug yours on the 12V pins.

 

This thread is related to power the switch directly with the 3 voltages that are used on the PCB : 3.3 / 1.5 / 1VDC

No 12VDC PS needed in this mod, simply because the purpose is to bypass the regulation steps.

Please find below this photo with the voltage zones & regulation zone to see how it works =>

1882347009_20200701_223003-pins1-1.5-3.3VDCzones.thumb.jpg.5c036d7238721ad2b46ac7daa040bf5a.jpg

The size of the PCB of my GS2024 is a bit bigger than 2008 & 2016, but not much.

There is a 2nd heat sink on the GS2024, but if you find photos of the PCB of 2008 & 2016 you'll see that you have the same zone of down-regulation (there are not strictly at the same place vs GS2024 but the overall story is the same :

this is the GS2024 =>

599605706_GS2024-PCB.thumb.jpg.a6e1b4a60f2b828c82a22057316d31af.jpg

this a rough comparaison of 2024 vs 2016 PCB =>

460713842_PCBGS2016vsGS2024-2.thumb.jpg.d00076aa71dbecb24b622ff38e76abf6.jpg

 

 

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This is the BS-gs2016.

 

21C81347-9433-4218-9CB7-C3DFD811ACAA.thumb.jpeg.64acab119208f42bc6cc40d15d5f4acf.jpeg

 

with temporary smps input.


🇳🇱
Meitner ma1 v2 dac,  Sovereign preamp and power amp,

DIY speakers with scan speak illuminator drivers.

Under development:

NUC7i7dnbe, Euphony Stylus

EtherRegen, LPS1- Isoregen, Lush^2

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Cool !

Does it sound better with the LDOVR ?

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002.jpeg


Synology NAS (LPS) >UA ETHER REGEN (BG7TBL Master Clock) > MACMINI (Uptone MMK JS-2) > Auralic Aries 2.1 > (LPS-2) > AUDIO-GD DI20HE (BG7TBL Master Clock) (I2S OUT)LampizatOr GG /Meridian 808.3> Wavac PRT1 / Wavac EC300B >Tannoy Canterbury SE

 

HP Rig ++ >Woo WES/ > Stax SR-009, Audeze LCD2

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thanks for the photo zerung (I saw it somewhere).

Is it yours ?

 

Unfortunatly, this mod is not about the 3 voltage supply.

12VDC seems to be pretty well done, but then it's the regs on the PCB that still work.

 

The Pink Faun clock add-on : really cool. But unfortunatly we don't how it has been done. I asked the owner to know more or have a more precise photo where the clock has been soldiered : "I paid, fine for me. The technical stuff behind that, that's not my cup of tea"... a pity we get stuck to this photo without explanation...

Rgds

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Sometimes a picture speaks for itself. Or not in this case.

 

A group of us are doing this.

 

There will always be a debate on 'discrete and not' LPS power. This takes the former route. The intervention of sub-intervention in the power path is another issue worthy of debate. Your intervention is welcome from that point of view (Which we are not doing). The sonic result will be interesting for sure-to know.

 

The clock in the switch is another point for debate. Which you have decided not to partake in (Perhaps wisely?).

Using a high quality clock on my Ether Regen gave my network a turbo boost - perhaps should state - completely calmed the network down and pushes the music thru in its most ethereal state (Pun intended) ....So it is, that I am doing the same for my Buffalo switch.

 

Yes, many have decide not to add clock and implement the best power they can provide into their system. Like you, and I understand that is wonderful too!


Synology NAS (LPS) >UA ETHER REGEN (BG7TBL Master Clock) > MACMINI (Uptone MMK JS-2) > Auralic Aries 2.1 > (LPS-2) > AUDIO-GD DI20HE (BG7TBL Master Clock) (I2S OUT)LampizatOr GG /Meridian 808.3> Wavac PRT1 / Wavac EC300B >Tannoy Canterbury SE

 

HP Rig ++ >Woo WES/ > Stax SR-009, Audeze LCD2

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3 minutes ago, zerung said:

Sometimes a picture speaks for itself. Or not in this case.

 

A group of us are doing this.

 

There will always be a debate on 'discrete and not' LPS power. This takes the former route. The intervention of sub-intervention in the power path is another issue worthy of debate. Your intervention is welcome from that point of view (Which we are not doing). The sonic result will be interesting for sure-to know.

 

The clock in the switch is another point for debate. Which you have decided not to partake in (Perhaps wisely?).

Using a high quality clock on my Ether Regen gave my network a turbo boost - perhaps should state - completely calmed the network down and pushes the music thru in its most ethereal state (Pun intended) ....So it is, that I am doing the same for my Buffalo switch.

 

Yes, many have decide not to add clock and implement the best power they can provide into their system. Like you, and I understand that is wonderful too!

Hi Zerung

With you say there was a large boost to SQ your 12v LPS power supply compared with the stock switching supply?  How would you describe the changes?

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9 hours ago, tims said:

Hi Zerung

With you say there was a large boost to SQ your 12v LPS power supply compared with the stock switching supply?  How would you describe the changes?

@tims The unit with out the LPS is a computer interface. Mediator of data, 'A post man'. Best in its class. With the LPS it becomes a musical instrument and starts to be the facilitator of music. The noise dies down and it becomes quieter. The nuance in the music comes through.


Synology NAS (LPS) >UA ETHER REGEN (BG7TBL Master Clock) > MACMINI (Uptone MMK JS-2) > Auralic Aries 2.1 > (LPS-2) > AUDIO-GD DI20HE (BG7TBL Master Clock) (I2S OUT)LampizatOr GG /Meridian 808.3> Wavac PRT1 / Wavac EC300B >Tannoy Canterbury SE

 

HP Rig ++ >Woo WES/ > Stax SR-009, Audeze LCD2

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Hi Zerung,

sorry about my last post, my point was not to be rude towards you or this kind of mods. Absolutly not.

My point was just to know some technical things about your modds :

how & where the Pink Faun for instance is plugged ?

- is it plugged on the part of the PCB that works @ 3.3VDC / 1.5VDC / 1VDC ?

I know that that kind of mod leads to a big jump in SQ. Totally agree vs this mod.

 

For instance, I received transfomer & LPS block (LT2045 based) from MPaudio yesteday : night/day vs the internal SMPS. Amazing that GS2024...

Rgds

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@tgb No offence taken.

 

@Soul Analogue Has just joined CA. He is our resident DIY wizard, the proponent of this intervention. Perhaps I can ask him to chime in on his clock design.


Synology NAS (LPS) >UA ETHER REGEN (BG7TBL Master Clock) > MACMINI (Uptone MMK JS-2) > Auralic Aries 2.1 > (LPS-2) > AUDIO-GD DI20HE (BG7TBL Master Clock) (I2S OUT)LampizatOr GG /Meridian 808.3> Wavac PRT1 / Wavac EC300B >Tannoy Canterbury SE

 

HP Rig ++ >Woo WES/ > Stax SR-009, Audeze LCD2

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Hello all,

 

yes, i have the same idea of powering the buffalo by three lps rails.

 

the intervention post by zerung was my work, most cost effective and keeping the original buffalo chassis. The result of 12v lps and the clock mod is promising.
 

i tried to measure the current taken by the 1v on the gs2016a, i believe it takes higher than 10a..... to build a lps for it is not that easy. And you need a big chassis and heatsink to accomodate a over 10a lps. 

the 3.3v and 1.5v rails should be pretty easy. I have yet to measure the current taken by these rails yet.

 

The separately powered clock mod is essential for the sound quality. But i could just make it work by an smd oscillator 25mhz. I could not make it pass the power on cycle with ocxo. Tried two ocxo, same frequency 25mhz, no avail. 
 

Did someone say there is mod by pinkfaun ocxo? I would be interested

E8E051F3-0146-4982-B78B-67440254D566.jpeg

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Hi Soul Analogue,

Very nice work.

 

Regarding the Amp @ 1V : I don't see how it can be so high.

For instance, I power the GS2024 at 12VDC => 0.8A max, thus : 9.6W at max.

How could ti be possible that the 1V rail uses more power than the device as a whole ?

Sure it is high current, but I'm like you => I'll check again & more precisely the 3 currents :-)

 

Do you know why the OCXO you tested did not power on ?

 

I think it is me that talked about the Pink Faun mod, saying that we do not see how they plug the clock under the heat sink.

So, based on your photo, you proceed like this : green wire is "clock" ? & black one ?

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Green wire is gnd, clock signal is black

 

no idea why it could not be powered on with ocxo... even the manufacture of the ocxo cannot explain... he just ignored me after i show him the pics

 

there is no way an ocxo be placed “under the heatsink”... ocxo physical size must be substantial... 🙄

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the clock can be placed aside the heat sink, like Pink Faun did.

With 2 wires like on your photo. No !?

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Can you show me Pinkfanu’s work on buffalo?

thanks

 

i would also be grateful if you can check the current drawn by the 1v....

i failed to do so in my attempt..

i used a 10a lab variable psu (linear) set to 1v and a fluke dmm in series to check the current...but when powered up... the voltage only got 0.6v at the buffalo end.. and obviously it didnt boot...

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Strange you did not manage to boot it.

See my post above => 

the Buffalo booted.

The issue then... was that the 1V required too much amps for my MPaudio block. But : it worked !

Knowing that the MPaudio block I used is limited at 2.5Amax. The 1V circuits should require 2.5A at very max. Maybe 1.5 or 2A..

Since this trial, I received this => https://fr.farnell.com/tenma/72-2985/multimetre-pince-amp-auto-100a/dp/2667180 ; now the Amp measurement will be more precise & easy to do. Very simple & efficient device.

 

The photo of PinkF work was on the other thread => see my post for instance, here (the pb is that we see nothing "interesting" => 

 

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My two GS2016 will hopefuly arrive soon.  To get them going I need to remove the 100vac switching PS and replace them with a 12v linear supply direct to the pcb's but I've only got one 6 amp linear PS available for both switches. 

Will this be detrimental to SQ by a loss of galvanic isolation due to sharing the power supply with both switches?

Thanks

 

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hi tims,

my GS2024 runs at 12VDC and uses 0.9Amax

so with 6A available you have much more than enough amps to power your 2 switches ! A Y cable & it gonna be fine. No pb.

Rgds

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So I Frankensteined this today and it works,😀.
 

2EC473DB-A603-48B8-B63D-4B76750E5754.thumb.jpeg.502460c43063ee215d3f7a43edff4b8c.jpeg

 

So I had to fall back to a smps to deliver the power, lower right corner.

From 7.5V I dropped it to 3.6V, that heatsink gets 60 degrees C. From this 3.6V I fed a 1A 3.3V module and a 2A 1.5V module. I used 2A module because dissipated heat/ power. 
The 1V, 5A was still a problem I started out with 4V on the input but that the regulators got about 80 degrees C, too hot. Than I tried it one diode, dropping 0.8V that dropped the temperature to 60 degrees C, still to hot. Than two diodes dropping 1.6V so now the 1V/5A regulator has 2V on its input and is about 50 degrees C now.

The heatsink’s from the first regulator and the diodes get about 60 degrees C. Even the smps get 43 degrees C.

So now that everything is working I will put it, temporary, in my system upstream of my Etherregen, connected by fiber.

So now I have to figure out what I need for a power supply. 
7.5Vx 5A= 37.5W    37.5W/3.6V= 10.4A at 3.6V ???

 

 


🇳🇱
Meitner ma1 v2 dac,  Sovereign preamp and power amp,

DIY speakers with scan speak illuminator drivers.

Under development:

NUC7i7dnbe, Euphony Stylus

EtherRegen, LPS1- Isoregen, Lush^2

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Well done Ricky !

 

Regarding the amps, do you have a wattmeter or something to know how much the power SMPS deliver ?

the best is to use an amperemeter to check the amps at each voltage. It is on my todo list, this week.

7.5V/5A it is its max output ? not what it really deliver ?

Then, as your way to deliver the power is a chain 3.3 > 1.5 > 1, we can't guess the amps at each voltage this way (I think).

 

When I power it, I'll use a 4ports USB charger, 1 port per voltage, and will use a amperemeter to check the amps at each voltage. I'll do it quickly because last time the buck converter on the 1V got hot quickly (like you).

Apparently we face high currents (not too high anyway), thus, the final setup I see is : custom transformer (MPaudio can do that ; 4-6weeks delay ; around 70eur).

A "custom" transfo to get a tight dV at the regs (1V should be efficient vs regulation & not too big to keep the heat at minimum).

For instance / the 1VDC : I'll need 1+1=2VDC upstream the regs => with 2*0.4V=0.8V voltage drop in the diode bridge & the ratio 1.41 => (2VDC + 0.8) / 1.41 = 1.985VAC. So a rough 2VAC transfo output would be ok to get the 1VDC with a tight dV=1V at regs.

Hope this rough calculation is ok.

I think using a custom transfo is the only way to manage thoses V & A, and avoid at max the issues regarding the heat transfer at regs due to too high voltage drop.

 

You plugs the GRD of each voltage to the caps next to screws ? Interesting. Equipolarity by doing so ? I'll use your method, thanks.

Rgds

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15 minutes ago, tgb said:

Well done Ricky !

 

Regarding the amps, do you have a wattmeter or something to know how much the power SMPS deliver ?

the best is to use an amperemeter to check the amps at each voltage. It is on my todo list, this week.

7.5V/5A it is its max output ? not what it really deliver ?

Then, as your way to deliver the power is a chain 3.3 > 1.5 > 1, we can't guess the amps at each voltage this way (I think).

 

When I power it, I'll use a 4ports USB charger, 1 port per voltage, and will use a amperemeter to check the amps at each voltage. I'll do it quickly because last time the buck converter on the 1V got hot quickly (like you).

Apparently we face high currents (not too high anyway), thus, the final setup I see is : custom transformer (MPaudio can do that ; 4-6weeks delay ; around 70eur).

A "custom" transfo to get a tight dV at the regs (1V should be efficient vs regulation & not too big to keep the heat at minimum).

For instance / the 1VDC : I'll need 1+1=2VDC upstream the regs => with 2*0.4V=0.8V voltage drop in the diode bridge & the ratio 1.41 => (2VDC + 0.8) / 1.41 = 1.985VAC. So a rough 2VAC transfo output would be ok to get the 1VDC with a tight dV=1V at regs.

Hope this rough calculation is ok.

I think using a custom transfo is the only way to manage thoses V & A, and avoid at max the issues regarding the heat transfer at regs due to too high voltage drop.

 

You plugs the GRD of each voltage to the caps next to screws ? Interesting. Equipolarity by doing so ? I'll use your method, thanks.

Rgds


I have a multi meter but I haven’t measured the current. 
All the voltages have there one regulator and the 3 regulators get power from the regulator, top left corner, and that regulator gets power from the smps.

 

I am not sure if you can get a 2Vac transformer.


🇳🇱
Meitner ma1 v2 dac,  Sovereign preamp and power amp,

DIY speakers with scan speak illuminator drivers.

Under development:

NUC7i7dnbe, Euphony Stylus

EtherRegen, LPS1- Isoregen, Lush^2

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