DENAFRIPS TERMINATOR GOES PLUS

[mevdinc]

Denafrips Terminator DAC Goes Plus. Some previews and news over on 6moon and Mono & Stereo.
Still no volume control as far as I can tell, but the Plus version sounds even more tempting than the original with a price tag of around 6,000 USD.
I will certainly be following this one closely.

Hope to see/read a review here soon.

[richard_crl032]

Hi mevdinc,

 

While is usd2k more than the standard Denafrip that I previously owned, the improvement is much more than any upgrade in power cords, interconnects, speaker cables, power regenerator etc. can do for my system.

I had the luxury of having the demo unit for 1 week but it only took the usual warm up of about an hour to know that I wanted it.

In comparison, the standard Terminator sounds veiled which I would have never thought is an adjective to describe it.

Midbass and bass are tighter which makes all genres more tuneful or I dare say more obvious PRAT that makes my system more musical and I feel more of the reported 23hz of my Salon 2 speakers.

Highs and midranges together with midbass and bass notes are easier to be differentiated and simply "pops" ... not sure if due to yet another 3db improvement in the SNR ratio at now 137db or its another another 2db improvement in its dynamic range.

 

Cheers.

 

Richard

 

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/old-king-of-r2r-dac-is-dead-denafrips-terminator-plus-terminator-arrives.936310/

 

 

[matthias]

10 hours ago, richard_crl032 said:

Hi mevdinc,

 

While is usd2k more than the standard Denafrip that I previously owned, the improvement is much more than any upgrade in power cords, interconnects, speaker cables, power regenerator etc. can do for my system.

I had the luxury of having the demo unit for 1 week but it only took the usual warm up of about an hour to know that I wanted it.

In comparison, the standard Terminator sounds veiled which I would have never thought is an adjective to describe it.

Midbass and bass are tighter which makes all genres more tuneful or I dare say more obvious PRAT that makes my system more musical and I feel more of the reported 23hz of my Salon 2 speakers.

Highs and midranges together with midbass and bass notes are easier to be differentiated and simply "pops" ... not sure if due to yet another 3db improvement in the SNR ratio at now 137db or its another another 2db improvement in its dynamic range.

 

Cheers.

 

Richard

 

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/old-king-of-r2r-dac-is-dead-denafrips-terminator-plus-terminator-arrives.936310/

 

 

 

Richard,

 

please can you compare the SQ of your new Denafrips Avatar vs the Jays Audio transport as a combo with the new Terminator Plus

 

Thanks

 

Matt

[mevdinc]

12 hours ago, richard_crl032 said:

Hi mevdinc,

 

While is usd2k more than the standard Denafrip that I previously owned, the improvement is much more than any upgrade in power cords, interconnects, speaker cables, power regenerator etc. can do for my system.

I had the luxury of having the demo unit for 1 week but it only took the usual warm up of about an hour to know that I wanted it.

In comparison, the standard Terminator sounds veiled which I would have never thought is an adjective to describe it.

Midbass and bass are tighter which makes all genres more tuneful or I dare say more obvious PRAT that makes my system more musical and I feel more of the reported 23hz of my Salon 2 speakers.

Highs and midranges together with midbass and bass notes are easier to be differentiated and simply "pops" ... not sure if due to yet another 3db improvement in the SNR ratio at now 137db or its another another 2db improvement in its dynamic range.

 

Cheers.

 

Richard

 

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/old-king-of-r2r-dac-is-dead-denafrips-terminator-plus-terminator-arrives.936310/

 

 

Thanks foır the heads up.
Sounds like a major improvement on an already great DAC. Can't wait to hear it myself. This could very well be my next DAC.

[richard_crl032]

2 hours ago, matthias said:

 

Richard,

 

please can you compare the SQ of your new Denafrips Avatar vs the Jays Audio transport as a combo with the new Terminator Plus

 

Thanks

 

Matt

 

Hi Matt,

 

Sure .. to my non professional review wordings as well as not exactly to your request with mentioned disclaimers on the same famed cdm 4/19 transport while noting Jay's is =>50% higher pricing and hence I managed to sell odd my Jay's at sgd100 more for new Avatar to first offer locally. 

 

Noted also while I had both the standard and plus Terminators, the Avatar was with me for about 1 week prior before the Terminator Plus i.e. more impression with the standard Terminator.  With this said, I will first share on using both with the standard Terminator and Avatar sounded below subjectively at the least in my system and preference:

 

1. Bigger i.e. wider and taller

2. More involving i.e. more dense, more detailed

3. Tighter midbass and bass i.e. more PRAT and hence also bsck to 2. more involving ... I appreciates now more how critical bass notes are on PRAT or boogy feel to music when calls for

 

One disclaimer here is that Jay's was on AES digital output as i2S A hdmi input to Terminator is occupied by NuPrime Omnia S1 while the Avatar had i2S RJ45 output. Hope you had experienced my very much preference for i2S connection and above is best estimated to be about 30% off if both Avatar and Jay's are on i2S A hmdi output.

 

Motivated by the improvement, I proceed to request for the demo Terminator Plus with the hope that it is only marginally better than the standard to avoid spending not only usd2k but more because I had to sell the standard Terminator at used unit price*. 

 

However this was not to be as you are already aware and again disclaimer on Jay's as I was already very much into using the Avatar while Jay's is still on AES digital output as I did not disconnect i2s hdmi output of the Omnia S1:

 

4. Same as above 1, 2 and 3

5. Darker background that made music "pops"

6. With synced clock possible only on the Avatar, 1, 2, 3 and 5 just pulls ahead to yet another estimated subjective 30%

 

Hope this helps and not raise more doubts to you but I no longer had both Jay's and Avator with Terminator Plus now for your exact request.

 

Cheers.

 

Richard

 

*I am shy to share the big loss again to first offer after just 10 mths but also hope it tells you that it was a easy decision for me for purely improvement in sound quality alone for the Terminator Plus since already decided on the Avatar first that resolved my wish on all possible i2S connectivity

 

 

- 

[Blake]

I had to give in to temptation.... Terminator Plus ordered. 

[richard_crl032]

Hi Black,

Congras !

Welcome to the bright side 🥳

Cheers 

Richard

[StreamFidelity]

1 hour ago, Blake said:

Terminator Plus ordered.

 

A good thing. We look forward to reports. 👍

[ConcreteCow]

Love to give the Terminator Plus a go!

But..... I would like demo it first as dropping 5K on a DAC I haven't heard is somewhat of a serious gamble. Especially if it comes all the way from the Far East.

I presume Customs fees and Import Taxes come into play as well.

Can anyone in the UK help me?

Also, what is the demo etiquette these days? Do I need to pay all in advance with an understanding of a full refund of not purchased? Or is it a deposit of some amount? Or is it based on the existing trust of one's regular Audio Supplier (whom mine unfortunately does not supply/import items from this manufacturer).

 

 

[Blake]

1 hour ago, ConcreteCow said:

Love to give the Terminator Plus a go!

But..... I would like demo it first as dropping 5K on a DAC I haven't heard is somewhat of a serious gamble. Especially if it comes all the way from the Far East.

I presume Customs fees and Import Taxes come into play as well.

Can anyone in the UK help me?

Also, what is the demo etiquette these days? Do I need to pay all in advance with an understanding of a full refund of not purchased? Or is it a deposit of some amount? Or is it based on the existing trust of one's regular Audio Supplier (whom mine unfortunately does not supply/import items from this manufacturer).

 

 

 

Hi,

 

Alvin Chee is the owner of Vinshine Audio.  Vinshine is the worldwide distributor for Denafrips.  Alvin can answer all of your questions and his customer service is the best in the business. 

 

Send Alvin an email at: [email protected] and tell him we sent you

 

 

 

 

[Blake]

T+ has arrived.

[ConcreteCow]

Hi Blake,

Looking forward to hearing your thoughts on the T+ 

Congratulations on your new acquisition!

I'm still deciding whether to go for it.....

[richard_crl032]

https://6moons.com/audioreview_articles/denafrips7/

 

Glad clock outputs of TP is finally explored here albiet I need to test out gaia to sync instead of daisy chain my Avatar and demo gaia next week .. and to be continued.

 

I prefer direct connection to TP of the Avatar and also my Antipodes ex via usb but will be interesting especially if conversion to i2s in gaia of this usb and synced clock to TP's ocxo clock will be better sound quality.

 

Cheers.

 

Richard

[richard_crl032]

Powess of synced digital components

[Blake]

Gaia and TPlus clocks now synced up with two Kimber D60's.  Pretty cool feature.

 

 

[divertiti]

@Blake Congrats on the purchase. Any early impressions on the Terminator Plus? How does it sound vs. the Terminator original model with and without Gaia?

[Blake]

3 hours ago, divertiti said:

@Blake Congrats on the purchase. Any early impressions on the Terminator Plus? How does it sound vs. the Terminator original model with and without Gaia?

 

I am smiling, but I am still trying to get a handle on everything as the Terminator Plus is burning in as well as some new clock cables and HDMI cable.  I will give things another couple of weeks to settle in and then I will try to put together my thoughts.  To further complicate matters, I just had some LessLoss gear in for demo. So many variables, but I will eventually sort it all out.

[richard_crl032]

On 7/24/2020 at 5:27 AM, ConcreteCow said:

Hi Blake,

Looking forward to hearing your thoughts on the T+ 

Congratulations on your new acquisition!

I'm still deciding whether to go for it.....

 

Hi Concretecow,

 

Taken the plunge yet on the T+ ?

 

Since you are on D90 dac and not having gaia or avatar for added synced components, standard T may also be considered especially if you can get a used one at 50% of the T+.

 

Cheers.

 

Richard

 

[matthias]

Hi guys,

 

is there already a consensus if the additional Gaia is an improvement on the Terminator Plus when the input is via USB?

 

Thanks

 

Matt

[richard_crl032]

4 minutes ago, matthias said:

Hi guys,

 

is there already a consensus if the additional Gaia is an improvement on the Terminator Plus when the input is via USB?

 

Thanks

 

Matt

 

Hi Matt,

 

No .. only Blake has both the gaia and T+ so far that I am aware of and he is busy as well as wanting to burn in his cablea etc.

 

I am a hair to getting the demo gaia but difficult to schedule as there is a queue of potential customers wanting I think 😅

 

Cheers.

 

Richard

[richard_crl032]

expand...

Hi All,

First of all, daisy chain of Avatar and gaia input to oxco clock output of T+ works !! This is really a denafrips ecosystem of digital playback though not advertised as such by denafrips or mentioned in detailed review by 6moon.

Secondly, key objective of getting aes-ebu output of my Bel Canto fm-1 tuner to gaia to convert to i2s and synced to oxco clock of T+ sounds so much better .. more detailed and clean with blacker background like veil had been lifted as compared to direct aes-ebu output directly to T+. Asked my dotter as I switch between the 2 and she remarked "you need to ask ? So obvious !"

Thirdly, on this main query if usb input directly to T+ or via gaia to convert to i2s that is synced to the oxco clock of T+, there is no miracle for the usb of my Antipodes ex and sounded less detailed and less engaging.

Speculative but the usb output from my Antipodes is no slouch and does not benefit from going via gaia but a lesser usb source may.

Similarly, the aes-ebu of my Bel Canto tuner benefitted very much via the gaia after conversion to i2s and synced to the ocxo clock of T+ but perhaps a higher quality aes-ebu or other digital source of say esoteric k series transport may not ... Avatar that I tested for sure benefits when synced to T+ .. more solid imaging and prat.

Hope this helps and YMMV since system dependent, personal preference and past experience ... I am still enjoying my Bel Canto fm 1 and it is unbelievable that fm radio can sound this good

Cheers.

Richard

 

[richard_crl032]

***Speculative but the usb output from my Antipodes is no slouch and does not benefit from going via gaia but a lesser usb source may.**

Hi All,

For completeness of the abovementioned, I connected my allo's usb bridge to the gaia and behold the needed validation ... the sound quality improved to more detailed, dense and musical presentation !

Believe this update sums up the outcome of my planned venture with gaia with synced clock to T+ and i2s and should help bros here to consider the digital source quality if gaia will improve the sound quality of your system if you have the T+.

Unfortunately, I cannot share further on validated result of the more common query getting the gaia for the standard Terminator or non Denafrips dac since having none.

I can only guess that without synced clock or even i2s connectivity of T+ which I covet due to their sound technical advantages, improvement is likely less but pure speculation of course while bro Blake, John, Abyss etc. had already reported improvement of the gaia with at least the standard Terminator and/or T+.

Cheers.

Richard

[richard_crl032]

Hi All,

 

Just listened to the allo's usb bridge signature via the gaia and T+ and compared the Antipodes directly via the T+ with various same tracks on both.

Without the gaia for both allo's and Antipodes to the T+ that I am very familiar with, it was like subjectively 60-70% for the allo's if Antipodes is at 90% ....

With the gaia for allo's, it gets to 75-80% of the Antipodes which is quite impressive and nice as a backup server but it also tells me just how nice the Antipodes is .. crisp, clear and extended in comparison.

Again ymmv and this helps further ....

Cheers.

[luisma]

Thank you Richard for the detailed explanation. I think I'm missing it but can you list what resolution of digital stream are you outputting from the Antipodes and the Allo? The T+ board accepts PCM 1536 and DSD 1024 (if I'm not mistaken) and the Gaia PCM 784 / DSD 512?) and I know digital resolution is not everything but just curious which samples you were using

 

thank you so much

 

Luis

[richard_crl032]

1 hour ago, luisma said:

Thank you Richard for the detailed explanation. I think I'm missing it but can you list what resolution of digital stream are you outputting from the Antipodes and the Allo? The T+ board accepts PCM 1536 and DSD 1024 (if I'm not mistaken) and the Gaia PCM 784 / DSD 512?) and I know digital resolution is not everything but just curious which samples you were using

 

thank you so much

 

Luis

 

Hi Luis,

 

My pleasure .. had always been looking at esoteric and dCs with their clocking but never been able to afford when younger but now old to be wiser not to spend too much ... until ok denafrips chi-fi products at chi-fi pricing at worldclass quality in sound and technology.

 

For both usb bridge signature and the antipodes, they are playing at default setting with same 44.1khz flac and dsd64 music files primarily ... not into upsampling nor have the knowledge to do so but seems moode os of usb bridge signature does upsamples to 32 bit for the usual 16bits 44.1khz flac and dsd128 for dsd64 respectively.

 

Cheers.

 

Richard