beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 I still like listening to LP's from time to time, and am always astonished when I do.... ATC's mid dome hasn't changed much in MANY years, and they still make some of the best sounding speakers imho. Vintage JBL's refurbished by kendrick are absolutely STUNNING!! LS3/5A still carry their weight in gold. I am sure there are many other gems out there still today. I would say of ALL engineering, audio engineering has progressed the least. Computing power has been dramatic. Hell, I remember telling my boss to get into the internet and I set up one of the first small company internet access in San Diego, and that seemed like just yesterday. I still have a sealed blank cd with a $15 price tag, and bought my first cd recorder for $2K....that would probably be like $20K by today's terms, and the cd's would fail during recordings at $15/pop 50% of the time. We have come a long way in most engineering fields...but ho hum audio....still unimpressed. You can put together a great sounding system for a lot less money today, but as far as actual SQ, there hasn't really been any really "wow" moments imho. Check out all of kendrick JBL videos...amazing...although i do notice this system is using a chord dave (smile) Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 53 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: Personal attacks aren’t allowed here. This is your warning. Depends on who is doing the attacking...I have seen a lot go on here by regular users. You have a great site, but I see bias regularly. I only wish you would be more unbiased in personal attacks you allow...but i must admit, it's been a couple years since i have been on, and it does seem much more quiet now than i remember...so maybe you have cleaned up the act a little...I certainly hope you don't allow personal attacks anymore...i certainly remember seeing many a day against many different people regularly in the past. Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 i changed the video above..no dave in that one....I also misspelled...it's kenrick not kendrick. If you haven't checked out what that guy does with vintage speakers, you ought to check them out...amazing.... Here is video with restored ALTEC's... I could still kill myself for selling a pair of Vintage JBL's that went through my hands, all for a quick $300 flip... When I heard them, I thought to myself, wow, these sound really good for their age,and off to my next flip....my biggest mistake in audio. Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 Very fun...watch, especially about blind test infiniti kappa bookshelf vs wilson https://www.therobinsonbrand.com/journal/3-life-changing-moments-in-hi-fi-for-me Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 Any salesman that admits they have sold snakeoil may be worth listening to... Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 3 minutes ago, SJK said: Dude, you keep making this personal - we should be able to have a discussion without people being insulted. My point wasn't that there's anything wrong with CD players, but more that most system design today does not include that element. While all CD players can read the digital data well, the implementation of the analog side is where the true art form exists. The CD players that do analog very well tend to be expensive units and for good reason. However, by ripping a CD to a digital file, the key element now becomes the quality of the DAC that you have in your system. If your stereo has a DAC already, and within any budget, you can buy a much better DAC because you no longer need that CD player with a DAC that likely isn't as good as a standalone unit. That's why high-end CD players can be had at a reasonable cost, it's the buggy whip of the past. And, by ripping the CD to a digital file you have many more options on how that file can be played back with different software programs that allow for a system to be tweaked, upgraded or changed for a desired goal. many times a cd transport can sound better (either using their internal dac or an external one) than playing the same file from a software player. daverich4 and Teresa 1 1 Link to comment
Popular Post beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted June 8, 2020 34 minutes ago, SJK said: I only ever owned one transport - can't remember what it was as I didn't have it very long as part of a "transitional" system. I agree that a transport allows you to play the CD without the built-in DAC getting in the way. I'm not clear as to how that could be better than playing back a file from software. To your mind, is that because the software is inadequate or do you think the file ripping process is the culprit? no problems with ripping if you use dbpoweramp (one of only a dozen programs i have ever paid for)...shows if rip is accurate along with checksum. i am sure it has to do with timing and power. I am not sure i have ever got better sound from a source than playing a bluray audio or sacd from a marantz sacd player regardless of what dac i had it hooked up to....and i know there are a lot more expensive transports out there....even plain cd players. Edit to add.... Even Mike Moffat (sp?) of Schiit DAC engineering, is working on a CD transport that he "suggests" will sound better than anything he has ever heard and I don't know if he said in jest or not, but his remark was something like "I dunno it's only 1's and 0's, right?"... If a DAC engineer can't suggest why a transport can sound better than a software player, then who knows....but I have experienced similarly... I really don't know about audio engineering....it either has "relatively" plateaued and is almost all snakeoil, but all these supposed "BIG WOW" moments are hardly impressive to me, and I am not convinced that you can't piece together some of the best vintage equipment in a dbt against modern day stuff and see a 70%+ concensus....but again, i think they can do it a lot cheaper today though.... Teresa and beerandmusic 1 1 Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 5 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: We get it, you believe you're smarter and more competent than the people who build this stuff for a living. You've also determined how much they pay in employee healthy care, retirement, facility rent, cabinet costs etc, to determine the products are way over priced. Perhaps you should start a Digi&Analog Audio Company and sell the stuff at a fraction of the price and be the savior of all high end audio. That sounds almost border-line like personal attack? Not saying you are wrong...just sounds personal. Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 3 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: What about it is a personal attack. The guy/gal always says he can do things much better than the manufacturers and his comments about the costs of materials are also along the same lines. I can only go by what s/he says. I think you could express your point without using "attack" words...take a moment and see if you could word it differently? Sounded "off the cuff" daverich4 1 Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 The biggest issue is the time in engineering costs. It's not the BOM....people forget this....new designs have to include "cost of engineering". Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 7 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: Please let me know what the personal attack words are. "you believe you are smarter and more competent" "you have determined" "be our savior" "start your own company" could be::: Is it possible that there are more costs involved in running a business and that the BOM is the least of the expenses? Have you ever owned your own business and know the costs that are involved? My mom used to always say to try and phrase your remarks as questions as to be less confrontational....not that i ever listened to my mom (smile). daverich4 1 Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 1 minute ago, The Computer Audiophile said: No comment. You asked, i just gave you my opinion...i am not stating I am any more perfect...i just found it funny that you just said "no personal attacks". I guess it is just "relative". Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 3 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: I didn't attack anyone. When someone says they know more than others etc... It isn't an attack to say it back to them. Chris, I haven't followed this guys posts but based on his last post questioning your IQ, i would give him the boot...clearly he is a trouble maker... I am sure you got your wilsons for a dance, and I am envious...this guy is just trouble. Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 11 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: To be honest, I couldn't even finish reading the entire thing until you said that. I went back to look. It's par for the course these days. Many people believe they are much more important than they are and feel like everyone owes them something. As an example, here is a PM I received not too long ago. I hope you can see how this gets really old. You earn much more than whatever you make, that is for sure! People are just envious. You have a successful business that is a service to the community...you couldn't be more proud. Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 2 hours ago, Norton said: There certainly seems to be something of a small revival of interest in CD players and transport across various forums. I don’t know whether this is just clever pre- marketing from the likes of Schitt or something more. A back to back test of SOTA CDT/CDP vs file based replay would be interesting. Personally I find that file playback from a custom thumb drive or SD card card transport beats both streaming and disc SQ wise, and is more convenient than a CD player too. playing a dsd file in a thumb drive on my sr6013 sounds damn good....what is this custom thumb drive you are talking about? Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 12 minutes ago, SJK said: Hey, that's what it's all about. You don't have to chase the brass ring. Play what you like, kick back and enjoy your day. I agree, i just commented in another thread that I have spent a lot of money and time "chasing" best hardware, when I realized that depending on the music, I much prefer some hardware vs other hardware and that there isn't any "magic bullet". In some cases I may prefer a schiit dac and in other cases I prefer a dsd dac. When i play rock, it sucks on my jazzy speakers that I love for vocals. I never did find speakers that I liked better for both rock and for jazz...although i am tempted to try tekton now, but I am relatively certain i wouldn't prefer them to ATC for jazz ballads with vocals....and damn...i sure wish i still had my jbl 4425's. Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 1 hour ago, SJK said: I think that the world of digital music playback has moved beyond the hardware and well into the software/configuration side of things. It certainly is amazing when you stop and REALLY think about it. How much music, emotion, and God given talent, can really be put on a small .wav file, and how many of these files can be stored on a micro-sd card. If not for digital music, there would not be the diversity we have across the world....it's only 1's and 0's, yet it makes so much color. Link to comment
beerandmusic Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 7 minutes ago, Norton said: Thumb drive transport Looks interesting, but wish it supported usb out to dac (it says only spdif), and only can select 99 songs, using only their player. Still, it's a start...would love to see more features....i bet it sounds really good though! Link to comment
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