MartinT Posted April 12, 2021 Author Share Posted April 12, 2021 5 hours ago, Rasputin said: Hi Martin, where have you purcahsed this one? seems non-catalog item at minicircuits I bought the first one from AliExpress. I have another coming from Mini-Circuits UK. TP-Link MR6400 4G router > Uptone EtherREGEN reclocker > Sonore Signature Rendu SE streamer > Gustard U18 DDC > Gustard X26 Pro DAC > Belles SA-100 power amp > Usher Dancer Be-20 speakers. AfterDark clocks x 2. PS Audio P3 & P10 regenerators. https://theaudiostandard.net Link to comment
MasterWarzombie Posted April 12, 2021 Share Posted April 12, 2021 2 hours ago, owldiscourse said: Just a heads up with the digital cable connecting the clock to etherregen. Was rummaging through a drawer this morning and found a 75ohm cable (a Nordost Silver Shadow) that I decided to replace the new one ($75) that I ordered from Amazon when I picked up the AfterDark square wave clock - and oh boy was I surprised! Had been playing Biko prior to that and could barely make out the African singers at the beginning. Swapped the cables and was making out the number of singers and their words DISTINCTLY... even at a much lower volume level. What a pleasant surprise - things are more transparent, detailed and clear than they already were. My toe is tapping and I'm on the edge of my seat again... I know Alex said to pay attention to the quality of this cable but OH MY! I have a DR 510 oyaide cable. I think this is a suitable cable for my square wave. I will stay with the belden cable provided by After Dark afterwards to make a comparison again, but I no longer want to burn in the clock again because as soon as you turn off, you start over. It is painful this story besides. Link to comment
R1200CL Posted April 12, 2021 Share Posted April 12, 2021 I purchased this cable as a test https://no.mouser.com/datasheet/2/1030/141-12BM_2b-1699951.pdf It’s very stiff. It was actually this one https://no.mouser.com/ProductDetail/549-CLPFL-0010-BNC that was the reason for my visit at the shop. So YES 😀 @ambre I did mean the Crystek. My bad. I said the BLP-10.7+, had arrived today, and I just switched it out with the Crystek. I have ordered a second one (BLP-10.7+) from AfterDark. It was shipped today together with a King clock. The plan is to test out the Cybershaft T with dual filters. Link to comment
owldiscourse Posted April 12, 2021 Share Posted April 12, 2021 36 minutes ago, MasterWarzombie said: I have a DR 510 oyaide cable. I think this is a suitable cable for my square wave. I will stay with the belden cable provided by After Dark afterwards to make a comparison again, but I no longer want to burn in the clock again because as soon as you turn off, you start over. It is painful this story besides. Interesting...if you don't turn the clock off and simply swap cables does it restart the whole burn-in process as well? Link to comment
Popular Post PYP Posted April 12, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted April 12, 2021 Just now, owldiscourse said: Interesting...if you don't turn the clock off and simply swap cables does it restart the whole burn-in process as well? you don't need to turn off the power to the clock in order to swap cables. At least with the Cybershaft that is true. R1200CL and owldiscourse 1 1 Grimm Audio MU1 > Mola Mola Tambaqui > Mola Mola Kaluga > B&W 803 D3 Cables: Kubala-Sosna Power management: Shunyata Room: Vicoustics “Nature is pleased with simplicity.” Isaac Newton "As neither the enjoyment nor the capacity of producing musical notes are faculties of the least use to man...they must be ranked among the most mysterious with which he is endowed." Charles Darwin - The Descent of Man Link to comment
PYP Posted April 12, 2021 Share Posted April 12, 2021 2 hours ago, owldiscourse said: Just a heads up with the digital cable connecting the clock to etherregen. Was rummaging through a drawer this morning and found a 75ohm cable (a Nordost Silver Shadow) that I decided to replace the new one ($75) that I ordered from Amazon when I picked up the AfterDark square wave clock - and oh boy was I surprised! Is this a one meter cable? The online reviews are as impressive as your impressions. The general recommendation is to keep the cables short, but perhaps the superior construction outweighs length if the cable you are replacing isn't constructed as well (not saying the one you replaced is faulty or a bad cable). Grimm Audio MU1 > Mola Mola Tambaqui > Mola Mola Kaluga > B&W 803 D3 Cables: Kubala-Sosna Power management: Shunyata Room: Vicoustics “Nature is pleased with simplicity.” Isaac Newton "As neither the enjoyment nor the capacity of producing musical notes are faculties of the least use to man...they must be ranked among the most mysterious with which he is endowed." Charles Darwin - The Descent of Man Link to comment
owldiscourse Posted April 12, 2021 Share Posted April 12, 2021 Just now, PYP said: Is this a one meter cable? The online reviews are as impressive as your impressions. The general recommendation is to keep the cables short, but perhaps the superior construction outweighs length if the cable you are replacing isn't constructed as well (not saying the one you replaced is faulty or a bad cable). Yes, I was worried about the length - 2x as long as the Wyde Eye it replaces but no problems so far PYP 1 Link to comment
PYP Posted April 12, 2021 Share Posted April 12, 2021 Well, now I'm getting curious about clock cables. Can anyone with technical knowledge comment on these specifications for a digital 75 ohm cable? "This cable has a DCT solid copper central conductor in an air blown polyurethane foam web, this is wrapped in DCT copper foil under a DCT copper wire shield inside a PVC jacket." Impedance 75+/-3 Ohm Capacitance 52+/-3 pF/M Attenuation 20 degree C 5MHz 0.80 dB/100m 10MHz 1.20dB/100m 50MHz 3.20 dB/100m 100MHz 5.40 dB/100m 200MHz 6.50 dB/100m 300MHz 8.50 dB/100m 470MHz 11.00dB/100m 600MHz 13.50 dB/100m 1000MHz 16.40 dB/100m Grimm Audio MU1 > Mola Mola Tambaqui > Mola Mola Kaluga > B&W 803 D3 Cables: Kubala-Sosna Power management: Shunyata Room: Vicoustics “Nature is pleased with simplicity.” Isaac Newton "As neither the enjoyment nor the capacity of producing musical notes are faculties of the least use to man...they must be ranked among the most mysterious with which he is endowed." Charles Darwin - The Descent of Man Link to comment
ambre Posted April 12, 2021 Share Posted April 12, 2021 39 minutes ago, R1200CL said: I purchased this cable as a test https://no.mouser.com/datasheet/2/1030/141-12BM_2b-1699951.pdf It’s very stiff. It was actually this one https://no.mouser.com/ProductDetail/549-CLPFL-0010-BNC that was the reason for my visit at the shop. So YES 😀 @ambre I did mean the Crystek. My bad. I said the BLP-10.7+, had arrived today, and I just switched it out with the Crystek. I have ordered a second one (BLP-10.7+) from AfterDark. It was shipped today together with a King clock. The plan is to test out the Cybershaft T with dual filters. Curious how Crystek compares with Mini Circuits BLP-10.7+. ? soares 1 Quote Ethernet::4x Bonn Silent Angel 8P, Afterdark Emperor Doublr Crown Masterclock and Cybershaft 75 Ohm,Mini Circuits convertor,Uptone EtherRegen with 75Ohm. SOTM Cat CAT 7. Audio: Auralic Vega G2.1, Cambridge Edge W, Kef Reference 3 speakers. Power: Farad super 3 (2x) , Keces P8 ( 2 Uptone LPS1.2 ) Afterdark 5V: Cables:Meicord Opal, SOTM Cat7 with filtering, Ghent Audio DC , Farad Level 2, Sharkwire speaker cable Link to comment
MasterWarzombie Posted April 12, 2021 Share Posted April 12, 2021 35 minutes ago, owldiscourse said: Interesting...if you don't turn the clock off and simply swap cables does it restart the whole burn-in process as well? This is the procedure indicated by @AfterDark. it is not advisable to disconnect the bnc cable from the clock if it is on . owldiscourse 1 Link to comment
ambre Posted April 12, 2021 Share Posted April 12, 2021 16 minutes ago, MasterWarzombie said: This is the procedure indicated by @AfterDark. it is not advisable to disconnect the bnc cable from the clock if it is on . ???? Adrian please comment https://audiophilestyle.com/profile/41989-afterdark/ Quote Ethernet::4x Bonn Silent Angel 8P, Afterdark Emperor Doublr Crown Masterclock and Cybershaft 75 Ohm,Mini Circuits convertor,Uptone EtherRegen with 75Ohm. SOTM Cat CAT 7. Audio: Auralic Vega G2.1, Cambridge Edge W, Kef Reference 3 speakers. Power: Farad super 3 (2x) , Keces P8 ( 2 Uptone LPS1.2 ) Afterdark 5V: Cables:Meicord Opal, SOTM Cat7 with filtering, Ghent Audio DC , Farad Level 2, Sharkwire speaker cable Link to comment
R1200CL Posted April 12, 2021 Share Posted April 12, 2021 13 minutes ago, MasterWarzombie said: it is not advisable to disconnect the bnc cable from the clock if it is on . This requires explanation. Can you short the signal, which lead to damage ? Maybe John can enlighten us ? Link to comment
MasterWarzombie Posted April 12, 2021 Share Posted April 12, 2021 5 minutes ago, R1200CL said: This requires explanation. Can you short the signal, which lead to damage ? Maybe John can enlighten us ? 5 minutes ago, R1200CL said: This requires explanation. Can you short the signal, which lead to damage ? Maybe John can enlighten us ? I quote afterdark ! Hi! GMG, Thanks for your question. The OCXO is design to work with powers on all the time, the Giesemann clock will reach its performance around 3 hours, up to 7days and 35days to reach its max performance. The waiting is all rewarding and worth it. The sounding will be more laid back and silky smooth after runs in. For moving the clock or unplug the BNC clock cable from the devices , we recommended to switch the power off first. It is for safety reason for audiophile devices. So, it is suggested to connect every clock cables to all devices, before power on the Giesemann Clock. The Giesemann Clock will be operated in 1 second. However, the burn-in time will be re-start agains. Best Regards, Adrian AfterDark. Link to comment
R1200CL Posted April 12, 2021 Share Posted April 12, 2021 3 minutes ago, MasterWarzombie said: It is for safety reason for audiophile devices. @AfterDark. This doesn’t make sense to me. Any device in the other end must be powered off, and you don’t say it’s for the clock itself. And you can’t say that your clock can potentially damage other equipment, or are you ? Time to look for a CE sticker 😂 ambre 1 Link to comment
Popular Post MartinT Posted April 12, 2021 Author Popular Post Share Posted April 12, 2021 I received my second Mini-Circuits BLP-10.7-75+ just earlier today. It's now in circuit from clock to EtherREGEN. Both reclockers are fed from 10MHz sinewave outputs via Belden 4694R cables into the 11MHz filters. I wondered if a second one could possibly be audible but it is. With both filters in place, the sound is incredibly delicate when it comes to tiny details. Cymbal strikes, shimmer and decay are to die for. Complex mixed vocals can be better picked out. Percussion strikes are startling. The sense of timing is very tight with great boogie factor. The whole presentation flows very naturally. ZeusOdin, ambre and PYP 1 2 TP-Link MR6400 4G router > Uptone EtherREGEN reclocker > Sonore Signature Rendu SE streamer > Gustard U18 DDC > Gustard X26 Pro DAC > Belles SA-100 power amp > Usher Dancer Be-20 speakers. AfterDark clocks x 2. PS Audio P3 & P10 regenerators. https://theaudiostandard.net Link to comment
Popular Post JohnSwenson Posted April 13, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted April 13, 2021 5 hours ago, R1200CL said: @AfterDark. This doesn’t make sense to me. Any device in the other end must be powered off, and you don’t say it’s for the clock itself. And you can’t say that your clock can potentially damage other equipment, or are you ? Time to look for a CE sticker 😂 There are a couple of issues that are being confused with each other. 1: warmup of a clock box 2: warmup of an ER 3: burnin of a clock 4: burnin of an ER 5: burnin of a clock cable #1 and #2, it takes several hours for the electronics to get to an equilibrium temperature, for an ER I would go for at least 8 hours, preferably a day. Who knows how external clocks respond. But it is probably a good idea to go with similar times. This is all about all the parts on the board getting to an equilibrium temperature. #3 and #4, burnin of electronics CAN take a long time. I can't tell you what the burnin time of an external clock is, but an ER takes two to four weeks, if you are using an external clock it needs to be with the external clock selected and on. Data should be running through the ER. You can certainly burnin an ER and and external clock at the same time. Burnin is actual changing of electrical properties of devices (and the board itself). Once the burnin has happened it does NOT take the full time after a short period of being powered down. You most likely WILL need to go through #1 and #2. The changes that happen with burnin do seem to reverse themselves during prolonged powered down. Thus if your system is powered down for six months you will most likely have to go through the burnin again. #5, cables also need burnin, particularly if you have a squarewave source. And of course as the quality of dielectric (insulation around the wire(s)) increases the time for burnin also increases. So a really good cable can take at least a month to really burnin in. This does NOT mean it sounds terrible early on, but it might take some time (weeks months) to reach its best. The ER will not be harmed by being powered down and a clock being fed to it, but I can make no such statement for other devices you may be feeding with a clock. So for trying different cables into an ER you CAN leave the clock on, turn off the ER, swap cables, turn on the ER. BUT if it is a new cable you need to start the cable burnin all over again. The clock and ER will not need to be burned in again, but a new cable definitely will need time. These cable burnin issues are not nearly as big a deal if you are sending a sine wave over the cable. Note I did NOT say there was NO effect from cable burnin when using a sine, but it is significantly less of an issue. I hope this clears this up. John S. nichino, ZeusOdin, PYP and 10 others 3 2 8 Link to comment
R1200CL Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 15 hours ago, MartinT said: I have another coming from Mini-Circuits UK. It’s still not listed as available. Did you make some custom order ? https://www.minicircuits.com/WebStore/dashboard.html?model=BLP-10.7-75%2B The AliExpress price is quite high. Link to comment
Rasputin Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 Dear audio frends:) I need some help buying the minicircuits 75ohm filter. The minicircuits.com did not answer my mail, Afterdark after I placed and paid an order, cancelled it due to (suspended EMS service to Russia - I will investigate if that is correct), so it seems close to impossible to buy it from here. Any help of getting it and sending to Russia would be greatly appreciated. I know, this is a strage request, but NOW that so many people report not subtle impovements, how can I live without such a filter? Life is not the same any more 🤩 any help as where to buy or buying and shipping to Moscow (I know very aggressive and strage country))) but we love Stravinsky:) would be appreciated. Obviously the payment is not a problem, I can paypal the money any time. Emm Labs NS1, Emm Labs DV2, Trusov AMP ( AB class 400 watt into 8 ohm), Vandersteen 5a Carbon, Dyrholm Vision series cables XLR and power cords, meitner speaker cables, etheregen, 2* Farad super3 with purple SR fuses, AfterDark double Crown, RAL RJ45 Link to comment
manueljenkin Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 On 4/11/2021 at 6:49 PM, R1200CL said: I’ve saw this 1.5 hour video. Not sure, but it seems to be a limitation to how good phase noise you need, before the internal noise of various components is added. Would be interesting to know if there actually is a phase noise number to be considered as sufficient ? I guess a question almost impossible to answer. Keep in mind that it has been said, using a clock in a B>A setup, shouldn’t be expected to work (have an improvement). Or at least not as good as A>B. This because of internal noise added by the isolator. I don’t know if a isolator even has phase noise numbers. I've went through 30 mins of the video before it got a little over my head. So I am trying to solve certain math fundamentals before continuing. I shared because even the 30 mins I saw was fantastic content, and felt someone else could proceed further if they had prior knowledge. Link to comment
R1200CL Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Rasputin said: I need some help buying the minicircuits 75ohm filter. Did you notice Aliexpress link in post above yours ? Alternatively, why not purchase the 50 ohm version? Link to comment
Rasputin Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 59 minutes ago, R1200CL said: Did you notice Aliexpress link in post above yours ? Alternatively, why not purchase the 50 ohm version? Tak, skal du have:))) I did. I just do not trust Ali to buy American branded goods. I have been through experiences of getting a fake. 50 is a question, everyone reported increases had 75, my clock and etheregen 75, so in order to be on the safe side I wanted 75. Now if the 50 is really the same (can someone confirm from the experience and not theory?) that could be a solution. Emm Labs NS1, Emm Labs DV2, Trusov AMP ( AB class 400 watt into 8 ohm), Vandersteen 5a Carbon, Dyrholm Vision series cables XLR and power cords, meitner speaker cables, etheregen, 2* Farad super3 with purple SR fuses, AfterDark double Crown, RAL RJ45 Link to comment
MartinT Posted April 13, 2021 Author Share Posted April 13, 2021 IMPORTANT INFORMATION FROM MINI-CIRCUITS UK I have received a plea from a very nice lady at Mini-Circuits UK to reiterate on this forum the correct parts to order. They have received several returns from people who have ordered the incorrect item and are now returning them. BLP-10.7+ (11MHz 50Ω) is a catalogue item - please order from the website here: Mini-Circuits BLP-10.7-75+ (11MHz 75Ω) is a non-catalogue item - please contact [email protected] who will be able to help you May I just add that I have had excellent service from Mini-Circuits, who handled my order perfectly from ordering, through confirmation, delivery schedule and right up to delivery. I wish more companies were like them! TP-Link MR6400 4G router > Uptone EtherREGEN reclocker > Sonore Signature Rendu SE streamer > Gustard U18 DDC > Gustard X26 Pro DAC > Belles SA-100 power amp > Usher Dancer Be-20 speakers. AfterDark clocks x 2. PS Audio P3 & P10 regenerators. https://theaudiostandard.net Link to comment
R1200CL Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 This is what they told me: ”The BLP-10.7-75+ is a non-catalogue part and is not recommend for any new designs” Link to comment
Superdad Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 Hey gents: As we have explained several times, the impedance of the Mini-Circuits filter does not matter for this application with sine wave clock. Buy and use whichever one you can get! I we were not so busy here I’d order 100 pieces and resell them as a service to UpTone clients since I can ship around the world for just $13 (First Class Airmail) or with some faster and slightly more expensive FedEx or Priority Mail options. ZeusOdin 1 UpTone Audio LLC Link to comment
Rasputin Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 Yeps, the UK office of Mini-Circuits came through with a quote. However, yes they want to make sure I order the correct one 75 or 50. As mentioned above they are now dealing a lot with returns:)))))) our great forum makes them work hard:) @ Superdad, this would be an excellent idea, people could order one on your site together with etheregen. Everyone I demoed my etheregen to has bought one:) Emm Labs NS1, Emm Labs DV2, Trusov AMP ( AB class 400 watt into 8 ohm), Vandersteen 5a Carbon, Dyrholm Vision series cables XLR and power cords, meitner speaker cables, etheregen, 2* Farad super3 with purple SR fuses, AfterDark double Crown, RAL RJ45 Link to comment
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