Master Clock for your EtherREGEN

[MartinT]

27 minutes ago, GMG said:

That’s just great to hear @MartinT

Thanks for the update. 
 

Did you get the 20mm cube due to clearance of the box cover or would the pricier 25mm also fit?

 

I'm glad you asked. The 20mm cube was admittedly less expensive but I did wonder at the clearance. I think an extra 5mm might just fit but it would be tight. Of course, the height of different OXCO cans would vary the clearance, too.

 

I was also wary of the greater warm-up time although I leave the clock running permanently.

[MartinT]

On 11/7/2020 at 6:03 PM, MartinT said:

 

 

 

I'm really hoping someone else tries this. I simply cannot be imagining the significant ease of musical flow, heightened slam and fantastic note decay and low level detail. I did this as yet another little experiment worth the time and low cost, but I'm quite wowed by it. This OCXO continues to amaze me.

[MartinT]

The difference was very small and I think that's down to my short clock cables, which are only 30cm (1 ft) long.

 

The improvement the tungsten cube made was far larger.

[MartinT]

I have reverted to the Canare LV-77S over the Belden 4694A.

 

It's just a tiny bit calmer with even greater air and depth.

[MartinT]

I should have said: both are great cables.  The 4694A is brightly lit (like its name: Brilliance) and pushes detail forward but can tend towards being too bright.  The LV-77S is just neutrally balanced with great depth, air and space.

 

Pick one according to your system.  My system, with the LKS DAC, prefers neutrally balanced cables as the LKS throws an incredible amount of detail out, which can be over-emphasised in a bright system.

[MartinT]

I think you should definitely use the Oyaide cable you have. 20cm is very short, the cable might be quite stiff so hopefully you'll be able to 'dress' it adequately (my 30cm Canares only just bend without unduly stressing the components). Connectors should match the cable, although the Neutriks are good connectors and not too pricy.

 

Get used to the sound first and then try the Tungsten separately. I look forward to your findings.

[MartinT]

Both of my OCXOs have DAPU clocks, but I've read others referring to the FCI clock.  I believe their specs are the same and all come from mobile masts.

[MartinT]

The double-whammy effect of using my master clock for both EtherREGEN and Mutec reclockers in my system is very evident, not subtle.

[MartinT]

The clock needs good power (I use an LPSU), a good DC cable (Coherent), vibration control (Black Ravioli Pads, titanium block glued to OCXO, granite mat on top), good clock cables (Canare LV-77S) and a lot of warm-up time.

[MartinT]

I can only speak from my own experience. I reclock ethernet with the ER and then reclock the USB from my ultraRendu again with a Mutec MC-3. Both ER and Mutec are fed with 10MHz from my OCXO master clock. Does reclocking twice work? It certainly works for me, giving incredible detail and insight from my LKS DAC and analogue-like soundstage and note decay.

 

Nick Gorham's Longdog PSU will give you great performance for sure.

[MartinT]

If I had known what I was starting with this thread back in May...  😄

[MartinT]

I am running my ER with sinewave and the Mutec with squarewave output. Sound quality is superb with this arrangement.

[MartinT]

3 hours ago, jamesg11 said:

My just arrived BG7TBL has 3 outputs - all 75ohm & I assumed square wave.

 

I have two BG7TBL units, I'm using the one with 3 x 75 Ohm outputs, one squarewave and two sinewave.  There is a symbol marked by each BNC socket indicating waveform.  I have verified this with an oscilloscope.

 

My other unit, with 50 Ohm outputs, does not sound quite as good.

[MartinT]

9 hours ago, R1200CL said:

Then you didn’t purchase this one ?

 

75ohm output by BG7TBL 10MHz OCXO FREQUENCY STANDARD 3 channel square wave  clock Master Clock for your EtherREGEN

 

No, that one came later.  To be honest, my setup sounds marvellous so I'm not inclined to change it now.

[MartinT]

Try also Black Ravioli footers and a heavy weight on top.  That finishes the job.

 

The tungsten works remarkably well!

[MartinT]

10 hours ago, sbilotta said:

So how do you attach the Tungsten cube to the clock?

Just thermal paste or also a glue/adhesive of some sort to lock it to the clock, so that there's no risk of it moving? 

 

I used two-part epoxy. It's not moving anywhere.

[MartinT]

Bit of a reality check: while there are many expensive clocks available, some of the so-called professional ones being quite outrageously priced, let's just remember that the inexpensive Chinese clocks use reclaimed OCXOs that are high quality devices originally designed for mobile masts.  They had to be good and reliable for such duties.  They also feature three outputs.

 

Until you've heard one, you might not believe just how good they are.  Mine is driving both my ER and Mutec and, in both cases, it sounds better than the internal clock.  The sum effect is astonishing in terms of the sound quality uplift.

 

It's worth trying one out so that you get an idea of what to expect.  I doubt that anyone would be disappointed.  You could even keep it as a spare in case your expensive clock decides it's had enough of life.

[MartinT]

Nice idea!

 

Better make sure that glue stays sealed, though, or else you'll have tungsten powder everywhere.

[MartinT]

For my part, I am hugely indebted to both Alex and John for all the information and encouragement they have given to those of us who have experimented with an external master clock.  I started this thread really to discover whether a ridiculously inexpensive clock sold for radio hams would work for audio applications.  It does, rather well - job done!

 

I believe quite a few of us have these clocks now and are very happy with them.  Thanks again.

[MartinT]

Try as short a clock cable as you can manage. What is the cable you are using?

 

Also, make sure the BNC connectors are fully secured both ends.

[MartinT]

As previously posted, I am using the BG7TBL DAPU OCXO clock for both the ER and Mutec MC-3+ USB. After many trials, I can confirm that it enhances the performance of both. It is a better clock than the internal Mutec one to my ears.

 

I am using Canare LV-77S cables, very short 30cm ones, 75 ohm matched throughout. High quality linear PSU, soon to be further improved by swapping to a Coherent supercap PSU being built for me.

[MartinT]

The BG7TBL requires 12V at around 2A for safety (it's rated at 18W).

 

So the answer is no.

[MartinT]

11 hours ago, R1200CL said:

Are you using Mutec MC-3+USB as a USB reclocker or as a USB/SPDIF converter ?

 

Won’t using the clock possible break the moat of the EtherRegen ?

 

 

I am feeding the LKS DAC with AES so yes, it's reclocking and USB/SPDIF converting.

 

Yes, I'm aware that I'm potentially breaking the moat via the clock cables. However, it sounds best with both reclockers fed from the master clock.

[MartinT]

1 hour ago, R1200CL said:

 

@MartinT use of tungsten and isolations is to me a prove that vibration can be an issue even without a transformer inside the clock. 
 

 

Agreed, all of my work in this direction (Black Ravioli footers, tungsten cube, DoDo Mat sound deadening, Schramm door stop on top) have helped with reducing vibrations to the sensitive clock.

[MartinT]

10 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

 

Rember it’s only phase noise figures that counts in order to find the best clock. 

 

 

Do we know that for sure?

 

What about other noise, such as ground plane noise?

What about amplitude variations?

What about waveform quality, especially in the case of squarewaves?

What about isolation of multiple outputs?

What about impedance accuracy?

Frequency drift?