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Building a DIY Music Server


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13 hours ago, StreamFidelity said:

Perhaps it is already known here, but if not then the following information may be of interest: 

 

Taiko Audio is therefore moving away from the Intel 2 core concept and is probably using one of these AMD cores:

 

AMD EPYC™ 9374F 32 64 Up to 4.3GHz 4.1GHz 3.85GHz 256MB 320W
AMD EPYC™ 9354P 32 64 Up to 3.8GHz 3.75GHz 3.25GHz 256MB 280W
AMD EPYC™ 9354 32 64 Up to 3.8GHz 3.75GHz 3.25GHz 256MB 280W
AMD EPYC™ 9334 32 64 Up to 3.9GHz 3.85GHz 2.7GHz 128MB 210W

 

Its seems to be "costs? -Forget the costs" build:)

Interesting what MB is using...

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8 hours ago, SK8 said:

From the picture posted by Taiko, it looks like this is the motherboard they are going to use for the new  Olympus server:

 

https://www.amazon.com/ASUS-TRX50-SAGE-WIFI-Threadripper-PRO/dp/B0CMZHDQPD

Did I just make a mistake or does Taiko Audio really use a motherboard with fans? Where did Taiko Audio post this?

 

47443316my.png

Pro WS TRX50-SAGE WIFI|Motherboards|ASUS Global

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Direct link to their post

 

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/introducing-olympus-olympus-i-o-a-new-perspective-on-modern-music-playback.37939/page-73#post-961237

WSRgRqK.jpeg

 

The board layout as well the as the number of VRMs etc. looked really like a perfect match

 

https://dlcdnwebimgs.asus.com/gain/be6effb0-a7ae-459e-bf4b-79ef39163cb1//fwebp

 

Though EPYC 9004 came with 6,096 contacts

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socket_SP5

Quote

Single Socket SP5 (LGA 6096)

 

Then EPYC 8004 came with 4,844 contacts

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socket_SP6

Quote

Single Socket SP6 (LGA 4844)

 

While Ryzen Threadripper 7000 (with 350W TDP for every single processor despite having different number of cores) also came with 4,844 contacts

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socket_sTR5

Quote

Single Socket sTR5 (LGA 4844)

  • Socket SP5 for EPYC 9004
  • Socket SP6 for EPYC 8004
  • Socket sTR5 for Ryzen Threadripper 7000

 

I guess that having a single CPU should be quite doable despite having to deal with something @ 350W TDP

 

https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/power-analysis-amd-ryzen-threadripper-7000/

VOu4Pdy.png

 

While spreading everything across a whopping 47 VRM stages should be fine and dandy, even though every single heatsink for those VRMs should be already gone for good

 

https://www.techpowerup.com/315981/asus-breaks-overclocking-records-9-world-records-16-global-first-places

Quote

Similarly, the PRO WS TRX50-SAGE WIFI motherboard is designed to handle powerful processors, featuring an overclocking-ready VRM with (18*2)+3+4+4 power stages. This robust power design is capable of delivering ample power for demanding applications and extreme overclocking scenarios.

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running a very light OS and player should result in far less actual TDP than using something like lightroom...IMHO

ISP, glass to Fritz!box 5530, another Fritz!box 5530 for audio only in bridged mode on LPS, cat8.1, Zyxel switch on LPS, Finisar <1475BTL>Solarflare X2522-25G, external wifi AP, AMD 9 16 core, passive cooling ,Aorus Master x570, LPSU with Taiko ATX, 8Gb Apacer RAM, femto SSD on LPS, Pink Faun I2S ultra OCXO on akiko LPS, home grown RJ45 I2S cable, Metrum Adagio DAC3, RCA 70-A and Miyaima Zero for mono, G2 PL519 tube amps. 

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Except for the fact that nobody could predict what those Roonatics would do in the background in the first place, while not always knowing what anyone could do to "tame" any Roonatics to begin with, and then who knows the size of the entire music library would look like etc.

 

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/58164-building-a-diy-music-server/page/69/#comment-1105181  

On 1/27/2021 at 5:20 PM, Nenon said:

Going back to the question about Roon. Roon does a lot of things that harm the sound quality. It performs constant network activity while you are playing, it has constant disk I/O activity, it does some processing that swings the CPU utilization, which causes noise that is audible in a resolving system. And the list goes on... Depending on whether you use a two box (a server and a streamer) solution or a single box solution like me it has different impact. But in any case, it would not be my choice for critical listening. Having said that Roon/Qobuz is the best tool for discovering new music for me. I so use it for that. 

 

Roon high CPU usage and loading slowly warnings

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/roon-high-cpu-usage-and-loading-slowly-warnings/242922

 


 

 https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/69011-article-harman-acquires-roon/page/2/#comment-1261663

On 11/29/2023 at 7:08 AM, LarryMagoo said:

ARC is the reason for a network connection.  Roon never required a network connection before ARC.   I got suspended for 90 days from their forum when I made an accusation about having ARC just to gather data on people’s listening habits and the contents of their album collection.    Data has always had a market….but then I got ARC working and appreciated having my entire collection available to me on the road…

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IMHO, the TDP quoted by AMD (and even Intel) should be taken with a grain of salt. One should question why the same TDP is quoted for different processors with big differences in cores count and cache:

 

 image.png.608f9f66ce4e2ccef16bd52bea5979c2.png

 

A good article to explain how AMD derives their TDPs:

https://gamersnexus.net/guides/3525-amd-ryzen-tdp-explained-deep-dive-cooler-manufacturer-opinions

 

For Taiko, you can see that they are using the whole aluminum chassis, together with the 10mm copper base plate as a combined huge heat sink for the motherboard and the processor. In addition, the new Ryzen processor is manufactured by the state-of-the-art 5nm process, compared to the 14nm process used by the Xeon 4210 CPU. If the workload is about the same and the Ryzen CPU is set to run at the base frequency, I believe the heat produced should not be much more than that produced by the twin 4210s.

 

BTW, my guess of the Ryzen CPU used in the Olympus server is  AMD Ryzen Threadripper 7970X. We should know very soon when the servers are shipped out from their factory.

 

https://www.amazon.com/AMD-RyzenTM-ThreadripperTM-7970X-64-Thread/dp/B0CK2W3WFP

 

 

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Some nice design tips here - I like the copper motherboard mounting plate, easy to DIY and will help remove heat.  Also, only 4 (larger) heat pipes on the CPU, which then get sandwiched in-between the heat sinks by the looks of it.  Neat. 

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I somehow doubt that the copper plate will dissipate much heat, any heat it will dissipate needs to travel from components through the circuitboard (epoxy) and via M3 bolts....it likely is more intended as EMI shield.

Still it's another very nice design by Taiko!

ISP, glass to Fritz!box 5530, another Fritz!box 5530 for audio only in bridged mode on LPS, cat8.1, Zyxel switch on LPS, Finisar <1475BTL>Solarflare X2522-25G, external wifi AP, AMD 9 16 core, passive cooling ,Aorus Master x570, LPSU with Taiko ATX, 8Gb Apacer RAM, femto SSD on LPS, Pink Faun I2S ultra OCXO on akiko LPS, home grown RJ45 I2S cable, Metrum Adagio DAC3, RCA 70-A and Miyaima Zero for mono, G2 PL519 tube amps. 

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that copper baseplate is thermal. In this situation Heat transfer is not just conductive, but radiative & convective as well, and it also acts as a huge heat buffer.

 

(IMO it would have little to no extra value as EM shielding in that location, on the underside, where there’s already a big chunk of aluminium, so hard to believe they’d spend so much on copper for a probably marginal/ non-existent benefit)

Grimm Mu-1 > Mola Mola Makua/DAC > Luxman m900u > Vivid Audio Kaya 90

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How exactly would heat transfer to that plate? For it to do anything thermal it would have to have some way of getting the heat transferred to it and to release it, all it does now is buffering some heat and I think that is already taken care of by the bulk of the chasis.

 

You may underestimate the sonic difference between aluminium and copper, or I may be wrong...time will tell.

ISP, glass to Fritz!box 5530, another Fritz!box 5530 for audio only in bridged mode on LPS, cat8.1, Zyxel switch on LPS, Finisar <1475BTL>Solarflare X2522-25G, external wifi AP, AMD 9 16 core, passive cooling ,Aorus Master x570, LPSU with Taiko ATX, 8Gb Apacer RAM, femto SSD on LPS, Pink Faun I2S ultra OCXO on akiko LPS, home grown RJ45 I2S cable, Metrum Adagio DAC3, RCA 70-A and Miyaima Zero for mono, G2 PL519 tube amps. 

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On 4/14/2024 at 12:39 PM, genvirt said:

Its seems to be "costs? -Forget the costs" build:)

Interesting what MB is using...

 

$2,499 for 7970X

 

https://www.newegg.com/amd-threadripper-pro-7965wx-350w-sp6-ryzen-threadripper-7000-series/p/N82E16819113806

 

 

$899 for the motherboard

 

https://www.newegg.com/asus-pro-ws-trx50-sage-wifi/p/N82E16813119666

 

 

We don't necessarily need THAT much RAM to begin with, and then we might grab an Optane P5800X since I heard pretty good things from another audiophile who acquired the 400GB version.

 

Though *THE* most intriguing aspect of that particular motherboard should be powering everything with multiple PSUs, we're gonna have lots of fun since ASUS actually decided to provide a pair of 24-pin ATX connectors rather than only one.

 

In terms of latency, so far 7970X seemed to be fine despite having to deal with the nature of RDIMMs

 

https://hothardware.com/reviews/amd-ryzen-threadripper-7980x-and-7970x-review?page=3

Quote

In terms of memory latency, the Threadripper 7000 series processors landed about in the middle of the stack, with their DDR5-5200 (CAS 38) RAM. And once again we see measured performance that's quite similar to the previous-gen. We expect latency to improve over time, however, as faster RDIMMs hit the market.

sT03igG.png

hEw5leO.png

 

Faster ones as follows

 

https://v-color.net/products/ddr5-oc-rdimm-amd-trx50-workstation-memory

 

Most importantly, the overall SQ should be largely determined by the temperature of the entire rig. That's gotta be the tricky part since either active or passive cooling would come with different pros and cons.

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great work Angelo!

 

 

ISP, glass to Fritz!box 5530, another Fritz!box 5530 for audio only in bridged mode on LPS, cat8.1, Zyxel switch on LPS, Finisar <1475BTL>Solarflare X2522-25G, external wifi AP, AMD 9 16 core, passive cooling ,Aorus Master x570, LPSU with Taiko ATX, 8Gb Apacer RAM, femto SSD on LPS, Pink Faun I2S ultra OCXO on akiko LPS, home grown RJ45 I2S cable, Metrum Adagio DAC3, RCA 70-A and Miyaima Zero for mono, G2 PL519 tube amps. 

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19 minutes ago, genvirt said:

Excellent job You do Angelo!

 

What material do You using here?

 

Can it be order separately?

 

Hi @genvirt

 

Thanks!

 

The material will be copper. 
 

It’s not available yet as It is still in the early stages of design. 
for example, the bottom probably doesn’t need that raised cpu contact plate. It can be simply flat across like in this pic. This would mean that there can be even less material between the CPU and the heatpipe. Then I can make the mounting flanges 8mm thick for additional structural stiffness when torquing it down.IMG_6982.thumb.jpeg.55a20166c038701ac09f4d571d5b5db0.jpeg

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@genvirt It is my view that too much material between the CPU and the heat pipes unnecessarily increases thermal resistance drastically reducing its heat transfer efficiency. In other words, the heat will have trouble getting from the CPU to the heat pipes quickly. Increasing the number of heat pipes doesn't overcome this.

 

On the other hand, making it too thin will result in localized heat and reduced spreading of the heat along the contact length of the heat pipe and across all heat pipes, as well as compromising structural rigidity.

 

As an example, If you look at high TDP Olympus pics, you can see that the base plate of the heat transfer block is relatively thin and it seems the heat pipes are bonded to it.

 

All these are just IMHO.

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20 hours ago, AngeloVRA said:

Update on DIY Chassis for Sage Server and ULPS:

  • Design has been concluded
  • Prices have been finalized with CNC facility as per design
  • Order will be placed as soon soon as all payments have been collected

It is still possible to join the group buy (hopefully not considered as an advert. If it is, please delete).
Message me for details.

So far the price for the server chassis is $1490 plus shipping ($185 shipping more or less). Angelo is putting in the order soon, so reach out to him if you’re interested. I have no financial interest in this other than I’m buying too. There is also a ULPS chassis, but I’m not sure of the final price for that. 

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