Building a DIY Music Server

[Darryl R]

On 6/20/2020 at 8:33 PM, Nenon said:

... Now comes the difficult part - power supplies.

 

4. Power supplies. That is the part that defines how the computer above would sound. It can easily go from Ok to better to best just by replacing the power supplies and DC cables here.

Let's look at three pricing options - cheaper, more expensive, and cost no object. Please note, I am not saying good, better, best! I am giving products in different price ranges, that's all.

Power supply comparison is a completely different topic outside of the scope of this post, which is focused on pricing. I know some people would ask me regardless, so let me answer this question in advance. I don't know how the DC4 compares to the custom DR or standard SR-7. I am as curious as you are and have been trying to arrange a comparison. But that would most likely take several months. 

 

4a. Cheaper

Get two Keces P8 power supplies. 20V / 8A for the HDPlex and 12V / 8A for the EPS connector. That would be around $1500.

This is not the cheapest option... there are other cheaper options but I would not consider them.

 

4b. More Expensive

Get a 2-rail Paul Hynes Design SR-7 to power the EPS and HDPlex and a JCAT Optimo to power the two JCAT cards. 

That would be around $4,000.

Alternatively, Sean Jacobs can do a 4-rail DC3 LPS.

 

4c. Cost no Object

Get a 4-rail Sean Jacobs DC4. That would be around $6,000.

 

This is a great thread.  Just thought I'd add, because I didn't see it elsewhere, that Farad will have its SuperATX LPS available in a few months.  From Mattijs today:

 

The two new models, the Super10 and SuperATX as we call them now are both running and field testing. Super10 is a 10A, deliverable in 12, 15 or 19V output, like the Super3, but more heavy. Sounds really good. SuperATX is a full linear supercap ATX supply, like 10 Super3’s and one Super10 in one enclosure. It has a 12V/8A output for the processor (100W TDP max), a full 24 pin ATX output, and three independent peripheral outputs with 5 and 12V for SSD, clocks and cards. We dropped the ATX conversion, since it is a cheap solution and not high quality.

[Darryl R]

Was anyone interested in trying a fiber optic ethernet card in their build?

[Darryl R]

1 hour ago, Exocer said:

 

My build is nothing to write home about... But I will say that moving to the Fiber network card was worthwhile.

 

In the beginning of Wynton Kelly's "Temperance" there is a drumroll...I did not hear it clearly until switching to the fiber NIC. https://www.startech.com/Networking-IO/Adapter-Cards/pcie-gigabit-ethernet-fiber-card-open-sfp~PEX1000SFP2

 

SFP modules were inserted between this card and my Etherregen. I will probably stick with this card until I can afford the JCAT Femto Network XE and proper LPSU to power it. Very pleased so far.

 

Does it support single and multimode?  How about drivers -- Windows and Linux?

[Darryl R]

Since the mobo Nenon used (post 266, page 11) is nla, which Asus ATX mobo would you guys recommend for use with the Ryzden?  I was looking at the B550-F, though several on NewEgg complain of network failures.  Thanks.

[Darryl R]

41 minutes ago, rickca said:

The follow on to Nenon's motherboard is the Asus ROG Crosshair VIII Hero (with or without Wifi).  What's wrong with that?  Are you trying to avoid the chipset fan?

 

Re networking on the Strix B550-F, one user review states 'No native network driver (you've got to download the drivers elsewhere and install them via USB or CD).

 

Nothing wrong with it if you're  okay with a $350+ board, just asking for any experiences with the newer chipsets.

[Darryl R]

There is of course the hotter running X570 chipset, and though the Crosshair Hero is a gaming favorite, I missed the integrated graphics outputs, since I don't keep a graphics card for audiophile machines.

[Darryl R]

Has anyone built with a new Z490 mobo and 10th gen Intel Core?

 

[Darryl R]

21 hours ago, kelvinwsy said:

Gigabyte Aorus Z490 Ultra with intel 10700k in a Lian Li O11Dynamic Tempered Glass Case with nice LED Accented Fans in Push Pull setup with a Cooler Master MK360 All in One Cooler ...

 

Looks like you went all out.  I wanted to keep mine at the mATX and 65W level for the fanless Streacom FC9 case, which I much prefer over the HDPlex (the one exception being the solid copper heatsink riser in the HDPlex kit).

[Darryl R]

On 9/18/2020 at 5:34 PM, kelvinwsy said:

Passively cooled case build will be my next project! I always worry about Not just CPU but also VRM cooling.

 

Yes, particularly with the new mobos.  I've only built with the T-suffixed, 35W Core processors before, and thermals weren't a problem, even when substituting graphite pads for thermal paste.  This is going to be a bit of an experiment this time, but the cases have adequate ratings.

[Darryl R]

On 9/18/2020 at 6:14 PM, bit01 said:

 I have a Gigabyte Z490 AORUS Master with an i9-10900K recently installed in an HDPLEX H5 2nd Gen. fanless case. The BIOS reports CPU at 75 C during boot!. Audiolinux reports CPU core temps of 32-35 C when playing music.

 

This MOBO has a bottom plate- it needs taller standoffs (10mm) to fit the back cover of the H5. This might cause other assembly issues if more accesories are fitted but I have not studied or required any as yet.

 

I am using the HDPLEX 800W DC-ATX converter fed by a PHD SR7/T 19VDC rail. This DC-ATX can fit the 2 pre-tapped holes but needs another hole drilled for the 3rd screw. The 4th screw locates in a cooling slot. When mounted this way, it is a bit of a tight fit as can be seen in the pic and may interfere with the MOBO in some cases- mine just makes it, but as can be seen in the pic the ATX cable clips are too close together. If I keep it in this case then I will drill holes for it to space it out a bit.

 

It is early days (some tweaking to do) but I am already getting a more hefty dynamic sound compared to the Intel NUC7I7DNH1E.

 

 

Very ambitious!  Please keep us posted.

 

PS - yes, I noted the HDPlex bottom plate doesn't have a flush surface for adherence - lots of fun when the CPU mount pushes off the bottom plate after everything else is in :(

[Darryl R]

On 9/18/2020 at 6:14 PM, bit01 said:

 I have a Gigabyte Z490 AORUS Master with an i9-10900K recently installed in an HDPLEX H5 2nd Gen. fanless case. The BIOS reports CPU at 75 C during boot!. Audiolinux reports CPU core temps of 32-35 C when playing music.

 

bit01,

 

What are you using to supply the DC?

[Darryl R]

Following up on some earlier posts about building with a Z490, I've not been able to get one up and running.  With 3 different mobos -- ASUS ROG Strix Z490-G, -E, and MSI MPG Z490M -- all will not boot into what appears to be a successful install of Ubuntu 20.04 LTS Desktop (which I use to test out builds).  It just keeps looping around to the GRUB menu and displaying Q-CODE F6.  If I use "Try Ubuntu" it seems to work fine.  Since the RAM is the only common denominator with the above machines, I think it's worth changing this out.  I was using Apacer 2 x 4GB UNB DDR4 2666 CL19 WT from an older build.  Can anyone recommend some RAM that worked on a Z490 build?  Thanks.

[Darryl R]

1 hour ago, bit01 said:

@Darryl R it could be you need more juice -See PM

 

The thought had crossed my mind.  I'm temporarily using a Streacom 150W SMPS.  And for all the boards I was using the i7-10700.  It's very close for the ATX, but should be enough for the microATXs.

[Darryl R]

On 12/18/2020 at 11:15 AM, Nenon said:

 

You should try Windows LTSC and ProcessLasso. 

I will be publishing a guide for tweaking Windows for this motherboard sometime next year. Planning to share everything I've learned since April. I am also working with Emile from Taiko on testing some of his technology that will most likely treacle down to the DIY market sometime next year. This coming year will be very exciting for DIY. 

 

Last I checked it would be a little tricky for individual DIYers to license W10 LTSC.  Has that changed?

[Darryl R]

13 hours ago, Nenon said:

 

There is a trick. You need to sign a Volume Licensing contract and buy 5 licences. They can be for something cheap (i.e. $10 licenses) and you get the option to purchase Windows LTSC. I have to review the exact process and will put it in the guide. 

In the meantime, there is an evaluation version that can be used. 

 

Thanks.  I was wondering if some were still buying from the guys on Ebay who sell a key half a dozen times until MS shuts it down.

[Darryl R]

44 minutes ago, Nenon said:

There is one particular question we are wondering about. For those who will be following this DIY recipe and building this computer - you are willing to pay 20-30% more for the extra space in a bigger chassis like this. 

 

There is of course plans to fill that space with a state of the art power supply. That's something that is still in the works and will be a part of the complete DIY recipe. It seems like there is a lot of excellent technology Taiko is willing to share with us. 

 

Thanks for the update Nenon.  I'm not nearly as concerned with the footprint of the chassis as I am with the accompanying power offering that would fill that extra space.

 

EDIT: I like the idea of the heavier chassis materials.  Also, a small detail I've been thinking about for my current DIY server -- it might be good to consider a common thread for studs that fit some of the more affordable feet like the BDR cones.

[Darryl R]

10 hours ago, Nenon said:

What about a logo on the front panel? 

Leave blank (a little cheaper)? Create a DIY logo? I don't really care myself...

Any good designers following this thread? 

 

I liked the way Emile attached the PCIe brackets internally on the Extreme.  Not a big deal either way for me.

 

Cosmetically, I prefer anodized finishes.  Scratched paint makes new cases look used.

 

I hope the mobo top-out package includes some nice heat-sinking metal, one area I really liked on the HDPlex.

 

Lastly for now, what is the form factor for the Sage mobo?  I would hope for some degree of flexibility in that choice (a very hi-end mobo + 2 CPUs may price some out of the project), but if not, can you provide a link to that mobo so we can begin to study it?  I know you and Emile liked the way controllers were integrated directly with the CPU(s).

[Darryl R]

29 minutes ago, Nenon said:

Thank you for all the feedback. A couple of quick notes. 

 

1. Target cost - my plan is to try to get this recipe around $10K. Time will tell if we would succeed or not. This is not a commercial product that needs to be at a specific target retail price, so we have a lot more flexibility.

 

So $10K for the chassis and power?  Are you able to say anything about software, like if Emile will include the new player he's developing?

 

EDIT:  I'm sure you'll fire up some of your group buys for off-the-shelf components, to keep those costs down, right?

[Darryl R]

6 hours ago, Nenon said:

I use HQP and Roon and will share what I do. That can be used as a starting point. But I am hoping the DIY community would test other software and come up with better options. 

 

Interesting, so you came up with something you like better than Euphony.  I always liked HQP, and have been meaning to try HQPE (embedded), but I never experienced the SQ problems others claim with Roon so I've stayed with it, and it's by far the best UI (though I have no big problem with the HQP UI options).  The combo is interesting.  You don't have to get into that now while you're focused on hardware.

[Darryl R]

3 hours ago, Nenon said:

This will not be a Taiko Extreme equivalent. The Extreme is packed with technology and tweaks that will not be shared with our DIY community.

 

On the other hand, you mentioned Taiko was willing to share some tech which was not in the Extreme.  That should be interesting, but either way, it's hard to truly critique the pricing estimates until we see the power supply, which as we all know is a big cost variable (I was hoping somebody has a breakthrough prototype in SMPS for this project, which could shrink chassis size requirements ;)

[Darryl R]

On 1/8/2021 at 5:43 PM, Nenon said:

On this dual CPU hardware I prefer Windows LTSC. I use HQP+NAA for bitperfect local files playback.

 

 

This is an interesting and creative permutation Nenon.  I wonder what Jussi Laako would think of it ;)

[Darryl R]

On 1/9/2021 at 11:23 AM, AME said:

Hello Nenon,

 

Thanks!

 

It was a lot of handwork, but I quess a lot can also be done with an computer controlled milling machine.

I will drop an email to Larry from HDPlex to see if he is interested.

 

I will definitely wait with the power supply decision.

 

A picture of the Farad ATX PSU next to 400W HDPlex PSU

 

 

 

 

I'd asked Mattijs about this a few times.  He said he'd been too busy with Super3 sales to finalize his design, so thanks for posting it.  However I was most curious about Pachanko's new lines, which look beautifully made, but I've only seen one customer post on them (and it was very good).

 

Nenon announced this project just in time to lay on the brakes and wait.

[Darryl R]

59 minutes ago, Nenon said:

I am guessing there will be some demand for an external unregulated power supply to feed the Taiko ATX (from people who are not comfortable building their own). Taiko will not get into the power supply business, but I am looking at a few options here as well.

 

Good.  I think it's smart to make any and all components as independent and reusable as possible.

[Darryl R]

5 hours ago, genvirt said:

Hope this question is not too much off topic.

My new PC build is without cd drive for ripping, so somebody can advice the best option for ripping and getting best quality and errors (I’m using embedded option of Euphony).

Thank You!

 

 

Depends on what you want to rip.  If just 16/44 (RBCD) I recommend the excellent dBpoweramp.

[Darryl R]

2 hours ago, Exocer said:

Very interesting @Nenon.

 

Was the SJ used through the Taiko DC-ATX or was it powering the CPU directly with separate 12v rail feeding the DC-ATX unit? And/or did you compare both scenarios above with the same results?

 

Up until now, it was understand by many that using a single rail "could" result in more audible noise, as more components share the same rail and could contaminate each other, hence the recent uptick in ATX LPSs with multiple dedicated and isolated rails.

 

Very excited for the SR7T / Unregulated supply testing I will conduct in the next few months. I am wondering if the results will be similar to what you've described 😎.

 

With only 10a on the 19v rail, I would be more comfortable powering the CPU directly and the other components through the 19v rail + Adapter.

 

Does the Asus C621 Sage motherboard utilize a separate 12v for the CPU?

 

 

 

I don't want to obscure responses to Exocer's good questions, but my understanding was the tech used in the Taiko moved switching noise out of the audible range -- all the more then the benefits of an SMPS, as opposed to staying the course with an ATX supply.

 

I'd like to ask someone to very briefly explain why they think non-regulated DC will work in the DIY server (apart from budget or whether they like it better or not).