Building a DIY Music Server

[cool_chris]

I must say I followed Nenon recommendation with the use of Buffalo BSGS 2016.

With his kind help I was able to get 2 of them. I dont think they are still available. All sold out.

I powered them with Vinnie Rossi great „mini” supercapacitor supplys rated 5v / 3A only !

Many powered them with 12v , but I recommend 5 v with 3A or more.

I think I can already say It is by far the bigest SQ gain I have ever experienced .

I wanted to thank Nenon for discovering soch a great improvements for us, testing many options and sharing results with all of us.
I see that Hols confirmed it already few posts above , so do I. 
 

My next step will be to improve both clocks with the use of OXCO as Nenon and Hols already did with great result.

Will report my experience .

 

[cool_chris]

8 hours ago, lwr said:

Did you try both 12V and 5V and find that 12V sounded better, or just go with 5V and stick with it?

 

Which OXCO are you planning to use?

 

Tried both . 12 v is more precise and focused but adds little more upper fequencies that is aready to much in my system.
5v is just a little less focused but it has an excellent musicality , flow and easyness in the presentation.

I think the take home message is : try all voltages from 5 v to 12v and pick the one that fits your system / ears best !

Hols sounds to be very happy with his local OCXO upgrade shop, Nenon did install PinkFaun ultra OCXO himself and is enthusiastic about that, but it is by far the most expensive one ( it might be the best but that needs to be confirmed by testing )

I am considering few options . Educating myself with different clock manufacturers and will report effects here.

I tried four PP modified zyxel swiches before and they were quite good, got Ether Regen that also was very good , added Ubiquiti xrouter that acts as a switch only, but only the last change with modified Buffalows elevated my system so many levels up.

 

The use of Buffalo BSGS 2016 / or Melco S100 / recommended by Nenon , Romaz, Hols and few others is probably one of the very best upgrates one can do to the audio system this time .

 

[cool_chris]

I have been quiet for some time testing and trying to understand the Network influance to the SQ

in my syetem. But I have some very strong conclusions to share.

 

First wanted to thank Nenon for creating soch a great and interesting thread.

I learned a lot from here and my system sounds truly amaizing now. It is Taiko extreme based system.

 

Today is 4 th day from the time I got the 2 Modified Buffalo 2016 from Jord.

Still early as this should be burning for next 200 hours to get 100% performance.

Its beeein amazing time as the installed Pink Faun clocks changed their character quite significant over that period.

 

In short I am shocked how deep and profund is the effect of that modification.

Yes that was not chep at all, but I cant imagine how to listen without that.

 

Getiing 4 moded Buffalows from Nenon was a miracle, because they are not available anymore.

Installing the Pink Faun ULTRA clocks in 2 of them was a second miracle.

 

I am one of the luckiest people because with great help and kindness of Nenon I was able to get and test 1, 2,3 and 4 stacked Buffalows.

And yes I can confirm thet the more switches the better.

 

Additionally adding ultra clocks tranformed the already great Bufflows to totally different levels.

So I have 2 Nenon Moded Buffalows now and 2 Nenon + Pink Faun moded  Buffalos.

I agree with Nenon findings that ONE Pink Faun ULTRA clock moded Buffao is better that stacked 4 Buffalos.

This clock simply adds something that is unreachable in normal switches.

It is so calm, fluid and transparent that nothing compares to that.

No wonder Jord is installing this clock in his best designs .

Also shipping work and return of Buffalows to Jord was great experience.

He was so kind to keep in touch with me diring the modification process and sent

me few pictures that I am aloud to share with You.

Please see below:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[cool_chris]

[cool_chris]

[cool_chris]

[cool_chris]

The Pink Faun ULTRA clock needs a separate power supply of 5V.

The main board needs 5v - 12v , but the lower value needs more current.

 

[cool_chris]

Many will  also ask what about the 1 v 2 Nenon + Pink Faun moded 2016 Buffalows?

Unfortunate adding the second N+PF moded Buffalo brings additional benefits , but I am sure most of you will be more than happy to start with 1 switch with addition of the Pink Faun Ultra clock.

This will be a true game changer.

Nenon said it is like listening the garage band v professional group playin on satge.

I must agree with that , it is that profund difference. 

[cool_chris]

I also wanted to point that Austipop did fantastic tests with the Buffalows he got from Nenon.

He was much better in explaining all the details with why the PF Ultra Buffalo is his " best " switch 

and thats why I didnt want to repeate that.

 

In short it is mine best switch too and I can't imagine to listen without it.

[cool_chris]

25 minutes ago, RickyV said:

 

Now what I would like to know is how the clock upgrade compares to the switch mode regulators upgrade in sq gain. Both report a nice sq gain.

Sure !
why not BOTH ?

Nenon mode to Buffalo , than Jord mode with PinkFaun clock 

AND adding the 3 separate regulators !
planning to do so.
an ultimate switch 

 

[cool_chris]

4 minutes ago, Brucemck2 said:

Where can someone in the US purchase these upgrade(s)? I have two unmodified units.

Contact Jord ! [email protected]

He can do that as full service in 2-3 days.

or PM  Nenon . He is from US.

Not sure if he will be willing to do that but you can ask .

In both scenarios clocks come from Jord any way .
 

[cool_chris]

31 minutes ago, auricgoldfinger said:

 

What is the magnitude of the change going from one PF switch to two?

if 1 PF Buffalo is 100 %
Adding the second is additional 20% as of now. 

But keep in mind this are 4 days only so they might need longer burn in.
All is expected to improve much further.

in reality it is as Nenon mentioned already . Hard to point one difference because everything is a way better. 
After a week or 2 will try to do more testing.

now I just sit and listen.

first time I have absolute no need to change anything or to test.

 

[cool_chris]

Nice report @cool_chris! I was waiting to see your jaw dropping after the clock upgrade :). Those are the best moments of our hobby!

 

Actually it did. Could not find it for few hours😁

I was not expecting that much difference. 

Thank you ! I wouldn't be here so happy without your help and knowledge. 

 

I have Ubiquity edgerouter and Ether Regen that I was feeding it with Mutec 10 mhz master . It was nice upgrade adding Ref10 but Pink Faun Clock upgrade is like 10 x delta you might get from the Mutec / ER combo.

I think this is due to the distance that you and Jord offer during upgrade.  It is only about 2 cm from the clock exit to the board versus 100 cm with ref10.

The shorter this distance the better !

Also there is no PLL loop that is mandatory with ref 10 feeding . That destroyes already great ref10 values.

The best solution is to have a clock right there when needed with correct frequency. 

 

 

[cool_chris]

1 hour ago, RickyV said:

👍 That would indeed be the ultimate switch. Then may I suggest you wait for @tgb to see if his solution to the 1V problem works, because it is probably the easiest. ( MPAudio transformer and 1V/ 5A regulator) My solution is a 1V/5A lt3045 regulator and in front of that an other 1.8 V higher power regulator with a reasonable heatsink. Then have a 1A ldovr regulator for the 1.5 and the 3.3V or an other MPAudio dual 2.5A regulator for the 1.5 and 3.3V and feed it all with a 5V 5A power supply with a big heatsink. 
Heat dissipation is a problem if you go all linear. The second best option would be to leave the 1V alone and power the switch with 12V and only do the 1.5V and 3.3V with linear regulators, much easier and no heat problem!

 

This is funny , because I am at the position when it sounds so amazing I have no intetest of changing anything. 

Just like Nenon.

Extreme benefits from 4 Buffalo switches .

2 are with amazing Pink Faun clocks.

Half more day since 2st post and it is still improving!

This is the most important addition to any system.

 

[cool_chris]

9 hours ago, Nenon said:

Just initially? Or every time you power it off/on? 

Initally it is several weeks as Jord explained.

But once burned in it takes 48h to get back to full potential after each power off.

Those clocs are disigned for 24/7 operation so we should keep them on at all times.

 

 

[cool_chris]

3 hours ago, Blackmorec said:

I wanted to add an “Of Course” paragraph to the above.

Of course, if you have already optimised the rest of your system then adding a second clock may be the only way you’ll get that extra 20-30% ‘goodness’.  Sometimes, if you want the very best SQ, you just can’t avoid the law of diminishing returns. 

I agree 100%

I tested after Nenon recommended stacking 4 Buffalo and adding Pink Faun clocks.

I started with 1 switch , than 2 , 3 and ,4 

And as you expect it was much better each time.

Than adding 2 Pink Faun Ultra clocks to my 2 switches .

1 brings it to the unexpected word of amazing 👏 

Than second amplifies that .

So at the end I tested if I can take any of the Buffalows and sell them.

NO it is impossible.  Each time the loss in SQ is so strong I cant take anybof the 4 switches away.

I added 5th switch that is Ether Regen as the first from the modem.

And Yes it adds great taste to the SQ 👍 

I use 5 switches now.

Planning to add one more ......

Best

K

 

 

[cool_chris]

Nenon is correct.

I got 4 Buffalo switches but sent 2 for the clock upgrade to Jord at Pink Faun.

He did fantastic work as you see on the pictures I submitted few pages ago.

Spering the money now to get other 2 upgrated. I need to have all 4 Buffalows  with Pink Faun clocks. Those are fantastic switches.

I wish you could hear the difference on my system. Night and day difference. 

There is no way to take any of the 4 Buffalows away or to get the 5th switch (Ether Regen) out of the chain.

 

I am glad Nenon confirmed the Telegartner M12 being excellent as a musical and sweetness adding solution. 

I wish I could afford to get one and install in my chain as the 6th switch.

 

For now I Prefer to keep Buffalows with PinkFaun clocks if they give 60 % of performance related to 40% of M12 performance ( Nenon rating).

So as far as I understand it correct

you get little more SQ for much less money.

Thank you Nenon !

Best

Chris

 

 

 

[cool_chris]

For the 2 Buffalows with Pink Faun clocks I am using for EACH switch :

Uptone lps1 - 7v out, followed by double regulated mpaudio SLS-Hpuln with 10x  LT 3045  for the clocks.

Vinnie Rossi mini supercap supplys with 3A and 5v out to the boards .

 

For 2 other Buffalows I use

Vinnie Rossi mini supercap supplys with 3A + 5V and

Vinnie Rossi mini supercap supply with 3A + 12 v .

 

I know it sounds crazy but planning to update this with Sean Jolacobs DC4 multirail. Just need little more time to collect the funds for that.

You cant go wrong with top supplys.

Best

Chris

 

 

[cool_chris]

2 minutes ago, Blackmorec said:

Hi Chris,

In my system I use Synergistic Research Atmosphere X Ref ethernet and USB cables. They are delivered with 2 ‘bullets’ which are exchangeable....the one bullet enhances the cable’s detail and spacial resolution, while the second bullet is more orientated around fullness and warmth, so with more than 1 cable you can fine tune exactly the balance between warmth, air and spacial resolution. 

 

Yes. You can do a lot with USB cables.

But I tested 25 different cables, solutions , cleaners , blockers , fibre and many more and got to the conclusion that they all work well, some very well, however only if your system is "mid class" 

If you have top system with perfected everything than removing all of the USB solutions gets you to the over the top sound quality. 

I liked very much the fibre usb isolation, the uptone iso regen and newest Intona 3.0 isolator .

 

[cool_chris]

11 hours ago, Blackmorec said:

Sorry Chris, i don't understand what you’re saying. How does a top class server with a USB output connect to the USB DAC input if not with a cable?   I found my system to work best with a simple USB cable....all the other stuff downgraded the sound

 

Sorry. You are correct this cant work 😆

I missed the one phrase  "except of the Intona Ultimate cable that is still in place" I removed everything.

But I keep everything , because the nirvana is not a stabile thing.

From time to time you want to change this or that OR after server / softwere update dosn't sound as " magical" anymore , so you need to experiment if one of the multiple USB solutions are improving the SQ or not.

So I come back and forth many times sometimes to set it to the new "absolute"

Especially Roon update can be very devastating to the SQ sometimes. Sometimes it improves SQ so you never know.

 

 

[cool_chris]

8 hours ago, Nenon said:

 

The 15% was a relative number.

 

Let's say we start with two stock clock Buffalos. I have written previously about the improvement of one stock clock Buffalo vs. two, three, four, five, etc. 

 

Then I replaced the stock clock on one of the Buffalos. And that was a huge improvement that I've also written about (let's call the level of improvement X). Replacing the clock on the second Buffalo did not give me the same (X) improvement... it gave me only 15% (of X) improvement .

In other words you get the best improvement from upgrading one of the switches. Upgrading more is an improvement but  diminishing returns. 

 

Hope that makes more sense. 

 

I did not try adding a non-PF Buffalo to a set up with two PF Buffalos. I don't have enough power supplies, DC cables, and network cables to do that at the moment. But @cool_chris already commented on that. He is using two stock clock Buffalos and two PF Buffalos. 

 

I agree with you Nenon, the only difference  I see is that in my case it is not X+ 15 % as it is in your case

In my system is rather X+ 50 % so not so much " diminshing returns "

It is solid very nice improvement.

so the first PF Buffalo is X ( in my case it is FEW levels up)

than senond PF Buffalo is about + 50% ( X+ 50 %)

As you remember I have 2 more Buffalows

so adding Nenon moded Buffalo to the above 2 PF Buffalows adds about 15 % ( X+ 50 %+15%)

Adding the 4th switch ( also Nenon moded Buffalo) adds additional 15 % ( X+50%+15 % + 15%)

Please keep in mind each time your starting point is much much higher !

So in reality once you get lests say about 100 % improvement (we call it X )with first swich adding second gives addtional 50 % form the new reference starting point not from the original starting point. I hope I am clear about that.

 

I had also an Ether Regen that was great but not so great as the stock Buffalo for sure.

I addesd it as the 5th switch ( A to A side ! = A side Ethernet to Startech SFP)

just after the modem as it added about 20 % I think it  double isolates the signal from modem.

It has build in transformers in ethernet ports as well as the Fiber opic cable isolates some noise futher. 

I know it is crazy but did try to remove one switch from that LONG chain, hoping I can sell it and invest in different regions of my system but I cannot 

listen to the music without one of the 5 switches. The loss is to painful to my ears.

 

Paul Pang is offering 4 x switch ( Reference QUAD SWITCH) in one enclosure in his e-store for a reason I think. He must have been one of the very early pioneering people in that area.  

It has one power cable but 4 internal linnear power supplys and 4 separate switch boards.

 

There was someone here in the one of the forums mentioning long ago that

 

" Signal going around the glob via hundreds of switches and servers gets devasteted with inpinting the 

character of the each switch / clock on the way to your home ,

so you might need FEW switches to rerender back some of the original content " 

 

I think this makes sense. I was able to confirm it is doing something to the signal / noise that brings the 

positive effects each time. But stopped at 5 switches.

Expecting to power it better than it is nnow and see if Taiko swich will come soon as the 6th swich. 

I dont know the answer how this is happening we are getting better SQ with so many switches.

All I know I get a way better SQ in my room each time.

Tried to calculate that using "Nenons fomula"  but I agree with Nenon that is is very hard to describe the 

difference because everything gets better.

So I think what we were doing until the SWICH era , we were modulating the SQ in one domain ( electrical equelizing ?)

Now with the use of the OXCO clock modified switches we are modulating something else ( time domain ?)

I wish someone can explain that soon.

 

 

 

[cool_chris]

20 hours ago, Blackmorec said:

The more profound the arriving data stream damage, the greater the level of SQ improvement multiple switches will bring. 

 

I must say this is very true in my system. 

I started long ago with radio based Internet.  

Not many know that in fact this are the very strong WiFi antennas (not radio broadcast !) with transmitting distance upto 5 km . This is a very strong signal.

There is more.

Usually this kind of Internet is used in difficult terrain and by that they use much stronger antennas to transmit it further. 

So in my case there was 3 transmission antennas and 3 receiving antennas before it reached the server og the internet provider.

I was able to get the difference with 5GHz and 2,4 Ghz and 5 Ghz destroyes the signal much more than 2,4 antenna.

Also I paid to get installed direct fibre to exclude the 3x plus 3x wifi demage and the outcome is clear.

Using the same system , same stacked switches music is by far better in every possible way. 

I left the radio internet (wifi) for home / office use and 200 mbps fibre is exclusive for music server only.

For those with radio Internet on the roof it will be much better investment to get the fibre home than anything else. 

[cool_chris]

7 hours ago, jean-michel6 said:

Buffalo bs gs 2016 . There are many report of the sq impact of using pf ultra ocxo clock on this switch .

Did anyone tried the same modification with their less expensive ocxo clock ?

 

I know what you mean. 

I was thinking same way before shipping it for the clock upgrade. 

Did a lot of research and decided to go for the best possible clock. Pink Faun Ultra.

Yes it is very expensive but worth every penny in my opinion. 

Once you turn this thing on you forget the money you paid . It is that good. 

 

Also please keep in mind the numbers you see (ppb, phase noise)  is only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to the clock performance .

There is much more that plays significant role in the final performance. 

 

Nenon reported already that Buffalo + PF ultra clock combo is a touch better than 5000 USD M12 . 

Why is that ? 

I am pretty sure it is related to the clock performance and its supply .

Pink Faun clock is not just a clock.

You get a full board with a power supply and proper grounding .

 

[cool_chris]

1 hour ago, Superdad said:

I would not bother with any of those C-W clocks you linked to.  Phase-performance of those is far worse than a good 

Crystek $10 XO.  
All you get with a $58 OCXO (besides a current-hog for the oven and a huge footprint) is a bit of frequency stability—something which matters not at all in the application.  To get decent low phase noise from an OCXO you either have to pay $350+ (and that’s at 200+ quantity) or scavenge particular clocks off of retiring 4G cell tower boards (that’s what the Chinese ham guy BG7TBL does; in fact the -125dBc/Hz at 10Hz offset 10MHz units he offers for $90 in a box are a steal).

 

Its good to hear from industry expert.

I got many of the Uptone products. Fantastic value for the mony .

Could you please be so kind to light up our view a little why do we see so gigantic experience by installing Pink Faun Ultra clocks in Buffalo ?

Which level is that clock in terms of the AUDIO performance in your opinion and if there are any better options?

Also in the price no object case.

Thanks Alex

Best

K

 

 

[cool_chris]

1 hour ago, Soul Analogue said:

The hardware and PSU part of my EPYC server are almost done

have successfully separated power supply an intel i350 lan card (removing the switching regulators on the card) by 1.0v and 1.8v

the 12v will power a PCIE SSD ... probably an optane 😁 

there will be spare 5v and 3.3v rails....probably for clock modifications or usb/i2s card

 

This looks fantastic. 

Congratulations 👏 

Could you please be so kind to share more about how you did 1 v and 1.8v  ?

We had similar issues whith powering the Buffalo 2016 switch .

It has 1.5v and 1v sps regulators on board .

Some were able to power it up but I am not sure what is the best way of bypassing those noisy regulators.  

I have already Pink Faun clocks installed, 

but wanted to power with LPSs only bypasding this regulators