Building a DIY Music Server

[dminches]

Thanks for sharing the pictures and progress.  Keep ‘em coming.

 

[dminches]

Looking great.

 

Can you explain the advantage of using the voltage regulators vs something like the HDPlex 800W DC-ATX module?  I haven't seen another build using those regulators before.

 

[dminches]

1 hour ago, mourip said:

 

I am running my Roon server with an i3 board in a fanless Streacom case with a JCAT Femto card in it. The server runs Windows 2019 with AO with Roon Core as the shell replacement. I have one 19V power supply to an HDPlex 400 converter and a 5V feed to the OS SSD and music SSD. Bridged JCAT outputs with one going to a NUC running AL ramroot. My purpose in mentioning this is that Roon server by itself does not really require a lot of horsepower and sometimes simpler is better.

 

Not trying to hijack the thread but only to mention that for many a powerful CPU may not be needed or even ideal.

 

I also thought that less powerful CPUs would result in lower noise levels.  However, the folks at Taiko Audio who produce the Extreme and Evo found in their research and over-powered CPUs resulted in better, quieter sound.  I can't confirm this since I haven't heard an Extreme but that's what drove their decision to have a dual Xeon configuration.

 

[dminches]

1 minute ago, Lobbster said:

Aren't the Taiko's are doing some very heavy lifting as single box solutions (HQP etc). If it was only a networked server how far do we need to go, or faster is better as long as you can keep processor power consumption to the fanless case limits?

 

 

The current top-of-the-line Extreme comes configured to run Roon only, not HQP.  It can run HQP but I don't believe that is their recommendation configuration.  The older unit did run HQ Player out of the box.

 

 

[dminches]

Nenon, we need the updated pictures!

 

[dminches]

Why not use a larger case, like the FC10, with a modified back panel so that you have more space and can use the cards vertically?

 

[dminches]

7 hours ago, Nenon said:

 

Have you seen the HDPlex H5 2nd Gen? No need to do the FC9/FC10 mod.

 

I considered it for this build but decided to use Streacom FC9 instead. 

 

 

My only issue with the HDPlex case is that the clearance for the CPU pipes could be an issue.  What I like about the Streacom cases is the ability to use a CPU cooling riser which not only gives you more flexibility in selecting a motherboard but I also think it cools better since there is a lot more surface area.

 

[dminches]

This has been a fun and informative thread.  It is permanently bookmarked.

 

 

[dminches]

Are you using external power for the Pink Faun USB card?  Do it benefit from it or is that only to pass power to the DAC?  I can't tell from their website.

 

 

[dminches]

1 hour ago, Chopin75 said:

I believe that is for sonic benefits, as I am doing this too but I have not compared between internal vs external powering myself. It will also benefit (probably greater) the powering of DAC I suppose but it depends on how much power the DAC needs. It is recommended for a 5V/3A supply. If the DAC needs more power it may not be adequate. 

My DAC doesn’t need power but I would suspect that the Pink Faun USB would benefit from a separate power rail. 
 

[dminches]

According to Emile, one of the significant contributors to the quality of the Extreme sound is that the music is stored locally.  He ranked the sound quality based on music location as:

 

Local > streaming (Qobuz/tidal) > NAS.

 

I have never had my music on local drives due to the size of my library and the type of motherboard needed if one wants to use Optane drives.  And then there is also the expense.

 

[dminches]

You should check out the Sablon Audio USB and LAN cables as well. Lots of great reviews on this site.

 

[dminches]

Have you guys compared internal (local hard drive) vs. external (NAS) storage?  Is the consensus that internal storage sound better?

 

[dminches]

1 hour ago, dctom said:

I have been thinking about this. I have 2 x M2 Pcie slots which are supposed to be the best way to implement internal storage. I did try playing some files from an ssd via sata connection and there was a bit of an improvement, not massive . The M2 route could well be quite a bit better only thing is I would need 2 x 2TB boards which are fairly pricy. Would be good to hear from someone who has actually tried it.

 

When you played from the SSD how did you power it, internal PS or external PS?

 

[dminches]

1 hour ago, dctom said:

 

Externally powered from Hdplex 200w.

 

I would have expected a bigger difference then.  I need to check this out on my server.

 

[dminches]

2 hours ago, dctom said:

 

 

SGM extreme people make a big thing of not using SATA channel for storage of music files, they use Pcie M2. Apparantly sata channel is very noisy. 

 

According to Emile it all comes down to PCI having a direct path to the CPU as opposed to going through the chipset.  Makes sense.

 

[dminches]

I would need a different motherboard to use PCI storage since my Supermicro mobo only has 2 PCI lanes and they are being used by network and USB cards.

 

Is there an ATX motherboard which uses ECC ram?  I would like to continue to use the Apacer RAM, if possible.

 

[dminches]

37 minutes ago, adamaley said:

Would that apply to the Pink Faun card as well?

 

 

If you ask them to they will send you both.  If you don't, you only get the one you pick.

 

[dminches]

4 minutes ago, Dev said:

Has anyone able to find good quality micro-ATX motherboard with 2 PCIe slots, with at least one slot being CPU direct ?

 

Supermicro X11SCH-F

 

[dminches]

1 hour ago, Dev said:

 

Yeah, I have looked at that motherboard. can you confirm that a i9-9900K or a KF will work ? It doesn't seem to support 300 series 1151 socket. Also, this motherboard will need a thermal riser if installing on Streacom but not a issue. 

I don’t know all the CPUs it supports.  I am using a Xeon CPU.  And, yes, it requires a riser but that part is easy.

 

I would email their support to ask about the CPUs.

 

[dminches]

40 minutes ago, Dev said:

 

which Xeon are you using ?

 

Intel Xeon E-2124G

 

I am only running Roon server and not HQ Player so I don’t need a ton of processing power.

 

[dminches]

1 hour ago, Nenon said:

The HDPlex needs about 30-35 Watts in this configuration, and it can take 16V - 63V. A 22V-1.5A LPS works just fine. I am using 22V-5A LPS, which is an overkill. 

 

 

Since you are only using the HDPlex to power the motherboard, is your 1.5A estimate reduced because you are powering the clock externally or is that only what the motherboard really needs?  I am using a Keces 20V 8A LPS for that purpose.  I guess that is really overkill.

 

[dminches]

2 hours ago, Gavin1977 said:

Perhaps the benefit of Nenons approach is that the full size motherboards he chooses have a dedicated 12V power to the processor... (unlike the DC/Molex single input style of solution I reference) if CPU lithography, typical speed and cache are the same then I would have thought that a i7 9700T would perform just as well as it’s higher powered counterpart(?), depending upon how many cores the operating system and playback software can utilise.   I know from experience that higher speed and larger cache processors sound better (so I’m also not interested in lower power Raspberry Pi solutions)... but do we need 39cores?  I have no experience to comment.

I’m limited to a single CPU <45w 9700T (or equiv) style solution anyhow as I don’t have the budget and prefer smaller boxes 🙂

 

I’ve posted the question on core count in the Gentoo Player thread as I wonder what the developer of this software thinks of the issue.

 

Did Emile f Taiko audio post a comparison of CPU’s somewhere?  Anyone got a link?

 

 

 

 

 

Are you saying that m-ATX motherboards don’t allow for direct powering of the CPU?  I am using an m-ATX Supermicro mobo and I am powering directly from the 12V rail of my HDPlex 400W LPS.

 

[dminches]

45 minutes ago, Nenon said:

This is my best build so far:

 

 

I think that the choice of motherboard/CPU StreamFidelity has picked for his latest build is also good if you want to go with consumer Intel CPUs.

 

And I think the Sage motherboard and dual Xeons would be better than all of them. But so challenging... 

 

Can you post the Apacer part number for the RAM you used?

 

[dminches]

1 hour ago, matthias said:

 

Congratulations,

you are in good company with others like @romaz who found the same.

 

When you have an excellent server this "endpoint" concept comes to an end. It is very enlightening to read the Taiko Extreme thread on WBF. When you combine the Extreme with an endpoint the SQ is inferior to the Extreme alone. The same when the Extreme itself is an endpoint and has another server as source. 

 

For me endpoints do not make any sense at all, the best is to have an UHQ server with excellent USB output into an DAC.

 

Enjoy:-)

 

Matt

 

Great points and something I have found to be the case as well even though I am not running an Extreme.

 

My biggest roadblock now is that I would love to have my files loaded on a card inside the server and not pull them from my NAS.  The issue is the amount of music I have.