HOLO Audio MAY DAC

[YALA]

I watch a lot of concerts and movies on bluray and dvd as well as music videos and songs on youtube. My sources are an oppo 205 and a Zappiti pro 4k. Both sources have been modified and improved by a professional, among other things they have been equipped with a femto clock. On the other hand, the holo does a magnificent job on the signal on its i2s and usb inputs. A considerable improvement on the front speakers for all my shows, even for films, documentaries ... The gaia has no hdmi input, otherwise I may have bought it but it is not certain because the holo is doing well on this chapter. If you know a ddc reclocker with hdmi input and i2s output, please let me know.

[GoldenOne]

7 hours ago, YALA said:

I know it is a DDC but not in the sense of a reclocker such as the denafrips ddc gaia which does have an i2s output but which does not convert an hdmi signal. If you know of any other high end hdmi / i2s converter, let me know because I'm a buyer.

Any format converter such as that inherently has to reclock as well. It unfortunately isn't possible to convert without retransmission, which then means it needs it's own clock which unfortunately for a cheap device like that is most likely going to be awful. 

 

What device are you actually feeding the may from? It's likely going to be easier to address that. Feeding it from an hdmi out is a little unusual

[YALA]

I must also add that my two sources are equipped with a second hdmi output reserved for audio. When connected, the primary hdmi output does not carry audio to improve video signal transfer, and the secondary hdmi output does not output video to improve audio signal transfer. On the other hand, hdmi audio output has been improved to reduce jitter. There, all is said. Now it only remains to talk about the quality of the holo may kte.

[YALA]

Be careful, do not enter an hdmi signal directly on the i2s input of the holo, you will damage it. hdmi and i2s are not directly compatible, you have to go through an hdmi to i2s conversion interface like
the two converter boxes I told you about ...

[JohnDonaldson]

At the suggestion of Tim at Kitsune I recently installed a Ableconn PUSB31P2A PCIE USB card in my AMD X570 based motherboard in the hope it would resolve the problems with Holo firmware 30.12. My May now happily plays at 1.536 mhz. While the cards may not be of Audiophile level, I think it is at least of the same quality of the typical motherboard USB port and it only costs $34 at Amazon.

Many thanks to Tim for great customer support.

[GoldenOne]

18 minutes ago, JohnDonaldson said:

At the suggestion of Tim at Kitsune I recently installed a Ableconn PUSB31P2A PCIE USB card in my AMD X570 based motherboard in the hope it would resolve the problems with Holo firmware 30.12. My May now happily plays at 1.536 mhz. While the cards may not be of Audiophile level, I think it is at least of the same quality of the typical motherboard USB port and it only costs $34 at Amazon.

Many thanks to Tim for great customer support.

I've ordered one of these to test in my AMD system as well.
For those buying though, make sure to get that specific model number as it has the ASM1142 chipset, the newer one with the ASM3142 may not work.
 

[JohnDonaldson]

43 minutes ago, GoldenOne said:

I've ordered one of these to test in my AMD system as well.
For those buying though, make sure to get that specific model number as it has the ASM1142 chipset, the newer one with the ASM3142 may not work.
 

Thanks for adding that important information.

[Extreme_Boky]

5 hours ago, GoldenOne said:

I've ordered one of these to test in my AMD system as well.
For those buying though, make sure to get that specific model number as it has the ASM1142 chipset, the newer one with the ASM3142 may not work.
 

The cards use a switching-mode power supply converter - terrible for audio - their implementation on these particular cards is especially quite bad. 

 

 

[ted_b]

As we’ve discussed before, those AMD server users who use HQPlayer can get 32fs by getting an inexpensive Intel NAA too. 

[Gavin1977]

12 hours ago, GoldenOne said:

I've ordered one of these to test in my AMD system as well.
For those buying though, make sure to get that specific model number as it has the ASM1142 chipset, the newer one with the ASM3142 may not work.
 

Any know issues with JCAT USB Xe?

[GoldenOne]

8 hours ago, Gavin1977 said:

Any know issues with JCAT USB Xe?

Pretty sure the jcat card won't do 1.5mhz. Someone earlier in the thread tried it I think (might have been in hqp thread I'm not sure) 

[GoldenOne]

14 hours ago, ted_b said:

As we’ve discussed before, those AMD server users who use HQPlayer can get 32fs by getting an inexpensive Intel NAA too. 

This is probably the easiest way, and what I'm currently doing. 

 

Small fanless Intel mini pc from 'mele' was £150 on amazon. 

Got roon Bridge and hqp naa running seamlessly side by side. 

 

And if anyone is Concerned about usb quality they can slap an Igalvanic Inbetween too

[GoldenOne]

15 hours ago, Extreme_Boky said:

The cards use a switching-mode power supply converter - terrible for audio - their implementation on these particular cards is especially quite bad. 

 

 

Can always add an Igalvanic or something if concerned. 

[stuck limo]

Looking into getting one of these. Has anyone heard the Stock version vs the Wildism version? And does anyone in this thread do upgrade mods for $$? 

[vfrpoye]

Hi everybody,

i have an usb issue with my May L2, it keeps say unlocked. I've tried several usb cable, from my motherboard port, a pic/usb card and even a macbook but so far nothing !

Obviously, it's neither recognized when i tried to connect with the windows app from the driver install.

Any idea on this issue ?

[Extreme_Boky]

Make sure the input selection is: USB

[vfrpoye]

Hi, 

it is. And i actually plug the usb cable given with the dac.

[Extreme_Boky]

Install Drivers 5.00

 

https://www.kitsunehifi.com/holoaudio-5-00-drivers-firmware-2020-same-firmwares-from-4-67-driver-pack/

 

Has it alwayds been like that? Since you bought it?

[vfrpoye]

No it worked flawlessly before, that’s weird.

I’ve already install drivers when I downgrade to test 30.12. Didn’t succed to read 32fs with my Matrix usb card but so far still working with everything else.

[darioG]

Hi , new to this forum, first post so please  be gentle, I know I'm not worthy! 😉

I am a bit of a Noob and don't understand some of the technical speak on here to explain shortfalls of Pi2aes setting with I2s. on Holo May L2, vs Usb...

 

I recently purchased the Holo May L2 dac after watching GoldenOne review.  I am current feeding signal through my Allo Usbbridge Sig with Shanti power supply (Ropieeee as Roon endpoint.). 

I coupled the Allo Usb to Holy May with a Curious Evolved usb cable.  This sound really natural to my ears:), but found that roon upscaling made sound too digital to my taste.  Hqplayer filters may help, will try when new hdmi cable arrives and will compare i2s and usb.

 

I though I would experiment 🙂

 

 I have also purchased a Pi2aes which I can also power with the Shanti power 5v power supply direct to the Pi2aes hat. 5v pins 

I had a £40 4k 1m hdmi cable which just tested to see if connection works! I found that I2s input kept locking between 5 and 15 seconds!!  I assume it was my hdmi cable. because it happens between albums and tracks, not just when turn on Holo dac.

 

I have just purchased a RAL .75m Prophecy CryoSilver™ Reference HDMI cable, should arrive soon.  

Hoping this will fix the locking but it may also be I2s port pinout setting on the Holo may dac???

 

Will polarity be effected and left and right channels be reversed when connecting pi2aes to Holo May I2s?  

 

Could someone please share the correct I2s Port pinout setting within Holo May dac setup to connect Pi2aes to holo may dac i2s?

Regards Darren

Hegal H390 amp, XLR to Holo May L2 dac, Allo usb bridge sig roon enpoint. Pi2aes, I2s, Roon endpoint, Shanti 5v power supply.  Dali Epicon 6 speakers.

[John Hughes]

It's in the manual (attached).  The May uses the same pinout as the Denafrips and PS Audio.  The delay you are experiencing is common with the i2s, its the PLL Lock.  If you disable the PLL Lock the delay will clear up.  If you have an HDMI cable thats about 1/2 meter or so, changing cables probably won't address that.

 

I've also used the USBridge Signature with Shanti. Its good. I'm using the Stack Audio Link II  with LPS now which runs a custom version of Ropieee. I definitely prefer that. 

 

I use USB from the May to the Link II directly for Roon. 

 

I use an Nvidia Shield as my second source for video.  I have tried 3 different USB to i2s converters so I don't have to switch USB cables for sources.  A cheap one from Ebay, the LKS USB-100, and the Kitsune Edition Singxer U2.  The cheap no name did work, but the audio was not that great.  The LKS made a nice upgrade, and is fairly inexpensive.  The Kitsune SIngxer U2 is definitely the best of the three.  I tried the Link II connected to the U2 and I would say it was too close to call vs direct USB connection to the May.  And the PLL Locking issues were worse adding in any of the DDCs.  So I'm not using it that way.  

May-Manual-English-V1.2.pdf

[darioG]

8 hours ago, John Hughes said:

It's in the manual (attached).  The May uses the same pinout as the Denafrips and PS Audio.  The delay you are experiencing is common with the i2s, its the PLL Lock.  If you disable the PLL Lock the delay will clear up.  If you have an HDMI cable thats about 1/2 meter or so, changing cables probably won't address that.

 

I've also used the USBridge Signature with Shanti. Its good. I'm using the Stack Audio Link II  with LPS now which runs a custom version of Ropieee. I definitely prefer that. 

 

I use USB from the May to the Link II directly for Roon. 

 

I use an Nvidia Shield as my second source for video.  I have tried 3 different USB to i2s converters so I don't have to switch USB cables for sources.  A cheap one from Ebay, the LKS USB-100, and the Kitsune Edition Singxer U2.  The cheap no name did work, but the audio was not that great.  The LKS made a nice upgrade, and is fairly inexpensive.  The Kitsune SIngxer U2 is definitely the best of the three.  I tried the Link II connected to the U2 and I would say it was too close to call vs direct USB connection to the May.  And the PLL Locking issues were worse adding in any of the DDCs.  So I'm not using it that way.  

May-Manual-English-V1.2.pdf 850.06 kB · 7 downloads

Thank you John for your reply. :)

 

Is the SQ of Stack Audio worth the extra £700 with LPS compared to the Allo USB sig, Shanti?, I am only going to use as Roon endpoint, so other features are wasted on Stack Audio!. If not a lot of SQ difference, I will stick with Allo. Unless find Stack and LPS second hand :)

 

If I turn off PLL lock I2s , will the effect be jitter?  Is the PLL just buggy with I2s, don't have issue with usb PLL locking...

 

I like the SQ of Roon compared to other software , Audirvana SQ didn't do it for me at all, plus all the bugs!

 I have seen the pinouts diagram and the different options in the manual, but when look on diagrams to compare with PS audio or denafrips pinout nothing like diagrams in Holo manual..(Alt1-Alt2 Or Alt3?) Anyone confirm which should select?  or is just connect hdmi cable select one which you get sound output and the stereo channels output from Holo XLR ports will be the correct way round ect?

 

[barrows]

3 hours ago, darioG said:

Thank you John for your reply. :)

 

Is the SQ of Stack Audio worth the extra £700 with LPS compared to the Allo USB sig, Shanti?, I am only going to use as Roon endpoint, so other features are wasted on Stack Audio!. If not a lot of SQ difference, I will stick with Allo. Unless find Stack and LPS second hand :)

 

If I turn off PLL lock I2s , will the effect be jitter?  Is the PLL just buggy with I2s, don't have issue with usb PLL locking...

 

I like the SQ of Roon compared to other software , Audirvana SQ didn't do it for me at all, plus all the bugs!

 I have seen the pinouts diagram and the different options in the manual, but when look on diagrams to compare with PS audio or denafrips pinout nothing like diagrams in Holo manual..(Alt1-Alt2 Or Alt3?) Anyone confirm which should select?  or is just connect hdmi cable select one which you get sound output and the stereo channels output from Holo XLR ports will be the correct way round ect?

 

The PLL is not buggy.  A really good PLL will take a long time to lock depending on how much jitter is present in the source, sometimes, if the source has too much jitter, a good PLL may not be able to achieve lock at all.  The long time to achieve lock indicates that your source has somewhat high jitter, and that if you turn off the PLL that jitter will get into the conversion stage, and produce artifacts in your analog output.  For best sound, keep the PLL on to reduce the incoming jitter, and live with the wait, or, even better, get a better source with less jitter in the first place.

Also, it is good to remember, that even a very good PLL does not eliminate incoming jitter, it actually just turns short term jitter (which is generally what produces objectionable sound quality) into long term jitter (which is generally inaudible).  It is always going to be a better fundamental choice to reduce the source jitter as much as possible.

[darioG]

19 minutes ago, barrows said:

The PLL is not buggy.  A really good PLL will take a long time to lock depending on how much jitter is present in the source, sometimes, if the source has too much jitter, a good PLL may not be able to achieve lock at all.  The long time to achieve lock indicates that your source has somewhat high jitter, and that if you turn off the PLL that jitter will get into the conversion stage, and produce artifacts in your analog output.  For best sound, keep the PLL on to reduce the incoming jitter, and live with the wait, or, even better, get a better source with less jitter in the first place.

Also, it is good to remember, that even a very good PLL does not eliminate incoming jitter, it actually just turns short term jitter (which is generally what produces objectionable sound quality) into long term jitter (which is generally inaudible).  It is always going to be a better fundamental choice to reduce the source jitter as much as possible.

According to Goldenone measurements between the PI2AES and Denaphips ddc, the PI2AES has lower jitter from I2S than the Denaphips ddc 🤔   

[barrows]

9 minutes ago, darioG said:

According to Goldenone measurements between the PI2AES and Denaphips ddc, the PI2AES has lower jitter from I2S than the Denaphips ddc 🤔   

So?  The fact remains that if a PLL takes a long time to achieve lock, it is because the incoming jitter is rather high.

In any case, I would expect there to be no advantage in using the I2S input (despite current fashionable beliefs) versus the USB in the May DAC-but I would still advise using a very good USB source.