UpTone EtherRegen measured. It's a switch.

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The point is that Sir Amir is the most credible and respected person in the industry and we should all defer to him. His knowledge and experience are boundless, his intelligence immeasurable and his ethics are above reproach. His aural sensors are both acute and subliminal, resembling those of a canine in its prime. 

 

Let it be clear; whoever claims that either commercial interests or personal bias affect the outcome of his tests is a malicious, slanderous cretin to be dammed and condemned. 

 

Having said that, if Amir is unable to hear any difference, and if his pinpoint, laser-guided measures demonstrate the ER has no efficacy whatsoever, we should unquestionably accept and pay homage to his verdict. Yes, we must immediately remove that snake-oil device from our chains and repeat to ourselves that the old sound is exactly the same, Indeed, we, poor souls, were merely deceived by the overwhelming forces of phsyoacoustic and cognitive dissonance.

 

Hail Amir!

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18 minutes ago, firedog said:

Amir directly compared the output of a DAC when connected to the ER and when connected to an off the shelf switch. Results: zero difference in various measurements such as jitter and S/N.

 

So either (a) Amir's measurements are somehow wrong or irrelevant to what the ER claims to do, or:

b) the ER isn't doing what it claims to do versus other ethernet switches.

 

I don't like the tone of this thread or the one at ASR,  but it would be useful if someone could come up with a relevant response to Amir's measurements. So far only ad hominem attacks that are meaningless, and responses which avoid actually answering the questions raised: 

 

No one has to accept anything Amir says at face value. But he made measurements, and claims his measurements show the ER does nothing superior to a standard ethernet switch. If Uptone and others want to claim the ER is somehow superior, they need to either show that Amir's measurements are incorrect, or explain how the superior performance of the ER doesn't show up in actual use. If the ER is operating as claimed, shouldn't it improve jitter performance and S/N over a standard switch?

 

Calling Amir names is a red herring.

 

What Amir says he heard is irrelevant - it's just his listening based on his biases. But saying lots of us "hear differences" is also actually irrelevant. Any individual can hear whatever he/she wants. That result is applicable only to him/her - and not to anyone else.

 

If you want to show that what you are hearing has some broader relevance and isn't a result of expectation bias, then explain (and making claims that aren't backed up doesn't count) how Amir's measurements are either technically wrong; or explain how the ER can be doing what it claims to do, yet not improve S/N or jitter results when compared to a standard switch. 

 

 

I’ll spell it out in simple terms. 

 

I spent about an hour researching reports with measurements taken to either validate or refute Amair’s results. There were enough inconsistencies to turn me into a skeptic. It’s beyond me to tell if he cooks his numbers or he’s not savvy enough to operate his equipment. No aspiration cast, but no trust gained.    

 

I read a bit his theories.

He contradicts himself enough times to compel even his fervent followers to raise an eyebrow on occasion.

 

So for me, it's difficult to take him seriously. 

 

UpTone is subscribed to the theory that the less electrical crap travels from one device to the next, the less overall jitter and the better the sound. How the ER supposedly accomplices that is well explained on various platforms.

 

Many people, including myself, hear a distinct difference when the ER is part of the chain. Are we all delusional idiots? Possibly…But it’s more likely that either Amir’s measurements are off the mark, or we need to look for a different set of measurements to explain the phenomenon. A point in case, consider speakers that have the same exact measurements, yet listening reveals completely different sound signatures. 

 

At any rate, UpTone gives 30-days-money-back. Anyone can find out for themselves. 

 

 

 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, firedog said:

It's a theory that isn't backed up. "Well explained" - not really. Explanations that sound good and logical, but haven't been shown to actually work in reality.  It would seem that Uptone or other larger manufacturers like SoTM could come up with not just explanations, but measurements that show their explanations and theories to be true. If there is "less overall jitter", why can't they show it actually happening at the DAC output? Jitter isn't some unmeasureable small nuclear force that we don't know how to measure without a CERN like setup.

 

What I know that I've enjoyed my music much more since I added the ER. You, on the other hand, won't get to enjoy that SQ bump for a while, as it behooves you to enjoy only improvements in sound that can be measured. 

 

Prey, wonder who's better off...While I'll be off to enjoy SoundCloud. 

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14 minutes ago, firedog said:

Nonsense. I have a great system that I enjoy listening to. I like to spend my money on products that have demonstrable benefits. I'm perfectly capable of buying the ER or any other add on product and "hearing" an SQ bump in sighted listening. I prefer not to spend my money just to engage in self deception. 

And don't misunderstand: if reputable measurements come out showing what the ER does, I'd be glad to buy it. I'd also probably buy it if several well run/designed blind listening tests showed it to make an audible difference. I am willing to entertain the possibility that there are aspects to audio we don't know how to measure. I'm just not willing to use that catch all explanation for every sighted (and by definition) biased listening test. 

 

Yeah, right, you won't spend $18 on two way shipping to give it a spin, but you'll spend countless minutes hammering the keyboard to explain why everyone who loves it is wrong. 

 

Get your priority right, man. 

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26 minutes ago, tapatrick said:

From reading this thread (and similar ones) all I can glean is that Amir made some measurements, concluded that the ER is no different from a less expensive model and therefore those who try it and say it makes a noticeable difference are being fooled or are imagining the improvement.  
Not very scientific and full of bias and presumption. 

 

Amir has got beef with UpTone and will do his best to cause them damage. 

The only point I don't get is why so many give him credence. Even Alex gets his hands dirty in these spats. 

 

"The dogs bark and the caravan passes thorough."

UpTone will sale six figures of ER, and Amir will still scream it's all a big sham.

 

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9 minutes ago, mansr said:

The real question is why Alex/Superdad is so deeply afraid of anyone discussing measured technical performance of his trinkets. Perhaps he is the one hiding something.

 

I'm sure you'll blow my forthcoming and speculative answer off as it won't fit the conspiracy you suspect in your mind. Nevertheless:

 

Alex is at John's mercy when it comes to measurements, and John is both extremely busy and  doesn't view proving the supremacy of his designs paramount, as--in his mind--the improvement in sound is so obviously clear. 

 

Further, the level and nature of measurements he'd like to ultimately extract require expensive equipment and home-brewed devices that dampen his enthusiasm even more. 

 

This is not advocacy, rather laying out a plausible conjecture.

 

 

 

 

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15 minutes ago, firedog said:

Coordinated attack? Really? It's a review, done the way Amir does every review about every device.

You can say lots of stuff about Amir, but he calls them as he measures them. He didn't even procure the ER,  a reader sent it to him for testing, as often happens.

 

He sometimes reports on multiple devices in a day. I'm not sure why you jump to conspiracy theories. Send him a SOtM switch or whatever, and he will measure it. He measures all sorts of stuff from all sorts of companies, but rarely super expensive stuff, as he can't afford to buy it and owners of such stuff usually don't send him such devices.

 

Either Amir's measurements are relevant or not; either done properly or not. All the  rest is just nonsense speculation and conspiracy theories. 

Amir's measures are not the point, and the entire process is rubbish.

That's what I would expect from genuinely scientific society, which ASR claim to be:

Since you have hundreds of people reporting on SQ improvement when adding the ER, set up a blind test to validate the null hypothesis. It is met, search for an explanation, including the use of measurements.

That would highly constructive and a positive contribution.

But instead, what we get is Amir, who-the-hell-is-he, running some possibly irrelevant test in his basement, followed by his choir of acolytes screaming murder. Over and again, it seems the sole goal of the exercise is to mock and heap abuse on others for being biased and placeboed.

 

To recap, let's first establish a difference can be heard. Then look for an explanation.