Kimo Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 It occurred to me while taking system inventory that I most likely will never own a number of items, which made up the core of my system not too long ago, 1. SACD/CD player: No need for another one of these 2. UDP: Not much need and not much to choose from any more. If another is needed, it will likely be a digital transport like my Sony 800. 3. Dedicated preamp: Plenty of options in the DAC world with dedicated volume controls and an extra input for my meager vinyl collection 4. Dedicated solid state power amp: If I ever make a change, it will be an integrated and I would look for models that included the DAC That leaves for my potential purchases. 1. Upgraded server: Pretty happy with the Innuos Zenith, but you never know 2. New Integrated amp: To include DAC and phono ideally. 3. New speakers: Would have to be horn, open baffle, or active. Likely there would be some active element any in any of these. Something akin to the Grimm Audio system has great appeal to me. I doubt I would be giving up much in sound quality, while eliminating almost all boxes. Anyone still looking for a new CD player, big 2 channel power amp, etc., or are these pieces headed toward near extinction? Will it all be servers feeding one box solutions or active speakers, in a short time? Link to comment
Popular Post Kal Rubinson Posted December 1, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted December 1, 2019 Yup. It's happening and it's about time that the configuration of audio systems changes to reflect modern technology. esldude and phosphorein 2 Kal Rubinson Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile Link to comment
Ralf11 Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 the boxes are vanishing from your rack... I bought an Oppo-205 recently to play BluRay/DVD and it's also used to play SACDs I still use a tube pre-amp (well, actually 2 - the old Sonic Frontiers is in the bedroom system now) - it euphonicizes the sound and lets my listen to my FM Tuner which I do nearly every year... Link to comment
Kimo Posted December 1, 2019 Author Share Posted December 1, 2019 3 hours ago, Kal Rubinson said: Yup. It's happening and it's about time that the configuration of audio systems changes to reflect modern technology. Seems the integrated DAC is starting to become a routine option, at least, on many newer amps. Link to comment
Kimo Posted December 1, 2019 Author Share Posted December 1, 2019 23 minutes ago, Ralf11 said: the boxes are vanishing from your rack... I bought an Oppo-205 recently to play BluRay/DVD and it's also used to play SACDs I still use a tube pre-amp (well, actually 2 - the old Sonic Frontiers is in the bedroom system now) - it euphonicizes the sound and lets my listen to my FM Tuner which I do nearly every year... Do you think that you will ever end up downsizing to something like a Devialet or the new Denon? Link to comment
Popular Post emcdade Posted December 1, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted December 1, 2019 There’s been integrated amps forever, they’ve just changed what’s integrated. If the future of Hifi is only active speakers and an iPad that seems pretty boring to me. I appreciate the more esoteric stuff in this hobby. It’s already a tiny minority, so I won’t wish death upon a bespoke tube preamp. daverich4 and NOMBEDES 2 Link to comment
Ralf11 Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 what new Denon? likely not to a Devialet... I keep thinking the bedroom system should be a Creek with a Ruby DAC module - OTOH, what is the advantage of getting rid of perfectly fine gear if I don't need the space? Link to comment
Blake Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 It depends on whether your goal is ultimate sound quality, or a desire for minimum component count. Albrecht and Ralf11 1 1 Speaker Room: Lumin U1X | Lampizator Pacific 2 | Viva Linea | Constellation Inspiration Stereo 1.0 | FinkTeam Kim | Revel subs Office Headphone System: Lumin U1X | Lampizator Golden Gate 3 | Viva Egoista | Abyss AB1266 Phi TC Link to comment
DuckToller Posted December 1, 2019 Share Posted December 1, 2019 Interesting topic!!! Imho, the standard - outside the audiophile spectre of pitched enthusiasts - will be divided between two poles Active Speaker + Streaming DAC/PreAmp + unnecessary gear like Vinyl, CD, SACD Passive Speakes + AIO - All In One Amplifiers, eventually with exchangable modules for DAC and Streaming + unnecessary gear like Vinyl, CD, SACD Both solution served by a NAS or an Innuos server or equivalent and the streaming services via Inet. If having a DAC included with the Actives, it will also be modular in the future All of this naturally has its price, you won't get modular solutions for free, more reasonable priced gear will have some tec gadgets like the streaming unit or DACs as integrated parts responsible for early retirement 😉 by advancing technology If you buy gear with a ten year guarantee or lifetime chances are good it will be modular .,.. my 2cents, Tom Link to comment
Kimo Posted December 1, 2019 Author Share Posted December 1, 2019 17 minutes ago, Blake said: It depends on whether your goal is ultimate sound quality, or a desire for minimum component count. There are real advantages to active speakers and integrated DACs/amplification for a talented designer. Won't necessarily be cheap though. Link to comment
Kimo Posted December 1, 2019 Author Share Posted December 1, 2019 30 minutes ago, Ralf11 said: what new Denon? likely not to a Devialet... I keep thinking the bedroom system should be a Creek with a Ruby DAC module - OTOH, what is the advantage of getting rid of perfectly fine gear if I don't need the space? https://www.denon.co.uk/uk/news/news/462 Pretty competitive price and an award winner, for whatever that is worth. Link to comment
Popular Post Kal Rubinson Posted December 1, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted December 1, 2019 1 hour ago, emcdade said: If the future of Hifi is only active speakers and an iPad that seems pretty boring to me. I gather that you have not discovered the delights of DSP. 1 hour ago, emcdade said: I appreciate the more esoteric stuff in this hobby. It’s already a tiny minority, so I won’t wish death upon a bespoke tube preamp. I used to be fascinated by the esoteric but most of it is becoming archaic bling. 44 minutes ago, Blake said: t depends on whether your goal is ultimate sound quality, or a desire for minimum component count. Not really. It depends on what you consider ultimate sound quality. Component count is a dependent variable. Thuaveta and esldude 2 Kal Rubinson Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile Link to comment
Popular Post Kimo Posted December 1, 2019 Author Popular Post Share Posted December 1, 2019 17 minutes ago, Kal Rubinson said: I used to be fascinated by the esoteric but most of it is becoming archaic bling. You've met my first wife? Blake, Ralf11 and Kal Rubinson 3 Link to comment
Ralf11 Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 Thx Kimo - the Denon looks like a nice all, all, all in one (phono, DAC, integrated amp) Link to comment
gmgraves Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 9 hours ago, Ralf11 said: the boxes are vanishing from your rack... I bought an Oppo-205 recently to play BluRay/DVD and it's also used to play SACDs I still use a tube pre-amp (well, actually 2 - the old Sonic Frontiers is in the bedroom system now) - it euphonicizes the sound and lets my listen to my FM Tuner which I do nearly every year... I have one of those as well. I use it not only to play BluRays and DVDs (as well as PAL auto racing DVDs from Duke Video on the Isle of Mann!). I also play my ripped music from attached storage via USB through my 205 but I only use the built-in DAC to play SACDs because my Yggdrasil does not do DSD. Everything else gets played through the Yiggy. I love my 205, and I think that Oppo made a big mistake getting out of the business. I’ve seen remaindered NOS of these players going for as much as $4000! I got mine just under the wire. George Link to comment
emcdade Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 6 hours ago, Kal Rubinson said: I gather that you have not discovered the delights of DSP. I use Roon's DSP currently and have used Dirac. It's great for 200 hz and down. However I wouldn't want to give up my opportunity to fine tune my sound through separate dac/preamp/amp combo, and I also wouldn't be fond of digitizing an analog signal by default so that DSP may or may not be applied in the case of an active speaker. Call me old fashioned I guess, at age 38. Link to comment
Teresa Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 17 hours ago, Kimo said: ...Anyone still looking for a new CD player, big 2 channel power amp, etc., or are these pieces headed toward near extinction?... I hope they don't become extinct before I die. I will replace my Yamaha SACD / HDCD / CD / Blu-ray universal player when it dies. When my amp needs replacing I will likely get an inexpensive tubed integrated amp. I have dementia. I save all my posts in a text file I call Forums. I do a search in that file to find out what I said or did in the past. I still love music. Teresa Link to comment
marce Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 15 hours ago, Blake said: It depends on whether your goal is ultimate sound quality, or a desire for minimum component count. No correlation.... Link to comment
Kimo Posted December 2, 2019 Author Share Posted December 2, 2019 5 hours ago, Teresa said: I hope they don't become extinct before I die. I will replace my Yamaha SACD / HDCD / CD / Blu-ray universal player when it dies. When my amp needs replacing I will likely get an inexpensive tubed integrated amp. I think that you are safe on the tube integrated, but the udps with analog outs are getting hard to find. I know of 1 Pioneer that does it all, and 1 Sony. There is also a Panasonic, but it doesn't do SACD or DVD-A. Teresa 1 Link to comment
Teresa Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 1 hour ago, Kimo said: I think that you are safe on the tube integrated, but the udps with analog outs are getting hard to find. I know of 1 Pioneer that does it all, and 1 Sony. There is also a Panasonic, but it doesn't do SACD or DVD-A. Thanks, I will likely get a Yamaha universal again since all but their cheapest ones have stereo analog outputs, multichannel out is only with HDMI. I have yet to see any tube preamps or tube integrated amps with HDMI inputs. I seem to remember reading that there are a couple of DACs with HDMI inputs. Basically, Yamaha universal players that retail for $300 or more have analog outs. I think eliminating internal DACs is how universal Blu-ray / SACD players got the retail price down as low as $100. The only Universal players that have everything I want (SACD, HDCD and stereo analog outs) are Yamaha, Denon and Oppo. And Oppo quit making universal players. My Yamaha universal is five years old, hopefully it will last at least another five. I play physical discs on it a lot. I mostly use music on my computer to load to my hi-res portable digital player for listening when I'm not home. I have dementia. I save all my posts in a text file I call Forums. I do a search in that file to find out what I said or did in the past. I still love music. Teresa Link to comment
Kal Rubinson Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 10 hours ago, emcdade said: However I wouldn't want to give up my opportunity to fine tune my sound through separate dac/preamp/amp combo, This seems, to me, to be becoming a crude way to "tune" the sound. 10 hours ago, emcdade said: Call me old fashioned I guess, at age 38. "We get too soon old and too late smart." 😊 Kal Rubinson Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile Link to comment
Kimo Posted December 2, 2019 Author Share Posted December 2, 2019 1 hour ago, Kal Rubinson said: "We get too soon old and too late smart." 😊 The other day at my local record store, I offered the hypothetical to the group of twenty somethings working there. You get 20 billion dollars, but you have to spend the rest of your life in a wheel chair. They all jumped on the deal without hesitation. Then I changed it a bit. You get 20 billion dollars, but you will be blind the rest of your life. They all jumped at that as well. So there you go. Link to comment
StephenJK Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 On 12/1/2019 at 10:45 AM, Kimo said: It occurred to me while taking system inventory that I most likely will never own a number of items, which made up the core of my system not too long ago, "snip" Anyone still looking for a new CD player, big 2 channel power amp, etc., or are these pieces headed toward near extinction? Will it all be servers feeding one box solutions or active speakers, in a short time? The system of the future may already be here! This past summer I got rid of a PS Audio Direct Stream Jr. DAC, a Korg MR-2000S digital recorder, a Musical Fidelity Nu-Vista Vinyl phono preamp and a Musical Fidelity Nu-Vista 800 integrated amplifier. All that was replaced with a pair of Devialet monoblock Expert Pro 440 integrated amplifiers. Essentially, they're a Class A/Class D amplifier combined with a digital sound processor. All configuration and manipulation is done in the digital domain. An input, such as from the Phono is digitized and then RIAA equalization and impedance matching is applied. That digital signal is available for recording and is then sent to the DAC section for playback to the speakers. The speaker profile can be downloaded so the output to the drivers is "time aligned" for the best possible sound. Being a hard core analog audiophile for many years I was nervous about those two little chrome boxes, but no longer. The sound is absolutely terrific and all I need is that and my turntable. All that other stuff is gone. Changes to the inputs and outputs is done with an online configuration tool and uploaded to the amplifier with an SD card. Link to comment
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