The EtherREGEN thread for various network, cable, power experiences and experiments

[agladstone]

17 hours ago, Johnnydev said:

I think you've got the real punch line.

 

An installation with on modem and or router etc. an SMPS, could benefits from the DX. If everything is connected to good LPS then the DXs in the line can give a lesser SQ.
 

I have 4x Farad Super3 and 1x uptone LPS 1.2 from cable modem, router, 2x EtherRegen and after dark clock and removing the DXs gives in this case an improvement in SQ.

Thanks for the explanation! 
It sounds to be based on this that perhaps the DXE wouldn’t benefit my Audio chain from router to ER to Aurender server/player/streamer. 
However, it does seem to me that based on your description, they might be a help to my Apple TV 4K since it has a built in SMPS power supply and I can’t seem to find anyone making a kit to replace the SMPS with an external LPS (hopefully someone will eventually do this, like the Upton MK kit for older Mac Mini’s, I suspect a lot of Audiophile’s also have an Apple TV 4K in their rack or other systems). 

[Rsbrsvp]

5 hours ago, MartinT said:

 

It isn't that - I checked carefully by playing some very low level detail songs, for instance the opening to Ry Cooder's Why Don't You Try Me.  There are all manner of cymbal shimmers and taps going on there so I know that low level details are coming through fine without the DXEs in place.  In fact, they're better.

 

It's simply that I've paid a lot of attention to mains regeneration, grounding, cables and support isolation.  In my system, the DXEs don't help.  I can fully understand that in others they work well.

The fact that the DX harms your sound is a pretty clear sign that your have things so right in your system, that upward movement is almost impossible.   I am in awe...    I wish my system was so so good that the DX would harm the sound.  The fact that it helps, and by a nice amount shows how much noise is still in my system.

 

Thanks to you and everyone for sharing your findings.   I just entered streaming audio in the last six months and I have learned so much from all of you...

[skatbelt]

9 hours ago, roman410 said:

I fully agree with you. But I want add one more word"right".

 

My music enjoyment with DX filters it is similar to " late night music listening experience" when music for some reasons sound so"right".

 

 

 

At night our ears are probably extra isolated by alcohol... 😇

[roman410]

3 hours ago, skatbelt said:

 

At night our ears are probably extra isolated by alcohol... 😇

Yes, that it is one of the theories,  but actually I was experiencing this effect early morning weekend listening sessions! I know my self if I will drink night before I will have different problem (hangover)😁.

 

Some people believes the main grid is cleaner late nights. But after installing DX filters I was experiencing this effect saturday afternoon, when grid was polluted from opening all local restaurants and everybody used A/C because of heat wave here in the northeast US.

 

 

[skatbelt]

5 hours ago, roman410 said:

Yes, that it is one of the theories,  but actually I was experiencing this effect early morning weekend listening sessions! I know my self if I will drink night before I will have different problem (hangover)😁.

 

Some people believes the main grid is cleaner late nights. But after installing DX filters I was experiencing this effect saturday afternoon, when grid was polluted from opening all local restaurants and everybody used A/C because of heat wave here in the northeast US.

 

 

 

I know the stories about a cleaner mains grid at certain times of the day and have experienced this myself. However, since I use an isolation transformer on a dedicated power line, the difference has become negligible.

 

I would like to clarify something about my experience with the DX's. I also strive for a transparent, neutral, and yes, even naked sound, but what I experience with the DX's is not an improvement of these criteria but a kind of unrest or imbalance. Especially in micro details and in the upper frequency range. High registers of a violin become too sharp, for example. The impression that jitter has increased instead of a reduction. As an analogy: like new glasses that correct the eyes just a bit too much and the brain cannot get used to. Even after a longer listening period.

[Superdad]

Okay folks, can we give the DX filter debate a rest for a bit?  I think it is clear that some people enjoy the extra transformer cores on the line while others do not.  Cheap enough for anyone to try.

 

By the way, all the EtherREGEN orders promised for shipment by May 31st are going out tomorrow (USA-destined units) and Tuesday or Wednesday (international destinations). A week early as is our style. 

 

So between these and the ones that shipped early in the month, something like 220 EtherREGEN will have gone out the door in May. Yet my wife and I still squeezed in two trailer camping trips and we still have some 60 EtherREGEN units left on hand for sale. I’d say we are getting better at this. 

 

Been putting our sons to work as well!

 

[Rsbrsvp]

4 hours ago, Superdad said:

Okay folks, can we give the DX filter debate a rest for a bit?  I think it is clear that some people enjoy the extra transformer cores on the line while others do not.  Cheap enough for anyone to try.

 

By the way, all the EtherREGEN orders promised for shipment by May 31st are going out tomorrow (USA-destined units) and Tuesday or Wednesday (international destinations). A week early as is our style. 

 

So between these and the ones that shipped early in the month, something like 220 EtherREGEN will have gone out the door in May. Yet my wife and I still squeezed in two trailer camping trips and we still have some 60 EtherREGEN units left on hand for sale. I’d say we are getting better at this. 

 

Been putting our sons to work as well!

 

YEAH!!!

[skatbelt]

8 hours ago, Superdad said:

Okay folks, can we give the DX filter debate a rest for a bit?  I think it is clear that some people enjoy the extra transformer cores on the line while others do not.  Cheap enough for anyone to try.

 

 

I would like to go on a little longer on the subject. After all, this is the experimentation thread and it is related to how the ER works... 😉

 

Last night I did another experiment. I replaced the EMO EN-70HD between the Mac Mini and the ER (A side) with the DX pair. At this place I do hear a small improvement without negative effects. I am curious if this is due to the 'in series' of two transformers. In other words, whether two EMOs in series would have the same effect.

 

So for now my conclusions are:
- DX pair does not work positively between ISP Router and opticalModule
- DX pair works positively between Mac mini and close to ER (A-side; all short 1-foot cat6 UTP cables)
- DX pair works better than single EMO EN-70HD between Mac mini and ER (A-side)
- No transformer at all between Mac mini and ER A-side is a big step back in SQ <- @Superdad disputed this way, way back

 

Maybe I should have listened to @One and a half right away ...

[Martin Herløv Andersen]

6 hours ago, rsctyslkr said:

This could be the shortest review ever

Hi I also had a very positive experience with the ER.

Want to ask if you are using the standard PSU?

I have thinking on upgrading it

[Johnnydev]

9 minutes ago, Martin Herløv Andersen said:

Hi I also had a very positive experience with the ER.

Want to ask if you are using the standard PSU?

I have thinking on upgrading it

yes, with the farad super3 it is great.

[PGAUDIO]

26 minutes ago, Johnnydev said:

yes, with the farad super3 it is great.

Have Fsrad its good !

Try lps 1.2 = better bass !

[Johnnydev]

4 minutes ago, PGAUDIO said:

Have Fsrad its good !

Try lps 1.2 = better bass !

That depends on which power cable and DC cable you use.

[esmit]

3 hours ago, Johnnydev said:

That depends on which power cable and DC cable you use.

With what cables does the Farad3 sound less than the LPS1.2, and which better, in your opinion?

[roman410]

12 hours ago, Superdad said:

Okay folks, can we give the DX filter debate a rest for a bit?  I think it is clear that some people enjoy the extra transformer cores on the line while others do not.  Cheap enough for anyone to try.

Maybe @One and a half can post his discovery on A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming thread or make dedicated thread where we can freely continue on this topic.

 

 

I am feel a lot more folks can profit from positive effect of DX filters not only EtherRegen owners.

 

 

 

[ambre]

11 minutes ago, esmit said:

With what cables does the Farad3 sound less than the LPS1.2, and which better, in your opinion?

IMO avoid silver Level 2

[Johnnydev]

9 minutes ago, ambre said:

IMO avoid silver Level 2

Yes you are right, the level 2 copper is a winner on the farad super 3.

 

On the  uptone LPS 1.2 the Ghent with Gotham GAC4/Pro: https://www.ghentaudio.com/part/dc-gac4.html

 

For the powercables i use the audioquest monsoon with great results.

[Rsbrsvp]

Just connected two new DX's between NAS and Side A of ER.  Result:- improvement, but not nearly as much as between Router and OM...

 

 

I cannot wait to get my second ER any day.  I really don't know how things can improve by much anymore.  My system is so freaking transparent; stripped of any possible coloration which is not already built into the components themselves.

 

I am a happy man.

[PYP]

9 minutes ago, Rsbrsvp said:

cannot wait to get my second ER any day.  I really don't know how things can improve by much anymore. 

You are about to find out!  It is a journey, though, given break in.  

[Mouna]

27 minutes ago, Rsbrsvp said:

Just connected two new DX's between NAS and Side A of ER.  Result:- improvement, but not nearly as much as between Router and OM...

 

 

I cannot wait to get my second ER any day.  I really don't know how things can improve by much anymore.  My system is so freaking transparent; stripped of any possible coloration which is not already built into the components themselves.

 

I am a happy man.

congrats man!

[Mouna]

On 5/22/2021 at 9:43 PM, JohnSwenson said:

Think of it this way:

 

data is put in the trunk of cars, the road on the B side has a speed limit of 10MPH, but the roads on the A side are 100MPH.

The overall rate at which data comes in on the B side is limited by its slow speed. When it gets to the A side it can go much faster, but the overall payload rate is determined by the slower speed on the B side. Cars going from one A port to another can go at 100MPH. 

 

On the A side the cars go at 100MPH, when the cars come from the B side there will be a much longer time in-between cars than a 100MPH road can support. Sorry about the "dead air", that is a term from long ago when a radio station was not transmitting anything, (like a DJ falling asleep) referred to as dead air. A car comes in at 10MPH, then speed out at 100MPH, but then there is a long wait while before the next car comes in on the 10MPH road.

 

Going the other way (A to B) cars come in at 100MPH and go into a parking lot (called a buffer), and then go out the 10MPH road. If too many cars come in at 100MPH all one right after another, eventually the parking lot fills up and traffic jams happen. Cars can come in right after another, but only so many at a time, then there has to be a long wait without any cars so the parking lot can empty. This is usually fine as long as the original source of the cars is sending then at slow enough rate. Like say 10 cars get their trunks packed at the same time, they all speed out over the 100MPH road, but then the next 10 cars have to be packed up, then they also speed out. There is a long space of time with no cars on the road.

 

I hope this makes sense.

 

John S.

thank you, John for this elaborate answer - I hope I can live up to it...saying I understoood that connecting to the ER A side only and inbetween the two ERs via fiber or LAN from the A side will connect the 1GB to the A side of the 2nd ER and thats what I wanted to know....

In the meantime I started dreaming about full parking lots that got emptied..

[rsctyslkr]

I performed all of my initial listening with the stock power supply. I then tried:

75ohm output by BG7TBL 10MHz OCXO FREQUENCY STANDARD 3 channel square wave clock Master Clock for your EtherREGEN from Aliexpress. Adding it took back 3/4 of the gains. If you doubt that, I have one for sale.

 

I then added:

50VA+50VA HIFI Linear Power Supply 2 Way LPS DC 5V/ 9V/ 12V / 15V / 18V /19V/24V from Aliexpress.

 

Well, it didn't hurt and I would be exaggerating a little to say it helped. It's staying, however.

 

Bottom line: save your money on the cheap improvements (IMHO) 

[roman410]

On 5/23/2021 at 2:28 PM, skatbelt said:

 

I know the stories about a cleaner mains grid at certain times of the day and have experienced this myself. However, since I use an isolation transformer on a dedicated power line, the difference has become negligible.

 

I would like to clarify something about my experience with the DX's. I also strive for a transparent, neutral, and yes, even naked sound, but what I experience with the DX's is not an improvement of these criteria but a kind of unrest or imbalance. Especially in micro details and in the upper frequency range. High registers of a violin become too sharp, for example. The impression that jitter has increased instead of a reduction. As an analogy: like new glasses that correct the eyes just a bit too much and the brain cannot get used to. Even after a longer listening period.

Long time I was rank dedicated power line  for best tweek in this hobby. That way when a bought my new condo, with luxury to have acces to the atik I have now 4 dedicated lines in my listening room. Was also experimented with isolation transformer, but found not for me,not just was buzzing so loudly also rob the dynamics. After experimenting with different brands of power conditioners and filters, I settled up with very good PI audio UberBUSS power filter.

 

Your experince with unrest and imbalance indicated to me something can get wrong with your ring longer time ago, but was masked with the noise, which when now it is reduced everything fleshed up.

 

When I talk about the noise, now after installed 4 pairs of DX filters I start hearing noise floor of the music. Noise what was embedded to the music during the recording, but that is very pleasurable noise😉.

 

[roman410]

3 hours ago, Rsbrsvp said:

 My system is so freaking transparent; stripped of any possible coloration which is not already built into the components themselves.

 

I am a happy man.

I know what you talking about 🙂.

[skatbelt]

46 minutes ago, roman410 said:

Long time I was rank dedicated power line  for best tweek in this hobby. That way when a bought my new condo, with luxury to have acces to the atik I have now 4 dedicated lines in my listening room. Was also experimented with isolation transformer, but found not for me,not just was buzzing so loudly also rob the dynamics. After experimenting with different brands of power conditioners and filters, I settled up with very good PI audio UberBUSS power filter.

 

Your experince with unrest and imbalance indicated to me something can get wrong with your ring longer time ago, but was masked with the noise, which when now it is reduced everything fleshed up.

 

When I talk about the noise, now after installed 4 pairs of DX filters I start hearing noise floor of the music. Noise what was embedded to the music during the recording, but that is very pleasurable noise😉.

 

 

If you follow the JS 'guidelines', isolation transformers are very, very effective. Especially in a balanced configuration. And if the capacity of the IT is correctly dimensioned, there is certainly no question of reduced dynamics. On the contrary. It is often power conditioners that limit the dynamics, especially with power amps. Mine is placed in an adjacent room, so I don't suffer from the humming.

 

For me the key to success was to have the whole system (streamer/dac/amp) behind one isolation transformer and to have all other incoming/outgoing signals electrically isolated. 'Moated' so to speak.

 

So, my system is also very revealing and has a very low noise floor. I can hear every noise and all imperfections in recordings, including tape hiss. And still it is able to bring across all the emotion and feeling that is in the music.

 

But I don't want to make a yes-no discussion of it. Every system is different and everyone's preferences are different. My DX-filters have found their place and in the end I am happy I bought them.

 

[LowMidHigh]

6 hours ago, Rsbrsvp said:

Just connected two new DX's between NAS and Side A of ER.  Result:- improvement, but not nearly as much as between Router and OM...

 

 

I cannot wait to get my second ER any day.  I really don't know how things can improve by much anymore.  My system is so freaking transparent; stripped of any possible coloration which is not already built into the components themselves.

 

I am a happy man.

In my experience, you're going to hear every minute imperfections in the mix. When I stream off SoundCloud, I skip 4 or 5 tracks in a row because it bothers me. On the other hand, great mixes are going to sound heavenly.