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The EtherREGEN thread for various network, cable, power experiences and experiments


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17 hours ago, Avalfa said:

Depends on where you are on the globe.

 

It's 'just' €2750.- where I am

 

Over here ER is around €800 lps1,2 €450

Clock€800-5000 depending on  which one another LPS 450-700 and than cable etc. 

 

So it's depending on so many factors, and than again I think few people have heard the Innuos yet, I haven't. So if it's any better? I Don't know. 

I just think it's interesting

 

Though the description is a bit confusing, maybe the bellow @AfterDark. product is a worthy comparison to the phoenix,

It seems to be an OCXO controlled switch, with SFP option and powered by an internal LPS + has an OCXO out,

So, it's an all in one like the phoenix but with more functionality? (SFP, OCXO clock out)

 

Not affiliated with Afterdark - just my thoughts here

 

https://www.adark.co/collections/project-giesemann-ocxo/products/afterdark-project-clayx-giesemann-network-switch-x-ocxo-10m-master-clock-audiophilestyle-edition?variant=32208640540790

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1 hour ago, GMG said:

 

Though the description is a bit confusing, maybe the bellow @AfterDark. product is a worthy comparison to the phoenix,

It seems to be an OCXO controlled switch, with SFP option and powered by an internal LPS + has an OCXO out,

So, it's an all in one like the phoenix but with more functionality? (SFP, OCXO clock out)

 

Not affiliated with Afterdark - just my thoughts here

 

https://www.adark.co/collections/project-giesemann-ocxo/products/afterdark-project-clayx-giesemann-network-switch-x-ocxo-10m-master-clock-audiophilestyle-edition?variant=32208640540790

How could it be that inexpensive if it has a built in super oxco and LPS?

 

If it is an all in one- why would anyone buy an ER ever again when for less than double you get the LPS and OXCO built  in?

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54 minutes ago, Rsbrsvp said:

How could it be that inexpensive if it has a built in super oxco and LPS?

 

If it is an all in one- why would anyone buy an ER ever again when for less than double you get the LPS and OXCO built  in?

 

It seems that you judge equipment by cost alone.

I don't believe many people share your view. 

 

Stereo

[Genelec 1032C x 2 + 7360 x 2] <== [MC3+USB x 3 <-- REF10 SE120] <== [AERIS G2] <== [EtherRegen x 3]
Chain switchable to [Genelec 8331 x 2 + 7350]


Surround

[Genelec 1032C x 3 + 8431 x 2  + 7360 x 2] <== [MiniDSP U-DIO8] <== [Mac Mini] 

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I have a remark.
Many people praise the addition of this or that device to the etherregen but no one talks about the impact of the room and its acoustic treatment, nor on the behavior of the speaker in that room.
If you have an acoustically rotten room, racking up tweaks won't get better.
A lot of acoustic work, passive or not, should be considered before investing.

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14 minutes ago, MasterWarzombie said:

I have a remark.
Many people praise the addition of this or that device to the etherregen but no one talks about the impact of the room and its acoustic treatment, nor on the behavior of the speaker in that room.
If you have an acoustically rotten room, racking up tweaks won't get better.
A lot of acoustic work, passive or not, should be considered before investing.

I don't think anyone would argue with you that room acoustics are one of the most important ingredients in the quest, but it is not the subject of this thread of the forum :-)

 

I use the ER to feed a MiniDSP SHD studio which runs DRC (digital room correction) which takes care of some of the acoustical issues in my room.

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31 minutes ago, LowMidHigh said:

 

It seems that you judge equipment by cost alone.

I don't believe many people share your view. 

 

O.K.  I did not think of my comment as a judgment.  It was a question?  How can a ER plus LPS plus OXCO sell for $1,100?

 

My assumption behind the question is that perhaps I do not understand properly what the product is...

 

I am asking for clarification to help me understand; I am not judging anything.

 

Perhaps you have misjudged my intentions due to my lack of clarity in stating my question? 

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No one suggested that the network switch in this box is equivalent to the ER,

It is a switch (of some sort and quality) + OXCO + SFP + LPS,

 

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2 hours ago, MasterWarzombie said:

I have a remark.
Many people praise the addition of this or that device to the etherregen but no one talks about the impact of the room and its acoustic treatment, nor on the behavior of the speaker in that room.
If you have an acoustically rotten room, racking up tweaks won't get better.
A lot of acoustic work, passive or not, should be considered before investing.

Or just use headphones. Sorry, poor argument against source tweaking (and yes, the room is an important factor in the overall sound)

SERVER CLOSET (in office directly below living room stereo):NUC 7i5BNH with Roon ROCK (ZeroZone 12V on the NUC)>Cisco 2690L-16PS switch>Sonore opticalModule (Uptone LPS 1.2)>

LIVING ROOM: Sonore opticalRendu Roon version (Sonore Power Supply)> Shunyata Venom USB>Naim DAC V1>Witchhat DIN>Naim NAP 160 Bolt Down>Chord Rumor 2>Audio Physic Compact Classics. OFFICE: opticalModule> Sonore microRendu 1.4> Matrix Mini-i Pro 3> Naim NAP 110>NACA5>KEF Ls50's. BJC 6a and Ghent Catsnake 6a JSSG ethernet; AC cables: Shunyata Venom NR V-10; Audience Forte F3; Ice Age copper/copper; Sean Jacobs CHC PowerBlack, Moon Audio DIN>RCA, USB A>C. Isolation: Herbie's Audio Lab. 

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Was there an objective for the addition of attenuators to the chain or just an experiment? Sorry if I missed that in the thread. FWIW: I have been trying to remove gadgets, where possible, unless there is a problem to address...

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16 hours ago, Rsbrsvp said:

Is there any conclusion about using attenuators on the SFP input of ER or is it system/ear dependent?

Some SFPs will oversaturate the receiver and this can harm the sound.  An attenuator will reduce this harm.  But to my ears attenuators do harm.  Better to use SFPs that don’t need them.  

Digital:  Sonore opticalModule > Uptone EtherRegen > Shunyata Sigma Ethernet > Antipodes K30 > Shunyata Omega USB > Chord Hugo TT2 

Amp & Speakers:  Spectral DMA-150mk2 > Aerial 10T

Foundation: Stillpoints Ultra, Shunyata Denali power conditioner, Shunyata Alpha and Delta power cords, Shunyata Alpha interconnect, Shunyata Sigma Ethernet, MIT Matrix HD60 speaker cables, ASC isothermal tube traps

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On 5/3/2021 at 1:11 PM, Rsbrsvp said:

Please forgive me for the question if this has been covered:

 

Does the ER need to be on 24/7 to sound its best or is a one or two hour warm up enough?

 

It gets so hot, I want to extend it's life so I prefer to turn it on only when necessary.

 

I thought at least to turn it on in the early afternoon and off at night before bed.  I listen to music in the evening....  That would allow a 4-5 hour warm-up time.

I’m curious what voltage and amps the power supply is at that you’re using to power eR ? 
I keep reading from most how hot the eR gets, however, I’ve been powering mine from day one with a 12V / 3A power supply (Vinne Rossi DC4EVER super cap) and I’ve never turned off my eR and it has never gotten too hot. 
I have a suspicion that 7v or 9V is creating more heat (just a hunch, I’ve never experimented myself and I don’t know enough about electric from an engineers perspective)? 

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4 minutes ago, agladstone said:

I’m curious what voltage and amps the power supply is at that you’re using to power eR ? 
I keep reading from most how hot the eR gets, however, I’ve been powering mine from day one with a 12V / 3A power supply (Vinne Rossi DC4EVER super cap) and I’ve never turned off my eR and it has never gotten too hot. 
I have a suspicion that 7v or 9V is creating more heat (just a hunch, I’ve never experimented myself and I don’t know enough about electric from an engineers perspective)? 

I use an LPS 1.2 set to 12v and the eR definitely gets hot, even when placed in a stand that acts as a bit of a heat sink.

Living room:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7> Roon/Audirvana/JRiver Media Server > xfinity Xfi Router > Netgear GS348 Switch > EtherRegen > Sonore Signature Rendu SE Tier 2 > Wyred4Sound 10th Anniversary DAC > Wyred4Sound STI-500 > Revel F32 Concertas

 

Basement:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7>Roon/Audirvana/JRiver Media Server > Xfinity xfi Router > Netgear GS348 Switch >TrendNet FMC>Sonore OpticalModule> UltraRendu > NuPrime IDA-8 > KEF LS50's

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2 minutes ago, Mike Rubin said:

I use an LPS 1.2 set to 12v and the eR definitely gets hot, even when placed in a stand that acts as a bit of a heat sink.

The LPS 1.2 is about 1A at 12V, whereas I’m using 12V / 3A , not sure if that would effect heat or not, but if the LPS 1.2 is getting near its max Amp, it may ? 

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2 minutes ago, JohnSwenson said:

The ER is a "constant power" device. It dissipates the same amount of power no matter what voltage you feed it (from 7 to 12 volts).

 

About 70% of the power is fixed, it is always there no matter what you are doing. The rest is determined by how much data is flowing through it. The lowest power will be one "input" (on an A side RJ45 jack) and an output on the B side RJ45 jack. Just doing 44.1 PCM will be the lowest. 384 or DSD512 will take a little more power. Using the SFP port takes a little more power.

 

The major increase is caused by using the other A side ports with lots of data flowing through the ports. Say running 4, 4K TVs off the A ports as well as your audio will get the ER power draw up to its maximum.

 

I don't HAVE 4 4K TVs to actually test what that is, but if anybody wants to donate that to me I'll be glad to run the test!

 

John S.

Thanks for the actual engineer explanation! 
I only have one Ethernet in on A side, and one Ethernet out on B side. 
Also, I use the EtherRegen with my Aurender streamer / server, which loads everything onto an internal SSD first, prior to playback, so perhaps this is why my never gets too hot like others have claimed ? 

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23 minutes ago, agladstone said:

Thanks for the actual engineer explanation! 
I only have one Ethernet in on A side, and one Ethernet out on B side. 
Also, I use the EtherRegen with my Aurender streamer / server, which loads everything onto an internal SSD first, prior to playback, so perhaps this is why my never gets too hot like others have claimed ? 

I have the same situation as you. ER sits under a desk with plenty of airflow but is very warm. Had it in the system over a year now and never a hiccup.

Digital: 1Gbs Fiber to house, then to endpoint > looks like copper from endpoint to router (all stock from ATT) > Router to "A" side is Monoprice Cat 5e Monoprice > ER "B" side 3' Supra 8+ to wall (ER has SR4T LPS)  > 15-20' Cat 5e run to audio room > 3' Supra 8+ to Aurender N10.

 

System: TAD Evolution system: M2500 amp, C2000 pre/DAC, E-1 speakers. Aurender N10, ER, SR4T LPS.

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3 hours ago, JohnSwenson said:

About 70% of the power is fixed, it is always there no matter what you are doing. The rest is determined by how much data is flowing through it. The lowest power will be one "input" (on an A side RJ45 jack) and an output on the B side RJ45 jack. Just doing 44.1 PCM will be the lowest. 384 or DSD512 will take a little more power. Using the SFP port takes a little more power.

Interesting.  I have two eRs (both with one input).  The first is A > B, fiber in and copper out.  The second is A > B, copper in and out (to the DAC).  The second one uses an external clock.  The second one runs much hotter than the first, but I'm assuming that results from differences in air flow within my cabinet.   

Mola Mola Tambaqui > Mola Mola Kaluga > B&W 803 D3       Cables:  Kubala-Sosna

 

Ethernet:  iMac/Roon/Qobuz > ... DXE filter > in-wall 6 UTP > DXE filter > Sonore opticalModule > UpTone EtherREGEN #1 > eR #2 + mini-circuits filter + Cybershaft OP13 clock > Tambaqui ( = DAC/Roon endpoint/volume control)

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My entire system is in a closed cabinet.  Of course, I make sure there is airspace around all my components within the cabinet, but still- in a cabinet which is often closed and in a hot climate.
 
So, I am always a bit concerned about heat when leaving everything on 24/7.  I have received confirmation from every component manufacturer that it is O.K...  so- I hope it is.
 
I generally shut off my entire system (except the Mutec Ref10 which runs pretty cool) once a week for around two hours just because of my heat paranoia...  Perhaps this is unnecessary.
 
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16 minutes ago, Rsbrsvp said:
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My entire system is in a closed cabinet.  Of course, I make sure there is airspace around all my components within the cabinet, but still- in a cabinet which is often closed and in a hot climate.
 
So, I am always a bit concerned about heat when leaving everything on 24/7.  I have received confirmation from every component manufacturer that it is O.K...  so- I hope it is.
 
I generally shut off my entire system (except the Mutec Ref10 which runs pretty cool) once a week for around two hours just because of my heat paranoia...  Perhaps this is unnecessary.
 

During the summer, a 5" X 5" quiet fan is on all the time (plugged in AC outlet).  The difference in the external temperature of the eRs and LPS 1.2 is dramatic.  From very, very hot to warm.   An inexpensive ($19) experiment.  

In the US:  https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MZ6T8VF/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1     

Mola Mola Tambaqui > Mola Mola Kaluga > B&W 803 D3       Cables:  Kubala-Sosna

 

Ethernet:  iMac/Roon/Qobuz > ... DXE filter > in-wall 6 UTP > DXE filter > Sonore opticalModule > UpTone EtherREGEN #1 > eR #2 + mini-circuits filter + Cybershaft OP13 clock > Tambaqui ( = DAC/Roon endpoint/volume control)

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13 minutes ago, JohnSwenson said:

I have previously posted here that the ER was designed to run at an optimal temperature of 50C, which is quite warm. So by being obsessive about keeping it cool you can actually hurt performance. I don't quite understand the mind-set of spending thousands on power supplies and external clocks and then run it too cool. Running an ER at around 50C (do not obsess about tenths of a degree here, a 5 degree spread on either side is fine) is an optimal point where conflicting effects are at a minimum. An infrared thermometer on the black case works great for measuring the temperature. In the design of the ER we went to huge lengths to make sure that all parts are at almost the  same temperature after thermal equilibrium has been achieved, thus you don't need to worry about some parts being hotter than others.

 

50C is way below the maximum operating temperature of every part in the design. Running at 50C instead of say 30C will decrease the lifespan of the unit by something like 5 days. I made the assumption that the increased performance was going to be more important to most of the people here.

 

I can't tell you what temperature to run yours at, but I can say it was designed for best performance at 50C.

 

The only time I would worry about using heatsinks is if the temperature is above 60C.

 

John S.

Once again,

 

these posts by John are VERY meaningful.

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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