The EtherREGEN thread for various network, cable, power experiences and experiments

[R1200CL]

On 7/7/2020 at 5:59 PM, Vangelis said:

I want to mate a better power supply with my EtherRegen. It looks like the sweet spot for pricing / performance might be a Farad Super 3. Farad recommends the 7v 3A PS. This is rated higher on the amperage then recommended by Uptone Audio:

  7V/1.4A, 9V/1.0A, 12V/0.8A. 
Is this extra 1 1/2 amp an issue at all?

Does higher voltage sound better or is the 7v just fine? 

You should really consider https://www.paulhynesdesign.com/sr4t  Same price and consider slightly better. 
Order now, and you should have it available August, unless they have some available now. 

[R1200CL]

1 hour ago, BigAlMc said:

I recall reading a note recommending not using LAN cables with metal connectors on the ER and from memory it was specific to one side.

Metal connectors is intended to do better shielding. 
But if the cable is following the Ethernet specification 100%, that connector is connected to cable shield and hence you can create unwanted leakage between equipment. You can test this by using a ohmmeter on the cable.  Maybe email Sablon and ask them ?
 

Audioquest Vodka is an example that doesn’t follow spec, and you can use it. 
This cable is another you can use. 
 

Hope this helps. 

[R1200CL]

2 hours ago, robbbby said:

And also a shorter 1mtr cable to go from ER to computer.

 

Many is happy with Supra cable. 
And you won’t go wrong with this one:

https://www.ghentaudio.com/pc/et11.html

 

Your 65 feet cable is probably OK, as long you terminated it correctly. 
You can use The OpticalModule > fiber > EtherRegen. Read The EtherRegen review. 

 

 

 

[R1200CL]

1 hour ago, sahmen said:

Would there be any special advantage in linking the modem and the router with an Audiophile RJ45 noise reducing cable

No, I dont think so. Use a good off the shelf 1 or 2 meter cable. 
And better power supplies on those units wouldn’t help either 😀

 

You could add a switch where your TV and those other things are. Even experiment with the etherRegen there, in order to buy a second one. 
 

You could also add an FMC after your router. Then fiber direct to a etherRegen or OM or anything that accepts fiber in, and have enough RJ45 plugs out at the TV area. 
 

Don’t expect to much. (Unless you’re going for a second etherRegen). There is another tread about etherRegen and TV. 
 

If you haven’t purchased the router yet, you may try to find one with SFP interface. 

[R1200CL]

19 hours ago, robbbby said:

I guess my other question is with cables that are fully shielded/grounded from tip to tip.  Are these ok from ER to computer?

In general no. You should avoid any commercial cables with shield and metal plugs. Especially those that comply with a standard 😀
The audiophile Ethernet cables will all (AFAIK) not comply with the Ethernet standard when it comes to shielding.
 

You will find a lot of useful information on Belden webpage. Also Blue Jeans webpage. Belden technick to glue pairs (bounded) is special, and well explained as an example. Unfortunately their catsnake 1303E doesn’t use that technology. But I really don’t think it matters in a cable less than a meter. 
 

Cables suggested here is OK to use. Also those with metal plugs for better RFI/EMI as well as with shielding.
 

You have to read this as a start in order to understand the theory behind JSSG360. 
 

(JSSG = John Swenson Shielding Guidelines). 

If you purchase a cable with metal plugs, and a ohmmeter shows the plugs are connected, you have the recipe to creat possible unwanted issues. Further reading can be found searching AS. 
 

[R1200CL]

6 minutes ago, thyname said:

Ghent sells two Ethernet RJ45 cables, both listed as JSSG360. This means they would be OK for EtherRegen, upstream and downstream?

YES. 
 

The whole idea behind those cables as well as the DC cables was based on:

 

 

[R1200CL]

6 hours ago, JFHSQT said:

My etherRegen is en route and should arrive Monday, barring any FedEx problems through Memphis with Hurricane Laura.

 

Anyway I had planned to use the eR from my Orbi satellite into my Naim Uniti Nova from the B port and my Orbi and Innuos from the A ports as suggested by Alex. 

 

However I am now considering making room for some additional boxes and would need to move my Innuos into another room, which means the eR will be only between the Orbi and the Naim. Since the Innuos will be in another room, would there be further benefit by running a second eR in that room from the router (A) and the Innuos (B)? Or is it far enough removed from the signal chain on the Naim that it wouldn't be a worthwhile investment?

 

In my case the Innuos (Zen MK III) is used only as a Roon Core and the Uniti Nova is the streamer/player. 

Isn’t that Innuos already intended to go wireless ? (If reallocated)

(As my understanding is you only have wireless in your listening room).

Just wondering:

How much differ the Naim today between wireless and wired ?

[R1200CL]

4 hours ago, robbbby said:

Do you know the difference between the two Ghent cables? One is a cat6a made with belkin cable, other is cat8 made with linkway cable. They are both the same price. I’m a bit confused. 

Not more than you. Just purchased the one you think is best for your. 
Belden was the first one he made. It’s a well known brand and has data sheet you can study, as well as a website with a lot of information.  I guess someone liked to try another one.
 

I think you won’t notice a difference between them.

You can use search here at AS and see if you find out more. 
 

(I just google Linksys Ethernet and the answer was that Linksys use Belsen)

[R1200CL]

29 minutes ago, chungjh said:

I am looking for a recommendation for the grounding wire between ER and Paul Hynes SRT4. What is best and is the quality that critical?

 

 

 

From user manual:

 

Use of the EtherREGEN’s Ground terminal screw:
We have measured high-source-impedance leakage on Ethernet cables coming from various other common network gear and computers. Leakage is common-mode AC current traveling over DC connections. It is pernicious stuff—passing easily along both analog and digital connections in our audio systems—and it is desirable to shunt it away. We address leakage in the design of the EtherREGEN in several ways, including our use of RJ45 magnetics having 12 tiny transformer
cores per port. And their center-taps are wired to ground and to the Ethernet switch chip through capacitors to maximally block port- to-port leakage. This works best if the EtherREGEN is grounded—either through the power supply or via the ground screw.
The DC output 0-volt/-VE (‘ground’/shell) of the UpTone-branded AC>DC power supply included with the EtherREGEN is common to AC mains ground. When our supply is used to power the EtherREGEN it is NOT necessary to use the Ground screw. [Do not assume that 3rd party linear power supplies are like this—some are and some are not. Some multi-rail supplies have separate diode bridges and transformer secondaries and thus each output ground is "floated.” This is easy to test with a continuity/multimeter (be sure power is disconnected.)]
If you power the EtherREGEN with a "floating" supply—one whose 0- volt/-VE (‘ground’/shell) is not common to AC mains ground—then ideally the Ground screw of the EtherREGEN should be used. You can do so by running an insulated wire safely to some AC mains ground or to the chassis of a known-grounded component in your audio system. [By the way, our UltraCap LPS-1.2 is a completely "floated" and isolated supply, so if using it with EtherREGEN the ground screw should be used.]
Please keep in mind that all of the above regarding grounding concerns only the blocking of leakage from one RJ45 jack on the ‘A’ side to another RJ45 jack also on the 'A' side. Regardless of grounding, zero AC leakage from upstream Ethernet devices ever gets past the full active digital isolation and reclocking ADIMTM—to the EtherREGEN’s 'B'-side port.

 

As the Paul Hynes SR4T is grounded, I wouldn’t do any further grounding. 
If I’m wrong, we should hear from Alex. 
 

Ops, I just learned I should be using the ground screw as I’m using the LPS 1.2. 
On the other hand since I’m only using fiber out on A side, I may not need. 

[R1200CL]

On 10/5/2020 at 5:40 PM, charlesphoto said:

 

Perhaps, but on low they are inaudibly quiet and have rubber(?) bumpers for feet and vibrationless as far as I can tell. These aren't Walmart builds. I'm sure you could isolate it even more with Herbie's etc material if so inclined, but best to make sure your components are first. I had an LPS 1.2 go on me this summer and my feeling is it may have been heat related (under warranty and repaired but no info on what was wrong) so got some of these fans after that. I have them both with the hifi upstairs and downstairs in the server closet. The one upstairs is powered by a wall wart (different circuit from the hifi) and downstairs via USB off the Roon NUC. 

You know it you really want to take these things to the limit, one could submerge the etherRegen in mineral oil. Perfect cooling and vibration removal. And no RFI/EMI. 
 

Add the power supply as well. 
 

Actually I’m surprised it hasn’t been tested out yet, at least with low power audiophile computers.

 

 

[R1200CL]

32 minutes ago, Avalfa said:

No Just one, between b-side and streamer.

 

Ethernet: Kangai ethernet is based on a Gigabit shielding concept providing 5 different shields, but it only carries 2 pairs for 100mbit connection. The pairs are also shielded from eachother which makes it a unique cable. This topology is chosen, because it's the best way to transport audio in our research. The 100mbit bandwith is more then sufficient for all audio formats. The Kangai uses pure silver and gold multistrand conductors. The silver and gold is treated in our special way to create a mono crystal wire. This cable also has a very unique grounding system to match with the Kangai power cords.
 

It would be very interesting to know if the plugs are connected. Are you able to use a ohm meter and find out ?

 

[R1200CL]

50 minutes ago, chungjh said:

Can someone recommend a more modestly priced high quality ethernet cable for ER? ASR mentioned Sablon for $375. Any others?

https://www.ghentaudio.com/pc/et11.html

 

You can even ask him to make a 100MHz version. 
 

No need to spend more 😀

Blue Jeans as an option. Probably also Supra. 

[R1200CL]

6 hours ago, chungjh said:

Which cisco2960 did you use? There are many.

I bought this one:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Cisco-WS-C2960G-8TC-L-Gigabit-Ethernet-Switch-2960G-1-Year-Warranty-FREE-SHiP/302433766710?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
 

WS-C2960G-8TC-L, the G is Gigabit version. Make him an offer just above 30. He sells SFP’s as well. 

[R1200CL]

14 hours ago, TwinPeak said:

Until yesterday my EtherREGEN drew its power through a Y-cable attached to one of Uptone JS-2 DC outputs, and sharing 12V with a WD NAS-disk. The other JS-2 DC output was dedicated to MMK-modified Mac Mini (+sense option).

 

Great drawing. Tells us so much more. 
 

How about remove the isoRegen, and use that spare LPS 1.2 to power the EtherRegen as a test ?

Then your have total isolation.

 

You may also play with adding MAC and/or NAS directly to the EtherRegen. 
Your setup seems to give some options to play with, unless distance is an issue.

 

[R1200CL]

6 minutes ago, TwinPeak said:

 

 

Hi R1200CL and esmit,

I tried without the IsoREGEN (between UltraRendu and Denafrips DAC), but to my ears it sounds better with the IsoREGEN. More air and space round voices and instruments, and better depth perspective. What might be able to substitute the IsoREGEN would be a Denafrips DDC using I2S, I think...

And at the same time power EtherRegen with LPS-1.2 ?

(In order to be sure you have isolation). 

[R1200CL]

36 minutes ago, TwinPeak said:

I use a dedicated DC 12V output from Uptone JS-2 to EtherREGEN. Do you think using LPS-1.2 would give better galvanic isolation than the JS-2?

My understanding is that you don’t have a total isolation with the JS-2. At least not equal to the LPS-1.2. 
There are several posts on the subject. I may not be 100% correct. 
However the moat on EtherRegen should cover you, so you’ll probably not notice any difference. 
 

I have a friend using microRendu. He also prefers the ISOregen in the chain. 

[R1200CL]

9 hours ago, fuzzypoodle said:

Can you please suggest the optimal application of Uptone power supplies to the following gear:

Not John, but since only Uptone was the requirement, I suggest LPS-1.2 for everything below one ampere. JS-2 for rest. 😀
 

Very nice digital chain. 

[R1200CL]

7 hours ago, rossb said:

Presumably there is some kind of conflict between the eR and my modem/router.

Maybe check if there is firmware upgrades available for your other network gear. Take cables in and out as a way to ensure good connections.

 

Assume your power to EtherRegen is OK, so that isn’t a place to look. 

[R1200CL]

20 hours ago, rossb said:

The ER was bought in March last year. I assume it is under warranty - I think I will be sending it back to Uptone for repair/replacement.

Please email Alex and send him details about your network and equipment in use.

 

I’m still thinking you have a network issue.

Suggestion for a test: Purchase the cheapest used switch you can find. Replace it with EtherRegen, assuming everything else is the same. Still problems ?

 

Or remove/disconnect everything from network, and connect EtherRegen and then another device and test. 
 

Also, if you lately added lights, like some cheap Xmas lights, or anything dimmable or remote controlled, those item can in some rare cases cause issues. 

[R1200CL]

3 minutes ago, rossb said:

I swapped in a conventional switch where the ER used to be and everything is working without problem.

I agree that’s pointing towards the EtherRegen. How so you power it ?

[R1200CL]

13 minutes ago, rossb said:

This is using a 7v power supply.

Do you have a 12V available? Preferably the one shipped with the EtherRegen. 
What is that 7V PS ?

[R1200CL]

48 minutes ago, Oggo said:

My excuses, if that has been asked before:

 

What gives better SQ?

 

1) router > copper > low-cost FMC > fibre > ER > copper > Streamer/Mediaplayer/DAC

2) router > copper > sonore OM > fibre > ER > copper > Streamer/Mediaplayer/DAC

3) router > copper > ER > fibre > ER > copper > Streamer/Mediaplayer/DAC

4) router with integrated FMC > fiber > ER > copper > Streamer/Mediaplayer/DAC

All are good 😀

Number 3 then number 2. 1 and 4 maybe equal. If no 4 is a Cisco 2960, probably rank as no 3.

 

The saying is a good clock upfront the EtherRegen, may benefit. 
 

But it may not apply to all systems. 

[R1200CL]

1 hour ago, Pokey77 said:

Finally, is there a real benefit to using a Ghentaudio cable on both sides of the ER? 

Probably not 😀

Use your Supra there. 

 

[R1200CL]

47 minutes ago, MarkusBarkus said:

i will then have a dedicated, audio only, fiber service. That's how much I like fiber. I'll keep the cable ISP for TV and home/phone stuff.

Do you have two ISP’s ?

 

[R1200CL]

8 hours ago, MarkusBarkus said:

Yes, sir. Spectrum for Internet/WiFi things in the house and cable TV.

I suppose both has a monthly cost. If you don’t know, you can just use a good DHCP server / firewall and from one ISP split the traffic into two subnets. It’s exactly same effect. 
 

Depending how you use your WiFi or communicate with your music, you will now need two Wi-Fi systems or hardwired network in your house, while with other solutions you can control access by setting up rules.

You may not even need two subnets, and maybe only a managed switch will do the job and isolating traffic properly.