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The EtherREGEN thread for various network, cable, power experiences and experiments


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Just bought 3 Cable Matters Cat 8 1m cables, and after quite a bit of comparative listening this evening, I surprisingly find I like the sound with the Slimrun Cat 6a more, at least in my system.

 

To whoever has tried the Cable Matters Cat 8: Did the cable go through a break-in period? Did it sound better than the other cables you'd tried as soon as you installed it?

 

If things remain as they are I'll possibly offer the new cables for sale to whoever here might like them.

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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It so happens that I got my second Cable Matters Cat8 1m cable this evening, so I was able to do a comparison against my first cable (~100 hours of music play on the first cable...I've had it running continuously since the weekend in anticipation of testing to see if burn in does anything with this cable)

 

There is a clear difference with the cable with hours on it (please don't ask me how or why, I'm still having a hard time admitting to any difference between ethernet cables), with more of the bass impact and precision/detail and sense of space that I was hearing as I went through the various cable tests (the effect is particularly striking with full range orchestral pieces...the lower registers and music hall really are coming into clearer and clearer relief).  That being said, I was hearing a more significant difference between cables of different types, but I'm surprised to hear any impact from burn in at all.

 

That being said, I wouldn't characterize it as a significant difference.  If you don't care for the Cable Matters vs your Slimrun, I'm not sure if the delta I'm hearing would be enough to tilt a clear preference for a different cable.

 

Anyway, time to ingest some mushrooms and sacrifice some poor creature to the audio gods and hope a rationale comes to me in a vision (my EE degrees certainly aren't any help in understanding what is going on here).

 

ATT Fiber -> EdgeRouter X SFP -> Taiko Audio Extreme -> Vinnie Rossi L2i-SE w/ Level 2 DAC -> Voxativ 9.87 speakers w/ 4D drivers

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1 hour ago, ray-dude said:

It so happens that I got my second Cable Matters Cat8 1m cable this evening, so I was able to do a comparison against my first cable (~100 hours of music play on the first cable...I've had it running continuously since the weekend in anticipation of testing to see if burn in does anything with this cable)

 

There is a clear difference with the cable with hours on it (please don't ask me how or why, I'm still having a hard time admitting to any difference between ethernet cables), with more of the bass impact and precision/detail and sense of space that I was hearing as I went through the various cable tests (the effect is particularly striking with full range orchestral pieces...the lower registers and music hall really are coming into clearer and clearer relief).  That being said, I was hearing a more significant difference between cables of different types, but I'm surprised to hear any impact from burn in at all.

 

That being said, I wouldn't characterize it as a significant difference.  If you don't care for the Cable Matters vs your Slimrun, I'm not sure if the delta I'm hearing would be enough to tilt a clear preference for a different cable.

 

Anyway, time to ingest some mushrooms and sacrifice some poor creature to the audio gods and hope a rationale comes to me in a vision (my EE degrees certainly aren't any help in understanding what is going on here).

 

My experience burning in Supra cat8 and other various ethernet cables is very similar and I agree with everything you've said.... except for the mushroom bit 🤣

 

Indeed there seems to be more difference between cables than between the same cable burnt in and not...

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Quite a few proposals have been made concerning LPSs to use instead of the standard PS.

I wonder why so far a power bank as a possible alternative hasn´t been mentioned.

Since over a year this power bank:

https://www.xtpower.de/XTPower-Powerbank-MP-50000-DC/USB-Hochleistung-Akku-Li-Ion-mit-52800mAh

replaced the JS2 to power-up a Mac mini because of a SQ improvement.

 

Uwe

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Basic Usb power banks are not engineered to be noise free and to have low ripple and so on...  sure it sound different, but better may not be the best word in this case. Battery can be a really good choice, but in association with the good electronic circuits to make it silent and precise. 

MSB Reference> Ypsilon Aelius 2 >Vivid G1 or Andra3

HQPlayer >Diretta DST>Holo May>Holo Serene>Kinki ex-m7>Leedh e2 glass or DIY (Davis/Heil).

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Is anyone here using the ER with Euphony ?

 

I having mayor drop outs after a week of ER's burning in, and now suddenly not only with the ER but replacing it with the TP LINK which i have had since two years ago without problems until now...i checked all connections that I'm aware so far in order to discard elements that could be causing this issue: and when i disconnect my NUC endpoint and connect my Macmini direct to the DAC using ROON directly there is no issue so far.

 

In the other hand my internet speed seems to be fine but real performance when opening pages on the web or playing videos is not as good and sometimes very slow (weird, never happened)

 

I am powering my ER with the HDPLEX 200W at 9V and the NUC with a PH SR4 at 19V

 

Any idea ??

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11 minutes ago, thotdoc said:

The ethernet cable in my system goes from my wall outlet to the eR. I replaced a no name flat cable (that was no slouch) with the BJCable and there was slight improvement in detail, enough to keep the BJ cable in the system.

 

I replaced the BJC with Cable Matters Cat 8: mid bass increased and there is more detail without harshness. I've had a mid-bass suckout in the big system, I thought was the room...maybe it was, but. It seems gone. And, cymbals just sheen and sound so real. I keep wondering, how much detail is in those 1s and 0s? To think we may be years or decades away from finding out.

 

My wife, who is as much a music freak as I am, but gets as much happiness from the speaker in her bathroom as she does from the big system, has always said the system lacked bass...though it includes a REL SE 212 that crosses over where the maggies drop off. Last night the mid bass was there as it should be. Tonite we will listen with the Cable Matters in the system to get her opinion.

 

So, the search for the 'best' ethernet cable will go on for me. I am also working on trying better SFPs. I'll report in a few weeks.

 

I've come to not be surprised that any change to a system component makes a change in the system SQ, no matter what you change; the entire system is completely interactive and every change creates some sound difference. Am I too subjective? Not scientific enough...even though I'm a scientist...Am I hallucinating or being duped?

 

My answer is No! All high end audio is about extracting the best SQ from microscopic/sub-microscopic changes in the flow of electricity and all these active and passive gadgets manage the flow of electricity and/or clean up what is in the flow. To me, further argument only comes from people who do not understand the phenomena of high end audio audio. I don't see the benefit of arguing with people who simply do not understand the field they are commenting on. and so argue from preconceived notions that are impervious to new information. 

 

As always, we have been and are being led by Jesus, Alex and especially John. Greatness is in the execution of the great idea. They saw it and see it and get it. Thank you all so much.

 

Music is one of the few elixirs of life for me and likely others here. I do enjoy it over the radio...and there is a lot of music that sounds better over the radio with radio type speakers.

 

So all music that is personally appealing is good, but great performances of great music recorded in a way that makes the music sound live over my system is a wonderful experience I'm driven to return to again and again...like an addiction. Of all the addictions I could have, this one is not so bad. Addiction? The experience I get does modify and pique certain pleasure centers of my...our...brains. That's why I think we keep coming back to sit in the chair by ourselves in the quiet room for so many hours.

 

Bits may be bits, but the magic carpet bits are riding on is what we are trying to improve. I think my experience tells me that a lot of the magic is in the power supplies and the cables and all else that tames the carpet's ride.

 

We are creating better and better microscopes, so the better our systems get at controlling the electricity, the more we will experience changes for the better in SQ.

 

Now that I'm at the end of the post, I think I can see that this long post was "just" a rationalization for trying that Shunyata $2,000.00 ethernet cable.  Sigh... OK, if it makes even more magic than I have now, I'll let you know. 🙂

Whoa...18 meters or so is quite a distance (based on highest priced Sigma cable and about 2K). But it will be worth it given the very likely improvement over whatever you’ve tested so far. 

Steve Schaffer

Grimm MU1 / dCS Vivaldi Upsampler - APEX DAC - Clock / Spectral DMC-30SV preamp / Spectral Anniversary monoblocks / Wilson Audio Alexia V /  Wilson Lōkē subs / Shunyata Everest / Shunyata Omega interconnects, power cables, Ethernet / Shunyata Altaira / Uptone EtherREGEN switch / Cybershaft OP21A-D / Uptone JS2 LPS / HRS racks - Vortex footers - damping plates

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4 minutes ago, mikicasellas said:

Is anyone here using the ER with Euphony ?

 

I having mayor drop outs after a week of ER's burning in, and now suddenly not only with the ER but replacing it with the TP LINK which i have had since two years ago without problems until now...i checked all connections that ram aware so far in order to discard elects that could be causing this issue: and when i disconnect my NUC endpoint and connect my Macmini direct to the DAC using ROON directly there is no issue so far.

 

In the other hand my internet speed seems to be fine but real performance when opening pages on the web or playing videos is not as good and sometimes very slow (weird, never happened)

 

I am powering my ER with the HDPLEX 200W at 9V and the NUC with a PH SR4 at 19V

 

Any idea ??

I’m pretty certain this crossed your mind - go back to what worked flawlessly before to verify that it still does and then proceed from there. 

Steve Schaffer

Grimm MU1 / dCS Vivaldi Upsampler - APEX DAC - Clock / Spectral DMC-30SV preamp / Spectral Anniversary monoblocks / Wilson Audio Alexia V /  Wilson Lōkē subs / Shunyata Everest / Shunyata Omega interconnects, power cables, Ethernet / Shunyata Altaira / Uptone EtherREGEN switch / Cybershaft OP21A-D / Uptone JS2 LPS / HRS racks - Vortex footers - damping plates

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21 minutes ago, mikicasellas said:

It is what i did but the TP LINK switch that was in place is also doing the exact issue...

So, from what you’ve said so far all evidence points to a failing NUC. What are the key hardware/software differences between the NUC and the Mac Mini?  And I’m unclear on the differing wiring. What software player or players are you using on each?  If you test with the Mac Mini to eR what happens?  And using the TP-Link in the same linkage has the same symptoms - would point to question of Ethernet cables becoming unstable. 

Steve Schaffer

Grimm MU1 / dCS Vivaldi Upsampler - APEX DAC - Clock / Spectral DMC-30SV preamp / Spectral Anniversary monoblocks / Wilson Audio Alexia V /  Wilson Lōkē subs / Shunyata Everest / Shunyata Omega interconnects, power cables, Ethernet / Shunyata Altaira / Uptone EtherREGEN switch / Cybershaft OP21A-D / Uptone JS2 LPS / HRS racks - Vortex footers - damping plates

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1 hour ago, stevebythebay said:

Whoa...18 meters or so is quite a distance (based on highest priced Sigma cable and about 2K). But it will be worth it given the very likely improvement over whatever you’ve tested so far. 

I thought it was @2K for 1 meter.

 

I'll check, now you say this, probably  I was thinking about the USB to replace my Wire World Premium Starlight 7.

 

I looked at cable co and see the Sigma ethernet is 900...Hmmm....I could have rationalized less 🙂

 

Thanks

 

G

Main: sonicTransporter I5>etherRegen>opticalRendu/ghent/UltraCap 1.2> WireWorld Platinum>YGGY Atma-sphere MP-1 3.1> Hegel 30> Maggie 1.7, REL SE 212: Zero Autoformers, Interconnects , Analysis Plus Silver Oval-In, Nordost Heimdall, Power Cables: Synergistic./Shunyata>Chang Litespeed 

HT:Dish>OPPO>Marantz>Hegel> 3-Maggies/2-Quads>REL Gibraltar>Custom Wire loom>APS>Samsung Plasma 55"

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11 minutes ago, thotdoc said:

I thought it was @2K for 1 meter.

 

I'll check, now you say this, probably  I was thinking about the USB to replace my Wire World Premium Starlight 7.

 

I looked at cable co and see the Sigma ethernet is 900...Hmmm....I could have rationalized less 🙂

 

Thanks

 

G

That's why the cost is so high.  You'll see that unlike many other higher end cables, Shunyata is not exorbitant as you increase cable lengths.  The items you're paying for are the 2 CMode bits and the more expensive ends.  But it's really worth a try between the eR and the DAC.  Not clear to me from what you've said just where your focus is re: your current Ethernet setup.

Steve Schaffer

Grimm MU1 / dCS Vivaldi Upsampler - APEX DAC - Clock / Spectral DMC-30SV preamp / Spectral Anniversary monoblocks / Wilson Audio Alexia V /  Wilson Lōkē subs / Shunyata Everest / Shunyata Omega interconnects, power cables, Ethernet / Shunyata Altaira / Uptone EtherREGEN switch / Cybershaft OP21A-D / Uptone JS2 LPS / HRS racks - Vortex footers - damping plates

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15 hours ago, Jud said:

Just bought 3 Cable Matters Cat 8 1m cables, and after quite a bit of comparative listening this evening, I surprisingly find I like the sound with the Slimrun Cat 6a more, at least in my system.

 

To whoever has tried the Cable Matters Cat 8: Did the cable go through a break-in period? Did it sound better than the other cables you'd tried as soon as you installed it?

 

If things remain as they are I'll possibly offer the new cables for sale to whoever here might like them.

Give them at least two or three days. I'm just breaking in a second pair and 40 hours in they are just beginning to open up and sound great. Just listened to the long version of Marley's Jammin', wowser!

 

Jachua Heifetz is playing Bruch at moment. Never heard him better!

Pareto Audio aka nuckleheadaudio

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6 hours ago, stevebythebay said:

That's why the cost is so high.  You'll see that unlike many other higher end cables, Shunyata is not exorbitant as you increase cable lengths.  The items you're paying for are the 2 CMode bits and the more expensive ends.  But it's really worth a try between the eR and the DAC.  Not clear to me from what you've said just where your focus is re: your current Ethernet setup.

Can't try between the eR and the DAC as the DAC is USB YGGI.

 

The focus of this is just feeding the eR from the wall. But, that will get complicated by the next phase: My sonic transport is in another part of the house and I want it downstairs in the listening room. That means another switch and that opens up that can of worms...The NEXT switch!!!  More eNet cables. The saga continues.   

Main: sonicTransporter I5>etherRegen>opticalRendu/ghent/UltraCap 1.2> WireWorld Platinum>YGGY Atma-sphere MP-1 3.1> Hegel 30> Maggie 1.7, REL SE 212: Zero Autoformers, Interconnects , Analysis Plus Silver Oval-In, Nordost Heimdall, Power Cables: Synergistic./Shunyata>Chang Litespeed 

HT:Dish>OPPO>Marantz>Hegel> 3-Maggies/2-Quads>REL Gibraltar>Custom Wire loom>APS>Samsung Plasma 55"

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5 minutes ago, thotdoc said:

Can't try between the eR and the DAC as the DAC is USB YGGI

Guess I'm not clear on how you've wired everything in your system.  What is included on both the A and B sides of the eR, especially the B side?  Do you only have the single cable from the wall coming into the A side?  Or is that the B side? 

Steve Schaffer

Grimm MU1 / dCS Vivaldi Upsampler - APEX DAC - Clock / Spectral DMC-30SV preamp / Spectral Anniversary monoblocks / Wilson Audio Alexia V /  Wilson Lōkē subs / Shunyata Everest / Shunyata Omega interconnects, power cables, Ethernet / Shunyata Altaira / Uptone EtherREGEN switch / Cybershaft OP21A-D / Uptone JS2 LPS / HRS racks - Vortex footers - damping plates

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47 minutes ago, stevebythebay said:

Guess I'm not clear on how you've wired everything in your system.  What is included on both the A and B sides of the eR, especially the B side?  Do you only have the single cable from the wall coming into the A side?  Or is that the B side? 

Right now: metal ethernet cable out of the wall box to the ether Regen. Optical out from the ether Regan to the  optical Rendu. USB out of the optical Rendu, metal in and optical out...simple.

 

Next, to bring the sonic transport downstairs I need a switch that is fed by the wall-ethernet-box using a metal ethernet cable, the switch is connected by another metal ethernet cable to

A) The sonic transport 

B) Then another metal cable from the switch, to  

C) The ether Regen, and

D) Optical out of the ether Regen to the YGGI.

 

 

 

Main: sonicTransporter I5>etherRegen>opticalRendu/ghent/UltraCap 1.2> WireWorld Platinum>YGGY Atma-sphere MP-1 3.1> Hegel 30> Maggie 1.7, REL SE 212: Zero Autoformers, Interconnects , Analysis Plus Silver Oval-In, Nordost Heimdall, Power Cables: Synergistic./Shunyata>Chang Litespeed 

HT:Dish>OPPO>Marantz>Hegel> 3-Maggies/2-Quads>REL Gibraltar>Custom Wire loom>APS>Samsung Plasma 55"

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OK.  So, if I get the picture in my mind your cable modem/router lives upstairs?  Then Ethernet wiring emerges downstairs.  And what you're seeking is to introduce your sonic transport source/player into the downstairs switched environment.  Does the sonic transport act as a switch (multiple Ethernet ports) or are you planning to add an additional eR to support the sonic transport? 

 

As I recall, with optical, everything is reversed with the B side acting as the "input" and the A side supporting optical "Out".  With a single eR the Ethernet from the wall would enter the B side of the eR. 

 

Guess I'm not clear on why a second eR is needed.  Doesn't the sonic transport have WiFi built in to support management of its local library and streaming? 

 

Guess a diagram of your proposed environment might help.  Also, given that your going optical out to the Rendu, what role does the Rendu play in your process?  Is it acting as a Roon Ready endpoint with the sonic transport as a Roon Core? 

 

The YGGI is getting its USB feed from an optical to USB converter device???  I've found optical a poorer sonic option due to the number of physical connections and less attractive devices in the link, especially if you can get devices closer together.  Seems that bringing the sonic transport downstairs would make using purely Ethernet a far simpler and better option.

 

But only testing out alternatives will prove what's best (see below):

 

I've used, for many years, a Yggdrasil / WireWorld Gold AES/EBU cable / Berkeley S/PDIF to USB box / Synergistic Research Galileo USB / microRendu / Sonore Signature LPS.  All this in the home theater setup.  The Berkeley was left over from prior DAC and using it is sonically superior to going straight USB out of the Yggy.  Can never make assumptions about what will turn out to sound best...testing...testing...testing.

Steve Schaffer

Grimm MU1 / dCS Vivaldi Upsampler - APEX DAC - Clock / Spectral DMC-30SV preamp / Spectral Anniversary monoblocks / Wilson Audio Alexia V /  Wilson Lōkē subs / Shunyata Everest / Shunyata Omega interconnects, power cables, Ethernet / Shunyata Altaira / Uptone EtherREGEN switch / Cybershaft OP21A-D / Uptone JS2 LPS / HRS racks - Vortex footers - damping plates

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On 12/19/2019 at 9:37 AM, alsterfan said:

Quite a few proposals have been made concerning LPSs to use instead of the standard PS.

I wonder why so far a power bank as a possible alternative hasn´t been mentioned.

Since over a year this power bank:

https://www.xtpower.de/XTPower-Powerbank-MP-50000-DC/USB-Hochleistung-Akku-Li-Ion-mit-52800mAh

replaced the JS2 to power-up a Mac mini because of a SQ improvement.

 

Hi Uwe,

 

thanks for reporting, seems to be a nice device.

It is a pity that is does not offer an USB-C output or adapter for powering a new Apple MBP.

 

Matt

"I want to know why the musicians are on stage, not where". (John Farlowe)

 

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6 hours ago, matthias said:

 

Hi Uwe,

 

thanks for reporting, seems to be a nice device.

It is a pity that is does not offer an USB-C output or adapter for powering a new Apple MBP.

 

Matt

 

 

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B07XZ7Q2N7/ref=sspa_mw_detail_4?ie=UTF8&psc=1

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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1 hour ago, lmitche said:

How did the cat 8 cable work out?

 

Still letting it run. Some time this weekend I'll compare it to the Slimrun again.

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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6 hours ago, Jud said:

 

Still letting it run. Some time this weekend I'll compare it to the Slimrun again.

 

More difficult to choose a preference now. Each seems to have advantages. Have the Cat 8 back in the system and letting it run again.

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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What about cable length?  Is there reflectance at certain lengths ?

 

I purchased 2 short cables from Monoprice to try from the ER B side to my DS dac’s Bridge card.    I think I ordered half meter and full meter.

 

I want to burn them in a bit before trying.

 

I currently have the ER plugged into another circuit, rather than into one of the outlets in my Niagara 7000.  Perhaps I should try using with the Niagara.  I imagine it would improve the ER but wondering if the ER power supply will dump noise into the power conditioner, negating the benefit.  

 

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