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EtherREGEN: Installation, Usage, Difficulty, Questions thread


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Hi community 

I received my new EtherRegen a week ago. 

I connected my IFI PRO  DAC  to port B and the router to port A. I power the EtherRegen with  the second port of my JS-2 (9 Volt). The first port is powering the DAC. 

After few days of use, I  have several problems with the EtherRegen –

It is extremely hot, almost untouchable.

Performance is not stable – in most of the time it sounds great, much better than the sound when I connect the DAC  directly to the router.

However sometimes it sound flat and narrow, worse than when I connect the DAC  directly to the router.

I also see intermittent disconnections from the internet.

 

Please advise

 

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2 hours ago, Haimsh said:

Hi community 

I received my new EtherRegen a week ago. 

I connected my IFI PRO  DAC  to port B and the router to port A. I power the EtherRegen with  the second port of my JS-2 (9 Volt). The first port is powering the DAC. 

After few days of use, I  have several problems with the EtherRegen –

It is extremely hot, almost untouchable.

Performance is not stable – in most of the time it sounds great, much better than the sound when I connect the DAC  directly to the router.

However sometimes it sound flat and narrow, worse than when I connect the DAC  directly to the router.

I also see intermittent disconnections from the internet.

 

Please advise

 

The negatives of the two outputs of the JS-2 are connected together (they are NOT connected to safety ground (third pin on the AC plug)) thus you are bypassing the "moat" powering both off the same JS-2. Try powering the EtherREGEN off the SMPS it comes with and see if that changes anything.

 

John S.

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1 hour ago, JohnSwenson said:

The negatives of the two outputs of the JS-2 are connected together (they are NOT connected to safety ground (third pin on the AC plug)) thus you are bypassing the "moat" powering both off the same JS-2. Try powering the EtherREGEN off the SMPS it comes with and see if that changes anything.

 

John S.

Alex suggested turning ER ‘around’

ie ethernet into B side + js-2 power to ER & then other js-2 power to dac with music from say uRendu on A side.

mb pro>ethernet / elgar iso tran(2.5kVa, .0005pfd)>consonance pw-3 boards>ghent ethernet(et linkway cat8 jssg360)>etherRegen B-side(js-2)>ghent ethernet(et linkway cat8 jssg360) >ultraRendu A-side(clones lpsu split>lps1.2)>uspbc>iso regen(clones lpsu split>lps1.2)>curious regen link>rme adi-2 dac(js-2)>cawsey cables>naquadria sp2 passive pre> 1.naquadria lucien mkII.5 power>elac fs249be + elac 4pi plus.2> 2.perreaux9000b(mods)>2xnaq12” passive subs.

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13 hours ago, JohnSwenson said:

This is normal behavior. The chips inside the EtherREGEN are designed to run with a clock, very strange things happen if they are powered up without a clock.

 

The Ref10 contains an OCXO, this runs the crystal inside at a high temperature (why is complicated), every time you turn it on and off you fully temperature cycle what is inside, this is VERY bad for an OCXO, not just because it can take weeks for an OCXO to really stabilize, but it can also damage what is inside. With an OCXO you should figure out where it is going to be placed, power it up and leave it running until you die. OK, if you move you have to unpower it, power cycling a few times is all right, but certainly not every day, or week or month. Once a year is probably all right.   if you live in an area where power goes off frequently, get a UPS to power the clock.

 

John S.

 

Wow John, thanks for the explanation. It is clear enough. I turn it off because of a paragraph in the manual that says this: 

 

Keeping the REF10, respectively REF10 SE120 permanently powered up is generally not required as long as you observe the extended warm-up period described above. We do however advise against power cycling the unit in short, repeated intervals.

 

I was just wondering if it degrades the crystal much faster compared to turning it off when I do not need it.

 

BTW, the Etherregen runs damn hot, to the extend you cannot keep your palm on it for more than 10 seconds. I know the case acts like a heat sink but should it be a concern? I seen people putting heat sinks on it. Is it really neccessary? I'm using the stock power supply that comes with it.

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5 hours ago, JohnSwenson said:

The negatives of the two outputs of the JS-2 are connected together (they are NOT connected to safety ground (third pin on the AC plug)) thus you are bypassing the "moat" powering both off the same JS-2. Try powering the EtherREGEN off the SMPS it comes with and see if that changes anything.

 

John S.

Hi  John,

I try now with the SMPS...

So far so good

Thanks 

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12 hours ago, dstubked said:

 

Wow John, thanks for the explanation. It is clear enough. I turn it off because of a paragraph in the manual that says this: 

 

Keeping the REF10, respectively REF10 SE120 permanently powered up is generally not required as long as you observe the extended warm-up period described above. We do however advise against power cycling the unit in short, repeated intervals.

 

I was just wondering if it degrades the crystal much faster compared to turning it off when I do not need it.

 

BTW, the Etherregen runs damn hot, to the extend you cannot keep your palm on it for more than 10 seconds. I know the case acts like a heat sink but should it be a concern? I seen people putting heat sinks on it. Is it really neccessary? I'm using the stock power supply that comes with it.

The EtherREGEN will generate more heat depending on how much stuff you have running through the A side. If you have several gigabit connections with a lot of data going on all the time (like 4K video) it will generate considerably more heat than just running music through it.

 

Mine which is just running music data through it gets warm but not hot.

 

In general the ways to help it be a little cooler are:

 

give it plenty of room to breathe. Don't put it in a cabinet with other hot devices and close the door.

 

put it in some form of stand that puts it on its side so air can flow up both sides.

 

Put a heat sink on it.

 

Personally I have never needed to add a heatsink. I have put it on its side, this can help a lot.

 

John S.

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On 9/11/2020 at 12:14 AM, JohnSwenson said:

The negatives of the two outputs of the JS-2 are connected together (they are NOT connected to safety ground (third pin on the AC plug)) thus you are bypassing the "moat" powering both off the same JS-2. Try powering the EtherREGEN off the SMPS it comes with and see if that changes anything.

 

John S.

I’m using a JS-2 to power both a Roon Nucleus (A side connection) and ER with B side connection to a dCS Upsampler. Any benefit using a ground wire from the ER to the grounding post of a Shunyata Denali power conditioner or newer Everest?

Steve Schaffer

Roon Nucleus/ dCS Vivaldi Upsampler - DAC - Clock / Spectral DMC-30SV preamp / Spectral Anniversary monoblocks / Wilson Audio Alexia 2 / Shunyata Everest / Shunyata interconnects & power cables & Ethernet / Uptone EtherREGEN switch / Cybershaft OP21A-D / Uptone JS2

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2 hours ago, stevebythebay said:

I’m using a JS-2 to power both a Roon Nucleus (A side connection) and ER with B side connection to a dCS Upsampler. Any benefit using a ground wire from the ER to the grounding post of a Shunyata Denali power conditioner or newer Everest?

I got a hum & disconnected my ground wire from the ER when I adopted Alex’s advice below re powering ER + other device (in my case a dac) with the js-2:

 

“ If your usage of the EtherREGEN has only one (network feed) connection on the 'A' side, then there is a trick you can use which will allow use of the JS-2 for both the EtherREGEN and endpoint while preserving the full isolation.  "Turn around" the EtherREGEN, running your network feed into the 'B' port, and your endpoint from one of the 'A' ports.  This works great for two reasons:

1) We went to extra trouble and expense to make the EtherREGEN symmetrical about its moat (i.e. differential clocking and reclocking and all super voltage regulation is the same both sides) just so that B>A performance would be equal to A>B. Main reason we did it was for optical endpoint users (opticalRendu), but there are other uses for B>A connection, such as multiple endpoints or issues of power supply.

2) DC power to the EtherREGEN is to its 'A' side (yes, power makes its way to the 'B' side, but via expensive isolating converters across the moat), so having the endpoint attached to an 'A' port makes it not matter that both the EtherREGEN and the endpoint are sharing a power supply (JS-2) whose two DC outputs share a common -VE/zero-volt "ground." “

mb pro>ethernet / elgar iso tran(2.5kVa, .0005pfd)>consonance pw-3 boards>ghent ethernet(et linkway cat8 jssg360)>etherRegen B-side(js-2)>ghent ethernet(et linkway cat8 jssg360) >ultraRendu A-side(clones lpsu split>lps1.2)>uspbc>iso regen(clones lpsu split>lps1.2)>curious regen link>rme adi-2 dac(js-2)>cawsey cables>naquadria sp2 passive pre> 1.naquadria lucien mkII.5 power>elac fs249be + elac 4pi plus.2> 2.perreaux9000b(mods)>2xnaq12” passive subs.

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3 hours ago, stevebythebay said:

I’m using a JS-2 to power both a Roon Nucleus (A side connection) and ER with B side connection to a dCS Upsampler. Any benefit using a ground wire from the ER to the grounding post of a Shunyata Denali power conditioner or newer Everest?

 

Hi Steve:

Although the independently regulated outputs of the JS-2 share common -VE/zero-volt "ground" with each other, that "ground" is "floated" from AC mains.

Therefore, if attaching more than one copper Ethernet cable to 'A' side ports--and if one of those components is SMPS powered (obviously not the JS-2 supplied Nucleus in your case, but perhaps the upstream router), it is technically desirable to use the Ground screw of the EtherREGEN.

Yet we would advise running that ground wire to a real AC mains outlet ground. One never knows what funniness is done to grounds on power conditioners.

As always, let your ears be your guide.

 

 

1 hour ago, jamesg11 said:

I got a hum & disconnected my ground wire from the ER when I adopted Alex’s advice below re powering ER + other device (in my case a dac) with the js-2...

 

Hi James:

Thanks, but Steve's situation is not like yours. The Nucleus he is powering with the JS-2 is connected to the 'A' side of his EtherREGEN, so the common -VE/zero-volt "ground" between the two is not an issue.  The his dCS Vivaldi upsampler has Ethernet input and is alone on the 'B' side. Perhaps you thought he had it connected via USB to the Nucleus (on 'B' side), in which case your sharing of our "turn around" trick would have be useful to him.

 

:D

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

I bought a very similar (but slightly smaller) heatsink on eBay and have installed it today using double-sided heat-conducting tape.  I shall keep tabs on the ER case temperature and hope it will keep it somewhat cooler.

 

s-l500.jpg

TP-Link MR6400 4G router > Uptone EtherREGEN reclocker > Asus TBS/Volumio streamer > Mutec MC-3+ USB reclocker > LKS MH-DA004 DAC > Burson AB-160 XLR buffer > Belles SA-100 power amp > Usher Dancer Be-20 speakers. BG7TBL master clock. PS Audio P3 & P10 regenerators AudioQuest, Coherent, MCRU & Wireworld cables

https://theaudiostandard.net

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fugly! :p

 

just kiddin' ;)

Qnap HS-251+ NAS (powered by an HD-Plex 100w LPS) > Cirrus7 Nimbini v2.5 Media Edition i7-8559U/32/512 running Roon ROCK (powered by a ZeroZone 19v/5A LPS) > Lumin U1 Mini (powered by an UpTone Audio JS-2 LPS) >  UpTone Audio ISO Regen (powered by an Uptone Audio UltraCap LPS-1.2) > Metrum Acoustics Adagio NOS digital preamplifier + First Watt SIT 3  power amplifier (or Don Garber Fi "Y" 6922 tube preamplifier + Don Garber Fi "X" 2A3 SET power amplifier, both powered from an Alpha-Core BP-30 Isolated Symmetrical Power Transformer) > Klipsch Cornwall III

 

headphones system:

Cirrus 7 > Lumin U1 Mini > Metrum Adagio > Pathos Aurium amplifier (powered by an UpTone Audio JS-2 LPS) > Focal Clear headphones

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45 minutes ago, octaviars said:

I have posted this picture before but it works really well with dual heat sinks and I have it mounted to the wall with two brackets in my networkcabinet. Temperature went from 48C to 38C so I am happy with this modification and the heat sinks are mounted with double-sided heat-conducting tape so it is reversable.

 

6ed0b93fb4349e88ad459ac429d60bb511fcc621.thumb.jpeg.886e0a8fca1aba0883785f695104ba93.jpeg

This looks like it would work well as a heat dissipater, but how do you orient it with cables attached?  Does the lower heat sink surface just sit on the shelf?

Living room:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7> Roon/Audirvana/JRiver Media Server > ASUS AC-87R Router > Netgear GS348 Switch > EtherRegen > Sonore Signature Rendu SE Tier 2 > Wyred4Sound 10th Anniversary DAC > Wyred4Sound STI-500 > Revel F32 Concertas

 

Basement:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7>Roon/Audirvana/JRiver Media Server > ASUS AC-87R Router > Netgear GS348 Switch >TrendNet FMC>Sonore OpticalModule> UltraRendu > NuPrime IDA-8 > KEF LS50's

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12 minutes ago, Mike Rubin said:

Does the lower heat sink surface just sit on the shelf?

 

As I wrote I made brackets to mount it to the wall so air can move around it.

 

1600881186554.thumb.jpg.0d830a0975b69c451bfd34cb6c2c9bec.jpg

Main system
TAD D1000mk2, TAD M2500mk2, TAD CE-1, Ansuz Mainz 8 C2, Ansuz Darkz D-TC, 
Qobuz Studio -> Roon ROCK on NUC -> Uptone etherREGEN -> dCS Network Bridge -> AES/EBU -> DAC
HD Plex 200W PSU (4 rail for ISP fiber, router, etherREGEN and NUC)
 
Second system
Qobuz Studio -> Devialet Silver Phantom, Devialet Tree
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10 minutes ago, octaviars said:

 

As I wrote I made brackets to mount it to the wall so air can move around it.

 

1600881186554.thumb.jpg.0d830a0975b69c451bfd34cb6c2c9bec.jpg

So you said, indeed. Sloppy reading on my part!  

 

Looks like a terrific installation.

Living room:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7> Roon/Audirvana/JRiver Media Server > ASUS AC-87R Router > Netgear GS348 Switch > EtherRegen > Sonore Signature Rendu SE Tier 2 > Wyred4Sound 10th Anniversary DAC > Wyred4Sound STI-500 > Revel F32 Concertas

 

Basement:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7>Roon/Audirvana/JRiver Media Server > ASUS AC-87R Router > Netgear GS348 Switch >TrendNet FMC>Sonore OpticalModule> UltraRendu > NuPrime IDA-8 > KEF LS50's

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Conversely, what might be the reason(s) for not having a hot ER?

Mine is just medium warm.

I don’t have fiber ..., I don’t have more than the single A-side connection ..., I don’t have ... ?

mb pro>ethernet / elgar iso tran(2.5kVa, .0005pfd)>consonance pw-3 boards>ghent ethernet(et linkway cat8 jssg360)>etherRegen B-side(js-2)>ghent ethernet(et linkway cat8 jssg360) >ultraRendu A-side(clones lpsu split>lps1.2)>uspbc>iso regen(clones lpsu split>lps1.2)>curious regen link>rme adi-2 dac(js-2)>cawsey cables>naquadria sp2 passive pre> 1.naquadria lucien mkII.5 power>elac fs249be + elac 4pi plus.2> 2.perreaux9000b(mods)>2xnaq12” passive subs.

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17 minutes ago, jamesg11 said:

Conversely, what might be the reason(s) for not having a hot ER?

Great question. While it’s possible that there are sonic benefits, that does not appear to be confirmed beyond question at this point. IMO the unquestionable benefit is longer unit life. Heat kills solid state electronics. The hotter the unit, the shorter the operational life.

 

You indicate yours is not particularly hot. I gather that can be a function of A-side network traffic. So many people’s may be a good deal hotter than yours. But either way, a hot solid state component is a short lived solid state component. Otherwise why bothering cool PC CPUs?

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30 minutes ago, scolley said:

The hotter the unit, the shorter the operational life.

I made many measurements of unit temp, ambient temp, etc. and listened quite a bit. I heard no differences I could correlate to temp up/down.

 

I only modified my unit because I *think* heat is an undesirable element for solid state, per @scolleyabove. I get that there

might be exceptions, or parameters that describe good heat levels for crystal "ovens" and the like. Happy to be wrong about that, but that's what I "learned" circa '74.

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I agree with the above, I attached a heatsink to mine to prolong its operational life, not because I think you could hear any sound quality differences.

TP-Link MR6400 4G router > Uptone EtherREGEN reclocker > Asus TBS/Volumio streamer > Mutec MC-3+ USB reclocker > LKS MH-DA004 DAC > Burson AB-160 XLR buffer > Belles SA-100 power amp > Usher Dancer Be-20 speakers. BG7TBL master clock. PS Audio P3 & P10 regenerators AudioQuest, Coherent, MCRU & Wireworld cables

https://theaudiostandard.net

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Today it was my turn to experience a mind-blowing and very unexpected lift in soundstage and overall sound quality. While I was behind my system and messing around with cables, I also replaced my single-mode SFP-modules and fiber cable with duplex-mode SFP's and fiber connecting a Ubiquiti router to EtherREGEN’s SFP-cage. I didn't turned power off on any device - just connected the new duplex-mode fiber.
 
Right away I was met by a larger and better defined soundstage. I could hear subtle details that previously had escaped my attention. The musical presentation and separation, especially in lower midrange and bass, also seem more clear and distinct.

 

Please remember, I don't use streaming so the fiber connection is not involved in the transport of music files. To me, this improvement doesn't seem logical. But maybe the duplex-mode SFP's and fiber give EtherREGEN better working conditions? I know that the single-mode fiber is mainly used for long distance/traveling signals, and the SFP mechanism is more complicated - but this much?

 

If any of you can explain this, please do.

Time for more listening...
Tom

 

My SetUp 2020-v8.jpg

UpTone JS-2 LPS (powering Mini / NAS / eR) > Mac Mini (UpTone MMK) > UpTone EtherREGEN > WD-NAS > Ubiquiti X-SFP Router > Cisco 2960 (SFP > eR SFP) > Sonore UltraRendu (LPS-1.2) > UpTone IsoREGEN (LPS-1.2) > Denafrips Pontus R2R DAC > Conrad Johnson PV10 > QUAD 405-2 > SoundLab Dynastat Electrostatic/Hybride Speakers > Cables: Sablon Audio / Ghent Audio (JSSG360) / AudioQuest / PS Audio / Transparent / Nordost

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