UpTone Audio EtherREGEN Listening Impressions

[GryphonGuy]

Whilst this could be a “me too” post about EtherRegen, I’ll try to add value to the EtherRegen community for those contemplating using the EtherRegen in a professional audio setting, particularly those using the Avid MTRX with Dante audio option or its OEM equivalent of DAD AX32 box running Dante protocols (Audio over Ethernet).

 

I have passed the 120 hours mark of run-in and I must say I am so glad the soundstage and presentation of audio through the EtherRegen changed for the better from its out-of-the-box shrilled and flat soundstage to the wonderfully detailed wide, deep and rock-solid soundstage it now presents.

 

Given my limited rig here I have not been able to do full scientific investigations but I have re-recorded non-EtherRegen vinyl tracks through the EtherRegen. Combining the two recordings into one file and there is a much more detailed presentation on playback with the EtherRegen recorded material than with the non-EtherRegen material. The key difference is that the faint sounding signals are so much more easily heard using the EtherRegen. It’s not that they are louder in the mix, just clearer in the mix. So I have to conclude that the signal being captured is different to the signal without the EtherRegen in the recording chain. Obviously playback works in the same way but I do not believe there is an additive process; just nicely formed and electrically quiet ethernet signals at all times.

 

Characteristics of the EtherRegen effect via Dante is that transients are noticeably much stronger. For example, a snare drum struck hard hits hard on playback and seems to know no bounds in how loud it can sound and sounds so close to the original that the timbres of everything sound so much more real. The inky blacks of no-noise are there too and when a vocalist reaches a crescendo in a song, the voice seems to pop appropriately as though they were singing live. Of course this is all relative to the recorded medium. Nothing I’ve mentioned is absolute except the realism EtherRegen brings to Dante audio.

 

To achieve this, I have used OM5 fibre optic cable feeding the EtherRegen using transceivers with wavelength of 1310nm (the 850nm waves on this 850nm optimized cable flattened or crushed the soundstage too much for me). The Ethernet cable on the “B” side of the EtherRegen to the Avid MTRX is a Cable Matters Cat8 cable.

 

I hope this adds value to the EtherRegen community.

 

Regards,

GG

[GryphonGuy]

Something struck me about the eR's presentation last night. Every album/track I listen to is now a performance and I can sense the passion in those performances. It just has me amazed day-in and day-out at how important the low-level signals are in our listening pleasure. Damn you Uptone Audio! I MUST stop listening and get some actual work done! 😍

[GryphonGuy]

11 hours ago, LewinskiH01 said:

 

My understanding (through my questions to users) is one needs to establish a "Ravenna network" and Ravenna as a protocol is very demanding of the network and the B-side can't cope with that. This why ferenc is connecting both the streaming PC and Hapi on the A-side. So can't cross the moat. Would be very interested in discussing with Hapi users who are crossing the moat.

 

 

Interesting answer. I was just feeling sorry of myself for how things turned out. You delivered as promised and there's no grief on my end. I know why I decided the way I did, and faced with the same scenario I had at the time of deciding I would choose the same. I hope you don't really think it was to save $34...

 

Ravenna appears to be a similar AOIP protocol to Dante and I use Dante across the moat on ER very successfully. The biggest issue I have is that after every windows update, windows somehow turns on network throttling which i then need to turn off to allow Dante to operate glitch free. The only way i know that network throttling is in use is that 192kHz signals played back on Roon sometimes stutters if I do ANYTHING on my PC that requires a network packet. I then run a special utility in Dante have Dante tell me the problem and then have it turn network throttling off, reboot my PC and all is well again until the next windows update.

 

Maybe something similar is happening with your Ravenna network protocols? Unfortunately I don't know how to permanently turn off network throttling but the Dante software identifies it and does it for me.

 

Regards

GG

[GryphonGuy]

23 hours ago, LewinskiH01 said:

 

Thanks for chiming in. I don't yet have the Ravenna card, but I'm considering the Merging Hapi for multichannel and been looking for eR+Hapi users, and I have only found one who, despite doing on 2 channel, said the 100Mbps port didn't work. From your comment I'm guessing that even a Dante card doing 8 channels at 192kHz would have trouble. let alone if doing DSD, which is something I consider down the road with Hapi.

 

cheers!

 

You're welcome.

 

Well 192kHz 24 bit audio uses approx 10-11Mbit/sec per mono channel so 8 mono channels would be theoretically using 80-88Mbit/sec. Whether that capacity usage would cause problems I cannot answer. Perhaps somebody with more technical knowledge might chime in also.

 

Regards

GG

[GryphonGuy]

On 4/23/2020 at 3:28 AM, feelingears said:

 

Thank you, @adamaley. No, what is unexpected (or perhaps entirely expected) is that putting ER before Orbi mesh wi-fi yields so much sonic goodness in my system. As I wrote, I had not intended to use it this way and I had hoped to have a device after the wi-fi as you suggested to enable me to use both Ethernet and the ER just before the <Lumin/Auralic/whatever> sending AES to the DAC. I expect this will take things to another level entirely, but things are really pretty dang awesome already. I'd rather spend $$$ on better speakers now than more digital! (And digital is complicated for me because the software is part of the mess.)

 

This has been a supremely satisfying journey of stepping up my system via various changes that have yielded substantial improvements. I use the same test tracks and have both vinyl and digital. The vinyl "doesn't change" (much) so it's a long-standing reference point, and I've heard other effortlessly outstanding systems as well. For my config and home and ears, the ER truly lets digital sing (even if it's ahead of wi-fi by necessity).

 

Just be aware that running a wi-fi transceiver on a feed of 100mbit/sec may impact your LAN. If you are sure that you have CD quality music 2.8mbit/sec and no more than, say 2 devices connecting to your wifi your throughput should be good. But any more than that and you run the risk of flooding your 100mbit/sec EtherRegen connection.

[GryphonGuy]

6 hours ago, R1200CL said:

I think the SMS200 or a Renu isn’t needed. Your Bryston 3.14 has Ethernet in. The Mac can be anywhere in your network.
 

Why would you use USB ?
 

If any Rendu should be considered, it should be opticalRendu. 
 

A usb regen after a Rendu is normally used with the Microrendu. (It’s equal the ultraRendu). 
 

Sell the SMS 200 and buy a clock from AfterDark. (Or a second EtherRegen 😀)

 

Perhaps he is not just connecting using Ethernet because needs it to make music and it appears the Bryston's ethernet port is only for control of the device. So any of the Audio inputs could be used and he seems to have chosen USB.

 

Regards

GG

[GryphonGuy]

5 hours ago, musicguy said:

Just  got my ether regen from uptone.  

 

Just a question and if anyone can  provide a link   to burn in.   Does it need  it?   Ive never owned a net work switch.

 

???

 

Short answer is yes it benefits from being on for a while and transmitting data through it. When I first turned mine on, I thought I'd made the wrong decision as the sound was so flat and stifled. However several hours later it sounded good and a few days later (not continuously turned on) it was magnificent. So if you enjoy a good journey, listen to it and enjoy it opening up. If you are a destination type guy, burn it in for a day or two and then start listening.

 

Regards

GG

[GryphonGuy]

8 hours ago, TimF said:

Quick q. I have the TP-LINK Archer VR2800. Any optimisation in settings required to improve sound quality to the etherregen? 
 

Thanks Tim 

 

This sounds like a loaded question. So I'll say there shouldn't be any special set up required. EtherRegen does its thing on hard-wired ethernet signals; and very well at that in my opinion.

 

Regards

GG

[GryphonGuy]

Some time ago, I posted (somewhere) that I had ordered some clocks for my system that includes 2 ERs. Well I have the clocks now and have had them running for about 1 week....

 

Since firmware upgrades forced software upgrades elsewhere, Dante, the AOIP (Audio over IP) solution I use in my home studio, I reported that I now MUST have 1GB networks for Dante to be stable enough to work. I already had a little 5-port TP-Link switch to fool my computer's PCIe dante card into believing it was on a 1GB network but with a firmware update to my Audio Distributor (Avid MTRX aka rebranded Digital Audio Denmark AX32), the Dante timing signals became erratic and at times would start arriving too late for the system to be able to manage the delays. (pops, clicks and mostly dropouts were the result)

 

Since the ER is only 1GB on the "A" side and I use a single-mode fibre network infrastructure in my audio VLAN that connects to the "A" side, in order for the "B" side to be connected to the Avid MTRX, I needed a 1GB solution.

 

I forked out for a TOTL SOtM Network Switch since it could connect back to my network with fibre, it has 8 ports of audiophile quality RJ45 copper connections and also allows for a 10MHz clock connection in the future. This resulted in a dynamics and tonal uplift but a flattening depthwise of the soundstage and a very slight edginess to the upper registers of the music. I added the ER's to this switch and decorum returned with the edginess eliminated to my hearing at least. However, the shallow, almost nonexistent depth of the soundstage remained. This, in my experience, tells me that I have miniscule timing issues with the audio signals. And with 3 "levels" of connection now each adding their own latency to the signals, why wouldn't I have timing issues?

 

So I purchased a Mutec REF10 SE120 10MHz clock for the 2 ERs and the SOtM switch together with a Mutec MC3+USB wordclock for the Avid MTRX (professional gear uses wordclocks, not 10MHz clocks as a standard).

 

Well blow me down with a feather. I knew I had depth or timing issues, but holy cow, depth with this configuration is almost limitless. Where the recording captures it, a transient and its echoing decay disappears metres (yards for USA) into the background. What I thought was accurate left-to-right takes on new meaning with the Mutecs doing their thing. Timbre is amazing. Cassandra Wilson is renounded for having lots of little percussive sounds on her tracks and every nuance of sound is delivered here together with their position as the audio engineer positioned them in the mix.

 

I am still waiting for an updated ER "B" side because with 2 levels of 1GB switches in the chain I was achieving a system latency of approx 50 microseconds but adding in a 3rd level at 100MBits/s that latency increased to an average of 200 microseconds (0.2 milliseconds). Still very workable but why have 3 levels of connections if you can get away with 2?

 

P.S. I used the Mutec supplied 10MHz cables too, even for the wordclock. Oh and by the way, I already alluded in another post on this forum to the fact that the Mutec MC3 would not lock to the SE120 10MHz signal. I tried different clocking cables, reversing the cables, shuffling the cables all to no avail. In a final ridiculous venture after noticing the 10MHz connection was about 1cm (1/2 inch) from the power inlet, I changed to an upmarket audiophile cable (Shunyata Sigma power cable) and instantly the blue Lock LED stopped randomly blinking and stayed on. Problem solved...but oh so expensive a solution!

 

Enjoy the ERs. They really are the bee's knees.

 

Regards

GG