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Article: dCS Bartok Review

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25 minutes ago, AnotherSpin said:

 

Exactly. That is why I couldn't see the point for dismissal of one's likes or dislikes, be it audio or anything else.

Maybe there's no point at all, then, in sharing each other's opinions and evaluations...

 

Here it's a 13K$ point. I'd like to see rankings on scales ; ie : if, for free once you have HQP or if you're testing it, you can set your perceived evaluation of differences between,  say, mqa mp and long lp filters to 10, how much is the perceived difference between 2K and 25 K Dacs (3, 8, 9 ; need to set a new range where that difference is 20 while the difference between filters become 7 or what have you...)

 

dCS can send me a Rossini to change my mind ; I'm not convinced that 20 K put in a DAC brings much more than a change of filters


 

HQP Embedded  (REW + RePhase created convolution filters for correcting frequency and time domains for the actual results presented below/IIR/Wide/overlap-ADD/ [email protected], mqa lp @ above Frequency Rates/DSD5EC) on a cooled mid 2012 15" rMacBP > Cat 6 UTP Ethernet> Airport TC > Cat 6 UTP Ethernet > NAA (Miska's image on UP NUC)> 2.0 certified Supra USB > Green Regen > TEAC UD 501> (balanced output) >Cardas Golden Cross> JRRG all balanced pre> Cabasse 4 ways 8 amps active system played at realistic SPL (key factor IMO). MCH files (matrixed to Stereo) on an attached HDD, the rest on a G-Tech HDD attached to the AirPort and WIFI accessed, as Qobuz, via Audirvana fronting HQPlayer Embedded.

 

 

 

Proofing B&K C @ -9 copie-Modifier-2.jpg

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2 hours ago, Le Concombre Masqué said:

Maybe there's no point at all, then, in sharing each other's opinions and evaluations...

[...]

True to some extent... Even our own evaluation of anything in this visible world would change drastically in no time

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7 hours ago, austinpop said:

 

Like it or not, a DAC is so much more than "just" its filtering and D/A conversion design. Indeed, if my experience has taught me anything, it's that modern DACs live and die by how well they get the good old-fashioned basics right:

  1. analog output stage design
  2. power supply design
  3. clock architecture
  4. design or choice of chipsets used for interfaces like USB, ethernet
  5. Electrical isolation strategy - both at input, as well as internally
  6. Mechanical isolation via careful chassis design
  7. Parts quality, board layout, and quality of connectors
  8. And last, but certainly not least - filtering and D/A conversion design.

To focus on #8 alone is to miss all the other factors that distinguish DACs from each other.

Right but never said that only #8 matters ; wrote : "I'm not convinced that 20 K put in a DAC brings much more than a change of filters". OK I get where I could be misunderstood : I did not mean that the 20K are invested in filtering and D/A conversion design ; I meant that a simple change of filters in HQP might yield the perception of changes of the same order of magnitude 


 

HQP Embedded  (REW + RePhase created convolution filters for correcting frequency and time domains for the actual results presented below/IIR/Wide/overlap-ADD/ [email protected], mqa lp @ above Frequency Rates/DSD5EC) on a cooled mid 2012 15" rMacBP > Cat 6 UTP Ethernet> Airport TC > Cat 6 UTP Ethernet > NAA (Miska's image on UP NUC)> 2.0 certified Supra USB > Green Regen > TEAC UD 501> (balanced output) >Cardas Golden Cross> JRRG all balanced pre> Cabasse 4 ways 8 amps active system played at realistic SPL (key factor IMO). MCH files (matrixed to Stereo) on an attached HDD, the rest on a G-Tech HDD attached to the AirPort and WIFI accessed, as Qobuz, via Audirvana fronting HQPlayer Embedded.

 

 

 

Proofing B&K C @ -9 copie-Modifier-2.jpg

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Thanks Rajiv for a very informative and enjoyable read. I found this interesting as I'm exploring ladder DACs again as an antidote to harshness.

 

“...ladder DACs are inherently prone to non-linearity, but Delta-Sigma types are prone to problems caused by timing errors and switching noise. The Ring DAC occupies the “sweet spot” where the benefits of high speed and multi-bit intersects. Note that even with the tightest practical tolerances, a ladder DAC cannot come close to the linearity of the RingDAC.

 

I do wish I hadn't heard about the Rossini tho' :) 


Tidal Streaming only: ATL DC Blocker > Topaz 2.5Kva Isolation Transformer > Sine SA5 Cryo 5 power strip > Aqvox 8 port network switch > Antipodes Dxe roon core> PS Audio Directstream Junior Dac 'Windom' > Decware SE84UFO3 Mono Amps > Omega Super Alnico Monitors.

PH SR4 power supplies

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8 hours ago, tapatrick said:

Thanks Rajiv for a very informative and enjoyable read. I found this interesting as I'm exploring ladder DACs again as an antidote to harshness.

 

“...ladder DACs are inherently prone to non-linearity, but Delta-Sigma types are prone to problems caused by timing errors and switching noise. The Ring DAC occupies the “sweet spot” where the benefits of high speed and multi-bit intersects. Note that even with the tightest practical tolerances, a ladder DAC cannot come close to the linearity of the RingDAC.

 

I do wish I hadn't heard about the Rossini tho' :) 

If you are interested in a ladder DAC, check out the Holo Spring 2. I love mine.

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On 10/26/2019 at 4:30 PM, Le Concombre Masqué said:

Maybe there's no point at all, then, in sharing each other's opinions and evaluations...

 

Here it's a 13K$ point. I'd like to see rankings on scales ; ie : if, for free once you have HQP or if you're testing it, you can set your perceived evaluation of differences between,  say, mqa mp and long lp filters to 10, how much is the perceived difference between 2K and 25 K Dacs (3, 8, 9 ; need to set a new range where that difference is 20 while the difference between filters become 7 or what have you...)

 

dCS can send me a Rossini to change my mind ; I'm not convinced that 20 K put in a DAC brings much more than a change of filters


i assume that your local dealer could help you in having a rossini/bartok to have with you a test feeding these DAC with HQ Player. You are more than welcome to share your experience when it would be done. without that you can argue for hours. Anyway these devices are more than dac with the streaming feature and the efforts put on the software side.

 

BR

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4 hours ago, Patatorz said:


i assume that your local dealer could help you in having a rossini/bartok to have with you a test feeding these DAC with HQ Player. You are more than welcome to share your experience when it would be done. without that you can argue for hours. Anyway these devices are more than dac with the streaming feature and the efforts put on the software side.

 

BR

thanks. the closest dealer is in f**** Paris, hundreds miles away. Anyway I'm quite happy with what I have


 

HQP Embedded  (REW + RePhase created convolution filters for correcting frequency and time domains for the actual results presented below/IIR/Wide/overlap-ADD/ [email protected], mqa lp @ above Frequency Rates/DSD5EC) on a cooled mid 2012 15" rMacBP > Cat 6 UTP Ethernet> Airport TC > Cat 6 UTP Ethernet > NAA (Miska's image on UP NUC)> 2.0 certified Supra USB > Green Regen > TEAC UD 501> (balanced output) >Cardas Golden Cross> JRRG all balanced pre> Cabasse 4 ways 8 amps active system played at realistic SPL (key factor IMO). MCH files (matrixed to Stereo) on an attached HDD, the rest on a G-Tech HDD attached to the AirPort and WIFI accessed, as Qobuz, via Audirvana fronting HQPlayer Embedded.

 

 

 

Proofing B&K C @ -9 copie-Modifier-2.jpg

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On 10/23/2019 at 10:45 AM, The Computer Audiophile said:

I absolutely love this review!

 

As I told Rajiv / @austinpop, the saying, "I'm not worthy" from Wayne's World comes to mind when I read through this review. Such a great effort, I feel honored to publish such a fine piece of work. 

 

 

Great review, indeed. AudiophileStyle feels like the natural home for this. If there is another audiophile media outlet more "worthy" of this review, I've yet to find it. 

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1 hour ago, Temporal_Dissident said:

If there is another audiophile media outlet more "worthy" of this review, I've yet to find it. 

FWIW I also enjoyed the Bartók review by Chris Thomas in HiFi+. His reviews of some David Berning amplifiers got my attention, and I ended up buying the pre/power pair after audition.

 

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Clearly Rajiv has an affinity for this kind of work.  I was particularly interested in his comparisons of combinations of upstream components with USB and Ethernet input.  We all seem to be looking for that magical optimization.

 

But when I saw he was listening to Sylvia McNair (my favorite female voice), I knew this review was serious stuff ;)

 

Well done.

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5 hours ago, Darryl R said:

Clearly Rajiv has an affinity for this kind of work.  I was particularly interested in his comparisons of combinations of upstream components with USB and Ethernet input.  We all seem to be looking for that magical optimization.

 

But when I saw he was listening to Sylvia McNair (my favorite female voice), I knew this review was serious stuff ;)

 

Well done.

 

Hi Darry,

 

Thanks for your positive comments.

 

When I first started writing reviews, I was a bit apprehensive about revealing my musical tastes and choices, which are so uniquely personal. I'm glad I overcame that, because the response here - to my identifying the music I used and my sharing of playlists - has been overwhelmingly positive. Enjoying the music that moves us is ultimately what this shared passion of ours is all about.

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55 minutes ago, austinpop said:

 

Hi Darry,

 

Thanks for your positive comments.

 

When I first started writing reviews, I was a bit apprehensive about revealing my musical tastes and choices, which are so uniquely personal. I'm glad I overcame that, because the response here - to my identifying the music I used and my sharing of playlists - has been overwhelmingly positive. Enjoying the music that moves us is ultimately what this shared passion of ours is all about.

 

Honestly, we must attribute a good portion of your talent to the fact that you live in the greatest state in the union ;)

 

PS - If you liked Sylvia McNair in the Laudamus Te, you must hear her in the Slatkin Carmina Burana, In trutina and Dulcissime, where she soars to the heavens.  PM me if you're interested.  I also have a lot of Queyras' recordings.

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3 hours ago, Darryl R said:

 

Honestly, we must attribute a good portion of your talent to the fact that you live in the greatest state in the union ;)

 

PS - If you liked Sylvia McNair in the Laudamus Te, you must hear her in the Slatkin Carmina Burana, In trutina and Dulcissime, where she soars to the heavens.  PM me if you're interested.  I also have a lot of Queyras' recordings.


Thanks for the pointer to Sylvia’s Carmina with Slatkin/St Louis. It’s lovely. But dammit I was peacefully working here, and this made me go and listen to a bunch of Carmina’s and now ... totus floreo, with no domicella around! 🤓

 

For the record, the Ozawa/BPO version, with Thomas Hampson and Edita Gruberova, is still my favorite Carmina Burana. 
http://open.qobuz.com/album/fm0kymmr3f05a

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Great, you have it.  Carmina's can be addictive.  The Slatkin is my favorite, even though I have better recorded ones in the Runnicles and more recently the Richard Cooke/RPO SACD rip.

 

You've made me want to go listen to some Laudamus Te's, so we're even.

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