Article: Amazon Music HD Launches

[Gus141]

Yes, that’s going to be an interesting issue: who gets access to the APIs?

 

TIDAL and Qobuz have been great getting their services integrated into third-party apps that support high-end streamers (e.g. DS Lightning, mConnect, etc.). Folks who own multi-thousand-dollar streamers (Auralic, Lumin, etc.) aren’t likely to leave a service that they can currently control with their remote apps, unless Amazon Music gets on those apps/streamers (like BluOS devices).

 

[Gus141]

3 minutes ago, shadowlight said:

 

Big assumption on my part here.  Since, BluOS already has support for Amazon there has to be some kind of API that exists.

API or partnership? Who gets to play with Amazon is the question; Roon or Audirvana+?  Time will tell, but if Amazon wants the audiophiles, they need to support audiophile equipment.

 

Desktop app mostly works to USB DACs but many prefer the tablet apps or at least all the options Roon software gets you with Roon endpoints.

[Gus141]

2 minutes ago, Jud said:

 

Listening to Lumineers at the moment playing on my main system from Amazon HD app on phone through microRendu via its Shairport app. The Amazon app acts as a remote.

 

This means my DAC rather than Audirvana, which I'd prefer, is doing the upsampling. But it does mean that with one of the Rendus, or another device/minicomputer that supports Shairport or a similar application (perhaps some of the streamers themselves?), streaming to the main system with remote control by phone is already available.

Good to hear, and it should only get better as time goes by.

[Gus141]

10 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

Using BluOS, this abum shows an HR logo, perhaps for high resolution. 

 

 

 

I tried Amazon Music on my Node 2i  (S/PDIF Coax out connected to an RME ADI-2 DAC, which shows SR and bit depth). I see the “HR” icon too for anything in my library I added via the Amazon apps that was labeled as “Ultra HD”; and the RME shows the correct kHz/bit-depth (based on comparing it to clicking “Ultra HD” text in a native app. to see what it’s playing).

 

Also, Chris, have you tried Amazon Music app with your DF Cobalt with CCK on iPad? My DFC lights up indicating 96kHz even if I play “HD”-labled music (44.1kHZ). Got the same behavior with a Monolith AAA THX Portable DAC attached to iPad via CCK (this DAC has an OLED screen that shows sampling rate, and it shows 192kHz for everything out of the Amazon Music app regardless of actual SR. So I tried an iFi xDSD on 5.3 firmware (versus 5.3c, so that the LED lights mean something) and the LED is indicating yellow (PCM 176-384 kHz) for *All* content.

 

Something is going on here. It looks like everything is getting upsampled on the iPad when connected to an external DAC. But the BluOS on Node 2i is working fine (just that the UI sucks! for Amazon on BluOS; you can’t see what’s “Ultra HD”, you have to use another app and add it to your library).

 

I hope mConnect adds this so I can use my DLNA/UPnP capable streamers on iOS (I don’t have Android so no BubbleUPnP).

[Gus141]

Can’t Get 24/192 on Bluesound Node 2i.

 

Neil Diamond - 50th Anniversary Collection, Sweet Caroline:

AMZ app (iPad) says 24/192 available and plays that way to external DAC connected via CCK; added that track to library; played that track via BlueSound’s iOS app to Node 2i connected to RME ADI-2 DAC: the DAC reports it is playing 24/96 not 24/192. Play the same track via Qobuz through the same Node 2i/RME setup and the RME DAC reports it is getting 24/192.  Weird that the Amazon stream is downgraded to 96 for this 192 album (tried other songs on this album between AMZ and Qobuz: AMZ plays as 96 on Node 2i, Qobuz plays as 192 on same Node 2i). Maybe this is Amazon doing some dynamic quality control based on network speed, but if that’s the case funny that Qobuz didn’t have a problem with my network.

 

Another example.

J.S. Ondara, Tales of America:

24/192 on Qobuz ->Node 2i-(Coax)->RME ADI-2 DAC;

24/192 on Amazon iOS app on iPad-(CCK)->external DACs;

but, BluOS Amazon Music plays this album as 24/96 on Node 2i-(Coax)->RME ADI-2 DAC

 

@cscamp and @The Computer Audiophile have you been able to get 24/192 from Amazon Music out of your BluOS devices to an external DAC? What tracks? I’ll try them.

[Gus141]

18 minutes ago, cscamp said:

I'll try it later. As of last night there is no indicator on my BlueOS app if i am playing 24/192 or 24/96, I just says Amazon HR or Amazon CD. I did update my Bluesound devices last night.

 

I'll test it on my Node and PowerNode tonight. I have the 1st Gen Node N100 and PowerNode N150 by the way. Hopefully, Amazon and Bluesound will update the UI soon

Thanks, but if you are using the built-in DAC there is no indication on the app except the “HR” in a circle for “Ultra HD”. I can monitor the stream’s resolution via the display on my external DAC being fed from the Node 2i over S/PDIF and it looks like the BluOS software is limiting output over S/PDIF to 96kHz from Amazon sources even if the track is 192kHz.

 

At the other end of the spectrum, the iOS app is upscaling and downscaling everything to match the highest capability of an external USB DAC (attached with Lightning-to-USB3 connector). So for a DAC that supports 96kHz max (Dragon Fly Cobalt), the LED on the DFC indicates it is receiving max res even if the song is only CD quality 44.1 on Amazon; conversly, 192kHz Amazon-sourced content plays at 96kHz on the same DAC. With a DAC that supports 192Khz max, I was getting all music played from the Amazon app upscaled to 192kHz (even an old purchased album in my Amazon library in MP3). I guess it is behaving like the desktop apps and not auto switching, but instead of using a manually-set operating-system setting it is using the max sampling rate reported by the USB-DAC.

[Gus141]

19 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

 

anyone have an MQA DAC to test the content from 2L. 2L delivers MQA to Qobuz whether they want it or not. 

 

This looks strange 24/48. This content is usually at much higher sample rates if left native. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I’ll give that track a try later when I’m home (I have to hook up my Oppo 205 via USB to my Macbook to check).

 

Your DFC is MQA capable. Do you get a green LED for 44.1, a blue LED for 48, or a Light Blue for max capable SR of 96kHz (the old manual said Magenta was for 96kHz but that was changed as you probably know because it was too close to the Purple they chose for MQA). Speaking of which, does that 2L track light up the MQA-purple light on the DFC? 

[Gus141]

1 minute ago, miguelito said:

 

Ok, I guess you’re answering my question above!  Very surprised the Amazon app would do this as that would have an impact on battery life, and I would have expected Amazon to try and minimize any possible drawback of the new service/app.

Another weird thing is the “Currently Playing at” reported resolution/SR is not what is being shown on the external DAC. Again the external DAC (for USB DACs connected to the iOS app via CCK) is always showing it’s receiving max-supported kHz. For example, a track that is shown as “HD”, when I click to find out the info I get:

Track Quality: 16 bit / 44.1 kHz

Device Capability: 24 bit / 192 kHz

Currently playing at: 16 bit / 44.1 kHz

but...my DAC shows it is receiving 192kHz. I don’t get it.

[Gus141]

13 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

 

anyone have an MQA DAC to test the content from 2L. 2L delivers MQA to Qobuz whether they want it or not. 

 

This looks strange 24/48. This content is usually at much higher sample rates if left native. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Chris:

 

I connected Macbook Pro via USB to Oppo 205 (with Oppo firmware that supports full MQA decode & render over USB, and updated USB driver per Oppo instructions, etc.)

 

When I set the MacOs “Audio MIDI Setup” app to 48kHz I get the following for the 2L track you referenced (played from Amazon Music desktop app):

 

Track Quality : 24 bit / 48 kHz

Device Capability: 24 bit / 48 kHz

Currently playing at: 24 bit / 48 kHz

No indication MQA was being received/decoded/rendered.

 

Sounded great by the way.

 

I don’t know if that helps, but I said I would try it out.

Cheers

[Gus141]

Another BluOS issue maybe: 

Music on Amazon Music labeled as “Ultra HD” with a “Track Quality” of 24 bit / 44.1 kHz played through Bluesound Node 2i-(S/PDIF Coax)->RME ADI-2 DAC shows on the RME display as only 16 bit.

 

Per the RME manual: “The Bit column shows the amount of bits found in the SPDIF audio signal. Note that a 24 bit signal that is shown as 16 bit is indeed 16 bit, but a signal shown as 24 bit might contain only 16 bit real audio plus 8 bits of noise…”

 

So RME is pretty confident I’m only getting 16 bits from a 24-bit “Ultra HD” track.

 

This only happens with Ultra HD tracks that are 24/44.1 (couldn’t find any 24/48 to try yet). Higher SR Ultra HD tracks (24/96, 24/192) show 24 bits.

 

So what is happening with 24/44.1 “Ultra HD”? Is Amazon sending 16/44.1 even tough saying it’s Ultra HD at 24/44.1; or, is the Node 2i striping the last 8 least-significant bits; or, is the RME misinterpreting the S/PDIF stream?

 

Anyone else with a DAC connected to Amazon Music that has a bit-depth display for S/PDIF? USB connections don’t usually display bit depth, just SR.

 

A couple of tracks that show this to try for yourselves (make sure to select the Ultra HD versions):

You Say, by Lauren Daigle

Bad Liar, by Imagine Dragons

If You’re Gonna Lie, by FLETCHER

Born Without a Heart, by Faouzia

 

Cheers

Gus

 

[Gus141]

8 minutes ago, MikeyFresh said:

Qobuz yes... Tidal a decided no, due to their MQA attached at the hip status. F MQA.

Agree. Keeping Qobuz; I like supporting this audiophile-centric service. But, I’m trying to ditch TIDAL for Amazon Music because of MQA. Love Qobuz, but the catalogue is too small, so I still need another service. Amazon’s catalogue seems as big as TIDAL’s but their app experience and UI is not there yet. I hope it matures, but considering their Prime Video apps...who knows.

 

Plus, I rely on a quality mobile solution. I have a lot of portable DACs and I listen to a lot of music on my mobile iOS devices with good wired headphones. Qobuz is bit-perfect. I like seeing how they report the bit/SR quality for a song and then my external portable DAC confirms the same quality either with LEDs or a display. TIDAL’s MQA support had me selecting CD-quality over MQA so that I didn’t need an MQA-capable DAC,

 

Now here comes Amazon Music HD, and I was hoping this was my solution to a big catalogue with great search and bit-perfect high-res music to my external DAC out of iOS devices. But this isn’t working as I hoped: bit-perfect output is a no-go on iPhones and iPads; the Amazon Music app upsamples everything to the max-supported sampling rate of the external DAC connected to an iOS device (I’m not talking Windows or Mac desktop issues here). Try it for yourself: connect any USB DAC to an iOS device (iPad or iPhone) with a Lightning-to-USB3 adapter or CCK to a DAC that shows the sampling rate received. It will indicate it is receiving a stream at the DAC’s highest-supported SR even if playing a lower-res stream. Not cool Amazon. I even tried with a non-portable device: I connected my RME ADI-2 DAC to the iPAD and it received *everything* from the iOS Amazon Music app at 24/192 according to its display.

 

[Gus141]

57 minutes ago, PAR said:

However,as a corollary I haven't found any 24/44.1 files from Qobuz that display as 16 bit when played.

Me neither. I just played 6 songs on Qobuz listed as 24/44.1 (to include the 4 songs I mentioned in post #237) via Node 2i and they show as 24 bit.

[Gus141]

5 minutes ago, Jud said:

Rendu will receive over Shairport, no rewrite necessary, though I don't know what the resolution limits of the protocol may be if any.
 

Roon you're correct.

@Melvin said in the Sonore microRendu thread on the sponsor forum: “I'm listening now using Shairport on the mRendu streamed from my iPad. Of course it's limited to 16/44.1 but it sounds pretty damn good. “

 

Haven’t tested it myself.

[Gus141]

31 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

I found a way to get 24/44.1 to play via Amazon at 24 bit through BluOS. You have to first play a 24/96 or 192 track, then the 24/44.1 and the bit depth will remain at 24. I can reproduce it 100% of the time. Via Qobuz, not issues at all. 

 

I sent the issue on to Bluesound. 

I got excited when I read this because that wouldn’t be too bad of a workaround; however, it didn’t work for me. I tried at least 10 times going from 24/96- and 24/192-based songs to 24/44.1-based ones. Every time I switched to the 24/44.1 song the bit depth dropped to 16. I made sure to check that they weren’t “HD” (native 16/44.1) files. Nope, all 24/44.1.

 

Since your DAC is working, I’ll bet my RME ADI-2 DAC is the culprit. But what I don’t understand is that I have no issues with Qobuz showing the wrong bit depth for 24/44.1.

 

Anecdotally, this isn’t the first time I’ve seen something like this though. A file I purchased from Qobuz at 24/96kHz shows up as 16/96kHz on the DAC. And, a while back when I was messing around with mConnect DLNA control of TIDAL to an Oppo 205, with the Oppo doing the first unfold of MQA and passing the SR-doubled result out (S/PDIF) to the RME ADI-2 DAC, the result was shown as 16 bit at times (a firmware update made that less frequent). But that anecdote does make me wonder if the BluOS is manipulating 24/44.1 in a similar way the Oppo was messing with the digital stream.

 

Thanks for working this with your contacts at Bluesound.

Cheers,

Gus

[Gus141]

Yes, there are edge cases. I’m lucky to be on the other edge: I have had great support the three times I have asked for assistance with Qobuz support.

 

As for Amazon Music HD (AMHD): I can’t help thinking they could be the last man standing. I’m replicating my favorite TIDAL and Qobuz playlists on AMHD anticipating the long game, but playing music on Qobuz & TIDAL and not AMHD until they fix:

—their desktop app exclusive mode capability

—BluOS shows 24/44.1 playing as 24bit and not 16bit

—iOS external DACs passed pit-perfect audio and not upsampled audio

 

EDIT: oh, I would love if the Amazon Music apps would support generic DLNA/UPnP; but, that’s probably asking too much.