Hqplayer: best NAA with best sound quality

[Miska]

5 hours ago, ambre said:

I cannot find at all? All dated 2020? or 23-02 2021

 

4.1.2 is there already, released in Feb 23.

 

5 hours ago, ambre said:

 

This is the place for NAA OS images, check again, refresh the index in browser.

 

[AudioDoctor]

12 minutes ago, Miska said:

 

These two are from different servers, signalyst.com vs signalyst.eu

 

Very interesting. Does signalyst.eu pull the file from the eu server? I tried it just now, and while faster, still nowhere near as fast as using wget.

[ambre]

1 hour ago, Miska said:

 

4.1.2 is there already, released in Feb 23.

 

 

This is the place for NAA OS images, check again, refresh the index in browser.

 

Only the naa-412-x64.7z' is updated not the Mac_Os ?

[Miska]

3 hours ago, ambre said:

Only the naa-412-x64.7z' is updated not the Mac_Os ?

 

Yes, no changes in the NAA software, just the OS got updated.

 

[Miska]

5 hours ago, AudioDoctor said:

Very interesting. Does signalyst.eu pull the file from the eu server? I tried it just now, and while faster, still nowhere near as fast as using wget.

 

Both are located in EU, but on different internet connection and server. If browser is slower than wget on the same URL then the problem is either in the browser or computer's network connection.

 

[ambre]

5 hours ago, Miska said:

 

Both are located in EU, but on different internet connection and server. If browser is slower than wget on the same URL then the problem is either in the browser or computer's network connection.

 

[ambre]

15 minutes ago, ambre said:

No again much more 

[ambre]

1 hour ago, ambre said:

 naa-412-x64.7z

This naa-412-x64.7z isn't working on  my X5-Z8350 HD. Pas. download took 1,5 hours!

 

it hangs after starting please below screenshots of starting NAA. Network cable in. Chord Qutest connected by usb-cable. The same issue with latest NAA X64 drivers but the oder version of 2020 works ....HOW CAN??

 

 

 

 

 

😳

[Miska]

3 hours ago, ambre said:

This naa-412-x64.7z isn't working on  my X5-Z8350 HD. Pas. download took 1,5 hours!

 

Interesting result for my 500 Mbps internet connection...

 

3 hours ago, ambre said:

it hangs after starting please below screenshots of starting NAA. Network cable in.

 

 

 

Here it says that the Realtek ethernet adapter doesn't have cable plugged in ("link is down") and keeps waiting to get IP from DHCP server.

 

[ambre]

Just now, Miska said:

 

Interesting result for my 500 Mbps internet connection...

NO FUEL I SUPPOSE

 

 

Here it says that the Realtek ethernet adapter doesn't have cable plugged in ("link is down") and keeps waiting to get IP from DHCP server.

 

Internet cable is in NOT KIDDING.

 

[ambre]

19 minutes ago, ambre said:

Internet cable is in NOT KIDDING.

 

How can older X64 work properly? With same connection/cables switches and network.  

 

Not a very serious and stimulating approach from your side Jussi. Assuming that I don't have an internet connection or a cable connected!  Have already spent so many hours on  NAA Mac_Os X64  images that apparently work very differently or not.

 

Please investigate if you yourself may have made a mistake. Instead instantly sliding everything back... which is very easy and not helpful at all.

 

 

[Miska]

8 hours ago, ambre said:

How can older X64 work properly? With same connection/cables switches and network.  

 

I don't know, you can then use that instead? Likely common problem related to Realtek NICs, since apparently they are failing to submit proper driver updates to upstream Linux kernels and thus some of the NIC variants are not working with the kernel drivers.

 

You can try to install for example minimal Ubuntu Server 20.04 LTS or Fedora 33 Minimal (from Server installer) on your hardware and then networkaudiod package there. This way you get wider hardware support. I cannot provide same level of hardware support companies like Canonical and RedHat can who have many people working full time with hardware support and hardware manufacturers to make things work.

 

My OS images are provided as-is, they either work or they don't.

 

8 hours ago, ambre said:

Not a very serious and stimulating approach from your side Jussi. Assuming that I don't have an internet connection or a cable connected!

 

You can see yourself it says "enp1s0: Link is Down".

 

8 hours ago, ambre said:

Please investigate if you yourself may have made a mistake.

 

I cannot investigate hardware/driver issues on hardware I don't have... I've listed hardware I've tested things on.

 

8 hours ago, ambre said:

Have already spent so many hours on  NAA Mac_Os X64  images that apparently work very differently or not.

 

First of all, let's not mix NAA OS images and networkaudiod macOS binaries. Very hard to follow which one you are talking about at different times.

 

You have said yourself that your other DACs work fine on macOS? Just Auralic is broken? And they have stated (as you quoted) that their firmware has some deficiencies that require extra delays outside of USB Audio Class specification to make things work. So we can say that Auralic gear is not supported.

 

[ambre]

10 hours ago, Miska said:

You can try to install for example minimal Ubuntu Server 20.04 LTS or Fedora 33 Minimal (from Server installer) on your hardware and then networkaudiod package there. This way you get wider hardware support. I cannot provide same level of hardware support companies like Canonical and RedHat can who have many people working full time with hardware support and hardware manufacturers to make things work.

I don't have that skill set.

10 hours ago, Miska said:

1) You can see yourself it says "enp1s0: Link is Down".

 

2) First of all, let's not mix NAA OS images and networkaudiod macOS binaries. Very hard to follow which one you are talking about at different times.

 

3) You have said yourself that your other DACs work fine on macOS? Just Auralic is broken? And they have stated (as you quoted) that their firmware has some deficiencies that require extra delays outside of USB Audio Class specification to make things work. So we can say that Auralic gear is not supported.

 

1) I don't have that skill set. I am only capable to add ethernet-cables 😆

 

2) I have said several times that I have 2xNAA's ( Mini PC X64 and a Mac Mini)  with your distros that  partially work ( old X64 Mini PC) or not in combination with Auralic Vega 2.1 .

 

3) Correct summary but is saw that Chris C. Owner A_Style  was using HQ-player on a Altair a few months ago.

 

That was primary reason to give it a try.  But  I can add Chord and maybe another DAC  a short notice which I can connect to analogue input of the Vega?

 

But using again Direct Usb cable  in terms of clean usb-signal was not intended.

 

Will sent you a PM concerning what are the best NAA's  in terms of SQ and regular software updates based on your experiences.

 

Many thanks till so-far, Andreas

 

 

 

[dkdali]

I have read a few comments in different forum  posts about using a Innuos server as a NAA device. I cant find the original post anymore but i think it was @baconbrainwho wrote he really enjoyed that solution. I have a Zenith mk3 I really like and would love to upgrade to a premium NAA device😎👍

Is it running on one of @Miska’s hqp/linux images from a USB drive?

Can one of you please let me know how to do this?

[jabbr]

On 5/26/2021 at 4:51 PM, AudioDoctor said:

Very interesting. Does signalyst.eu pull the file from the eu server? I tried it just now, and while faster, still nowhere near as fast as using wget.

The internet is designed at its core to work much faster for people who use the command line ;) 

[baconbrain]

On 5/31/2021 at 12:29 AM, dkdali said:

I have read a few comments in different forum  posts about using a Innuos server as a NAA device. I cant find the original post anymore but i think it was @baconbrainwho wrote he really enjoyed that solution. I have a Zenith mk3 I really like and would love to upgrade to a premium NAA device😎👍

Is it running on one of @Miska’s hqp/linux images from a USB drive?

Can one of you please let me know how to do this?

@dkdali You can do this a couple of different ways depending on how your signal chain is setup. If you want to use the mk3 as a device solely running hqplayer, then booting from a usb memory card loaded with the hqp image is the easiest way to go. You will need to change the boot priority on the mk3 to do this, but it is pretty straightforward when you connect a monitor & keyboard directly to the mk3 and then change the boot order in bios. The second alternative is to run the mk3 as a roon core, or endpoint,  and ask Innuos Support to add the NAA demon to the linux image on the mk3. This also works very well if you already have hqplayer running on a seperate pc, but does have the limitation that you will not be able to update the Innuos OS on the mk3 without it overwriting the manually added NAA Demon. BB

[dkdali]

On 6/3/2021 at 9:14 PM, baconbrain said:

@dkdali You can do this a couple of different ways depending on how your signal chain is setup. If you want to use the mk3 as a device solely running hqplayer, then booting from a usb memory card loaded with the hqp image is the easiest way to go. You will need to change the boot priority on the mk3 to do this, but it is pretty straightforward when you connect a monitor & keyboard directly to the mk3 and then change the boot order in bios. The second alternative is to run the mk3 as a roon core, or endpoint,  and ask Innuos Support to add the NAA demon to the linux image on the mk3. This also works very well if you already have hqplayer running on a seperate pc, but does have the limitation that you will not be able to update the Innuos OS on the mk3 without it overwriting the manually added NAA Demon. BB

Thank you @baconbrainfor the details😎👍

I was not aware you could attach a monitor or keyboard to the Zenith. I will be trying to use the Zenith as a NAA with music from my ROCK/Roon server processed on my PC.

If this works as expected i will be looking in to building a DSD capable PC. Next gen AMD will have AVX-512 so hopefully the 5900/5950 replacement will be capable of best quality dsd512....

BTW NAA should be a standard option on any Innuos device!

[Miska]

There's now also "naa-4121-x64" image as well. It may work better on certain newer pieces of hardware.

 

[ted_b]

Jussi, et al,

Is there a situation where putting an NAA daemon on the SAME cpu as your HQPlayer (desktop or embedded) has benefit?  I see that Zaphod (PGGB author) is doing that, and I am stumped as to why he is getting better performance (fewer clicks, etc).  I'm not even sure how HQPlayer sees the NAA in this scenario, since there is no network involved. 

[Miska]

34 minutes ago, ted_b said:

Is there a situation where putting an NAA daemon on the SAME cpu as your HQPlayer (desktop or embedded) has benefit?  I see that Zaphod (PGGB author) is doing that, and I am stumped as to why he is getting better performance (fewer clicks, etc).  I'm not even sure how HQPlayer sees the NAA in this scenario, since there is no network involved. 

 

Not really, it just makes situation more complex. You get some additional buffers through network packet buffers, but OTOH some extra overhead for going through the protocol stacks for no reason. You can have both on the same machine, since then the machine just talks to itself over network stack. Generally if there is benefit in doing so, such as having effect on clicks or something like that, then there is something wrong with the system/setup in first place, since added overhead shouldn't be making things better.

 

[ted_b]

6 minutes ago, Miska said:

 

Not really, it just makes situation more complex. You get some additional buffers through network packet buffers, but OTOH some extra overhead for going through the protocol stacks for no reason. You can have both on the same machine, since then the machine just talks to itself over network stack. Generally if there is benefit in doing so, such as having effect on clicks or something like that, then there is something wrong with the system/setup in first place, since added overhead shouldn't be making things better.

 

That was my thinking as well, but both Zaphod (owner) and Larry (builder) are smart people, so not sure what is going on there. 

[baconbrain]

5 hours ago, dkdali said:

BTW NAA should be a standard option on any Innuos device!

 

Completely agree!

[Zauurx]

2 hours ago, Miska said:

 

Not really, it just makes situation more complex. You get some additional buffers through network packet buffers, but OTOH some extra overhead for going through the protocol stacks for no reason. You can have both on the same machine, since then the machine just talks to itself over network stack. Generally if there is benefit in doing so, such as having effect on clicks or something like that, then there is something wrong with the system/setup in first place, since added overhead shouldn't be making things better.

 

Yes, this is also the problem of having Roon and HQPlayer on the same machine, but it is also the advantage.
2 IP addresses (eth1 > Roon > HQP > eth2 > Allo USBridge via IPV6). No ? 

[Miska]

3 minutes ago, Zauurx said:

Yes, this is also the problem of having Roon and HQPlayer on the same machine, but it is also the advantage.
2 IP addresses (eth1 > Roon > HQP > eth2 > Allo USBridge via IPV6). No ? 

 

That will cause problems. I have everything on the same network, but Roon and HQPlayer always on separate machines. Some DACs with NAA and some without NAA. Then on Roon I select which HQPlayer server I want to use. Just one Roon core, but at least one HQPlayer server per room. So zone selection is still in Roon (when I use Roon in first place at all - rarely these days).

 

[Zauurx]

I agree, but with a single HQP server (+ Roon), it avoids possible network imperfections (cables, router, switch, power supply, etc between Roon Server and HQP server.) or those of the Roon server .
This does not prevent you from having other HQP machines managed by Roon.
But my configuration is justified by my wish to limit my system to one server (but of good quality - HDPlex ATX, etc)...

Occasionally I would try again with a nuc as a Roon server... to compare but believe me a single server with a JCat card (unbridged - "Roon in" and "HQP out") works very well.