Popular Post DuckToller Posted September 27, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted September 27, 2019 https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/sep/27/the-greta-thunberg-problem-so-many-men-freaking-out-about-the-tiny-swedish-climate-demon First dog on the moon knows it all 😉 semente and christopher3393 2 Link to comment
Popular Post DuckToller Posted September 27, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted September 27, 2019 48 minutes ago, esldude said: I think collectively at the time they did. I certainly don't think they were thinking, " you know we could trash the future environment making it easier on us. So let's do that. We don't care about our grandchildren.". Pls let me express my doubts on that theory. I think that scientists have had since along time calculations including long term effects, risks and costs of externalities for products like Nylon or HVAC, nuclear power and use of fossil ressources for energy deployment/production. But these are never (completely) included in business plans, as it is cheaper to push the framwork. This scenario is just about everywhere in the industry, weapons, chemicals, energy, pharmaceutics.You name it ... You don't pay lobbyists for leaving the legal framework on those subjects uncovered from your business interests. Just look at the Brumadinho dam desaster , where you can see, that accidents just happen. That's too bad ... Where a proper dealing with highly toxic waste wasn't conducted (obviously), and the consequences had been disatrous. Around 250 deaths and long term evironmental effects still not completely accounted for the region. And yes, it had a bad effect on Vale 's (the company owning the dam) stock price on short term, but that has nearly recovered as of July 19th. Only 6 month later. Isn't it ironic ? I think the coverage of this example is plain old school economics, you'll find that entrepreneurial spirit still everywhere where a lot of money is to be made in industrial operations, and that is the reason why I disagree. If you make business decisions, you just make sure that your grand children are not to close to your production line or the waste dumps. That's it. Tom Fluffytime and Teresa 1 1 Link to comment
DuckToller Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 @Racerxnet Wasn't it you who brought down the @sphinxsix thread idea about a musical reaction from Covidean times? Pls correct me if I remember wrongly. If I am correct, please behave better in this thread which has already 30 pages ... Tom Link to comment
Popular Post DuckToller Posted November 24, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 24, 2020 The time has come to say fair's fair To pay the rent now, to pay our share https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/24/midnight-oil-has-always-been-about-social-justice-the-earths-beauty-and-hope-through-action Midnight Oil have always been about social justice, the earth's beauty and hope through action sphinxsix, JediJoker and PYP 1 1 1 Link to comment
DuckToller Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 @Priaptor Happy to confirm your views form old leftist Europe ;-) If you import products,. you have exported their production waste to other countries/continents. If - as economist or politician - you close they eyes on that, you may not have read Ricardo ... Would you/we / Europe/USA achieve climate goals with 100% inbound production? I doubt it. Matter of lifestyle (though a cultural/individual problem ?), I'd say. And, perhaps, the strange idea about worldwide wealth distribution without losing wealth for the ones who are wealthy ... ? Especially a problem, when extreme weather impacts demand extreme measures. Though Boris can make funny Kermit lines about all that .. That's entertainment Cheers, DT sphinxsix 1 Link to comment
DuckToller Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 contributed that 2019 , Summerbreeze ... .. " What importance does the weather (or change of climatic conditions) have for us audiophiles, you may like to ask? We have power conditioners, linear power supplies, solid state amplification and power hungry transducer, just because we can and we want to! ... And if there has been a wise SO, our system is accompanied by a nearly noiseless AC in our condo. Albeit, you are lucky ... Here in France, we usually have to deal with limitations in the grid, because some of the nuclear plant's reactors have been proven less resistant against overheating as expertly expected and thus have the need to be shut down more often for grace periods during the summer. I've noticed that ain't different in Germany and Belgium. Given that obvious vulnerability in European power resources which came to light, some people wonder why the French Nuclear Power lobby had successfully dichotomized the once so promising DESERTEC project during the last decade: Solar and Wind power for the European markets originated in the Sahara? As an Audiophile, I really appreciate the idea of regenerative clean power from sustainable energy sources, even more, if the system is able to improve energy supply to North Africa and the Sub-Saharan regions!!! Who would imagine that shareholders, for example of Siemens, GE, Trane and Goodman, or other companies that profiteered from shareholder value proposition/generation based on cheap & limitless consummation of energy sources for cooling aids, would stand up with their accumulated wealth to take on responsibility for environmental issues evolving as a consequence of these profits? I'd reckon, they would rather pay their advocates to prevent them of the obligation than to support victims of the existing/coming climate change. In short, there were billions of wealth made for investors and companies with engineering, manufacturing, installing and supplying HVAC systems, not only in the USA, but the environmental costs externalities, social & opportunity costs related to their economic success are usually distributed to the public budget. Which nowadays is forced to invest into a "big, beautiful wall" rather than support climate change prevention. It is not only a European problem alone, that available knowledge and wisdom haven't been used sufficiently to avoid a crisis that can't be controlled by state forces or conglomerates. In an age of denial, watercraft & wind energy nowadays are often criticized by their environmental impact and the unbearable costs of the future deconstruction. This argument didn't stop past decisions to build fossil fueled or nuclear power plants and gas & oil drilling platforms. It's 2019, the year when SHELL is using the uncertainty about Brexit to circumvent European legislation in order to back away from the formerly planned environment respecting deconstruction of its outdated oil-drilling platforms in the North Sea. Leaving an "estimated 11,000 tonnes of raw oil and toxins remaining" within the Brent oilfield between the Shetlands and Norway's west coast, as its removal would be "too costly and risky". Elsewhere in the USA, Floridians still believe it is God's will to get plagued by hurricanes, which are growing more destructive every year. You may wonder, if the long time denial of climate change and the discombobulating treatment of the science and scientists behind its explanation, has led people to believe, it's consequence is now an inescapable doom. And can no longer be reversed by human action and decisions or, for example, by executing the idea of re-size & de-growth . "... any serious proposals to change our lifestyles – cutting down on driving, flying or imported avocados – are considered “beyond the pale, heretic, almost insane”. This is especially true of air conditioning, where calls to use it less are frequently treated as suggestions that people should die in heat waves, or evidence of a malicious desire to deny other people the same comforts that citizens in wealthy countries already enjoy" (The Guardian,2019) As a counter argument often the low-efficiency use of energy for heating during the wintertime in old cities like Minneaopolis appears valid, as long as you do not put it into perspective. Although my family uses only ventilation in-house, nonetheless, I do not condemn air conditioning, overall. It has enormous positive effects on wellbeing and productivity in several countries, including the USA. In my personal conviction, this much desired effect of local cooling just unfortunately (too often) delivers an irreversible effect on global heating, with exceptions granted for cooling systems run by sustainable power generation. Still, the penetration of AC usage in European households north of the Mediterranean Sea is at about quarter compared to data from the US, and it differs a lot between the south and the north. Especially Germany and its neighbors having been traditionally outspoken critics of personal use of air conditioning, while the northern countries have nearly no usability scenario for AC. This is the cultural background for my personal assessment. Another point is to review the impact it has on our resources and climate change. I fully advocate solutions that would be as close as possible to a net zero carbon footprint." Link to comment
DuckToller Posted September 27, 2021 Share Posted September 27, 2021 1 hour ago, semente said: Interesting results. The Greens, which were touted as the winners some 6 months ago, ended up third but got most votes in half of Berlin's constituencies, Frankfurt, Bonn, Stuttgard, Munich, Heidelberg... Apparently voting outside of the 2 main parties is still predominantly an urbanite thing (small Heidelberg is a university/research town so it was to be expected), except for east-southeast Germany which is predominantly far-right leaning, with a massive >30% of the votes around Dresden. The good news is that looks as though the far-right is on the decline in the west and south (old FDR). https://www.theguardian.com/world/ng-interactive/2021/sep/26/german-election-results-exit-poll-and-possible-coalitions The interesting thing with that result remains that the parties which are Nr.3 & 4 by result, are prone to be decider for the new chancellor. The losers (Conervatives, only 2nd) may still reign under that condition. It might be worth to note, that the tendency to far right votes in the "new" regions (integrated/founded after 1989) are profundly rooted in the disappointment of the people in the old "democratic" parties, who are blamed for the misery in living conditions for many living in these regions. As a matter of fact, the majority of the former "East Germany" residents haven't (by far) profited alike from the German prosperity during the last 30 years as their Western brothers and sisters; or arriving for the West German companies that ramshackled the remains of industrial estates in the east. I still think it's worth to be explained / indicated, but it is not (imho) a proper reasoning for their tendencies. I got a call from my friend yesterday, who is Liberal party politics activist somwhere close to Frankfurt and succeeded with a 20% vote in a 15k village near Frankfurt (prosperity belt). She was actually in the Nord for holidays, close to Denmark, in a small village where the Liberals even have the mayor and a 34 % voting. Problems felt there are vastly different from East Germany or the big cities. As a matter of fact, Germany's 2 big established parties (CDU/SPD) have had in 2002 about 77% of all votes, while in 2021 they dipped well below 50% of votes. This may be read as a strong vote against the long term great coalition Germany has had under Madame Merkel. Anothe point to note is that established parties cannot any longer intergrated the bordeline democrats at the right and left wings of the rally. Nearly 25 % of voters dedicated their votes to parties outside the core of the established democratic system. From the ecologist standpoint, strategic partnerships between Greens and Liberals are very bad news, in my pov. It is more about importance and influence for the parties after years in opposition, rather than focussing on the important isuues that need to be addressed. YMMV .. Link to comment
DuckToller Posted September 27, 2021 Share Posted September 27, 2021 Here is a disturbing quote from "The Spiegel" this morning: "During Angela Merkel's 16 years as chancellor, the CDU/CSU had "taken a fatal left turn" and was now, for the first time in a long time, not the strongest party. "The Federal Executive Committee has supported this course and shares responsibility for the current election debacle," it said. If the CDU/CSU were to enter into coalition negotiations with other parties, the Values Union (Werteunion - ultra conservative part of CDU) would demand the formation of a government without the participation of the Greens." This is the logic of neanderthal conservatives if they lose to the right AND the left/moderate, because they have nothing more to offer... Link to comment
DuckToller Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 On 9/24/2021 at 5:13 PM, DuckToller said: contributed that 2019 , Summerbreeze ... .. " What importance does the weather (or change of climatic conditions) have for us audiophiles, you may like to ask? We have power conditioners, linear power supplies, solid state amplification and power hungry transducer, just because we can and we want to! ... And if there has been a wise SO, our system is accompanied by a nearly noiseless AC in our condo. Albeit, you are lucky ... Here in France, we usually have to deal with limitations in the grid, because some of the nuclear plant's reactors have been proven less resistant against overheating as expertly expected and thus have the need to be shut down more often for grace periods during the summer. I've noticed that ain't different in Germany and Belgium. Given that obvious vulnerability in European power resources which came to light, some people wonder why the French Nuclear Power lobby had successfully dichotomized the once so promising DESERTEC project during the last decade: Solar and Wind power for the European markets originated in the Sahara? As an Audiophile, I really appreciate the idea of regenerative clean power from sustainable energy sources, even more, if the system is able to improve energy supply to North Africa and the Sub-Saharan regions!!! Who would imagine that shareholders, for example of Siemens, GE, Trane and Goodman, or other companies that profiteered from shareholder value proposition/generation based on cheap & limitless consummation of energy sources for cooling aids, would stand up with their accumulated wealth to take on responsibility for environmental issues evolving as a consequence of these profits? I'd reckon, they would rather pay their advocates to prevent them of the obligation than to support victims of the existing/coming climate change. In short, there were billions of wealth made for investors and companies with engineering, manufacturing, installing and supplying HVAC systems, not only in the USA, but the environmental costs externalities, social & opportunity costs related to their economic success are usually distributed to the public budget. Which nowadays is forced to invest into a "big, beautiful wall" rather than support climate change prevention. It is not only a European problem alone, that available knowledge and wisdom haven't been used sufficiently to avoid a crisis that can't be controlled by state forces or conglomerates. In an age of denial, watercraft & wind energy nowadays are often criticized by their environmental impact and the unbearable costs of the future deconstruction. This argument didn't stop past decisions to build fossil fueled or nuclear power plants and gas & oil drilling platforms. It's 2019, the year when SHELL is using the uncertainty about Brexit to circumvent European legislation in order to back away from the formerly planned environment respecting deconstruction of its outdated oil-drilling platforms in the North Sea. Leaving an "estimated 11,000 tonnes of raw oil and toxins remaining" within the Brent oilfield between the Shetlands and Norway's west coast, as its removal would be "too costly and risky". Elsewhere in the USA, Floridians still believe it is God's will to get plagued by hurricanes, which are growing more destructive every year. You may wonder, if the long time denial of climate change and the discombobulating treatment of the science and scientists behind its explanation, has led people to believe, it's consequence is now an inescapable doom. And can no longer be reversed by human action and decisions or, for example, by executing the idea of re-size & de-growth . "... any serious proposals to change our lifestyles – cutting down on driving, flying or imported avocados – are considered “beyond the pale, heretic, almost insane”. This is especially true of air conditioning, where calls to use it less are frequently treated as suggestions that people should die in heat waves, or evidence of a malicious desire to deny other people the same comforts that citizens in wealthy countries already enjoy" (The Guardian,2019) As a counter argument often the low-efficiency use of energy for heating during the wintertime in old cities like Minneaopolis appears valid, as long as you do not put it into perspective. Although my family uses only ventilation in-house, nonetheless, I do not condemn air conditioning, overall. It has enormous positive effects on wellbeing and productivity in several countries, including the USA. In my personal conviction, this much desired effect of local cooling just unfortunately (too often) delivers an irreversible effect on global heating, with exceptions granted for cooling systems run by sustainable power generation. Still, the penetration of AC usage in European households north of the Mediterranean Sea is at about quarter compared to data from the US, and it differs a lot between the south and the north. Especially Germany and its neighbors having been traditionally outspoken critics of personal use of air conditioning, while the northern countries have nearly no usability scenario for AC. This is the cultural background for my personal assessment. Another point is to review the impact it has on our resources and climate change. I fully advocate solutions that would be as close as possible to a net zero carbon footprint." https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/oct/09/fossil-fuel-companies-law-firms? Greenlighting Fossil fuel companies paying top law firms millions to ‘dodge responsibility’ semente 1 Link to comment
DuckToller Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 18 minutes ago, sphinxsix said: I didn't always think so, except for my late teens when I felt lots of sympathy for the idea of anarchosyndicalism Better late than NEVER only in the late teens ... Link to comment
DuckToller Posted October 24, 2021 Share Posted October 24, 2021 3 hours ago, semente said: The US system looks, to my European eyes, like little more than a modernised version of what I remember seeing in cowboys films growing up, the lawless Wild West. The political system was designed to keep rich white men in power and to favour the interests of the few over the needs and wellbeing of the many. It's undemocratic, unequal and unfair. Such a system, steered solely by greedy commercial interest, has little chance of addressing the climate issue which requires a completely change in paradigm: on the one hand infinite growth is not sustainable, and on the other assymetries in wealth distribution will have a massive disproportionate impact on the population with the poorest getting hit the hardest by the measures needed to control heating and waste, and those who profited from destroying the planet will go through the change almost unsacthed. THIS, exactly describes my 'typical European" perception problem with "American" - often "Libertarian" - Conservatism. Any discussion about that is prone to be shattered by the cultural divide, as we write the same words but they have different meanings to us, depending on geography. Link to comment
DuckToller Posted October 26, 2021 Share Posted October 26, 2021 4 hours ago, PYP said: Would need a separate thread to discuss the politicization of religion and religious nationalism. As well one to reflect on the worldwide green impact of US economic growth drivers like Haliburton or Lockheed.. . 19 trillion $$$ since 2001 ... Did they invest their lobbying budget as well for the ecological footprint of mass destruction??? Just asking for a dead friend.. . Link to comment
Popular Post DuckToller Posted November 11, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted November 11, 2021 In case someone missed it ... Ballad (Sullivan) 1986 When they look back at us and they write down their history What will they say about our generation? We're the ones who knew everything and still we did nothing Harvested everything, planted nothing. Well we live pretty well in the wake of the goldrush Floating in comfort on waves of our apathy Quietly gnawing away at Her body Until we mortgage the future, bury our children Storehouses full with the fruits we've been given We send off the scrag-ends to suckle the starving But still we can't feed this strange hunger inside Greedy, restless and unsatisfied. I was never much one for the great "Big Bang" theory Going out in a blaze of suicidal glory Not foolish and brave, these leaders of ours Just stupid and petty, unworthy of power; Just a little leak here and a small error there Another square mile poisoned forever A series of sad and pathetic little fizzles And out go the lights, never to return. The affair it is over, the passion is dead She stares at us now with ice in Her eyes But we turn away from these bitter reproaches And take up distractions to forget what we're doing I stand on these hills and I watch Her at night A thousands square miles, a million orange lights Wounded and scarred, She lies silent in pain Raped and betrayed in the cold acid rain And I wish and I wish We could start over again Yes I wish and I wish We could win back Her love once again semente and sphinxsix 2 Link to comment
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