Jud Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 40 minutes ago, Superdad said: 0402 size parts are really a pain to hand place and solder. Unless you like to spend all day with you face on a microscope. For prototyping (not large production), clever folks built their own pick-and-place machine. Couple with a small vapor-phase reflow oven it makes for beautiful boards. I've got a small hereditary tremor in my right (dominant) hand, so if something like these ever became inexpensive, it would be the saving of any ambitions I have to DIY in retirement. activist38 1 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Popular Post Jud Posted April 10, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 10, 2019 9 hours ago, activist38 said: so you discrediting his products? Not sure how saying I'd like to have a pick and place machine to allow me to enjoy DIY in retirement can be interpreted as any sort of hostility to PB's products. Does he seem to make a bit of a fetish about not using surface mount components? Yes. Have at least two people I know are skilled at product design, barrows and Superdad, said there are surface mount products that work as well as or better than through-hole products? Yes. Does this mean PB's products can't work well for the price? No. Does it mean that "No surface mount products anywhere" is marketing rather than necessarily an indication of better quality? Yep. activist38 and crenca 1 1 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 13 minutes ago, jabbr said: Wise @Jud likened this place ideally as like a pub. We are all sitting here enjoying our ales, and you’ve come in telling us about a new type of hops you’ve found. We are chatting about the best ways to grow hops. We talk about hops and different ales on a nightly basis. Some of us grow our own hops for ourselves, others sell the hops they grow, and others just want to drink. If that’s not of interest to you, we can continue our discussions amongst ourselves ... Nice extension of the analogy, but with the apparent liberal use of the ignore list, he may never see it. activist38 1 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Popular Post Jud Posted April 10, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 10, 2019 Just now, mansr said: Paul claimed that through-hole parts are easier to replace than surface-mount. I know from experience that this is bullshit. It's that simple. And thus you ensure that no one who might learn something from you will pay any attention. "I haven't found that to be so in my experience, though I haven't built audio pieces for customers commercially [assuming the latter is true]. I've found surface mount parts pretty easy to replace using [description of method/tools/procedure]." Then PB can have a dialog with you about whether he has ever tried the same method or tool, why he chooses not to, or say "I hadn't been aware of that; thank you, I'll look into it." @Neverfinished0, I wanted to mention that Chris likes people who sell commercially to have their industry affiliation/business in their member title (which you can change by going into your user profile and editing it). Thanks, and looking forward to hearing from you here. activist38, daverich4 and The Computer Audiophile 1 2 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Popular Post Jud Posted April 11, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 11, 2019 6 minutes ago, mansr said: Through-hole parts are always harder to remove without damaging the PCB. That's really not debatable. Heavy, high-power parts are always tricky, but that's beside the point. As for sourcing parts, the easiest to find is going to be whatever is made (and thus sold) the most. With few exceptions, that's going to the the surface-mount variant. In many cases, there isn't even a through-hole version. Parts should be chosen based on performance and price, not irrelevant properties like mounting method. Refusal to use surface-mount parts can only lead to worse performance, higher cost, or both. That's *almost* a discussion. Good job! 😁 The Computer Audiophile, Lebouwsky, activist38 and 1 other 4 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 11, 2019 Share Posted April 11, 2019 21 minutes ago, 4est said: Oh come on. If you aren't experienced enough to know how to remove a through hole part, you probably haven't had to fix much gear. SMD work requires much more precision and prep. As to the parts, here we are talking about resistors, filter caps and some ICs. I likely could get any through hole part here in town today at the local counter. By the way - in the States, what *is* "the local counter" for a hobbyist now that Radio Shack is gone? One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 11, 2019 Share Posted April 11, 2019 Don't see anything in the nearest large city that has "other than mundane parts," as Alex puts it, but then I don't do enough DIY to be that sophisticated in my search. Anyway, please forgive the OT. activist38 1 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 11, 2019 Share Posted April 11, 2019 6 hours ago, activist38 said: I apologise. I have clearly misunderstood your communication. Not heard of "pick and place machine"? Superdad had a photo of it in a post in this thread. It’s a machine that you can program to pick up small surface mount parts from a tape and place them in the appropriate spots on a circuit board. These (at some expense) are available to the home hobbyist/prototyper/small manufacturer. Because I have just enough of a hereditary tremor in my dominant hand not to be able to do fine soldering work (as mansr put it, my hands are “insufficiently resolving”), something like that (hopefully less expensive by then) would allow me to pursue an interest in DIY when I retire in a couple of years. activist38 1 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Popular Post Jud Posted April 11, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 11, 2019 5 hours ago, activist38 said: take a look at this one: https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/56127-lpsu-choices-new-contender/?do=findComment&comment=947698 ...could this be libellous perhaps? I'm an attorney by profession. The amateur version isn't what I come to an audio website for. crenca and activist38 1 1 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 11, 2019 Share Posted April 11, 2019 Points for use of "fetid" in a sentence? 🙂 Would be nice if the manufacturer could come back to the thread (if he's not tired of the whole thing already) and have a chat along the lines @sandyk was asking about, rather than any more back and forth about extraneous stuff. activist38 1 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Popular Post Jud Posted April 11, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 11, 2019 3 minutes ago, jabbr said: resting the firearms and base of hands in the table, while using the fingers to manipulate the teasers. I know you meant forearms and tweezers, but this version sounds more interesting! 4est, jabbr, Hugo9000 and 1 other 1 3 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 11, 2019 Share Posted April 11, 2019 14 minutes ago, Shadders said: Hi, I solder surface mount using a cheap stereo microscope - £200 from a UK supplier. I use the smallest components that are possible given the design power requirements etc. Here is a picture of a 24bit R2R DAC i built using 0603 surface mount resistors. As others have said, i use the corner of the hand to pivot to obtain the relevant precision and stability. Regards, Shadders. Very nice work. With this type of tremor, as @jabbr knows but others might not, it's a little more complex than just bracing. This tremor is what's called "postural," which means that having the hand in certain positions triggers it. Bracing would be helpful (and thanks for the idea), but I'd also need to try to ensure that my hand, wrist and forearm aren't in a bad position (one that triggers tremors) during soldering. One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 11, 2019 Share Posted April 11, 2019 19 minutes ago, crenca said: 40 posts in and already a civility screed. Paul R has some competition... From which we've managed to get things back to chatting about audio, for a while at least. activist38 1 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Popular Post Jud Posted April 12, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 12, 2019 2 hours ago, marce said: Instead of spitting your dummy out of the pram, why not answer some of the points, it would gain more respect for your products... This entire thread was worth it just to read the expression "spitting your dummy out of the pram." daverich4, jabbr, Superdad and 3 others 2 4 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Popular Post Jud Posted April 16, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 16, 2019 11 minutes ago, Tomslin said: A hint for you can be; don't trust people who claim they know and understand better than you do 😉 Since he designs circuit boards for mission critical digital equipment for a living, perhaps he has developed some sense of who to trust with regard to particular aspects of battery power supply design. 4est and Superdad 2 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 16, 2019 Share Posted April 16, 2019 1 hour ago, marce said: Cheers Jud. Not just battery supplies, I started a list of all power supplies I have worked on, lots over the years, from 35kV supplies down to low current on board LDO's, SMPS's, LPS's, supplies with batteries and integral chargers... supplies with big batteries, little batteries, invertors, lots of interesting stuff, always remember the first mainframe supplies, emitter coupled 2n3055 by their hundreds in a 1U tray to get the current, the good old days. LOL Oh I know. But the other fellow was talking specifically about battery supplies, so I thought I ought to talk about that as well. One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Popular Post Jud Posted April 17, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 17, 2019 42 minutes ago, Ralf11 said: how many dB down is Johnson noise? My Johnson goes pretty low. crenca and jabbr 2 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 19 minutes ago, sandyk said: Neither do I accept that just because you are a highly qualified E.E. that designs multi layer PCBs etc. means that your own home Audio system will necessarily sound as good as, or better than that of many other non electronically qualified members. Didn't see him claim it did. I know you've got plenty of LPSU/DIY knowledge. It would be nice for me personally and I'm sure others to get some tips regarding what components one might expect to see in a quality LPSU, if we're thinking of purchasing one. One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 We all might wish for a little more cross-fertilization. Would be interesting to see what marce thought of Pavel's implementation of Miska's DSC-1, for example, since that's hardware without proprietary IP in the way. One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 9 hours ago, sandyk said: Why not also ask members like John Swenson that question, as he has proven expertise in that area ? You could always start a thread and ask for contributions from both qualified and DIY members Already have a number of replies by him. He was an early popularizer of El Cheapo, then moved on to ultracap supplies, shunting noise from SMPSs to ground, and of course the supplies that bear his initials. I also used info he provided on this forum and others to avoid transformer ringing when I built a DAC. One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 In fact Miska has talked about the resistor matching problem with ladder DACs, one of the reasons his design isn't. One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Jud Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 2 hours ago, marce said: But while we argue over the number of angels on a pin head, Yeah, thus why I asked if you might have anything of interest to say about board layout, power component choices, etc., regarding Pavel's version of the DSC-1. It's a project of actual substance, and while not the only interesting one by a long shot, it has the advantage that there's no proprietary IP involved. One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
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