Forum Rules Suggestion

[The Computer Audiophile]

2 hours ago, mansr said:

Why don't you whiners just go and join SBAF or some other echo chamber?

You may be surprised to know the subjective and objective crowds are equally “whiners” as you call it. My inbox is full of messages from both groups who think the other is out of line. 

[mansr]

1 minute ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

You may be surprised to know the subjective and objective crowds are equally “whiners” as you call it. My inbox is full of messages from both groups who think the other is out of line. 

In this particular thread, the whining is pretty one-sided.

[Dutch]

16 minutes ago, manisandher said:

 

Don't be so rude. You have a problem with what he's saying, fine. Articulate your issue and leave it at that.

 

Mans has been over to my house, and I would have no hesitation in inviting him over again (but perhaps not for another ABX 😉.)

 

Mani.

 

You did notice, he just called (some of) us whiners?

 

Anyway, fair enough! I need to find something to spend 500 on I just recouped from selling a Lessloss power cable. That will be my next two hours life’s goal! 😁

[The Computer Audiophile]

2 minutes ago, mansr said:

In this particular thread, the whining is pretty one-sided.

One man’s whining is another’s rational complaint. 

[manisandher]

15 hours ago, mansr said:

I wasn't surprised in the slightest. As for being a cable god, from what I can tell, Galen held the title of Principal Engineer at Belden. In most companies, that's a level 3 or 4 title. Retiring at that level is decidedly unimpressive.

 

That's incredibly rude too. I know many middle-senior managers who decided not to progress because they loved what they did and knew they wouldn't be able to if they took their promotions.

 

You voiced your concerns about what @Galen was saying, so just leave it at that.

 

Mani.

[manisandher]

2 minutes ago, Dutch said:

You did notice, he just called (some of) us whiners?

 

Yep, and that's unfortunate.

 

2 minutes ago, Dutch said:

Anyway, fair enough! I need to find something to spend 500 on I just recouped from selling a Lessloss power cable. That will be my next two hours life’s goal! 😁

 

Ah consumerism to the rescue. Enjoy!

 

Mani.

[mav52]

6 minutes ago, manisandher said:

 

That's incredibly rude too. I know many middle-senior managers who decided not to progress because they loved what they did and knew they wouldn't be able to if they took their promotions.

 

You voiced your concerns about what @Galen was saying, so just leave it at that.

 

Mani.

 

After all that Principal Engineer at Belden. the avg salary is around $160 k,  not to bad. 

[mansr]

6 minutes ago, manisandher said:

Yep, and that's unfortunate.

How would you characterise it?

[kumakuma]

8 minutes ago, manisandher said:

 

I know many middle-senior managers who decided not to progress because they loved what they did and knew they wouldn't be able to if they took their promotions.

 

 

It's also possible that they knew about the Peter Principle...

[manisandher]

11 minutes ago, mansr said:

How would you characterise it?

 

In a word, frustration.

 

But I see this from both perspectives. When someone tells you that you cannot have an opinion unless you've heard their 'horse-hair covered, pure-gold conductor' interconnects in person, I can see why you (or anyone of a rational bent) would get frustrated. Conversely, when someone says that they hear differences between cables (that all cost the same modest amount) and are told that they must be imagining the differences, I can see why they get frustrated.

 

I've experienced both camps myself many times.

 

But there's still no excuse for being rude (something else I've been guilty of on occasion).

 

Mani.

[mansr]

4 minutes ago, manisandher said:

In a word, frustration.

 

But I see this from both perspectives. When someone tells you that you cannot have an opinion unless you've heard their 'horse-hair covered, pure-gold conductor' interconnects in person, I can see why you (or anyone of a rational bent) would get frustrated. Conversely, when someone says that they hear differences between cables (that all cost the same modest amount) and are told that they must be imagining the differences, I can see why they get frustrated.

 

I've experienced both camps myself many times.

 

But there's still no excuse for being rude (something else I've been guilty of on occasion).

You make a fair point. That said, do you think either frustration is cause to ban the expression of entire classes of opinion?

[mav52]

15 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

 

It's also possible that they knew about the Peter Principle...

 

The problem with that, is its all speculation, we will never know.

[manisandher]

13 minutes ago, mansr said:

You make a fair point. That said, do you think either frustration is cause to ban the expression of entire classes of opinion?

 

Absolutely not. I think some threads on AS already adopt the best approach:

 

19 hours ago, kumakuma said:

I think a better solution is for the person starting a thread to state in the first post what they consider acceptable behavior in that thread.

 

Mani.

[Paul R]

2 hours ago, mansr said:

Last time I checked, you didn't get to have final say on who is or isn't an audiophile. That's for GUTB to do.

 

What is a GUTB? Is it infectious? 

[pkane2001]

1 minute ago, Paul R said:

 

What is a GUTB? Is it infectious? 

 

Very. But thankfully seems to be in remission for now.

[Paul R]

33 minutes ago, mansr said:

You make a fair point. That said, do you think either frustration is cause to ban the expression of entire classes of opinion?

 

Not the expression of, no. The type and form of the expression? Absolutely. 

 

Every society has unwritten but very well know standards for behavior. The nasty cracks made from frustration, without humor or consideration, definitely are Not what this culture is all about. The political calculations designed to Trump someone do not belong here either. 

 

There are are better ways to express those frustrations, more effective ways even. They allow room for different people to get along. 

 

The better ways do have one drawback - they are slower, and require more dedication and thought. Not as much fun as ripping into “that asshole” over there because he said something stupid, or did not recognize how absolutely right a poster was. 

[Rt66indierock]

19 hours ago, lasker98 said:

We were lucky enough to have one of the top cable designers in the world actively participating and sharing here. I'm sure you wouldn't be surprised to find out he was driven off by the usual crew that knows so much more than he could ever hope to know.

 

Sorry but the top cable guys aren't in high end audio. If I need information about wire the first place I go is AT&T. For USB and Ethernet, I look up some old golfing buddies at Intel.

[manisandher]

1 minute ago, Rt66indierock said:

If I need information about wire the first place I go is AT&T. For USB and Ethernet, I look up some old golfing buddies at Intel.

 

And what experience do they have with cable for audio purposes?

 

Mani.

[manisandher]

15 minutes ago, pkane2001 said:

 

Very. But thankfully seems to be in remission for now.

 

Cruel... but funny.

 

Mani.

[Rt66indierock]

Just now, manisandher said:

 

And what experience do they have with cable for audio purposes?

 

Mani.

 

Lots actually that's why I talk with them. 

[pkane2001]

5 minutes ago, manisandher said:

 

Cruel... but funny.

 

Mani.

 

I'd never say this if I had thought for one second that the Neurotypical One couldn't take it

 

[manisandher]

17 minutes ago, Rt66indierock said:

Sorry but the top cable guys aren't in high end audio.

 

Where's your evidence for this?

[mansr]

7 minutes ago, manisandher said:

Where's your evidence for this?

AudioQuest.

[Rt66indierock]

13 minutes ago, manisandher said:

 

Where's your evidence for this?

 

The problems, challenges and money are elsewhere. Can I remind you how small high end audio is just in audio?

 

 

[John Dyson]

1 hour ago, manisandher said:

 

That's incredibly rude too. I know many middle-senior managers who decided not to progress because they loved what they did and knew they wouldn't be able to if they took their promotions.

 

 

I VERY purposefully stayed an engineer.  As soon as you get into what Bell Labs called a 2nd level mgr, then it is a management job (someitmes there is some engineering -- but only in the pure research, not product side.)  I hated any kind of management, but loved engineering -- REAL, TRUE engineering and innovation, not just carbon copying designs.

It has been a bit of a blow, but I have historically  had times when I was paid well (I mean, VERY VERY well -- way beyond the typical salaries that one normally thinks of as an engineer), but I also worked hard and had a h*ll of a reputation.  (I had companies calling me just to get on their payroll -- crazy and in my opinion a little unethical on my part if I did it.)

Now, I am in total obscurity, and other than the financial differences, I rather like it.  Now I work on projects that I want to do -- sometimes will make money, but most of the time just trying to do good things.

Management is HIGHLY HIGHLY overrated, and the only real draw (other than compensation type emotional power issues) is that sometimes mgmt is the only way to attain substantially higher pay.

All I had (and still have) is my family that I grew up with, and need to enjoy something.  I don't want to hate my job, so that is why I am just a lowly engineer (who has attained very nice pay level --  probably more than most surgeons.)  Now, I am poor, living off of meager retirement (premature disability), and frankly -- very happy. (admittedly, sometimes frustrated -- it would be very nice to have a 10-12 core CPU, while seeing kids playing games on that kind of machine.  I am doing REAL projects -- but thems the breaks.)

 

John