Euphony OS w/Stylus player setup and issues thread

[davide256]

It looks like Stylus is assuming that play starts when it sends to the UPNP renderer.. there is a variable delay between when stylus starts the song “timer” bar and when play actually starts. What seems to be happening is that stylus jumps to next track without any allowance/check for that delay when the song timer finishes @Cebolla would you mind commenting on how does UPNP normally handshake to deal with renderer start delay?

[biosailor]

BTW, I am just now running Roon within Euphony on MacBook Air > Ethernet > Raspi 4B running VitOS > USB Devialet.

 

VitOS is an OS for Raspi 4 developed by Thunder Data Ltd. with a Roon brdge. Now THAT is good sound!!,

[ASRMichael]

7 hours ago, maxst67 said:

Any of you have suggestions to configure \ optimize the bios of the mobo (Gigabyte z390 Aorus mini Itx) to maximize performance with Euphony? Thanks so much

 

[davide256]

11 hours ago, davide256 said:

It looks like Stylus is assuming that play starts when it sends to the UPNP renderer.. there is a variable delay between when stylus starts the song “timer” bar and when play actually starts. What seems to be happening is that stylus jumps to next track without any allowance/check for that delay when the song timer finishes @Cebolla would you mind commenting on how does UPNP normally handshake to deal with renderer start delay?

I’ve found a workaround. Setting song position update to never allows songs to play completely with UPNP

[mdzaki]

Hi all....i have euphony installed on a fanless nuc5i5ryh that is connected to isoregen using curious usb cable and then to my brinkmann nyquest dac. i would like to get myself another nuc in order to build a dual pc . so that one nuc will be the server and the other the end point similar to summus server and endpoint.

my question is how do i connect the server and the endpoint together for the best sound quality ? usb? ethernet ?

 

regards,

 

Zaki 

[ASRMichael]

42 minutes ago, mdzaki said:

Hi all....i have euphony installed on a fanless nuc5i5ryh that is connected to isoregen using curious usb cable and then to my brinkmann nyquest dac. i would like to get myself another nuc in order to build a dual pc . so that one nuc will be the server and the other the end point similar to summus server and endpoint.

my question is how do i connect the server and the endpoint together for the best sound quality ? usb? ethernet ?

 

regards,

 

Zaki 

Ethernet for me. You’ll need two Euphony licenses for that. 

[mdzaki]

6 minutes ago, ASRMichael said:

Ethernet for me. You’ll need two Euphony licenses for that. 

thank you for your reply, could you send me a pic of your setup?

[ASRMichael]

1 hour ago, mdzaki said:

thank you for your reply, could you send me a pic of your setup?

Go to my profile & look at pdf. 

[biosailor]

5 hours ago, davide256 said:

I’ve found a workaround. Setting song position update to never allows songs to play completely with UPNP

Very good idea, I tried it and so far no problems in streaming to my Raspi. Well done! I keep looking into it.

[mdzaki]

22 minutes ago, ASRMichael said:

Go to my profile & look at pdf. 

thank you ...i dont see a dual pc setup 

[BCRich]

6 minutes ago, mdzaki said:

thank you ...i dont see a dual pc setup 

Look again....DB7 Streamer has Euphony installed and so does the HDPlex.

[ASRMichael]

I’m using my NUC currently as a NAS (Euphony SMB server). But two pc setup would be the same. 

[Speedy381]

• I have just had an odd experience; I have been using my NUC i7 with good RAM, Optane card running Euphony, powered by a Farad 3 PS. So a pretty well sorted front end, if not full exotic then decently middle range. My source up to now has been my library on external hard drive, self powered USB. I found an appreciable difference with network isolation and ran a Cisco switch for a while, until firewall issues caused me to go back to an old Netgear. Tidal is not at the quality of my own library, and Roon piped from an Imac on the system is also unrewarding in a different way, using the same external HD as library. I cannot implement Roon fully on Euphony as the Optane card is not big enough and the library filled it, necessitating a full new install. 
• So, here's the issue; I was about to purchase a Synology NAS for use primarily as a music library, but also for other household/security things that I can actually do without but if I have one I will implement. At present I have an HP running WHS that has a backup library (was primary), so I set the music source as that in Euphony for proof of concept re sound quality of served FLAC files. The resulting sound is thin and uninvolving, despite buffering and isolating the network. I had actually forgotten I had switched source and was reading in the earlier part of the evening, writing off the lack of emotion in the music to one of those nights, then I turned my attention fully to the music and the volume went up but did not deliver. The penny dropped then as to the change of library.
• Can it be that internal noise in the HP server is somehow contaminating the files? The switch is robbing the bass? Re the latter, Tidal still has plenty of presence, if not ultimate fidelity etc. so maybe not that. Unless a more powerful NAS has less internal noise (possible), then those times I have been unimpressed with shop system centrally served could be just down to source? I realise companies such as Antipodes advise against served files and use internally mounted drives, but that requires very clever power supplies to isolate from the processor etc.
• How are your files served? Has anyone noted a dramatic difference between sources? At present I am sticking to a USB external drive, unless anyone has a better solution for an NUC implementation.

[c-w]

@Speedy381

Do you buffer the whole queue before playback? That should be better than using just 100% buffer option.
Have you tried the new expert option 'Play & disconnect' where your network is disconnected for the total duration of the queue playback time?

I somehow don't believe that files buffered from NAS can be different from files buffered from local storage but i do believe that the whole system may be in a different 'state' after buffering is finished in each case.
Also, maybe there is a difference to be heard if, after you buffer the whole queue, you wait some time (several minutes?) before starting playback? To let the system 'settle down' after buffering? I know this is not practical - but it may be worth to try and see if anything changes.

I don't use NAS and cannot try this (and my system is probably not that resolving anyway).

[Speedy381]

1 hour ago, c-w said:

@Speedy381

Do you buffer the whole queue before playback? That should be better than using just 100% buffer option.
Have you tried the new expert option 'Play & disconnect' where your network is disconnected for the total duration of the queue playback time?

Yes, all buffered and play and disconnect used. The phenomenon remains throughout the playback so it's doubtful there is a state of disarray while it sorts itself out. The logical part of me would like to believe there is no difference, just like I would like to think that a switch can have no influence on the sound. I have, however heard a Melco switch replace a Netgear and the subsequent improvement, so am prepared to believe that I heard the difference I did for the reason the data was bounced about in a noisy box before getting to the NUC. But all good points, thanks for reading through and offering up ideas. 

[davide256]

3 hours ago, Speedy381 said:

• I have just had an odd experience; I have been using my NUC i7 with good RAM, Optane card running Euphony, powered by a Farad 3 PS. So a pretty well sorted front end, if not full exotic then decently middle range. My source up to now has been my library on external hard drive, self powered USB. I found an appreciable difference with network isolation and ran a Cisco switch for a while, until firewall issues caused me to go back to an old Netgear. Tidal is not at the quality of my own library, and Roon piped from an Imac on the system is also unrewarding in a different way, using the same external HD as library. I cannot implement Roon fully on Euphony as the Optane card is not big enough and the library filled it, necessitating a full new install. 
• So, here's the issue; I was about to purchase a Synology NAS for use primarily as a music library, but also for other household/security things that I can actually do without but if I have one I will implement. At present I have an HP running WHS that has a backup library (was primary), so I set the music source as that in Euphony for proof of concept re sound quality of served FLAC files. The resulting sound is thin and uninvolving, despite buffering and isolating the network. I had actually forgotten I had switched source and was reading in the earlier part of the evening, writing off the lack of emotion in the music to one of those nights, then I turned my attention fully to the music and the volume went up but did not deliver. The penny dropped then as to the change of library.
• Can it be that internal noise in the HP server is somehow contaminating the files? The switch is robbing the bass? Re the latter, Tidal still has plenty of presence, if not ultimate fidelity etc. so maybe not that. Unless a more powerful NAS has less internal noise (possible), then those times I have been unimpressed with shop system centrally served could be just down to source? I realise companies such as Antipodes advise against served files and use internally mounted drives, but that requires very clever power supplies to isolate from the processor etc.
• How are your files served? Has anyone noted a dramatic difference between sources? At present I am sticking to a USB external drive, unless anyone has a better solution for an NUC implementation.

I've used a Buffalo NAS and a PC as music file server... they sucked, pretty lifeless. And i really wanted local storage in Euphony to be best... but the DS214Play NAS

I have continues to be far more convincing for mid range tone color purity and reduction of digital artifacts. My last try to supplant the NAS, a local M.2 NVME drive

didn't even last 24 hours in the Euphony server before I gave up and went back to NAS.

 

[Speedy381]

31 minutes ago, davide256 said:

I've used a Buffalo NAS and a PC as music file server... they sucked, pretty lifeless. And i really wanted local storage in Euphony to be best... but the DS214Play NAS

I have continues to be far more convincing for mid range tone color purity and reduction of digital artifacts. My last try to supplant the NAS, a local M.2 NVME drive

didn't even last 24 hours in the Euphony server before I gave up and went back to NAS.

 

That is heartening that you have had the same results. I don't feel quite so crazy now. Although I have to wonder whether the whole Synology range is the same as the 214 for sound. 

[davide256]

1 hour ago, Speedy381 said:

That is heartening that you have had the same results. I don't feel quite so crazy now. Although I have to wonder whether the whole Synology range is the same as the 214 for sound. 

I suspect that as long as the processer is intel based only the library scan time will vary. 

[al2813]

Quick question. I sent a mail to support as well but not sure if they will answer on Sunday. I just purchased the Stylus licence (ouch after adding EU VAT) which means I can now move my Euphony drive to my internal system dedicated SSD. Is there a process to do this? I am not 100%, and I want to avoid a fresh setup if I can. 

[al2813]

First ignore my question. I found the answer myself - it was easier than I thought.....

Secondly  Željko answered immediately. Great support again! 

[walloon]

17 hours ago, al2813 said:

Quick question. I sent a mail to support as well but not sure if they will answer on Sunday. I just purchased the Stylus licence (ouch after adding EU VAT) which means I can now move my Euphony drive to my internal system dedicated SSD. Is there a process to do this? I am not 100%, and I want to avoid a fresh setup if I can. 

Good call, you won't regret it. 

 

Agree about the VAT...

[biosailor]

18 hours ago, al2813 said:

Quick question. I sent a mail to support as well but not sure if they will answer on Sunday. I just purchased the Stylus licence (ouch after adding EU VAT) which means I can now move my Euphony drive to my internal system dedicated SSD. Is there a process to do this? I am not 100%, and I want to avoid a fresh setup if I can. 

You can store Euphony OS into the internal drive of your system. Once you have a registered version, it‘ll ask if you want to store it internally. If you do so, your system will start from the internal drive, so no need for a USB flash drive any more.

I did that on my MacBook Air. I‘m not sure if I‘ll ever be able to revert to Mac OS, but it’s an old Mac, so it won’t be used for anything else anymore.

[Mike Rubin]

This is a basic question that probably is answered in this 75 page thread, but I was confused by something that I perceived to be a conflict between the Euphony website and the user grid.  If I were to try Euphony, it would be installed on a NUC and used to stream from a NAS to Sonore rendus over ethernet rather than over the NUC's USB bus to a connected DAC.  The Euphony site says it requires a DAC connected by USB but the user guide tosses off a reference to enabling upnp without really articulating the use case.  So, can Euphony be used to stream to a upnp device or must it be connected to the DAC by USB cable?

[aangen]

It can be used both ways, and at the same time if you wish. 
I have mine connected to a DAC via USB and I Stream to my Signature Rendu via Ethernet. 

[Mike Rubin]

Thanks, aangen.