Euphony OS w/Stylus player setup and issues thread

[walloon]

Just to clarify, the "Random Album" on Daphile/LMS is a feature that browses the entire library and randomly selects 50 albums (not sure about the exact number) and presents them on the main screen.

It's nice as it sometimes shows you albums you forgot about and you're like "oh man, I haven't listen to that for months..." or gives you ideas what to listen to etc... you get the idea.

 

It's currently not implemented but Željko will put it on their list of things to consider for implementation.

[k27R]

New update.  Working fine on my Pink Faun.

20200712
- Latest Roon binaries included
- Fix for Roon -> StylusEP playback via HQPe control interface
- Link for release changes is now obvious
- Removed the limit of 5 displayed saved filters 
- Prevent usage of 'Copy app data to RAM' ramroot option with Stylus or Roon
- RAM limits for entering ramroot are slightly reduced
- Latest HQPe options added to Euphony UI

[ASRMichael]

I would love Euphony to have the option for convolution Filters, like HQPlayer or Roon. 
 

I presume I can’t use HQPlayer sending music to stylus EP on a 1 box server? 

[dc-audiogeek]

On 7/10/2020 at 10:36 PM, dc-audiogeek said:

Version 2020709 has some issues.

 

I encountered severe issues with running Roon Core on the Summus after the update. Lots of weird errors and crashes. 

 

Also, the sound quality is worse after the update. I thought something was wrong with my headphone amp. I went searching for silver cables because the sound had become overly warm and diffuse. 

 

I've since reverted back to the older version, and now Roon works fine and the sound quality is back to how it was before.

These issues have been fixed in version 20200712. Everything works.

[aangen]

I upgrade to 20200712 last night with no issues. Hooray!

[jacky5555]

Hi,

Is there anyway to bypass volume control or any software mixer?

I found it working but no where in setting to bypass the mixer.

 

Also I could not find where to log out Tidal/Qobuz acc in Stylus interface.

 

 

[walloon]

I posted this question in another forum (A novel way to...) but I should have posted it here.

 

I used to tune stream/output buffers and Alsa when I was using Daphile, which is based on LMS. I'm now using Euphony Stylus on a single box (NUC) and I'm very happy with it.

 

Out of curiosity, does it make any sense to tune the buffers using the "Squeezelite command line params" in Expert settings, when using Stylus only?

[austinpop]

5 hours ago, walloon said:

Out of curiosity, does it make any sense to tune the buffers using the "Squeezelite command line params" in Expert settings, when using Stylus only?

 

No, because these settings only apply when running the Squeezelite player. Stylus does not use Squeezelite. These settings would only come into play if your were running these two "Audio systems" in the settings menu:

• Squeezelite
• Roon core + Squeezelite.

 

Let's be clear on terminology:

• Euphony refers to the OS. It is a Linux variant based on the Archlinux distribution.
• Stylus refers to a web application that encompasses 2 distinct functions:
  • It provides a web UI to control OS configuration and settings
  • It also implements the Stylus music server, which is Euphony's native music player
    • the Stylus web app implements the library management, indexing, and UI for the player
    • the actual playback engine runs in a separate executable called "gstp."
• You can run other music servers on Euphony OS, like Roon, HQPlayer Embedded, or AirPlay.
• You can run other renderers (or endpoint software) on Euphony OS, like Squeezelite (SL), Roon Bridge, NAA, and StylusEP (essentially the gstp player accessible via a SL and HQPlayer API).

So when referring to a configuration, it is not enough to simply say Euphony. One has to specify both the OS AND the music software. For example, I run a standalone music server, and alternate between Euphony/Stylus and Euphony/Roon+StylusEP.

[walloon]

3 hours ago, austinpop said:

 

No, because these settings only apply when running the Squeezelite player. Stylus does not use Squeezelite. These settings would only come into play if your were running these two "Audio systems" in the settings menu:

• Squeezelite
• Roon core + Squeezelite.

 

Let's be clear on terminology:

• Euphony refers to the OS. It is a Linux variant based on the Archlinux distribution.
• Stylus refers to a web application that encompasses 2 distinct functions:
  • It provides a web UI to control OS configuration and settings
  • It also implements the Stylus music server, which is Euphony's native music player
    • the Stylus web app implements the library management, indexing, and UI for the player
    • the actual playback engine runs in a separate executable called "gstp."
• You can run other music servers on Euphony OS, like Roon, HQPlayer Embedded, or AirPlay.
• You can run other renderers (or endpoint software) on Euphony OS, like Squeezelite (SL), Roon Bridge, NAA, and StylusEP (essentially the gstp player accessible via a SL and HQPlayer API).

So when referring to a configuration, it is not enough to simply say Euphony. One has to specify both the OS AND the music software. For example, I run a standalone music server, and alternate between Euphony/Stylus and Euphony/Roon+StylusEP.

Many thanks for your answer. It helps and clarifies things.

[Lukasluis]

I am aware that many folks here have good results with using the NUC hardware and I had a fair bit of success before I discovered that I prefer the SQ of Windows dual PC using 2 NUC machines, the server being the more powerful NUC, 8i7, which I used to run Euphony. Enjoying this combo for more than 3 months now. 

 

In order not to waste my Euphony license, I am planning to buy an even more powerful Mini PC with the new AMD Ryzen chip most probably 8-core 16-thread but running on much lower TDP. Has anyone here is using AMD hardware with Euphony? If so, how much core or frequency is needed to make Euphony sings. 

[edwardsean]

I'm using Euphony/Stylus installed onto Optane and RamRoot on Apacer RAM. I have both full song buffer and cache enabled. Since the tracks are being played from Optane and RAM does this mean that it doesn't matter where the song files are coming from.

 

I've been using an SD Card to avoid issues with SSD and Hard Drive. However, it is of course pretty slow, and my song files are upscaled PCM768KHz so are about 1GB each. 

 

Would I not lose any SQ using a faster drive?

 

[Lukasluis]

45 minutes ago, edwardsean said:

I'm using Euphony/Stylus installed onto Optane and RamRoot on Apacer RAM. I have both full song buffer and cache enabled. Since the tracks are being played from Optane and RAM does this mean that it doesn't matter where the song files are coming from.

 

I've been using an SD Card to avoid issues with SSD and Hard Drive. However, it is of course pretty slow, and my song files are upscaled PCM768KHz so are about 1GB each. 

 

Would I not lose any SQ using a faster drive?

 

When I used Euphony, I configured it similar to yours except that my Music files were stored on the Nas (buffer and cache enabled) . Iistened blind folded while my wife plugged and unplugged the LAN cable. While the music is playing and also before starting and restarting the same music. I did not perceive any difference. 

[organics1]

When I started using Euphony several months ago I worried a lot about resources because I am using a simple mini PC with a Celeron chip and 4GB RAMS and I was getting a lot of hiccups, mostly stuttering and dropouts. Even after following the recommendations of Support things remained tenuous. I decided I should just park it until I could afford a more powerful setup. A few weeks later I noticed a system update and I tried it. 99% of my headaches were gone. The other 1% disappeared on the next update.

Before Euphony came along I was struggling with AudiophileLinux, which was the sweetest program I'd ever heard on my system...and I had tried them all. But, not being a Linux genius, it was giving me pure fits because it ALWAYS breaks! Euphony relieved me of all that agony, and continues to provide superb SQ. Eventually I will convert one of my i7/32GB computers to music server duty. For now, though, everything is copacetic. 😄

[TheAttorney]

5 hours ago, edwardsean said:

I'm using Euphony/Stylus installed onto Optane and RamRoot on Apacer RAM. I have both full song buffer and cache enabled. Since the tracks are being played from Optane and RAM does this mean that it doesn't matter where the song files are coming from.

 

 

I also have Euphony/Stylus on Optane and ramroot Apacer RAM. And songs buffered in RAM. And music files stored onto a directly attached USB thumb drive (my files are all redbook FLAC, so they all fit).

 

Once the music files are buffered into RAM, I've not noticed any difference in SQ whether or not the thumb drive is removed from the NUC server, although to be fair, I didn't compare that hard because I so didn't want to keep removing the thumb drive, so it's stays permanently connected.

 

Furthermore, I no longer bother to cache the music files from thumb drive to Optane - because there's no noticeable real world speed difference buffering an album from Optane compared to buffering from thumb drive (USB 3.0 thumb drive Read speeds are about 10x faster than Write - still slower than Optane of course, but the difference isn't noticeable in practice with a redbook FLAC album). Most likely the difference would be much more obvious with much larger HD music files.

 

As an aside, I did notice a minor incremental SQ boost when I added a newly updated ifi iSilencer+ between thumb drive and USB socket. And noticed a larger incremental SQ boost when the iSilencer+ was added in the USB signal path, which was surprising because I already had top quality USB cables and an ISORegen in that signal path, yet the iSilencer+ still gave a worthwhile improvement for its modest price of £49. So it's not clear if the iSilencer+ is specifically reducing noise from the thumb drive or just generally reducing noise in the USB circuits (it's a parallel noise filter, with passive caps for HF, plus active noise cancellation circuit for lower frequencies).

[edwardsean]

So, if I'm following this correctly:

 

All the traditional SQ benefits of using a NAS instead of a directly attached drive, and the sonic issues of an SSD, no longer apply with Euphony buffering songs to RAM?

[davide256]

8 hours ago, edwardsean said:

So, if I'm following this correctly:

 

All the traditional SQ benefits of using a NAS instead of a directly attached drive, and the sonic issues of an SSD, no longer apply with Euphony buffering songs to RAM?

Nope. Buffering to RAM improves NUC performance ... it doesn’t fix source issues

[edwardsean]

This is the message I got from Željko:

 

"I often hear that people avoid SSDs because they think SSD is noisy even when not being actively read but that probably varies from one SSD to the next and I don't really expect you will be able to hear the difference when playing from RAM unless your system is already ultra resolving."

 

I spent some time comparing an external SD Card and SSD. My system is very resolving, and I do think there is a slight difference. There did seem to be a–slightly–excited upper mid/highs which is consistent with increased noise. It also just sounds a bit more clear. However, as he said, playing from RAM, it was not a major difference. 

 

Since the audio file is not playing directly from SSD but RAM, we are talking about just the noise emission of having it plugged in and powered. 

[lmcuong4u]

Any one tried Euphony with Nuc10? I intend to update Nuc10 but not sure it is compatible or not?

[dminches]

Has anyone tried the network card bridge mode with a USB DAC?  If so, how did it compare to the USB output?

 

[davide256]

On 8/5/2020 at 8:49 PM, edwardsean said:

This is the message I got from Željko:

 

"I often hear that people avoid SSDs because they think SSD is noisy even when not being actively read but that probably varies from one SSD to the next and I don't really expect you will be able to hear the difference when playing from RAM unless your system is already ultra resolving."

 

I spent some time comparing an external SD Card and SSD. My system is very resolving, and I do think there is a slight difference. There did seem to be a–slightly–excited upper mid/highs which is consistent with increased noise. It also just sounds a bit more clear. However, as he said, playing from RAM, it was not a major difference. 

 

Since the audio file is not playing directly from SSD but RAM, we are talking about just the noise emission of having it plugged in and powered. 

IME SSD  has more glare than SDXC when bus or USB attached to 1 box NUC solution...but they are both bright in the treble and thin in the midrange compared to ordinary

WD red HD used in my Synology NAS. This might not show with DAC's that are "midrange challenged", did remind me a lot of when I used JPlay. The nice thing about NAS

is that other than throughput speed and capacity, few claim to hear a sound difference between models from the competent brands like Synology and QNAP

[davide256]

FWIW I'm finally getting better sound  results using the RAM mode with Euphony than normal mode. I had broken my Audiophonics cable for external USB 5

volts before replacing a Gumby with Chord Mojo, without it the  sound irritant level increased whenever I switched to RAM mode with both DAC's. Running

 a Y Ghent DC cable from an LPS 1.2 as external PS to the Mojo and as 5V USB into the Mojo using the Audiophonics adaptor cable has resulted in a smoother

sound using RAM mode, no more irritants. Improvement over normal mode is subtle, just a greater sense of ease in playback of complex passage..

[edwardsean]

Thanks Dave, 

There are a few things to consider here, one is that you're comparing a SDCard, SSD connected locally and the HD was connected over network. Did you try connecting a HD directly to the NUC and were the results the same?

 

Also, in your second post you mentioned you moved to RAM mode. I assume you mean RamRoot. However, in your tests were you caching to an Optane drive and buffering 100% song to RAM before playback. 

 

This is the use case that I'm trying to test. The question is: if audio files sound different played directly from SDCard, SSD, or HD, does this difference hold when the files are no longer being played directly but from cache/RAM?

[ASRMichael]

Does anyone who why you can get Gapless playback using Stylus & HQPLAYER DSD? 
 

I read both Euphony & HQPlayer can do gapless, but seems not when running together?

[cat6man]

this could just be cockpit problems here (not unheard of) but i'd appreciate any help.

 

i'm trying to run euphony/stylus on my 7i7NUC.

after a couple of mis-steps on my part, i got it to find my DAC and play music.

however, it does not seem to be able to handle my 6TB music library, which is on an external HDD attached to the NUC.  it gets part of the way though, then seems to hang around 22k/96k items.  it also slows to a crawl and goes in and out of being connected the remote login (presumably due to being hung up on music library).

 

i'm running off of a 16G usb stick and want to get things running before moving to ramroot operation.

 

 

so, a few questions:

1.  any help for the library issue?

2.  once the library is loaded, is there a way to navigate the music directory directly?

 

thanks

[walloon]

9 hours ago, cat6man said:

this could just be cockpit problems here (not unheard of) but i'd appreciate any help.

 

i'm trying to run euphony/stylus on my 7i7NUC.

after a couple of mis-steps on my part, i got it to find my DAC and play music.

however, it does not seem to be able to handle my 6TB music library, which is on an external HDD attached to the NUC.  it gets part of the way though, then seems to hang around 22k/96k items.  it also slows to a crawl and goes in and out of being connected the remote login (presumably due to being hung up on music library).

 

i'm running off of a 16G usb stick and want to get things running before moving to ramroot operation.

 

 

so, a few questions:

1.  any help for the library issue?

2.  once the library is loaded, is there a way to navigate the music directory directly?

 

thanks

My library is "only" 2TB but I had the same issue when I tested Euphony/Stylus on a 16gb USB stick. I then moved to a 64gb stick and all went well.