Euphony OS w/Stylus player setup and issues thread

[al2813]

Spending this weekend on working on my server. I decided to try Euphony for 30 days and the first one hour is challenging to say the least. The first problem was I guess on my count. I did the setup and when trying to import my Roon DB, Roon core hung up. I realized the issue was probably because my backup was done from a newer build than the one shipping with Stylus. No way to recover - go back and setup a new USB. Setup and this time I make sure to update my Roon build from the remote. Again Roon hangs. Trying now again and this time will not update and just configure Roon from scratch. 

 

I have no issue when this is an open source system where you need to do configs yourself etc. but when this is a closed system costing a lot of money, these kind of issues irritate me a bit more....

 

Let's see if I can get this to work. 

 

UPDATE - not working. New setup. I setup Roon this time without upgrading the build. I am trying to reboot. The OS loads, web client works, but Roon remote cannot find the core. I opened a ticket with Euphony support. 

[al2813]

5 hours ago, al2813 said:

Spending this weekend on working on my server. I decided to try Euphony for 30 days and the first one hour is challenging to say the least. The first problem was I guess on my count. I did the setup and when trying to import my Roon DB, Roon core hung up. I realized the issue was probably because my backup was done from a newer build than the one shipping with Stylus. No way to recover - go back and setup a new USB. Setup and this time I make sure to update my Roon build from the remote. Again Roon hangs. Trying now again and this time will not update and just configure Roon from scratch. 

 

I have no issue when this is an open source system where you need to do configs yourself etc. but when this is a closed system costing a lot of money, these kind of issues irritate me a bit more....

 

Let's see if I can get this to work. 

 

UPDATE - not working. New setup. I setup Roon this time without upgrading the build. I am trying to reboot. The OS loads, web client works, but Roon remote cannot find the core. I opened a ticket with Euphony support. 

 

Good support from Euphony. My USB stick was too small hence the issues. Am now trying with a spare drive on hand. Too big probably and first boot where Euphony does its thing will take some time....

[al2813]

10 hours ago, ASRMichael said:

You can use an Intel optane 32gb. Boots on few seconds

 

The only thing I had in hand is a 2TB usb drive. Took time to boot the first time but now works well. I would recommend Euphony to change the language in their documentation. 16GB is the minimum but the moment you add Roon it is clearly not sufficient. 

 

In the AL-Stylus shoot out thread the nuances were there but in my case they are not. Compared to my AL setup, that is not very well tweaked - I only use Ramroot which already improves things quite a bit, Stylus delivers a big improvement in SQ. Bigger stage, more organic sound. Using Roon the difference is there, but using Stylus player - wow this is a killer. I adore the Roon interface, but I am not sure if I will renew my subscription. 

 

My current server is not NUC based. It has a Jetway nf9m N2930 motherboard. The system drive is a Kingston 240gb mSATA SSD. I am planning to use it for the permanent Euphony system drive when I buy the license (which looks right now a real possibility). I don't think I can use Optan in this setup? 

[al2813]

2 minutes ago, biosailor said:

 

I booted mine yesterday from a 6 TB drive. First boot took more than an hour, second boot was quick in about 5 mins.

 

How do you add Roon?

 

I assume you have a Roon subscription? If yes then you just need to select Roon as the Audio player. 

[al2813]

1 minute ago, ASRMichael said:

Why not use Optane for Euphony OS. Then have your music on separate drive. You’ll get better SQ by having your music on a NAS or Separate PC. 

 

I have a separate 2TB SSD as my music drive and it is connected with a JCAT SATA cable. I thought Optane will not be compatible with my motherboard, but apparently it can be and there are two options - msata to M2 adapter or an external USB3 M2 enclosure. I am not sure though if this is worth the extra spend 

[al2813]

Just now, biosailor said:

Yes, I do, lifetime subscription. Unfortunately, at the start of the trial period, I had to inactivate Roon on Stylus, and now I can't seem to re-activate it 😬

 

You can select and deselect Roon - I've done that, and it works. If not then just open a ticket. You get a quick response. 

[al2813]

2 hours ago, biosailor said:

Unfortunately, still fighting numerous problems with Euphony's library. For example, Allen Toussaint's album American Tunes is imported only from track two on. I deleted the file in the music folder, updated the library, but it is still there on Euphony's web app! I re-copied the same album containing all tracks and I still see only tracks 2-12, track 1 is missing. How come that Euphony's web app doesn't refresh? Library management in Euphony is a real mess!

 

 

 

I have the same issue. The Euphony library is a complete mess with multiple items not working well.  Roon obviously it's the other way around - the library as well as GUI is their main strength. However, right now Euophony Stylus player sounds much better to my taste in my system so am using it now as default. I could not believe something will take me off Roon but it is happening. As much as the Roon layout is incredible, sound is still my top priority. 

[al2813]

7 minutes ago, Holzohr said:

 

You don't need a HQPlayer embedded licence in this case. Stylus EP means that you use Roon and Euphony's Stylus player. To realize this the Euphony team is using the HQPlayer protocol. I am pretty happy with this solution and use it for a couple of months though I have a HQPe licence, too.

 

 

Did you compare Stylus player vs. this setup? Does this allow you to have the Roon interface with the Stylus player sound quality? 

 

[al2813]

Tried the core + stylus ep this evening and indeed this is a nice combo. I will do more testing this weekend but this looks so far the winning formula. 

[al2813]

I have been now playing with Euphony for 2 weeks. I would have loved to keep Roon as my front end due to its interface, but even compared to Roon + Stylus EP, the Stylus player is just better. The only problem is the library - killer issue. Want at least to clean up the files (until now I let Roon do everything <sigh>). Anyone can recommend me a good app to do this ? mac preferred. 

 

 

 

[al2813]

Quick question. I sent a mail to support as well but not sure if they will answer on Sunday. I just purchased the Stylus licence (ouch after adding EU VAT) which means I can now move my Euphony drive to my internal system dedicated SSD. Is there a process to do this? I am not 100%, and I want to avoid a fresh setup if I can. 

[al2813]

First ignore my question. I found the answer myself - it was easier than I thought.....

Secondly  Željko answered immediately. Great support again! 

[al2813]

Reading all the posts here I have no desire to update..... Yesterday I listened to music the whole evening and I like it as it is now. Only one issue bugs me, I need to reboot my Roon core (used in core + stylus EP mode - works great for me), evey time I start my Roon app as Qobuz login is not working. Reboot Roon core and issue solved. For now, I will stay with the 108 version.....

[al2813]

3 hours ago, maxst67 said:

To go back to version 102 just send a ticket to Euphony and they will send you the image of this version. Then you have to redo the installation procedure via USB and install it to insert it on the internal ssd

 

Hi, I am still on version 108 (which was the first version I really installed as I purchased Stylus in January). Is it worth reverting to 102 as well? I have fired up the support site to submit a ticket but thought I'd ask here first :-) 

[al2813]

1 hour ago, Holzohr said:

 

It is possible with a m.2 to PCIe adapter. The drawback is you can not use a m.2 ssd in this case. I am just playing with this solution: m.2 to PCIe adapter plus JCAT USB XE. The NUC (NUC7i7DNKE) is booting either from a Diretta stick or from a NAA stick. I think about purchasing a HDPLEX H1 V3 case plus NUC Kit plus m.2 to PCIe riser.

 

 

 

Hi, I assembled a NUC with an HDPLEX H1 V3 and the NUC kit + riser cable. I ended up selling the combo becuase i decided to keep my second hand server in a Streacom F10 Alpha for the time being as a combo Stylus server / end point with my JCAT USB card. While the HDPLEX box is a great product and the only solution in the market allowing you to run a fanless NUC with a PCI card, there one point to take into account. You need an external power supply for the JCAT card, since the the riser cable delivers 3,3V and it seems to not be sufficient to power the JCAT. You will also need to get a SATA splitter to allow the single SATA port in the NUC to feed both the JCAT and the SSD (and indeed M2 is not possible). 

 

I have been in contact with Larry on this one and I believe my info is checked. The person who bought my NUC with the case confirmed the same findings to me. He had no issue as he had DIY LPS foreseen both for the NUC and the JCAT card (in his cae net card)

[al2813]

I am running a singxer SU-1 as an innetrface between my Euphony box (JCAT USB card) and the spdif in of my DAC. Before that I had a WAVEIO card delivering the same functionality. In both cases the distortion is appearing very randomly. In fact I was "blaming" my DAC until I tried the CD player which had no such issue. 

 

I will do some more testing this week. The issue is very rare on my side 

[al2813]

9 hours ago, Exocer said:

Thanks for the report al2813. Which DAC did you experience this issue with?

it’s a TDA1541. I have also a PCM1794 DAC (both are DIY but very professionally built) which seems not to have the issue although again I need to do more rigorous testing and add my RPI source to the mix. Again as it appeared very little I did not investigate any further. Only reading the thread today made me think there could be a link. 

[al2813]

8 hours ago, di-fi said:

Hi al2813

Thanks for sharing. To solve the problem, it would be good to share as much details as possible. I repeat the questions from above. One important difference might be that you experienced distortion playing to USB and SPDIF. 

So you experience strident distortion during the whole track, but you can still hear the music playing (at a higher speed?). This happens when you change between tracks with different bit depths (16/24/32 bits)? When this happens Euphony becomes unresponsive and needs a 'Restart app' command? 

Do you play with ramroot, do you activate 'buffer before play 100%'  and 'buffer albums to queue'?

Any other specific settings?Sorry for all the questions, take your time testing,  I appreciate.

Paul

Hi Paul, again I need to do real testing. I will try to find some time this weekend and will report back any findings. I have several combos I can test. Euphony is in Ramroot default setting. I did not tweak any further and I am on the 108 version. I run Roon server with Stylus EP. 

[al2813]

51 minutes ago, Exocer said:

 

This is a very good data point. Happy to see that it the issue is not limited to Schiit Unison USB DACs. Will let Zeljko know.

maybe not so fast. I couldn’t reproduce it last night and I listened to numerous tracks from DSD (converted to PCM) to 44/96/192. Very strange. Until I see otherwise no issue on my side. 

[al2813]

A different question. Euphony is not allowing me to upload a 1,6 Gb file into my music library (located in the internal SSD used as the Euphony drive). Currently I use the file manager to upload files. error message is: "400: ENOSPC: no space left on device, write"

 

2 questions: 

 

- How do I solve this limitation?

- Can I map a network drive on my Mac? 

 

[al2813]

I have been working for some months now out of a PC with a low power motherboard CPU (Jetway NF9M). I am thinking of changing those now for a higher power setup, but looking to get feedback from other Euphony users (my specific setup now is Roon core + Stylus EP). I have an HDPlex 300 LPS currently feeding 19v directly to a DC in jack the motherboard, will of course add a DC-ATX from HDplex. Happy to get recommendation for specific motherboard/CPU combos. 

[al2813]

I am happy I started this little discussion  resulting in these different opinions . My hunch (not scientific I admit) is that the big power system yields results if you also invest in other components most notably LPS. So if you spend 7-10k then you’re probably able to get further with a high power system. If you (like me) spend 2-3k, then potentially the low power variant can yield an interesting result. I suspect also that the other system components, the music people listen to, and their taste of « what is good » in SQ influence the end result. 

[al2813]

1 hour ago, ASRMichael said:

I agree, however you don’t need to spend 7-10k. 
 

My LPS for ATX & CPU was around £2.5k and MB + CPU £1k..plus case+cables £0.5k

 

£4k total. You can add extra rails to power other things like Eth card or USB card for £250-£300per rail if i recall. 
 

Yes you can go higher but you can go lower also. Paul Hynes, Farad etc..

 

Maybe the 7-10k was a bit on the high side, although I was in EUR so your £4k is already €5k :-). Then, if you count the extra card (I think you'll need a high end JCAT or equivalent to match the rest, extra work on the networking side (card, cabling, switch). I suspect that the full package gets very close to my €7k. My server is €2-2.5k (case, motherboard + CPU + SSDs, HDPlex 300W, JCAT FEMTO) and for now I settled for a non tweaked Cisco 2900 switch which already delivered a little improvement.  

 

However, I still suspect that my second part (about the other components in the system/room acoustics etc.) holds. I strongly suspect that in order to really see the difference in SQ in a higher end source, you need a high-end setup around it in a proper room. I have come up quite a bit since I started this hobby in a more serious way last year, but probably am still very far from what is required, but maybe I'm wrong. 

 

[al2813]

16 minutes ago, bos3812 said:

I powered the Xeon server with my HDPlex 300W. I also had two Farads but sold them both because I liked the HDPlex better. The HDPlex had more resolution and dynamics.

 

Interesting one. My HDPlex is the first "serious" LPS I got for my server. The previous was a home-grown LPS installed inside the case by the Dutch store who originally built it. The store owner described it as "high end", but the HDPlex outclassed it by a massive distance. Your comment that the HDplex is better than a Farad (which is considered as a very reputable brand) is interesting. 

[al2813]

5 minutes ago, ASRMichael said:

I would recommend treating your room before upgrading a source! Room is 50-60% of SQ! I learned this the hard way! 

 Yes I am starting to understand this. A more modest setup in my bedroom sounds very close my main setup in my new listening room just because room acoustics is probably better there. If you can send a few tips my way that would be great!