Chromecast for Rendu series

[asdf1000]

On 2/6/2019 at 8:10 AM, vortecjr said:

Production update

 

The production boards arrived yesterday and a few are shipping out to our team members today for internal testing. As best as I can tell the enclosures which should arrive first of March. 

 

As a reminder, if you are interested in this product please send an email to [email protected] with subject "opticalRendu".  

 

Hi JR

 

With the new hardware for opticalRendu, any chance it will support "Chromecast Built-in"?

 

 

[vortecjr]

51 minutes ago, Em2016 said:

Hi JR

 

With the new hardware for opticalRendu, any chance it will support "Chromecast Built-in"?

no

[asdf1000]

53 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

no

 

Damn. That would be cool. I'm sure you've seen:

 

http://www.streamunlimited.com/products/streaming-audio/streamvienna/stream1832---audio-streamin.html

 

Hoping for Chromecast Built-in for a future product perhaps.

 

[vortecjr]

48 minutes ago, Em2016 said:

 

Damn. That would be cool. I'm sure you've seen:

 

http://www.streamunlimited.com/products/streaming-audio/streamvienna/stream1832---audio-streamin.html

 

Hoping for Chromecast Built-in for a future product perhaps.

 

I think that is because Google owns them.

[asdf1000]

1 minute ago, vortecjr said:

I think that is because Google owns them.

 

Maybe not more than 50% but owns a large chunk of them yep.

 

Supports DSD, UPnP and other stuff too.

[barrows]

2 hours ago, Em2016 said:

 

Damn. That would be cool. I'm sure you've seen:

 

http://www.streamunlimited.com/products/streaming-audio/streamvienna/stream1832---audio-streamin.html

 

Hoping for Chromecast Built-in for a future product perhaps.

 

Curious as to what features of this hardware you would want?  It looks like this is a 3rd party hardware module which has many features which would degrade sound quality, like WiFi and Bluetooth.

Sonore Rendu products are built without these features in order to have the lowest noise footprint possible and deliver the best possible sound quality-is there some additional feature you are looking for specifically?

[Superdad]

20 minutes ago, barrows said:

..is there some additional feature you are looking for specifically?

 

Maybe Sean wants to be able to shout “Hey opticalRendu, play some King Crimson.” 

[vortecjr]

57 minutes ago, Superdad said:

 

Maybe Sean wants to be able to shout “Hey opticalRendu, play some King Crimson.” 

When Roon or JRiver add this feature maybe you will be able to... 

[barrows]

11 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

When Roon or JRiver add this feature maybe you will be able to... 

Through the tablet interface (Siri, etc), makes sense.  Considering how well (not) spell correct works I expect more problems than success in actual use of voice command track/album selection, hahaha...

[asdf1000]

6 hours ago, barrows said:

is there some additional feature you are looking for specifically?

 

One cool thing of Chromecast is it supports the native/OEM apps of all the streaming services (except Apple Music for now). So you can use the official apps of Tidal/Qobuz/Deezer/Spotify etc, without having to go through 3rd party apps.

 

I know the default response is always “just get Roon/JRiver/Audirvana”. But one example is the official Qobuz app. Really nice UI and always improving. Same with official Tidal app (Roon doesn’t include the great personalized “suggested new albums” and new “my mixes”). All the official apps have personalized features that are not available via 3rd party integration.. you’d have to try these to see firsthand.

 

Chromecast Built-In should support 96kHz and I believe even 192kHz is possible with this module.

 

Just a couple examples but Chromecast is ultra flexible in terms of app support. 

 

I have Roon lifetime and A+ and JRiver but when I play with these official apps and experience the great personalized features they offer now, I get a bit tired of all the 3rd party integration options that are behind. 

 

Chromecast Built-In lets you bypass these 3rd party solutions, up to 96kHz (and 192kHz I believe is possible).

 

More of a future product feature request.

[barrows]

As far as supporting Tidal/Qobuz on their apps that is a question for Jesus.  I do not know the licensing strategies of these companies and whether there are additional fees, etc...

 

But using hardware from Google is going to be a non-starter for Sonore, especially hardware limited to such low sample rates.  We need to support DSD 512 and PCM 768, (perhaps higher...) and we do!  We also have to do so with the highest possible sound quality, so we design out products to achieve those goals.

[asdf1000]

30 minutes ago, barrows said:

But using hardware from Google is going to be a non-starter for Sonore, especially hardware

 

Noted, I didn’t suggest only getting Google hardware. There are other ways to incorporate Chromecast Built-In, like Naim are doing now. Sonore products of course already support Shairport and the Spotify Connect hack, which are limited to 16/44.1

 

30 minutes ago, barrows said:

 

As far as supporting Tidal/Qobuz on their apps that is a question for Jesus. 

 

 

I don’t know what this means. I’m just talking about using the official Qobuz/Tidal/Deezer apps without 3rd party integration. All of their official apps support Chromecast playback. No 3rd party app required. The advantages are the quickly improving personalisation features. As mentioned, you’d have to use these apps now to understand what I mean, otherwise the default response will always be “use Roon/JRiver/Audirvana”.

 

Chromecast also supports multiroom/grouped playback. Just like Roon except with all the other streaming services too.

[barrows]

@vortecjr  (Jesus) is the President of Sonore and would be the one to determine whether it would be likely to add support for the Tidal and Qobuz apps directly to the SO operating system used in the Rendu Renderers. 

[asdf1000]

1 hour ago, barrows said:

@vortecjr  (Jesus) is the President of Sonore and would be the one to determine whether it would be likely to add support for the Tidal and Qobuz apps directly to the SO operating system used in the Rendu Renderers. 

 

Hehe I know who JR is. He was the person I asked the question to initially... I wasn't ask you or the general public (respectfully).

 

Looking at Tidal as an example, I don't believe what you are hinting at is possible... I'm not aware of any product on the planet that allows you to cast from the official Tidal app (iOS or Android) direct to the streamer, unless it's via Chromecast or Apple Airplay...  it's different story with 3rd part integration but I'm talking about the official apps here.

 

Same with Qobuz, Deezer etc.

 

As mentioned a couple times, you would need to use these official apps to experience the advantages over 3rd party integration options (including Roon, which I'm already a lifetime member).

[jaaptina]

11 hours ago, Em2016 said:

 

One cool thing of Chromecast is it supports the native/OEM apps of all the streaming services (except Apple Music for now). So you can use the official apps of Tidal/Qobuz/Deezer/Spotify etc, without having to go through 3rd party apps.

I'm with you. It would be great to be able to use Qobuz/Tidal Android app and stream directly to the ultraRendu. 

[R1200CL]

11 hours ago, barrows said:

As far as supporting Tidal/Qobuz on their apps that is a question for Jesus.  I do not know the licensing strategies of these companies and whether there are additional fees, etc...

 

But using hardware from Google is going to be a non-starter for Sonore, especially hardware limited to such low sample rates.  We need to support DSD 512 and PCM 768, (perhaps higher...) and we do!  We also have to do so with the highest possible sound quality, so we design out products to achieve those goals.

 

I think @Em2016 suggestion is worth looking into. 

 

I also dont want degrading sound quality. 

 

Maybe its possible to add a switch that  totallt remove this circuit, if it turn out to be noisy, then at least people  could have a choice. 

 

Who knows, maybe @JohnSwenson is able to make a hi res super duper version of this circuit 😀

Still, I guess there is license fee to be paid. 

 

And upgrade for UltraRendu, not the opticalRendu maybe.

 

Or maybe I totally  new box put I front of any Rendu ?

(people use same PS, with a Y-split)

[asdf1000]

1 minute ago, R1200CL said:

I also dont want degrading sound quality. 

 

A Chromecast Built-in feature request has nothing to do with degrading sound quality. The board I linked earlier appears to be limited to PCM38kHz so obviously not an option here - I only linked it because it's interesting and the first of it's kind (Google own a chunk in that company).

 

The Chromecast Built-in feature request itself is more important to me than any particular board I may be able to find.

 

Something for future consideration I guess.

 

4 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

Still, I guess there is license fee to be paid. 

 

@agillis has shared before, that he's spoken to Google Engineers about Chromecast, so SMG/Sonore have obviously looked into it in the past.

 

I understand there may be an encrypted chip that would be required in the streamer.

 

If that's correct then there's a hardware cost (obviously). I'm not sure if there's an additional licensing cost though - I'm sure Andrew and JR already know.

 

They are usually 1000 steps ahead of any of us with this kind of information 

 

Anyway I just thought I'd ask JR since he mentioned the opticalRendu would be a hardware upgrade over ultraRendu, so just thought I'd sneak the question in.

 

Maybe Chromecast related posts can be moved to a separate thread @vortecjr

 

[R1200CL]

32 minutes ago, Em2016 said:

The Chromecast Built-in feature request itself is more important to me than any particular board I may be able to find.

 

But doesn’t such feature need WiFi or Bluetooth, meaning possible noise added to the Rendu ?

(unless you can totally turn it off)

[asdf1000]

12 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

 

But doesn’t such feature need WiFi or Bluetooth, meaning possible noise added to the Rendu ?

(unless you can totally turn it off)

 

No Chromecast doesn't need WiFi to work. Just like UPnP, Roon, Airplay don't need WiFi to work.

 

It would just be another input option on the Rendu, like UPnP, Roon, Airplay etc (future Rendu maybe one day).

 

[R1200CL]

Well, let’s hope this can be a possible future upgrade then. 

May I then add AirPlay2 as well the the list. 

 

@vortecjr

Please post your taughts about this ?

 

Is is technically possible ?

 

What’s the downside? Except of a more expensive product. 

[asdf1000]

47 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

Well, let’s hope this can be a possible future upgrade then. 

 

New future product likely. As mentioned above, Chromecast appears to require some encrypted chip but Andrew knows more, having discussed with Google before.

 

47 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

May I then add AirPlay2 as well the the list. 

 

Definitely. I'm still waiting for a streamer that supports the 'big 4' properly/officially - Chromecast, Airplay 2 (proper latest, supporting multiroom, not Linux hack), Spotify Connect (proper, not Linux hack). And Roon which we already have.

 

I'd happily pay extra...

 

[agillis]

8 hours ago, Em2016 said:

@agillis has shared before, that he's spoken to Google Engineers about Chromecast, so SMG/Sonore have obviously looked into it in the past.

 

You need a license to be a Chromecast playback device. There are a bunch of boards out there like the StreamUnlimited that can do it. BUT even if you use a third party board in your product you still need a license direct from Chromecast. A Chromecast license is very complex and expensive to get. That's why only a few big companies have them.

[asdf1000]

Hi @vortecjr

 

Can you change the thread title to “Chromecast for Rendu series”...

 

That’s really what this thread is about

[asdf1000]

10 hours ago, agillis said:

 

You need a license to be a Chromecast playback device. There are a bunch of boards out there like the StreamUnlimited that can do it. BUT even if you use a third party board in your product you still need a license direct from Chromecast. A Chromecast license is very complex and expensive to get. That's why only a few big companies have them.

 

Thanks for the clarification Andrew.

[R1200CL]

11 hours ago, agillis said:

A Chromecast license is very complex and expensive to get. That's why only a few big companies have them.

 

Can you give us an idea what expensive means ?