Blind tests can be unreliable.

[STC]

 

23 minutes ago, fas42 said:

 

Yes, the lowest frequencies can be accurately reproduced, .

 

Meaningless statement for someone who couldn't produce them via their Sharp mini combo speakers.

[STC]

2 hours ago, fas42 said:

Of course it doesn't reproduce low bass frequencies well!

 

Drop the "well". It won't able to produce the LF. Don't bluff unless you are imagining.

[STC]

2 hours ago, PeterSt said:

 

Can't you get out of here ?

 

Nope because 

 

 

Generally, a gentleman can sense  what others think about him and take the necessary steps to address or avoid them. Here, we have Fas who got nothing. Not even a proper working  low fi set but talks about getting the sound right simply by repeating the same old mantra quoted from somewhere. In the end, the thread often gets hijacked and as usual none of his stuff would not have anything to do with the OP. 

 

Then suddenly something popped up in my head.  Maybe he is a she.

 

Edit:- Sorry Teresa. I hope you dont read this post.  

 

 

[fas42]

20 hours ago, STC said:

 

 

Generally, a gentleman can sense  what others think about him and take the necessary steps to address or avoid them. Here, we have Fas who got nothing. Not even a proper working  low fi set but talks about getting the sound right simply by repeating the same old mantra quoted from somewhere. In the end, the thread often gets hijacked and as usual none of his stuff would not have anything to do with the OP. 

 

 

 

Which is why mankind gets stuck in a rut, and it takes generational change to move on - wait for the old buggers to drop off the perch, because they refuse to change their position.

 

A rig doesn't need to reproduce the very low bass for convincing sound - if a pipe organ plays a whole piece which is deliberately written to never use a note below 100Hz, will the real instrument sound low fi? And forget about room rumblings ...

[KingRex]

I can't help myself from quick change opinions. We all do it.   That is why I also insert a new device such as an Emotive power conditioner I have on my DAC and Server now.  Then I listen for a couple days.  Then I take it out and listen for a couple days.  You find there is a lot to be learned from living with something for a while.  Over time some definite opinions of whether you like it or not form. I feel over time I have a better understanding of clarity and tone extension improvements or detraction .  You seem to notice, wow, it's really more clear today.  Or, the high end it better.  Or, its sounding thin and anemic.  If your not liking your system, or even if you are, pull it and live with it for a few days.  Then assess how you feel again.

[fas42]

The more transparent a rig, the more sensitive it typically is to making changes. And a large part of the reason is that the physical environment is disturbed in the activity of making the change - just the moving of cables to access where you need to make the alteration can be enough to "do the damage".

 

What I've learned is to be extremely circumspect - if you alter, do the absolute bare minumum, in a physical sense especially, to actually implement - you aiming to hear the result of doing one thing, and one thing only. Otherwise, it's a combo of factors that you are hearing the impact of - "stuff has to settle down", again, and you are vulnerable to getting 'wrong answers'.

[STC]

1 hour ago, KingRex said:

Then I listen for a couple days.  Then I take it out and listen for a couple days.  You find there is a lot to be learned from living with something for a while.  Over time some definite opinions of whether you like it or not form. I feel over time I have a better understanding of clarity and tone extension improvements or detraction .

 

It is possible provided you do this blind.

 

My example is about hearing suppression and short term memory where it is possible for the brain to fill in the missing the information.

[STC]

23 minutes ago, fas42 said:

The more transparent a rig, the more sensitive it typically is to making changes.

 

Which you do not have. A Sharp mini combo speaker is not transparent. 

 

3 hours ago, fas42 said:

wait for the old buggers to drop off the perch, because they refuse to change their position.

 

It has been 30 years for you to see the light.

 

Don't rely on your brain to do the job because it doing rather poorly here. It can't even keep on topic and starts to pollute this thread with your fantasy. This thread is not about your brain or your imaginary tweak. But then I feel sorry for you. What can a man with no working audio system could contribute other than hijacking others thread. 

[Teresa]

On 2/4/2019 at 5:27 PM, STC said:

Edit:- Sorry Teresa. I hope you dont read this post.  

 

Too late. However, I forgive your dip into misogyny. 🙂

[KingRex]

49 minutes ago, STC said:

 

It is possible provided you do this blind.

 

My example is about hearing suppression and short term memory where it is possible for the brain to fill in the missing the information.

Why does it have to be blind.  I come home, fire up the system.  Then I go and walk the dog.  I get back and work out to music.  Then I pour a drink and relax.  I hope most people are here to enjoy the music.  That's what I'm doing.  Its during the relaxation  time I react to what I like or dislike. If its good I usually leave it alone.  If its not I take note what's wrong, then change it back to original.   If its still wrong, well???????

 

In short, I think people are to quick to judge or rushing to form an opinion.  In those situations I fully buy into bias having lots of influence on what you think you hear. 

[Ralf11]

10 minutes ago, KingRex said:

Why does it have to be blind.  ...

 

 

bias has lots of influence on what you think you hear whether you do quick switching or long

[Kal Rubinson]

5 minutes ago, KingRex said:

Why does it have to be blind.  I come home, fire up the system.  Then I go and walk the dog.  I get back and work out to music.  Then I pour a drink and relax.  I hope most people are here to enjoy the music.  That's what I'm doing.  Its during the relaxation  time I react to what I like or dislike. If its good I usually leave it alone.  If its not I take note what's wrong, then change it back to original. 

Too many variables.  What did you drink that night and was there a night when you had no drink?  Was your dog cooperative every night?  How was the weather?  Are you always in the same mood and level of relaxation?  Do you include these variables in your deliberations?  Do you repeat the assessment under different or the same conditions?   Have you considered that all these things (in addition to your awareness of judging a particular component) will affect your perceptions?

[Ralf11]

Rex - if you search the site for "Oxford" (or maybe it was Cambridge) in a post by me you'll find a URL for some cutting edge research on cross-sensory perceptual issues

[STC]

48 minutes ago, Teresa said:

 

Too late. However, I forgive your dip into misogyny. 🙂

 

But we have to accept we do think differently. We means male and female. 

[STC]

39 minutes ago, KingRex said:

Why does it have to be blind.  I come home, fire up the system. 

 

That’s acceptable too if you are judging your system on other criterion. Nothing wrong with that. However, if you want to judge them based on one criteria only, like sound quality alone, then you have to eliminate other factors from

influencing your preference. 

 

Right now, I have the opportunity to test for four almost identical players. One is Ki and modified by CherinAudio. What will be the best way to pick them based in sound quality only?  

 

[Ralf11]

best thing is to use blind tests to select your components...

 

and THEN open the 30 year old Scotch

[fas42]

2 hours ago, STC said:

 

Which you do not have. A Sharp mini combo speaker is not transparent. 

 

Ahh, I forgot the magic that occurs when the Right Brand name is applied to a cabinet - there's a mystical transformation that occurs, that increases by a magnitude the SQ that can ever be possible, as soon as the right logo is attached ...

 

We will carefully ignore that fact that the drivers often come out of a big factory, that spits them out to suit a large range of 'boutique' makers, as well as the big boys.

 

Quote

 

 

It has been 30 years for you to see the light.

 

Don't rely on your brain to do the job because it doing rather poorly here. It can't even keep on topic and starts to pollute this thread with your fantasy. This thread is not about your brain or your imaginary tweak. But then I feel sorry for you. What can a man with no working audio system could contribute other than hijacking others thread. 

 

ST, you're losing the plot rather badly at this point - you can't even keep track of the fact that the NAD rig has been working quite nicely this week - did a rather pleasant job on a pipe organ plus orchestra CD last go ... care to know what it was?

[PeterSt]

52 minutes ago, STC said:

 

But we have to accept we do think differently. We means male and female. 

 

Sadly the woman is generally better at it (audio). IME.

[fas42]

1 hour ago, KingRex said:

Why does it have to be blind.  I come home, fire up the system.  Then I go and walk the dog.  I get back and work out to music.  Then I pour a drink and relax.  I hope most people are here to enjoy the music.  That's what I'm doing.  Its during the relaxation  time I react to what I like or dislike. If its good I usually leave it alone.  If its not I take note what's wrong, then change it back to original.   If its still wrong, well???????

 

In short, I think people are to quick to judge or rushing to form an opinion.  In those situations I fully buy into bias having lots of influence on what you think you hear. 

 

Yep, it's about the dislike factor. A barely good enough rig will fluctuate in the subjective sense, microscopically sensitive to things like the level of inebriation, to a couple of decimal places worth - if a rig is in a good place, then no matter how you feel, and what you throw at it, it will still sound like 'music'. Most systems live constantly in a state of unstable equilibrium, where ridiculous things matter - getting them into the zone where it always pleases is the goal, and then one can truly say, "Just enjoy the music!"

[STC]

22 minutes ago, fas42 said:

care to know what it was?

 

Nothing you could show that i am not aware of. 

 

 

You want more? 

 

Btw, are you now bypassing the SOTA Sharp speakers?  Connected the wires directly to your ears?

 

Frank, please dont hijack this thread with your fantasy. 

[PeterSt]

1 hour ago, Kal Rubinson said:

Have you considered that all these things (in addition to your awareness of judging a particular component) will affect your perceptions?

 

Me, explicitly. And my time for consensus is 5 days, although these days it tends to require 6 days (because beyond 5 days it can still go "wrong" (too many music types to run into and check)).

The only thing which is quite out of control for me is that the music quality itself starts to cause so much adrenaline that it circles itself up to infinite highs and nothing can sound wrong for the day. IOW, good reproduction is dangerous and it fires up blindness.

 

Please consider that I do this for myself all right but that in the end it is about products going out to e.g. "you". And they are not allowed to fail (I am not into it for the money).

[STC]

10 minutes ago, PeterSt said:

 

Sadly the woman is generally better at it (audio). IME.

 

Sadly?  I will be happy if I could find more like them. 

[PeterSt]

1 minute ago, STC said:

Sadly?  I will be happy if I could find more like them. 

 

Yes, that would be the better expression. Plus generally I like women better than men. 

[fas42]

Just now, STC said:

 

Nothing you could show that i am not aware of. 

 

Help! You didn't even follow that I was talking of the CD, the recording, I was playing - NOT the amplifier.

 

Your fantasy is that electronic parts have to certified to be of audiophile standard, before they "can sound good". Which is why the audio industry is currently in this awful mess, where people outside it think those in it are quite mad .. which seems to be partially true, .

 

If one actually applies a little bit of intelligence to the situation, then one can do the experiments to find out what really matters - and the results don't fit the stereotypes.

 

 

 

[STC]

2 minutes ago, PeterSt said:

 

 Plus generally I like women better than men. 

 

Don’t we all?  OTOH, maybe not.