Mytek Stereo 192

[mytek]

I'll be reposting what I wrote on headfi.org, hope this clarifies our design approach:

 

Actually, chipset manufacturer typically quote the performance of their demo board as the chipset performance. Analog section in Mytek DAC is simpler and uses parts optimized for sound, while keeping the basic DR specs comparable, so sonically we feel our implementation is better while it measures similarly. Mytek uses 9016 chip , a very good chipset comparable to other high end chipsets on the market such as PCM1792 or AD1955. I would say that at this level of performance (around 130dB) implementation becomes critical, and the way we designed analog section, its dynamic performance, no caps in analog path, the parts we used, the power supply, well grounded multilayer board and clean clock circuit has way more impact on the sound than the particular chip mentioned. For example a new excellent $8000 DAC from Bricasti uses AD1955 very successfully and so does our multichannel DSD capable 8x192ADDA. Sabre has some extras we liked like 32 bit processing, clever clock jitter approach, programmable filters etc. 9018 chip offers few more dBs in DR but that does not translate necessarily to huge sonic difference- this chip is twice as expensive as 9016 and beyond the budget for this $1695 unit. If we have used it , we would need to cut budget in features or in quality of analog and it just did not make sense from sonic perspective. When we tests our designs endless listening trials are integral part of it , while measurements make sure we stay at least within datasheet performance. In the end at this high level it's the sound which matters eventually, rather than the noise floor measurements. In our designs we look for sweet spot between these two. I soon should be posting some comparison files of what Mytek Stereo192-DSD-DAC does to sound, compared to competition. In meantime if you want to get a sense of how, for example, our older Mytek Stereo96dac compares to Benchmark sonically , and what's the difference in headphone amp sound, please check the files labeled "Mytek Stereo96-DAC and Benchmark Media DAC-1 comparison files:" here http://www.mytekdigital.com/compare/index.htm

 

Hope this clarifies things a bit. Regards Michal

 

Best Regards, Michal at Mytek

 

[arnolfini]

I think that it is interesting for us that you have explained the different coexisting elements which need to be optimised in your design with a care for technical measurements and listening sessions. And the fact that the dac chip itself is just one of many factors.

However it seems that the price difference between the chip themselves (ES9016:30$ and ES9010:60$) is a small quatity compared to the price of the product. Are you saying that the correct implementation of ES9018 is much more expensive than the other one?

Regards

Lorenzo

 

[arnolfini]

Sorry for the typo typo I meant ES9016 is 30$ and ES9018 is 60$

 

[HiFiInsider]

The DAC is shipping end of this month right? How does this compares to Apogee in non-DSD playback? Do you need drivers for OSX Lion?

 

There are two versions. Which would you say is best for music playback? The Mastering version cost less. Why?

 

This seller shows it as "in stock". Is it the same as final released version?

 

http://www.frontendaudio.com/Mytek-Digital-Stereo192-DSD-DAC-p/9999-08885.htm

 

[Synfreak]

As I noticed today, Foobar is / should now also be able to stream native DSD data via ASIO to appropriate hardware:

 

http://sourceforge.net/projects/sacddecoder/

 

It would be cool if someone at Mytek might be able to test this (and maybe Miskas HQ Player) and report back ...

 

Thanks

Harald

 

[mytek]

Hello- There is an avalanche of detailed QQ about various aspects of using Mytek with DSD and more. A lot of this like the Foobar SACD plug is new to us and we will be testing things as they come along. For now I can say Mytek supports regular DSD and 128xDSD on win7 via ASIO2.2 drivers so if software is using the same spec it should work. We'll be also announcing options for MAC OSX as they become available in the next few months.

 

 

Best Regards, Michal at Mytek

 

[Synfreak]

Michal, thank you for your reply!

 

Please keep us posted about your findings!

 

Cheers

Harald

 

[HiFiInsider]

Michal,

 

How does this new DAC compares to the Stereo96 in 16/44.1k or 24/96k playback? Is this new DAC a lot better?

 

[HiFiInsider]

Harald,

 

Please keep us posted on your impression of the DAC. It's build quality and sound.

 

[gregeasley]

Hey Michal,

 

The DAC looks very interesting to me, and it's great to see that you are based in New York (I lived in the city for 17 years).

 

Questions:

 

* Regarding the output stage, is it a discrete circuit or OP-amp based?

 

* Can you tell us more about the headphone amp? Will it play nicely with IEMs? (In my experience some headphone amps have too much gain or hiss to be used with IEMs like the JH Audio customs.)

 

Thanks!

 

[yverof]

Hi Michal,

 

Michal, do I misunderstood what you said that OSX drivers will not be available with the initial release of the new DAC ?

 

I am a very happy customer in France who has been using the DAC96 K for a few months, waiting for the 192K DAC. I have put an order through Mytek Europe and I am anxious to receive the new unit.

 

Every time I had friends who asked me to come with my 96 K DAC for a comparison with their DACs they ended up buying the Mytek, putting their's aside.

 

An other point to mention is the excellent service provided by Mytek Europe.

 

I have the Pure Music 1.8 software but I have not been successful in making it play DSD files (taken from free internet downloads). I hope over time Mytek and Pure Music will work smoothly together.

 

 

Thank you for your great work,

 

 

Yverof

 

[reverendo]

very, very interested in this DAC. Are there any real users using it and sharing impressions? Any comparisons been made yet?

It has all the functionality I need, but have no idea regarding the sound.

best regards

André

 

[Kalahaan]

Hello,

 

I am distributing audio products in Japan.

I am very interested by your new preamp/DAC as well !

I checked your Japanese distributor's web site but there is no reference to your products, or even your brand...

I will be following up this thread anyway.

Best regards,

Cedric

 

www.take5japan.com

 

 

[akustik80]

Hello All,

 

I am looking for dacs to replace/upgrade my arcam rdac. The Mytek is in the right price range and looks interesting.

 

Can anybody comment on the USB async implementation? It seems as though many dacs are claiming USB async.

 

Thanks!

 

[Kalahaan]

Would it be possible to setup the analog input (RCA) as a bypass, to connect to the pre-out of an AV amp for the main channels ?

 

Also can you please confirm the possibility to play DFF files from a Macbook using Puremusic 1.8 through the firewire connection ?

 

Thanks,

Cedric

 

[reverendo]

looks like we don't have any real-world experience up to now... I'm very curious.

 

[mytek]

Yes, this QQ already came up during development. There is a relay bypass of the fader that can be controlled from menu. This might not be yet available in first firmware rev, but soon after in the next firmware download.

 

Pure Music DSD file playback for both USB and FW is being worked on. This is the Pure Music feature and we are working together to make this possible asap.

 

Best Regards, Michal at Mytek

 

[mytek]

Async essentially means that the DAC uses its own internal clock for DAC conversion while only requesting data from USB pipeline when needed as opposed to using the clock coming from USB.

 

Async operation allows for using very low jitter internal clock for conversion, essentially isolating conversion from effects of jittery and "dirty" clock originating from computer.

 

Mytek USB2.0 port is async and so can be the FW port. Using low jitter 10ps internal clock provides the best quality conversion

 

Best Regards, Michal at Mytek New York

 

[mytek]

Yes, many more features and more resolution. Having said that Stereo96dac is extremely good for the money- when compared to products in the same price range. Here is an article about St96 shootout:

 

http://www.mytekdigital.com/download_library/PAR%20Review%20Jan%202010-Stereo96-Two-Channel%20Analog-to-Digital%20Converters%20(ADCs).pdf

 

Regards Michal

 

[mytek]

Mytek was established in NYC in 1992 by myself while I was working at Hit Factory and then later Skyline recording studios which where the two biggest recording studios in Manhattan at that time. I have designed our first 18 bit ADC in 1993. That prototype converter was used in many recording sessions at Skyline including Mariah Carey, B52s, James Taylor, The Chic, Lou Reed and many others. It was way better than Sony converters typically in studio use.

 

I have since designed more than 20 models of various ADCs and DACs mostly for mastering and professional use. When SACD was launching Mytek have worked on a couple of DSD design projects for Sony.

 

Stereo192-DSD-DAC is Mytek's first product aiming at hi-fi market but it does come from experienced hands. Since 1992 I'm in never ending critical listening sessions. We always aim to have our next product better than the previous one.

 

Best Regards, Michal Jurewicz, Founder of Mytek

 

[HiFiInsider]

I am one step away from pre-ordering one through Altas Audio. Is the product on schedule for ship end of this month? Would I be making a mistake by buying the Master version for home use for music playback only? Does it support OS X Lion right out of the gate?

 

[mytek]

There are both FW and USB OSX drivers, and the DAC is now capable of playing PCM up to 192k through either port, no problem. However DSD implementation on the Mac is different than on Win. Win use ASIO2.1 drivers for DSD/hi-resPCM and DSD specs are in the driver and thus the same for all applications which use DSD. Mac Core Audio does not have DSD spec and DSD on a Mac must be implemented individually for each application (at least for now). We are currently working with Channel D to have DSD implemented in Pure Music playback software (PM already does it with Playback Design DAC). So this feature might be added a bit later depending when we can finish it. DAC has user updatable firmware and we except to have more features added in the future this way.

 

I'll be posting the DAC manual in a day or two and more details should be there.

 

Regards, Michal, Mytek New York

 

[mytek]

The current drivers are for OSX10.6 but we do already have drivers for Lion being tested, I would except these to be released within few weeks. As a rule it's probably a good idea to not install the "latest and greatest" immediately on on an audio or video system that works fine with last rev of the system. From my studio experience such systems rely a lot on 3rd party software that needs time to catch up with OS change.

 

Regards Michal, Mytek New York

 

 

[mytek]

We've been accepting orders on first come first served basis and are shipping in the same sequence. We have sold over 100 pcs but decided to make 120pcs instead of 100 in the first batch when we understood the demand. We have extended the free cable offer by one week until Sept 9 but anything ordered now will likely not ship before Sept 30 , we are putting these out as fast as we can but we are a small Company so we can only work as fast as we can. After Sept 9 we will be offering the DAC without bonus cables for delivery in October.

 

Best Regards, Michal , New York

 

[alrmad]

I'm looking to substitute my pre-amp with the 192 Stereo DAC. In the pre-release product documentation it's clear that the the fader can control the RCA-outputs, but it doesn't mention whether the XLR-outputs are only fixed-level or if they can also be set to be controlled by the volume control?

This would be crucial to me as my power amp runs balanced and only accepts XLR.