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Audiolinux Server configurations, Software, Hardware, and Listening Impressions


lmitche

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On 10/6/2020 at 3:25 PM, cat6man said:

 

no responses at all.

is anyone using cpu isolation?

Hi Cat6man,

 

I used to configure AL with cpu isolation for Roon. Later Roon made a change in a new release and sound is better without the isolation. If you run Roon, I'd leave this alone.

 

Larry

Pareto Audio aka nuckleheadaudio

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21 hours ago, lmitche said:

Hi Cat6man,

 

I used to configure AL with cpu isolation for Roon. Later Roon made a change in a new release and sound is better without the isolation. If you run Roon, I'd leave this alone.

 

Larry

 

thanks for replying Larry.  I am only using squeezelite and have a dual core 7i7 NUC.

if you can, would you share the details of how you would set up cpu isolation for this case?

its not obvious to me what should be done (or even how)!

 

thanks

 

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2 hours ago, cat6man said:

 

thanks for replying Larry.  I am only using squeezelite and have a dual core 7i7 NUC.

if you can, would you share the details of how you would set up cpu isolation for this case?

its not obvious to me what should be done (or even how)!

 

thanks

 

Hi cat6man,

 

The AL menu should contain all you need. First create the isolated cores, one for the OS and one for apps. Next assign your app, squeezelite to run in the isolated core.

 

Having said that, I couldn't tell you what will happen to your SQ if you do this. With two cores, you may be better off leaving things alone. This really depends on the squeezelite process architecture which I have never explored.

 

 

Pareto Audio aka nuckleheadaudio

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On 10/8/2020 at 7:54 PM, lmitche said:

Hi cat6man,

 

The AL menu should contain all you need. First create the isolated cores, one for the OS and one for apps. Next assign your app, squeezelite to run in the isolated core.

 

Having said that, I couldn't tell you what will happen to your SQ if you do this. With two cores, you may be better off leaving things alone. This really depends on the squeezelite process architecture which I have never explored.

 

 

 

thanks.  i'll give it a try this weekend.

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Some news.

 

RASPBERRY 4 Version 1.3.0  Most of changes already introduced for Audiolinux now ported to Raspberry. Menu version is 109

 

1) Full system update

2) Kernel updated to linux-raspberry4-rt version 5.4.69-1-rt39 (custom kernel only for Audiolinux)
3) Menu 109 with

New option 1 "REALTIME MANUAL ASSIGNMENT configuration" configuration" in EXPERT menu. This is a great news, since now you can set priority for IRQ, APPLICATION and NETWORK and see a summary with 0 "SHOW configuration" in main menu. This script is available only on Audiolinux and is using proprietary code.

ISOLATE CORES option 16 "ISOLATED CPU CORES configuration" completely changed. Now you can isolate and... de-isolate CPU cores without changing kernel line and reboot. The effects are immediate!
7 "ISOLATED CORES Assign core to application" in expert menu also changed with the new isolated cores configuration. Applications can use different cores and configured without restarting. An application is checking the isolation status periodically and will make the necessary changes.

Improved 0 "SHOW configuration" in main menu now show also which applications are running in which core.

Added buffer option to 9 "SQUEEZELITE select DAC and buffer" in audio menu

Now in Web Interface at ipaddress:5001 the various menus are in different folders. A lot more easy to use!

Many other little changes and fixes and a general cleaning of scripts removing duplicates.

Simplified Realtime Priority summary on SHOW configuration and some other minor fixes

Main menu will try only 2 times to download new version number to avoid too long waiting time if Internet connection is down or slow. Menu update script will download menu file only if necessary

Since the package spotifyd-bin is no more available, it has been replaced by spotifyd-slim

Now after installing this package and logitechmediaserver-git all packages needed only for compilation are removed, to save disk space

Profile scripts updated to the new options

 

 

AudioLinux --> https://www.audio-linux.com

developer of AudioLinux realtime OS

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On 10/8/2020 at 7:54 PM, lmitche said:

Hi cat6man,

 

The AL menu should contain all you need. First create the isolated cores, one for the OS and one for apps. Next assign your app, squeezelite to run in the isolated core.

 

Having said that, I couldn't tell you what will happen to your SQ if you do this. With two cores, you may be better off leaving things alone. This really depends on the squeezelite process architecture which I have never explored.

 

 

 

hi larry,

 

cockpit error here.............i have a 4-core i7-8650 cpu.

any recommendations on how many cores to assign to squeezelite?

is there anything else to isolate if squeezelite is the only audio app running?

 

it isolated cores 2 and 3 and i assigned squeezelite to both of them.

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15 hours ago, cat6man said:

 

hi larry,

 

cockpit error here.............i have a 4-core i7-8650 cpu.

any recommendations on how many cores to assign to squeezelite?

is there anything else to isolate if squeezelite is the only audio app running?

 

it isolated cores 2 and 3 and i assigned squeezelite to both of them.

Hi cat6man,

 

With little squeezelite experience, I can't say which of the four possible permutations of core isolation in a 4 core box would yield the best SQ. You are going to have to try each one and have a listen. There is really no avoiding this.

 

Don't forget to assign the squeezlite app to the non-OS core segment using the expert menu.

Pareto Audio aka nuckleheadaudio

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thanks larry.

 

i tried two configs yesterday, isolating cores 2 and 3.

when i assigned squeezelite to just core 2, there was a small increase in sound quality but the real benefit came when i assigned both cores 2 and 3 to squeezelite.

listening was only with headphones (stax 009) but the change in soundstage was dramatic, feeling much more of a larger and surrounding image in place of one laid out in front of me.  there was also more detail without edginess, and i was able to more easily follow multiple instrumental lines voices. 

 

 

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hi, I'm posting here the question hoping someone has a similar use case. I recently acquired a second hand X86 music server that is relatively weak on HW configuration, but has a pretty decent HW components. A low power Jetway motherboard and Celeron N2930 CPU. A linear power supply (again I understood it's not of the highest quality but still) and a jcat USB card. Until recently I ran a Roon ROCK and fed an endpoint from it (previously a USbridge Signature, now the new server). Enter the new server, I ended running Roon server in Ramroot on the new machine. In my setup this delivers the best sound quality I've ever had from my particular setup. 

Although the machine is weak, the 8gb of RAM are sufficient after some tweaks to run Roon Server in ramroot. I stopped doing DSD oversampling which I used to do before in the two box setup. As I say, for me it is still the best sound I've had until now. 

 

As my NUC machine is now idle, I started toying with the idea of installing Audiolinux on it as well, run Roon server on it. Question to the audience if anyone tried a similar flavour setup. My NUC is a much stronger box with an i5 CPU and 16GB of RAM. I could presumably then try to run it also in Ramroot and upsample. 

 

I wonder if anyone played with a similar scenario and can give some tips? I briefly discussed this scenario with Piero when I had issues setting up my machine, but as this is not support don't want to bother him any further with that....

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18 hours ago, al2813 said:

Question to the audience if anyone tried a similar flavour setup

I have been running two machines (1 server + 1 endpoint) for quite some time. The simpler PC, the celeron, with simplified components and ideally no fan should be (usually) the one for the endpoint, simple components, celeron etc. lowers the EMI/RFI footprint which is critical for the endpoint / renderer.

Since it is a simpler computer will be easily powered by an LPS shall you choose to.

 

I have been going back and forth between 2 PC's vs 1 PC over the last year due to specifics on my configuration, I have always preferred the 2 box solution, I have a similar setup EXCEPT I upsample with HQPlayer (which in my case makes all the difference with Roon alone).

Hope this helps, don't hesitate to post more questions, I'm going under Tropical Storm conditions in Florida now, possibly losing power so I might not be able to reply immediately

 

EDIT: Let me add that I ran Roon alone at some point, Server + Bridge, same results with sound quality, preferred the 2 box over 1

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On 11/8/2020 at 2:26 PM, luisma said:

I have been running two machines (1 server + 1 endpoint) for quite some time. The simpler PC, the celeron, with simplified components and ideally no fan should be (usually) the one for the endpoint, simple components, celeron etc. lowers the EMI/RFI footprint which is critical for the endpoint / renderer.

Since it is a simpler computer will be easily powered by an LPS shall you choose to.

 

I have been going back and forth between 2 PC's vs 1 PC over the last year due to specifics on my configuration, I have always preferred the 2 box solution, I have a similar setup EXCEPT I upsample with HQPlayer (which in my case makes all the difference with Roon alone).

Hope this helps, don't hesitate to post more questions, I'm going under Tropical Storm conditions in Florida now, possibly losing power so I might not be able to reply immediately

 

EDIT: Let me add that I ran Roon alone at some point, Server + Bridge, same results with sound quality, preferred the 2 box over 1

 

 

Thanks for this! hopefully the tropical storm is not causing damage! 

I've read numerous posts yesterday about the AL NUC setup. I am struggling to get it to work but I did not pay any attention to BIOS tweaks - will have a second shot tonight after work. 

 

A few questions to you as i noticed you have worked out your NUC setup over time: 

 

- Are you running the NUC without a disk? I have an m2 drive there and although I do plan to go Ramroot, I was thinking of installing AL on the M2 internal SSD. 

- You're currently using the NUC as the server side. Are you using the standard power supply? 

 

I am thinking of taking the NUC to a fanless case in light of potentially using it in the future as a second end point and adding down the line LPS. only thing is that I am now not sure of the direction to go as Akasa's cases are great value, but they don't allow for a future PCIE USB card. HDPlex H1 does but costs a lot more. 

 

 

 

 

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You can look here for example: https://www.kernel.org/category/releases.html

 

Longterm
There are usually several "longterm maintenance" kernel releases provided for the purposes of backporting bugfixes for older kernel trees. Only important bugfixes are applied to such kernels and they don't usually see very frequent releases, especially for older trees.

 

In general LTS kernels are considered very stable. Also realtime patch (number 70) should work good.

AudioLinux --> https://www.audio-linux.com

developer of AudioLinux realtime OS

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1 hour ago, lmitche said:

Plug one of these into one of the direct to cpu USB 3 ports on your motherboard and you will be good to go.

Thanks Larry, greatly appreciate the advise, going to go ahead and get it, I was browsing boards last night and none of the B550 or even X570 with Intel nics are practical to use for my build, this saves me the trouble ... thank you

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1 hour ago, luisma said:

Thanks Larry, greatly appreciate the advise, going to go ahead and get it, I was browsing boards last night and none of the B550 or even X570 with Intel nics are practical to use for my build, this saves me the trouble ... thank you

If you like the Tplink, the next step is to get a Monoprice Slimrun USB fiber cable externally powered by a good 5 volt source. Just plug the Tplink into the downstream port.

 

Using a Monoprice on the DAC side increases SQ as well.

Pareto Audio aka nuckleheadaudio

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On 11/15/2020 at 12:28 AM, lmitche said:

Luisma,

 

Plug one of these into one of the direct to cpu USB 3 ports on your motherboard and you will be good to go.

It will sound better then the onboard NIC ever will as you avoid the PCH. In the US the cost is $12 on Amazon.

 

https://www.tp-link.com/us/home-networking/usb-converter/ue300/

 

This NIC is fully supported in Archlinux. Remember to disable the onboard NIC in bios.

Thanks for sharing this Larry... I've put this UE300 on my endpoint nuc between my Etheregen b side and turned off the LAN in the bios.... I'm impressed with the change after a few days... Things are still settling in and the initial harshness seems to have worn off now.

 

Have you found that there ue300 sounds particularly good/better than other usb nics? Or will others have a similar impact? Are all USB 3.0 ports direct to cpu?

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@Bricki If memory serves me right, I preferred the TP-link UE300 for 'smoothness' to the older USB 2 adapters from Apple & Anker. On my boards I find that for the same type of USB port, I prefer the one physically farther away from the RJ45 port even when the LAN controller is disabled in BIOS.

I do not have a USB PCIe card at the moment (my last one died) so I have not tested the direct lines to the CPU on this new board I am trying out (Gigabyte Aorus Master)

 

ATB

b.

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On 11/17/2020 at 3:27 AM, Bricki said:

Thanks for sharing this Larry... I've put this UE300 on my endpoint nuc between my Etheregen b side and turned off the LAN in the bios.... I'm impressed with the change after a few days... Things are still settling in and the initial harshness seems to have worn off now.

 

Have you found that there ue300 sounds particularly good/better than other usb nics? Or will others have a similar impact? Are all USB 3.0 ports direct to cpu?

Hi Bricki,

 

Answers to your questions are below:

 

Have you found that there ue300 sounds particularly good/better than other usb nics? Or will others have a similar impact?

  • While I certainly haven't done an exhaustive review of the various USB nics, the Tplink does seem to sound best. However, most run with the same realtek chipset so are probably close to identical.

Are all USB 3.0 ports direct to cpu?

  • No this varies across motherboards and cpu manufacturers. AMD machines have a PCH onboard the processor chip so there are usually 4 direct to cpu USB 3 ports on AMD motherboards. Look at the block diagram of your motherboard to determine which ports go direct.

Larry

Pareto Audio aka nuckleheadaudio

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On 11/17/2020 at 5:46 AM, Miska said:

Problem with USB ethernet adapters is that USB devices always require quite a bit of CPU involvement to deal with USB protocol.

Playing a 192/24 Qobuz track in Roonserver with no-upsampling, an 8 core AMD machine at 3200ghz  runs at 98.64% idle and draws 16.14 watts. With playback stopped, and 100% idle, power usage is 15.75 watts. The machine is USB DAC direct so two USB ports are in use.

 

The USB NIC plus Roonserver overhead appears to be negligible at 1.36% of the processors and .39 watts.

 

The CPU direct USB NIC approach also avoids the motherboard PCH and the 4x PCIE lane congestion on most consumer motherboards. This just sounds better.

Pareto Audio aka nuckleheadaudio

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