Jump to content
IGNORED

GentooPlayer


Recommended Posts

19 minutes ago, Loukiz said:

 

I'm running a Metrum Adagio Dac with Metrum Ambre as streamer (basically a Raspberry Pi 3B+ with Femto Clock board and linear power supply). The connection between the Ambre and the Dac is I2S direct via ethernet. 

 

Before that I was running USB: either directly to the Metrum (not that great) or via a Gustard U16 (via AES into the Dac), which was replaced by a Audio-GD DI-20 (via AES into the Dac). 

 

The Software I tested with all these combinations included: Amarra, Audirvana, Roon, HQPlayer and Logitech Media Server.

 

The Linux images I tested on the Metrum Ambre include: Ropieee, PiCorePlayer, Moode, Volumio and of course Gentooplayer :D

 

In summary (put into different categories):

 

  1. Ethernet > USB (ethernet provides error correction and galvanic isolation as standard). This leads to more Details without sounding harsh/analytical.
  2. Metrum Ambre > Audio GD DI-20 > Gustard U16 > USB direct. 
  3. I2S > AES. Tested on the Ambre, as it also includes an AES output. AES or BNC always have to recover the clock signal which is avoided with I2S directly. 
  4. Sound via USB: Amarra > HQPlayer > Audirvana > Roon. Roon never provided me with a sound I liked, it tends to sound harsh in my system and the separation of instruments/voices is not as good as with the others. With the others you get different flavours: Amarra is the warmest sounding by far, followed by HQPlayer. Audirvana is however much more detailed and provides the biggest soundstage (both in width and depth).
  5. Sound via Ethernet (Ambre): Audirvana (Upnp) > HQPlayer (NAA) = Roon (HQPlayer plugin) > LMS (squeezelite) > Roon (squeezelite) > Roon (Roonbridge). Roon again sounds harsh in my system, but gets better with either squeezelite plugin or HQPlayer plugin (with HQPlayer it's actually very good). Audirvana via Upnp is in a league of it's own at the moment, the details are astonishing and the soundstage is huge (3-dimensional sound). 
  6. RPI Images: Gentooplayer > PiCorePlayer > Moode > Ropieee = Volumio. Gentooplayer with upnp/MPD works awesome in conjunction with Audirvana. PiCorePlayer sounds very good as well but it does not offer upnp. Moode is good but does not provide the same detail and in my system it occasionally sounded "artificial". Ropieee and Volumio are great choices if you don't want to tweak as much and both sound nice.

 

I switched back to a non-RT kernel as well, as these also tend to sound a little warmer in general, at least in my system. I'm now using 4.19.89-GentooPlayer-MIN-NOGRAPH-RCU+

 

I hope this provides others with some helpful information :)

 

 

 

Hi @Loukiz,

excellent post:-)

 

What is your verdict on Audirvana via USB vs Audirvana via UPnP?

Which delivers better SQ?

 

Thank you

 

Matt

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, matthias said:

Hi @Loukiz,

excellent post:-)

 

What is your verdict on Audirvana via USB vs Audirvana via UPnP?

Which delivers better SQ?

 

Thank you

 

Matt

 

 

 

Thanks! :)

 

Upnp in my system, but of course this comparison involves different devices to achieve the best approach for each:

 

Audirvana via USB:  MacBook Pro > USB > Audio-GD DI-20 > AES > DAC

Audirvana via Upnp:  MacBook Pro > Ethernet > Metrum Ambre (Gentooplayer) > I2S > DAC

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Loukiz said:

 

Thanks! :)

 

Upnp in my system, but of course this comparison involves different devices to achieve the best approach for each:

 

Audirvana via USB:  MacBook Pro > USB > Audio-GD DI-20 > AES > DAC

Audirvana via Upnp:  MacBook Pro > Ethernet > Metrum Ambre (Gentooplayer) > I2S > DAC

 

 

 

May I  ask two additional questions?

 

Would like to buy a Macbook Pro, what do you think about the SQ of this device?

Did you try "Internet sharing" with your Macbook Pro via UPnP?

 

Thanks

 

Matt

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, matthias said:

 

May I  ask two additional questions?

 

Would like to buy a Macbook Pro, what do you think about the SQ of this device?

Did you try "Internet sharing" with your Macbook Pro via UPnP?

 

Thanks

 

Matt

 

Via USB the Sound quality of a MacBook is probably limited (switching power supply and not optimized for USB audio in general) but this can be improved with USB to SPDIF/AES/I2S converters such as the Gustard U16 or DI-20. The DI-20 for example provides galvanic isolation on the USB input and there are other devices that provide this as well. 

 

Via Ethernet you already have galvanic isolation and if using a dedicated streamer you always have a more optimized computer for converting your audio into the final format (but this is true for USB as well).

 

I'm using "Internet sharing" via Mac System preferences right now :)  I did not want to use Wi-Fi on the Metrum Ambre Streamer and my MacBook is right next to it. 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, matthias said:

Hi @Loukiz,

excellent post:-)

 

What is your verdict on Audirvana via USB vs Audirvana via UPnP?

Which delivers better SQ?

 

Thank you

 

Matt

 

 

 

I recently had an audio-technician friend over to compare this same thing, using Audirvana and UPnP:

 

Mac Mini -> USB -> Doge DAC

vs.

Mac Mini -> Allo USB Sig -> Doge DAC

 

The Allo was much cleaner and more transparent.  I have the Allo connected directly to the Mac Mini via an ethernet bridge.

Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, zackthedog said:

 

I recently had an audio-technician friend over to compare this same thing, using Audirvana and UPnP:

 

Mac Mini -> USB -> Doge DAC

vs.

Mac Mini -> Allo USB Sig -> Doge DAC

 

The Allo was much cleaner and more transparent.  I have the Allo connected directly to the Mac Mini via an ethernet bridge.

 

Thanks for sharing.

More important for me than cleaner and more transparent is slam, dynamics and rhythm.

Are these also improved with the Allo?

 

Matt

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, matthias said:

 

Thanks for sharing.

More important for me than cleaner and more transparent is slam, dynamics and rhythm.

Are these also improved with the Allo?

 

Matt

 

 

 

They are unaffected as far as I can tell.  I mean, with less noise and crisper transients you are able to hear more information in the recording.  Live jazz recordings convey more ambient sounds, like glasses clinking and musicians shifting around the mic, things like that.   There's also a pretty wide variety of player software that will give you slightly different sounds.  So far I like Volumio the least, it does sound a little more sluggish to me.  Moode probably has the most "vigorous" sound and Gentoo is more spacious.

 

ETA:  If you want ultimate speed and dynamics load your files onto the player's internal drive.  I haven't tried it with Gentoo but with Moode you get almost scary clarity.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I tried the new Gentooplayer 64-bit with the Allo USB Sig today, with USB output and Upmpdcli, using Audirvana.  It seems that by selecting MPD BitPerfect in the web gui I was able to select a variety of kernels without clicks or pops, but my ears are older and I'll have to check more carefully.  But I was able to do DSD without a problem.  I wish the web gui had a kernel change menu, or am I missing it somewhere?

Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, zackthedog said:

I tried the new Gento 64-bit with the Allo USB Sig today, with USB output and Upmpdcli, using Audirvana.  It seems that by selecting MPD BitPerfect in the web gui I was able to select a variety of kernels without clicks or pops, but my ears are older and I'll have to check more carefully.  But I was able to do DSD without a problem.  I wish the web gui had a kernel change menu, or am I missing it somewhere?

Its an option on the left.  I'm at work, and don't remember exactly what it was called, but was pretty obvious I thought.  You do have to scroll down a bit to get to it.

 

How do you select BitPerfect?  Or maybe I just need to look for it when I get home.

 

FWIW, I compared my fairly highly tweaked audio PC to the usbridge sig, and the sig sounded better, not even close, IMO.  This PC sounds way better than an old macbook I have

 

Randy

Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, randytsuch said:

Its an option on the left.  I'm at work, and don't remember exactly what it was called, but was pretty obvious I thought.  You do have to scroll down a bit to get to it.

 

How do you select BitPerfect?  Or maybe I just need to look for it when I get home.

 

FWIW, I compared my fairly highly tweaked audio PC to the usbridge sig, and the sig sounded better, not even close, IMO.  This PC sounds way better than an old macbook I have

 

Randy

 

I found it, thanks!  Staring at me. 😉  MPD BitPerfect is Player No. 4 in the left-hand gui menu.

 

I had a *very* expensive tricked-out server I built over the course of six months.  This is better. 😉

Link to post
Share on other sites

@antonellocaroli  I am going to ref lash my cards tomorrow with the latest release.  I want to systematically test a few of the kernels.  Is there any special order to process you would like me to use?  There are a LOT of options.  I am mostly looking for ones that do not make clicks/pops and to see if any of them “sound better?

 

bob

 

OH another thing. On the web menu for the players that are enabled or disabled your menu says “enable” or “disable”.  The tense would be “Enabled” or “Disabled” to show the status which is what I think the menu is trying to show us.  If I am wrong, not a problem.

 

Also in the left menu the Player 1 item subtitle might be better stated as “Select Player” 

 

The  Player 4, 4,5,6  should maybe be “MPD”. All caps

The Player 5 item has” libesmplarate” after it.  I do not know what that means

The System 1 should have a space between Select and kernel

E6598CA9-C18B-4964-A47F-6A51BAF88E02.thumb.jpeg.6e822e92d2dc9038e718e9e4ded35e52.jpeg

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, zackthedog said:

 I wish the web gui had a kernel change menu, or am I missing it somewhere?

 

I don't know exactly what you mean.
But there is a SelectKernel.

http://gentooplayer.com/webinterface

 

 

 

 

24 minutes ago, bobfa said:

@antonellocaroli  I am going to ref lash my cards tomorrow with the latest release.  I want to systematically test a few of the kernels.  Is there any special order to process you would like me to use?  There are a LOT of options.  I am mostly looking for ones that do not make clicks/pops and to see if any of them “sound better?

 

bob

 

OH another thing. On the web menu for the players that are enabled or disabled your menu says “enable” or “disable”.  The tense would be “Enabled” or “Disabled” to show the status which is what I think the menu is trying to show us.  If I am wrong, not a problem.

 

Also in the left menu the Player 1 item subtitle might be better stated as “Select Player” 

 

The  Player 4, 4,5,6  should maybe be “MPD”. All caps

The Player 5 item has” libesmplarate” after it.  I do not know what that means

The System 1 should have a space between Select and kernel

E6598CA9-C18B-4964-A47F-6A51BAF88E02.thumb.jpeg.6e822e92d2dc9038e718e9e4ded35e52.jpeg

 

 

Thanks Bobfa!!!

 

Yes, in fact enable shows the state, but also the possibility to change it. So what's the best option?

Libsemplerate, in reality it's libsamplerate. I was wrong to write....😊
http://www.mega-nerd.com/libsamplerate/

https://www.musicpd.org/doc/html/plugins.html#resampler-plugins

Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

I am going to ref lash my cards tomorrow with the latest release.  I want to systematically test a few of the kernels.  Is there any special order to process you would like me to use?  There are a LOT of options.  I am mostly looking for ones that do not make clicks/pops and to see if any of them “sound better?

 

From what I'm understanding, the most stable thing for USB Bridge is to use a 4.14 kernel not RT, only that in the kernel list there are three 4.14 but they are RT (18,20 and 21), maybe try them.....

Link to post
Share on other sites

I guess the click/pop issue (with the USBridge Signature) is probably DAC dependent.

 

I'm not getting any clicks or pops with any of the kernels, and this is true with both USB and SPDIF output.

 

I tested a few different methods of Ethernet hookup (in case maybe that's where the issue is), but none of them resulted in any pops/clicks.  

 

I'm sure about it, because I'm listening with headphones (where clicks/pops would be obvious).

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

gentooplayer right now one of the most problem-free build if you want to find no any clicks and pops. there are more preferable builds from sound point of view like picoreAP, yoctoap, dastereo edition, especially if you choose Aplayer as output, but a lot of clicks and pops there. 

The problem of clicks and pops of usbridgesig is certainly need to be resolved from allo side. and as I've understood it lies in the ASIX driver fixing for Linux kernel team.

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, bobfa said:

 

 

I would like to add my name to the list of VERY happy people with the Allo USBridge Sig!

 

I have been testing servers and systems for about 8 years.  Starting with Mac Laptops, MacMini’s and a series of commercial servers.  I then started building my own systems. I built a NUC and a Xeon Server.  NONE of them sounded as good as the Allo.  I am sure we will get past the little issues with Linux issues

 

I was surprised and happy!

 

bob 

 

 

 

Hi Bob,

please can you shed some light on how big the impact of the "core" server (Audirvana, Roon) is in a combo with the Allo USBridge Signature.

Is there a SQ difference between a MacBook Pro and a Xeon Server for example as a core when they both play to an Allo UBS downstream?

Thanks

 

Matt

Link to post
Share on other sites

I decided to put my system details in my audio system page and included it in my footer so anyone can see what I'm have now.

 

Of significance here (maybe) is I am using hqplayer to upsample to dsd256.  When I was using the revised, supposed to fix pops version of allo's dietpi, I didn't hear pops at dsd128, only at 256.  Haven't tried with GentooPlayer, maybe I'll do that just to see.

 

Also, since I was able to make changes to the pi clock rate and fix the pops, I've decided, for my problem, its related to pi overhead.  But I look at the pi's usage, and its not that busy, less than 30% for any core at most from what I remember.  But maybe there are times when its not responding fast enough?

 

I also made a 2nd sd card with gentooplayer 64 bit last night and retried it.  Definitely hear pops, worse on the rt kernels (even 18 and 20).  Then I can pretty much fix it using "profile select" to select one of the offered profiles.  Last night I was trying a different kernel/profile combination and may have heard a few faint pops, but not enough to bother me.  I expect that profile select is optimizing the pi for music playback, so it can respond faster and no pops.


Randy

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/3/2020 at 8:58 AM, alecm said:

gentooplayer right now one of the most problem-free build if you want to find no any clicks and pops. there are more preferable builds from sound point of view like picoreAP, yoctoap, dastereo edition, especially if you choose Aplayer as output, but a lot of clicks and pops there. 

The problem of clicks and pops of usbridgesig is certainly need to be resolved from allo side. and as I've understood it lies in the ASIX driver fixing for Linux kernel team.

 

It looks like Allo have done something in conjunction with DietPi.

 

DietPi v6.27 released on 1st January has this in the changelog"

 

An updated USBridgeSig Ethernet driver, as provided by allo.com, will be applied via postinst kernel script, until it has been merged into official RPi kernel: https://github.com/allocom/USBridgeSig/tree/master/ethernet

 

I haven't tried it yet.

 

It would be great if something similar would be possible with GentooPlayer so that we can enjoy system in RAM, profiles. multiple kernels etc.!

 

Chris

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, Chris_Shorter said:

 

It looks like Allo have done something in conjunction with DietPi.

 

DietPi v6.27 released on 1st January has this in the changelog"

 

An updated USBridgeSig Ethernet driver, as provided by allo.com, will be applied via postinst kernel script, until it has been merged into official RPi kernel: https://github.com/allocom/USBridgeSig/tree/master/ethernet

 

I haven't tried it yet.

 

It would be great if something similar would be possible with GentooPlayer so that we can enjoy system in RAM, profiles. multiple kernels etc.!

 

Chris

 

 

hi Chris,

That driver already tied into gentooplayer.image.thumb.png.f0174ed92d2dd864824d26fbe2b0070d.png

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Install Gentooplayer on an Intel X64_64: does anyone have a manual or how-to? 

The Raspberry Pi version is simple, but install on an SSD in an intel X64_64 musicserver is really different.

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, Krk said:

Install Gentooplayer on an Intel X64_64: does anyone have a manual or how-to? 

The Raspberry Pi version is simple, but install on an SSD in an intel X64_64 musicserver is really different.

 

 

you unfortunately etcher does not install on internal hard drives ...

to install on a ssd you have to continue in this way:

boot the pc with a live linux (any) put on usbstick, it could also be gentooplayer-xfce put on usbstick with etcher...

 

download the image

 

open a terminal and become root (in gentoo to become root just give the command "su" and then type the password)

 

then take over

 

xzcat /path-to-file/file.img.xz > /dev/sdX && sync

sdX is the disk where to install

example sda, sdb, sdc, etc.

 

Be careful to choose the right disc... the disc is overwritten...

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×
×
  • Create New...