Sonore opticalRendu

[Metnoc]

15 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

You could power the opticalModule from the LPS-1.2 and see how that works for you. The iFi, if it’s DC negative is not shunt to AC ground, has noise on its DC output and others have commented that they achieve better results with a better power supply on the opticalModule. Also, we don’t make these units to emphasize any particular frequency range. On the contrary are units are meant to be brutally honest in their music reproduction. The power supply can invoke some character of its own on a Rendu, but usually less so with quality power supplies. From my perspective the source should be neutral and not used for tuning your system as that is what your DAC, cables, and AMP are for. 

I've tried powering the OM with lps 1.2, but that was a few days ago, can try it again.
I've heard this statement more than a few times: "our products sounds neutral", but I'm not sure If I've heard any hifi component that also sounds neutral.

[GryphonGuy]

1 hour ago, Metnoc said:

I've had this recommended to me before, now I'm using the Sonore dc cable.
But I guess the Ghent sounds good as well.

 

The Ghent dc-gac4 (JSSG360) blows away other star quads like the uptone star-quad. I've not heard the Sonore dc cable.

 

Regards

GG

[vortecjr]

54 minutes ago, Metnoc said:

I've tried powering the OM with lps 1.2, but that was a few days ago, can try it again.
I've heard this statement more than a few times: "our products are neutral", but I'm not sure If I've heard any hifi component that really sounds neutral.

I think you pretty much showed yourself. Again, I gave you some examples of what we know, from measurements, makes a difference and what doesn’t. This is not the follow the leader thread. On this thread we don’t argue perception and we just try to explain things as best as we can and help you sort it out. If people aren’t having different experiences then that is a red flag for me. If this combination doesn’t do it for then enjoy the one that does.

 

[vortecjr]

9 minutes ago, GryphonGuy said:

 

The Ghent dc-gac4 (JSSG360) blows away other star quads like the uptone star-quad. I've not heard the Sonore dc cable.

 

Regards

GG

It’s not a “star quad” anything:)

[charlesphoto]

The 12" Ghent JSSG Neotech 7N solid 16g OCC I just got is really nice as well after a bit of burn-in (for the opticalModule). Might try making a Vh Audio FEP starquad for the NUC. 

[Metnoc]

17 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

I think you pretty much showed yourself. Again, I gave you some examples of what we know, from measurements, makes a difference and what doesn’t. This is not the follow the leader thread. On this thread we don’t argue perception and just we try to explain things as best as we can and help you sort it out. If people aren’t having different experiences then that is a red flag for me. If this combination doesn’t do it for then enjoy the one that does.

 

 

I'm happy to have tried the OR, its a nice streamer and I can see many preferring it over the SMS. I'm not sure I would describe either OR/Ci or the SMS/Uptone as completely neutral in my stereo. But the point here is not to debate such things, I just wanted to share my impressions. 
 

[vortecjr]

19 minutes ago, Metnoc said:

 

I'm happy to have tried the OR, its a nice streamer and I can see many preferring it over the SMS. I'm not sure I would describe either OR/Ci or the SMS/Uptone as completely neutral in my stereo. But the point here is not to debate such things, I just wanted to share my impressions. 
 

You described this perfectly yourself. You said the opticalRendu had more soundstage and greater delineation. You said the other unit was more dense and full. What do you think is the likely cause of more sound stage and greater delineation. IMO this is less of the bad stuff that causes music to sound more dense and full. Reviewers who are use to working with different sources understand this and account for it when commenting on gear. However, when you source tone your system, like many here do, I can see how one might have a preference. If you look around here this forum is obsessed with source side tuning and seem to ignore DACs, pre-amps, amplifiers, and speakers. This forum is source centric:) Again, i’m not arguing your preference in your system...I’m just trying to explain it.

[lestes]

About 3 weeks in now with the OR w/SGC power supply.  I couldn't be happier.  My vinyl rig has been gathering some dust but I think that will level out in time.  It's been fun.  I thought I might share some experience here and hopefully gather some insight from the group.

 

Original Setup 1: Ubiquiti EdgeRouter SFP, Audioquest CAT 7 construction cable 20' run to stereo (their in wall spool), to Starter switch with SFP, Sonore supplied Optical Cable, OR with SGC PS.  This definitely bettered my Auralic Aries to PS Audio DS DAC using Audioquest Diamond USB

 

Setup 2: While waiting for the OR to arrive I installed the Ubiquiti to replace a Netgear WiFi router that was antiquated.  Of course I bought a router with SFP port so I had to get a 10m run of Optical Cable for $18 to try a direct connection.  When I originally purchased the OR Starter Kit I did not foresee this change.  When the direct connection to router came in it significantly bettered the Audioquest to switch setup.  

 

Setup 3 I was being curious if the OM would better a direct connection to the router.  Sonore/SGC were fantastic to deal with.  They took the switch back and credited me towards the OM.  I tried the OM first near the OR, connected to the 20' run of Audioquest CAT 7 construction grade cable and using the previous 1m supplied Optical Cable.  The OM is powered by its own SGC PS.  It was clear this was not as good as direct to the router.  I also swapped the 1m cable with the 10m just to make sure it wasn't the cable.

 

Setup 4 was to use a 1m Audioquest Vodka ethernet cable between router and OM and the same 10m Optical Cable to the OR that yielded such good results from the router.  Here is where the better part of two weeks have been spent.  This was a slightly different but good setup.  

 

Both this arrangement and the direct to router arrangement were tried for many days in a row each.  I have settled on using the router arrangement.  The music just feels more immediate and alive to me.  I am now curious if anyone else has compared the OM to a direct router SFP?  If you are using the OM I would not rush out to change, however in my system I found it to have lots of detail but less life.  Each arrangement takes a bit to suss out, but the OM never came around to making me sink into the music the same way the router connection does.  The beauty is that the OR is amazing and very honest.  I am convinced any change upstream of it will reveal different results.  I am currently thinking about a dedicated PS for the Ubiquiti EdgeRouter to see what that does.  Right now I prefer it and it is on its factory supplied PS.  

 

I am eager to hear from each of you.  Right now I am ecstatic with the OR.  

[vortecjr]

Who knew that there were routers with SFPs:) I’m using the BellSouth provided router with cable Ethernet run across the attic and an opticalModule in the audio room. I would run optical to the audio room, but attics in south FL are 

not fun in the summer. Enjoy!

[Metnoc]

10 hours ago, vortecjr said:

You described this perfectly yourself. You said the opticalRendu had more soundstage and greater delineation. You said the other unit was more dense and full. What do you think is the likely cause of more sound stage and greater delineation. IMO this is less of the bad stuff that causes music to sound more dense and full. Reviewers who are use to working with different sources understand this and account for it when commenting on gear. However, when you source tone your system, like many here do, I can see how one might have a preference. If you look around here this forum is obsessed with source side tuning and seem to ignore DACs, pre-amps, amplifiers, and speakers. This forum is source centric:) Again, i’m not arguing your preference in your system...I’m just trying to explain it.

The "bad things" that makes the sound more dense and full I think is closer to the real thing, therefore your point doesn't really hold up in my perspective. But no problem, my thinking is still that there are probably nothing that sounds "neutral" and rather than claiming neutrality, we can consciously reach out for the components that gives us the best experience.

[vortecjr]

1 hour ago, Metnoc said:

The "bad things" that makes the sound more dense and full I think is closer to the real thing, therefore your point doesn't really hold up in my perspective. But no problem, my thinking is still that there are probably nothing that sounds "neutral" and rather than claiming neutrality, we can consciously reach out for the components that gives us the best experience.

HAHAHA. That’s what makes the world go round...your reality doesn’t coincide with mine. Think of this way. In your reality we would have to make music sound more real or more dense and full. That is the wrong approach because then only you in your system would think it sounded good and everyone else would think is sounded bad. The units are neutral so the greatest number of people think it sounds good. According to the bell shaped curve this approach yields people who hate it, people who thinks it’s just right and people who love it. This means I expect some outliers on and the greatest number of people in the sweet spot. 

[Metnoc]

28 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

HAHAHA. That’s what makes the world go round...your reality doesn’t coincide with mine. Think of this way. In your reality we would have to make music sound more real or more dense and full. That is the wrong approach because then only you in your system would think it sounded good and everyone else would think is sounded bad. The units are neutral so the greatest number of people think it sounds good. According to the bell shaped curve this approach yields people who hate it, people who thinks it’s just right and people who love it. This means I expect some outliers on and the greatest number of people in the sweet spot. 

I'm happy that you have found what you're looking for, and its certainly a quite good streamer.

Again I'm sharing my point of view, couldn't really care less if I'm in a majority or not.
In this case its rather the other way around OR/Ci sounds thin in my ears, analytical rather than organic, not that the sms sounds overly full or dense. My problem is with manufacturers that just can't help themselves in shoving down your throat that their stuff is neutral and as a consequence everyone who have other impressions are at fault. Well you shouldn't feel too bad about that, you're not alone in arguing like that, it's quite common.
However, good luck in your coming endeavours, I think sonore is doing great service to the hifi community by making endpoints that is a part of improvements in streaming.

[alexreusch]

Hello, I saw the list of recommended Power Supplies and in general you recommend all PS to be set on 7VDC.

However, there is only one Power Supply that has lower settings, the Sbooster to be set on 6VDC. I know that Sbooster does currently not offer any Power Supply with 7VDC, but it is still on the list of recommended PS. Is there any negative impact running at 6VDC vs. 7VDC? What is your opinion on it? It is also possible to set the Sbooster to 6.5VDC.Would that be better than 6VDC?

[jcn3]

4 hours ago, alexreusch said:

Hello, I saw the list of recommended Power Supplies and in general you recommend all PS to be set on 7VDC.

However, there is only one Power Supply that has lower settings, the Sbooster to be set on 6VDC. I know that Sbooster does currently not offer any Power Supply with 7VDC, but it is still on the list of recommended PS. Is there any negative impact running at 6VDC vs. 7VDC? What is your opinion on it? It is also possible to set the Sbooster to 6.5VDC.Would that be better than 6VDC?

 

the required input voltage is a range -- any power supply with a voltage within the range will work fine.  since power supplies that are recommended on the sonore web site are all 6v or 7v,  anything in between will be fine.  i doubt anyone would be able to tell the difference between 6v, 6.5v, or 7v (assuming the same quality power supply) -- just too small a difference.

[vortecjr]

On 6/25/2019 at 9:00 AM, Metnoc said:

I'm happy that you have found what you're looking for, and its certainly a quite good streamer.

Again I'm sharing my point of view, couldn't really care less if I'm in a majority or not.
In this case its rather the other way around OR/Ci sounds thin in my ears, analytical rather than organic, not that the sms sounds overly full or dense. My problem is with manufacturers that just can't help themselves in shoving down your throat that their stuff is neutral and as a consequence everyone who have other impressions are at fault. Well you shouldn't feel too bad about that, you're not alone in arguing like that, it's quite common.
However, good luck in your coming endeavours, I think sonore is doing great service to the hifi community by making endpoints that is a part of improvements in streaming.

Yes and Thank You. We are dealing with digital signals (1s/0s) and noise. On the Rendu series we can easily show that we are bit perfect and thus we don’t have intentional tuning on the signals. We are a pass through device and not a digital signal processor or equalizer and no one would want us to alter the signal in the signal path. With respect to noise we are doing different thing to reduce it with power supplies, regulators, isolations, low noise components, etc. Lower noise is better and I don’t think that needs additional qualifications. A bit perfect signal can’t be the source the sound signature you observe. Lower noise can impact soundstage and delineation and you said we had good sound stage and delineation. There are several types of sound tuning such as "analytical" among others. Analytical devices do not emphasize or de-emphasize the amplitude of frequencies. The Rendu series is "analytical" because tuning of your system should be done in the analog domain. This is my position because analog manufactures do tune their gear based on the intended audience. DACS are tuned, amps are tuned, and speaker are tuned. You may have not have realized it, but by calling the Rendu "analytical" you are actually supported my argument that we are neutral and brutally honest in our presentation. What you are hearing with a Rendu is the real signature of your system with a bit perfect low noise signal. I respect that you know what you like and that you disagree. Enjoy!

[vortecjr]

5 hours ago, alexreusch said:

Hello, I saw the list of recommended Power Supplies and in general you recommend all PS to be set on 7VDC.

However, there is only one Power Supply that has lower settings, the Sbooster to be set on 6VDC. I know that Sbooster does currently not offer any Power Supply with 7VDC, but it is still on the list of recommended PS. Is there any negative impact running at 6VDC vs. 7VDC? What is your opinion on it? It is also possible to set the Sbooster to 6.5VDC.Would that be better than 6VDC?

6VDC to 7VDC is not issue. 

[GryphonGuy]

On 6/25/2019 at 6:42 AM, vortecjr said:

It’s not a “star quad” anything:)

 

Hi vortecjr, I would be happy for you to explain why you are denying the nomenclature but I am simply quoting part of the name of my purchase from both Uptone and Ghent Audio.

 

Regards

GG

[vortecjr]

4 hours ago, GryphonGuy said:

 

Hi vortecjr, I would be happy for you to explain why you are denying the nomenclature but I am simply quoting part of the name of my purchase from both Uptone and Ghent Audio.

 

Regards

GG

I was talking about our DC cables. 

[Mike Rubin]

The BIG secret is out!  

 

For details, read the review of the optical Rendu products on the landing page! 

[cat6man]

On 6/24/2019 at 10:03 PM, lestes said:

  I am now curious if anyone else has compared the OM to a direct router SFP?

 

I did and had a very different result.  I bought a pair of single mode SFP and put one in the oRendu and one in my router.

I thought the oRendu was better than the ultraRendu but it wasn't night and day.

After adding the oModule, it was night and day.

 

In my case, I have  verizon router feeding a netgear 24 port gigabit router.  The 24 port gigabit router feeds a netgear 5 port 10gigabit router.  I was comparing SFP from the 10gigabit router to cat6 from the same router.  

 

So in my case, the oM was absolutely essential to cleaning up the source digital.

My routers carry a lot of different IP clients for the house and family, share a circuit breaker with a ton of other stuff in my basement (LED lights, NASs, usb hard drives, nuc/pc acting as SageTV server and HQPlayer, Silicon dust tv tuners and more wall warts than I can believe!) and is probably as dirty as I can imagine short of having a welding machine or active power drills/saws operating.

 

Now that I see what I've just written, maybe I should do something about isolating my audio source equipment from all the rest of that crap?

 

I suspect the gain of the oM will be very system dependent, but in my case is was huge.

YMMV

[vortecjr]

25 minutes ago, cat6man said:

 

I did and had a very different result.  I bought a pair of single mode SFP and put one in the oRendu and one in my router.

I thought the oRendu was better than the ultraRendu but it wasn't night and day.

After adding the oModule, it was night and day.

 

In my case, I have  verizon router feeding a netgear 24 port gigabit router.  The 24 port gigabit router feeds a netgear 5 port 10gigabit router.  I was comparing SFP from the 10gigabit router to cat6 from the same router.  

 

So in my case, the oM was absolutely essential to cleaning up the source digital.

My routers carry a lot of different IP clients for the house and family, share a circuit breaker with a ton of other stuff in my basement (LED lights, NASs, usb hard drives, nuc/pc acting as SageTV server and HQPlayer, Silicon dust tv tuners and more wall warts than I can believe!) and is probably as dirty as I can imagine short of having a welding machine or active power drills/saws operating.

 

Now that I see what I've just written, maybe I should do something about isolating my audio source equipment from all the rest of that crap?

 

I suspect the gain of the oM will be very system dependent, but in my case is was huge.

YMMV

Great feedback. Enjoy!

[skatbelt]

On 6/25/2019 at 4:03 AM, lestes said:

About 3 weeks in now with the OR w/SGC power supply.  I couldn't be happier.  My vinyl rig has been gathering some dust but I think that will level out in time.  It's been fun.  I thought I might share some experience here and hopefully gather some insight from the group.

 

Original Setup 1: Ubiquiti EdgeRouter SFP, Audioquest CAT 7 construction cable 20' run to stereo (their in wall spool), to Starter switch with SFP, Sonore supplied Optical Cable, OR with SGC PS.  This definitely bettered my Auralic Aries to PS Audio DS DAC using Audioquest Diamond USB

 

Setup 2: While waiting for the OR to arrive I installed the Ubiquiti to replace a Netgear WiFi router that was antiquated.  Of course I bought a router with SFP port so I had to get a 10m run of Optical Cable for $18 to try a direct connection.  When I originally purchased the OR Starter Kit I did not foresee this change.  When the direct connection to router came in it significantly bettered the Audioquest to switch setup.  

 

Setup 3 I was being curious if the OM would better a direct connection to the router.  Sonore/SGC were fantastic to deal with.  They took the switch back and credited me towards the OM.  I tried the OM first near the OR, connected to the 20' run of Audioquest CAT 7 construction grade cable and using the previous 1m supplied Optical Cable.  The OM is powered by its own SGC PS.  It was clear this was not as good as direct to the router.  I also swapped the 1m cable with the 10m just to make sure it wasn't the cable.

 

Setup 4 was to use a 1m Audioquest Vodka ethernet cable between router and OM and the same 10m Optical Cable to the OR that yielded such good results from the router.  Here is where the better part of two weeks have been spent.  This was a slightly different but good setup.  

 

Both this arrangement and the direct to router arrangement were tried for many days in a row each.  I have settled on using the router arrangement.  The music just feels more immediate and alive to me.  I am now curious if anyone else has compared the OM to a direct router SFP?  If you are using the OM I would not rush out to change, however in my system I found it to have lots of detail but less life.  Each arrangement takes a bit to suss out, but the OM never came around to making me sink into the music the same way the router connection does.  The beauty is that the OR is amazing and very honest.  I am convinced any change upstream of it will reveal different results.  I am currently thinking about a dedicated PS for the Ubiquiti EdgeRouter to see what that does.  Right now I prefer it and it is on its factory supplied PS.  

 

I am eager to hear from each of you.  Right now I am ecstatic with the OR.  

 

My guess is that, technically, the setup with the OM is the optimal one but for you - coming from a vinyl rig - this sounds to clinical/analytical. Your ears and brain are used to distortion and you perceive this as lifelike, live, warm... 

[incus]

So weird... Glad that's done with...

[Michaelb4]

I have now been listening to the OpticalRendu for weeks so my system has settled down. Change was basically the OpticalRendu for the Ultra, Optical Module and fiber, and Teddy Pardo power supplies. 

 

System improved, mostly in bass performance- more there and more defined. I feel now that the quality of the source is most important. I have burned CDs but mostly listen Qobuz. So much to listen to, so many wonderful musicians. Will be hard to convince  a 67 year old upgrade from here. 

 

Anyway, thanks for your efforts. 

 

Source :Roon and EERO Mesh Wi-fi

Amp:  (2) Bel Canto Ref 600 (Brickwall Surge Protector)

Stream: Sonore Opticalmodule(Teddy Pardo 5v power supply) to Sonore OpticalRendu(Teddy Pardo 7v power supply)

DAC: Mytek Brooklyn+ (Uptone JS-2)

Speakers: B+W 802d3

[vortecjr]

1 hour ago, Michaelb4 said:

I have now been listening to the OpticalRendu for weeks so my system has settled down. Change was basically the OpticalRendu for the Ultra, Optical Module and fiber, and Teddy Pardo power supplies. 

 

System improved, mostly in bass performance- more there and more defined. I feel now that the quality of the source is most important. I have burned CDs but mostly listen Qobuz. So much to listen to, so many wonderful musicians. Will be hard to convince  a 67 year old upgrade from here. 

 

Anyway, thanks for your efforts. 

 

Source :Roon and EERO Mesh Wi-fi

Amp:  (2) Bel Canto Ref 600 (Brickwall Surge Protector)

Stream: Sonore Opticalmodule(Teddy Pardo 5v power supply) to Sonore OpticalRendu(Teddy Pardo 7v power supply)

DAC: Mytek Brooklyn+ (Uptone JS-2)

Speakers: B+W 802d3

Nice combination...enjoy!