AudioLinux and NUC Troubleshooting and Tuning

[zizione]

Is there any benefit reinstalling a version 0.8 from scratch rather than a 0.5 upgraded ?

[greenleo]

2 hours ago, zizione said:

Is there any benefit reinstalling a version 0.8 from scratch rather than a 0.5 upgraded ?

I guess for one that has 0.5 with lots of personal customization, upgrade may be a a better choice.   

[austinpop]

5 hours ago, hifi25nl said:

This is right. The menu version can be seen on the main menu screen on the title, but headless version on console will stay as in original installation, since this is not an image update, but a menu update.

 

Piero is adamant that he wants the menu version to remain tied to the original image it was installed from. So for example, here's an 0.7 instance, which I updated to 0.85 from the Update menu. It still says:

 

********************************************

              

              Welcome to

         AUDIOLINUX HEADLESS

             version 0.7

 

********************************************

 

Personally, I would like this to change to the current version, since how else can we keep track to what level we are up to? If not on the login splash screen, where else can we query the current version information?

[austinpop]

I also ran into an issue yesterday where I wanted to install LMS on my 0.7 -> 0.85 stick. 

 

I tried doing it using the Update menu. The script seemed to run to success, but starting LMS didn't seem to work. I then manually did the logitechmediaserver-git install via pacman, and found the issue was that the "perl-sqlite" package was not found in the default mirror sites that are uncommented in the file /etc/pacman.d/mirrorlist. I edited this file (as root) and uncommented the first 10 sites in the USA section. After that the install eventually found the package in one of these mirrors.

 

Unfortunately, I don't know how to make this more resilient for people who want the menu-driven actions to "just work" reliably.

 

Maybe Piero can resolve.

 

Until then, be careful.

[bobfa]

In this crazy update mode, we are in personal version control is hard.  I have only made a couple of small changes and I am keeping a "log" in an Apple Note.  I was thinking about moving to Evernote to share stuff with others.  When I get my new NUC I will have to add BIOS change log to that.

 

I am still thinking of a WIKI.  I will go over to my A2 hosting panel and see what I can install quickly.

 

 

 

[austinpop]

1 hour ago, austinpop said:

 

Piero is adamant that he wants the menu version to remain tied to the original image it was installed from. So for example, here's an 0.7 instance, which I updated to 0.85 from the Update menu. It still says:

 

********************************************

              

              Welcome to

         AUDIOLINUX HEADLESS

             version 0.7

 

********************************************

 

Personally, I would like this to change to the current version, since how else can we keep track to what level we are up to? If not on the login splash screen, where else can we query the current version information?

 

Apologies, I should have read Piero's comment more carefully. In my updated system, the current version is displayed when you type "menu":

 

[ray-dude]

A quick update for this thread on my experiments with large buffer squeezelite end points.  When running LMS and Roon Core on various servers, I wasn't able to detect any difference in SQ when connecting to my large buffer squeezelite NUC core.  Similarly, I couldn't detect a difference in SQ for files local (in RAM) on my NUC server vs files pulled from an SMB share over the network.  

 

I'm looking forward to hearing reports from folks with more power and network configurations, in case they are able to pick up on differences that I can not.

 

Those interested in the discussion should check out the server thread (linked below)

 

Best wishes for the New Year!

 

Ray

 

 )

[jean-michel6]

On 12/31/2018 at 1:12 AM, LTG2010 said:

Hi, no real conclusions yet just was a bit surprised at the results.

I had a single X10SBA setup, sclk-ex clocked motherboard/cpu, lan, SOTM pcie USB and tx-usb hubin ( similar to your txusb ultra)

slc sata OS server 2016 and 6tb 2.5inch sata hard disc.

All powered by a nine rail Sean jacobs supply.

Then I switched to audiolinux with Roon or hqplayer on the single machine. In this situation the best sound I got was via the pcie/ USB card and reclocking board, the direct motherboard USB was coarse less refined in comparison. (note in comparison, the sound was in no way coarse or unrefined, I could live with it)

With all the NUC fuss, I tried the NUC endpoint with audiolinux, and audiolinux on my sclk-ex server with a bridge on the LAN, (so now the PCIE -USB and reclocking board are redundant. In this situation the sound improved further the 2 box audiolinux solution works, the NUC provided a more open dynamic sound although with less warmth. (in comparison) but it was better.

Switching over the NUC as server and the sclk-ex machine as endpoint the sound through the motherboards USB output has the original warmth and combines the NUC's dynamics with greater frequency extension at both ends, the sound has greater bass kick and extension. I suspect that clocking the motherboard USB output would improves things further. The sound with the NUC as endpoint is a bit tighter and focused, both equally good in slightly different ways.

The ouput from the SOTM PCIE USB in this situation is less dynamic (again in comparison, its not undynamic) a bit more polite, the sound stage a bit smaller, less bass punch i'd say a bit more suited to classical small scale, less suited for rock etc.

I suspect the type/ multi rail power supply plays a big part, and maybe there is a bit too much filtration on the PCIE card if you already have a good power supply.

As a side note bridging works equally as well on the endpoint in the reverse role.

 

Thank for all this additional information. 

I am on the fence considering experimenting with an I7 nuc , however from what you are writing in your system you get the best result from the x10sba direct usb output.

 

How is powered your NUC ?

 

How was powered you SOTM pcie board ? From the external Sean Jacobs psu i guess 

Do you have the card also connected to the mobo internal power as recommended by SOTM as safety. 

I am using only the external psu as I have found that using also the internal power from the mobo was bad for sq. 

 

How is powered the NUC ?

 

 

[LTG2010]

13 hours ago, jean-michel6 said:

I am on the fence considering experimenting with an I7 nuc , however from what you are writing in your system you get the best result from the x10sba direct usb output.

With your equipment I would first try a dual headless audiolinux setup server/renderer. As you have dual ethernet ports I would also suggest a linux bridge, unless you have a fancy switch.

Look at the rtirq configuration as it defaults to USB you'll need to make the lan (eno1 or eth1 on your board) as priority on the server.

I powered all 3 SOTM boards (including the USB) on separate 9V external rails, I did not follow the 'safety' advice as a linear power supply would turn everything off in any case.

I powered the motherboard with 4 linear rails, 3.3V, 5V, 2x 12V. I initially powered the NUC7i7 with 12V from an sPS500. Then I 'borrowed' the 12V Sean Jacobs atx rail from the motherboard for NUC and allocated the the sPS500 to the motherboard 12v atx. I felt that my best rails should be allocated to the renderer and server- CPU. So its 4 rails vs 1, that may impact sound.

The NUC has been described here as 'creamy' this is very apt, it has a wide deep soundstage and smooth presentation, you are approximately 1/3 way down the seating. If starting from scratch it's a no brainer.

The x10 sounds like the loudness button has been activated throughout the frequency band, bass and treble is stronger and voices are projected forward - a front row seat. This type of presentation is not kind to poorer recordings and a bit of jitter reduction is also useful. I would suggest motherboard USB out but also try USB to your txUSBUltra that might be a great combination. ( I need to make up a special connector to try out my reclocking board). Leave out the Pcie usb unless there's a way to bypass most of the filtration.

Both results I would call equal, switching back and forth results are excellent. Certainly I would try audiolinux on what you have first.

 

 

[jean-michel6]

On 1/1/2019 at 9:47 PM, LTG2010 said:

With your equipment I would first try a dual headless audiolinux setup server/renderer. As you have dual ethernet ports I would also suggest a linux bridge, unless you have a fancy switch.

I was running Roon server and Roon bridge on my dual pc setup. 

I have switch now to the latest Daphile which is a lms  and squeezlite. It is quite better then Roon about sq. 

Daphile squeezlite is fully run in ram and allows extreme mode and optimisation of buffers. Also the lms side allows to load the music in ram on the server side with a nice sq boost too. 

I have purchased the headless audiolinux but have not tested it yet. 

I have a quote sophisticated optical network switch between my 2 pc’s with very good results , with good psu and Sclk ex clock for the tplink optical converter. 

On 1/1/2019 at 9:47 PM, LTG2010 said:

Look at the rtirq configuration as it defaults to USB you'll need to make the lan (eno1 or eth1 on your board) as priority on the server.

How do you do that since I am no Linux expert ?

 

On 1/1/2019 at 9:47 PM, LTG2010 said:

I powered the motherboard with 4 linear rails, 3.3V, 5V, 2x 12V. I initially powered the NUC7i7 with 12V from an sPS500. Then I 'borrowed' the 12V Sean Jacobs atx rail from the motherboard for NUC and allocated the the sPS500 to the motherboard 12v atx

You have a better power set up than mine for your x10sba board as innuos recommend atx 24 and 4 pis power for best sq on this board. 

I too have a very good level 3 Sean Jacobs psu but I power only the 4 pin atx at 12v.

 

This is probably why I think that the NUC May be a good choice as endpoint. 

Anyhow i have to try before to run from the x10 sea usb and also to try the audiolinux on my current set up. 

[LTG2010]

16 minutes ago, jean-michel6 said:

How do you do that since I am no Linux expert ?

edit: /etc/rtirq.conf

for the server remove ''USB'' and substitute ''eno1 eth1'' or as required.

Use the command: rtstatus you'll see the connections there.

[davide256]

wanted to play with LMS since some were reporting it can be made to sound better than Roon with buffer settings. I can get Squeezelite to work but when I use the menu in 083 version to install R2 version and enable, I can see "audiolinux@squeezelite" enabled with "Show Audio Services" but its not running as an audio service or application.

Is there a step I missed with R2 that's different from Squeezelite enablement?

[zizione]

Posted by mistake

 

[BigAlMc]

After getting my system stable (thanks to @Bricki as deleting the Roon unique_id did the trick) and making backups of both the server and endpoint USB drives (thanks to @ray-dude for the dd method instructions) I decided to install and enable the Squeezelite endpoint in order to tinker with buffer sizes.

 

Made some good progress but will revisit that later as not quite figured it out and need to see if I can add another 4GB RAM into my endpoint without upsetting the LPS-1.2 apple cart! 🙄

 

Meantime quick question. I noticed almost by accident that high res music is playing as 48/16 on my Directstreams screen.

 

When I look at the Signal path in Roon it shows FLAC 96/24 2ch

 

Is this a limitation in SqueezeLite that it only does up to redbook or am I missing a setting somewhere?

 

Cheers,

Alan

[Monge]

I’m using Putty for remote login and WinSCP to navigate the AL filesystem like @afrancois did.

But then I try to edit a file in AL root I cannot save it course I don’t have permissions to do so. 

 

How do I get permission or acesss to do so In WinSCP?

 

Thanks Monge

[hifi25nl]

Login as audiolinux user with ssh

Once connected...

 

From the GUIDE:

ROOT USER

How to switch to root user:
Type
su
and give the password audiolinux0
You can return to normal user with
exit

[BigAlMc]

15 minutes ago, Monge said:

I’m using Putty for remote login and WinSCP to navigate the AL filesystem like @afrancois did.

But then I try to edit a file in AL root I cannot save it course I don’t have permissions to do so. 

 

How do I get permission or acesss to do so In WinSCP?

 

Thanks Monge

 

Hi @Monge,

 

In WINSCP just change the user to root and password to audiolinux0

 

Cheers,

Alan

[Monge]

24 minutes ago, BigAlMc said:

 

Hi @Monge,

 

In WINSCP just change the user to root and password to audiolinux0

 

Cheers,

Alan

Thank you very much. I tried a lot of things but not user root.

Cheers Monge

[clipper]

2 hours ago, BigAlMc said:

Meantime quick question. I noticed almost by accident that high res music is playing as 48/16 on my Directstreams screen.

 

When I look at the Signal path in Roon it shows FLAC 96/24 2ch

 

Is this a limitation in SqueezeLite that it only does up to redbook or am I missing a setting somewhere?

Are you choosing the correct output device when you start squeezelite?

 

Do a squeezelite -l command to see the available output devices.

 

If I don't specify front (see below), I get 48 for everything.  I start squeezelite by typing squeezelite -o front &.

 

 

 

[elpampeano]

Hi guys, i have an issue with my NUC-6CAYHL as endpoint in Ramboot mode. It don't detect the LAN wire...i use a basic cat5 and is not working. I Change by an Audioquest rj45 and Works, but after a reboot the lights on the LAN port are dead. I use AL headless 0.5, but seems strange...i try the same configuration at my brothers house and work fine and stable (Even with the cheap LAN cable). The only difference, he haves a 10 Mb internet connection, and i have 50 Mb. Is there the issue ? Is there only thing that changes...i do not what to do !!!

P.D. : i reassembly my server as endpoint  (the same NUC model) with a notebook as server running Roon and the same trouble, the endpoint don't get LAN signal. Even more strange ......

[greenleo]

elpampeano,

 

Has it the same issue when not in Ramboot mode? 

 

Network trouble shooting through words can be a nightmare on words but could be quick on spot.  You've done so many things and it is hard to give you a full picture in one go.

 

I'm not an expert in this area.  Just try to help by breaking case down into atomic size subcases.

[ronfint]

24 minutes ago, elpampeano said:

Hi guys, i have an issue with my NUC-6CAYHL as endpoint in Ramboot mode. It don't detect the LAN wire...i use a basic cat5 and is not working. I Change by an Audioquest rj45 and Works, but after a reboot the lights on the LAN port are dead. I use AL headless 0.5, but seems strange...i try the same configuration at my brothers house and work fine and stable (Even with the cheap LAN cable). The only difference, he haves a 10 Mb internet connection, and i have 50 Mb. Is there the issue ? Is there only thing that changes...i do not what to do !!!

P.D. : i reassembly my server as endpoint  (the same NUC model) with a notebook as server running Roon and the same trouble, the endpoint don't get LAN signal. Even more strange ......

 

Try  

 

ip link set interface up

 

where interface is, say, enp4s0, or whatever your interface is on   Ip addr show.  This worked for me yesterday.

[BigAlMc]

16 hours ago, clipper said:

Are you choosing the correct output device when you start squeezelite?

 

Do a squeezelite -l command to see the available output devices.

 

If I don't specify front (see below), I get 48 for everything.  I start squeezelite by typing squeezelite -o front &.

 

 

 

 

Thanks @clipper,

 

I haven't specified anything so guess I'm getting default.

 

How do I specify front once I've checked the available options?

 

Cheers,

Alan

[LTG2010]

2 hours ago, BigAlMc said:

I haven't specified anything so guess I'm getting default.

I'm not currently using LMS but I recall a bitrate limiting setting in LMS audio 'player' settings maybe that's set to 48? Also there's a checkbox for SOX  maybe try checking that. It could also be a wrong setting in the squeezelite config file. Edit it to put your player default as clipper above (the card = part). It should play PCM 192.

[jean-michel6]

On 12/30/2018 at 9:20 PM, LTG2010 said:

Another surprise was my sclk-ex server as endpoint only, sounds so good I've left it at that for a while. This is direct from the motherboards USB output. Adding back the SOTM PCIE USB card, decreases the soundstage and flattens dynamics.

Anyone with an X10SBA motherboard or even an Innuos zenith might want to try it as an audiolinux endpoint, before moving on, you may be quite surprised.

I did follow your path and I tested my x10sba set up using the mobo usb instead of the SOTM pcie USB. 

What a surprise , I did got something with significantly better transparency ... I was not expecting that. With the added transparency the soundstage is deeper but somewhat smaller in width. 

There seem to be also somewhat some more hf noise coming from the mobo usb. 

I need to do some more listening and also try to use the tx usb ultra after the mobo usb.