SOTM, RENDU, AUDIO-LINUX, DIY, DOES IT REALLY MATTER??

[davide256]

RAM arrived, no issues with getting LXQT version 2.1 loaded into RAM on my PC server.

 

Difference between running LXQT off   RAM (vs SSD) was subtle, music seemed softer in intensity, a little easier to relax and get into.

Did some swapping around between endpoints, microRendu and RPI3 with AL, big difference in dynamics in favor of the RPI. Went

back to WIN 10/Roonserver with microRendu, dynamics  were fine with this combination but loss of harmonic purity compared

to AL Roonserver was  frustrating.

Beginning to think Sonicorbiter SW has some weaknesses/incompatibility with AL source, hard to believe the mR HW is at fault.

Had to pull the RPI3 out and go back to microRendu because I could hear stuttering with high res music.

[esldude]

8 hours ago, Ralf11 said:

you can also wait for 5G

5G is just so passe'.  

 

I say wait for 6G.  It will happen.

https://www.cablefree.net/wireless-technology/4g-lte-beyond-5g-roadmap-6g-beyond/

 

Travel weary data will be fixed once and for all.

 

 

[DuckToller]

18 hours ago, beerandmusic said:

I recommend audio-linux too....i don't invest in much (hqplayer, and now audio-inux, and likely fiber soon)....but i do feel i squeeze what i need out of this site.

Salut BaM,

did you finally build a server with AL and HQP last week ?
Pls share the specs and the experiences on which you've based your recommendations.
If it is in another thread pls just link to it.
Thx in advance
Curious, Tom

[davide256]

10 hours ago, esldude said:

5G is just so passe'.  

 

I say wait for 6G.  It will happen.

https://www.cablefree.net/wireless-technology/4g-lte-beyond-5g-roadmap-6g-beyond/

 

Travel weary data will be fixed once and for all.

 

 

 

was reviewing how to do something like this a few years ago for a major carrier. Don't expect miracles. Requires more antenna footprint/less coverage reach so the economics

will limit it to population dense area or existing highway antenna locations covering service areas. Biggest headache is building facility entrance rights/lease as this will be roof

based antenna vs established/regulated basement entrance facilities.

 

[mav52]

11 hours ago, esldude said:

5G is just so passe'.  

 

I say wait for 6G.  It will happen.

https://www.cablefree.net/wireless-technology/4g-lte-beyond-5g-roadmap-6g-beyond/

 

Travel weary data will be fixed once and for all.

 

 

 

Who wants to wait 10 years.  Its going to be a while in the US.  HEck 5G is still moving slowly.  This article is dated June 28, 2018  https://www.networkworld.com/article/3285112/mobile-wireless/get-ready-for-upcoming-6g-wireless-too.html

[esldude]

3 hours ago, davide256 said:

 

was reviewing how to do something like this a few years ago for a major carrier. Don't expect miracles. Requires more antenna footprint/less coverage reach so the economics

will limit it to population dense area or existing highway antenna locations covering service areas. Biggest headache is building facility entrance rights/lease as this will be roof

based antenna vs established/regulated basement entrance facilities.

 

Oh, I know all that. 

 

I wish they'd put the effort in the USA into much better coverage.  I can get 100 to 160 mbps over my phone in the right locations.  And nothing in many places.  Everyone nearly everywhere being able to get 100 mbps would be more useful to more people than what 5G will be.  

[Rt66indierock]

On 11/21/2018 at 3:08 PM, beerandmusic said:

 

Great, i am very happy you responded...I have "pretty much" the same beliefs, but am open to change of beliefs, and if you are willing to discuss, i would be extremely happy to chit-chat a bit.

 

I have read from Archimago and find very reliable and believable and have high trust iin him, so i will see what he does share inre jitter.

 

My main questions are these:

1.  If we are talking just about the digital front end, trying to get music bits to the dac with as little noise as possible, and if jitter isn't an issue, then why is there ANY difference at all whether you use an SOTM, Rendu, Audio-linux on x86, regardless of we use a celeron, i3, or i7?  or are you one of many other skeptics that believe there would be no difference?

2. Do you also believe then, that it doesn't make a difference at the resolution of the music even up to quad dsd in regards to jitter?

3. What about does it matter what power supply you use or if you use decrapifiers on the usb out or not?  I do believe that I read that Armichagelo doesn't believe the decrapifiers do anything, but possibly add more jitter (but maybe that was someone else that said that?).

4. What about other "normal" voltage noise?  Is there any noise that would cause degradation in the digital front end affecting the DACs output that is not jitter related?  (when i use "normal" voltage, i mean within mfr specs...not like a bad ps).

 

My personal opinion, CURRENTLY, and subject to change, is that jitter "may" effect SQ more than what many engineers believe, especially high speed dsd, but certainly not on the order of "OMG MASSIVE IMPROVEMENT".  I read a paper yesterday that suggested nanoseconds of jitter can impact harmonic distortion, and even Marantz suggests that jitter can afffect soundstage, so I am not 100% convinced that small amounts of different jitter "can" affect SQ, especially at quad dsd rates.

 

It would be nice if someone could point to a "whitepaper" that would suggest x amount of jitter cannot impact SQ, but anything above x amount can cause these issues....and then determine what is the minimal hardware/os spec that would be acceptable as to not affecting SQ and where to measure it. 

 

If you could answer all 4 questions as to your belief, share a white paper, or even just comment, i would be most appreciative....same to anyone else that would be brave enough to share the opinioin without fear of being jumped on....it clearly is a very debatable topic...religion is easier.

 

 

Now that I’m back from a very foggy Thanksgiving in the Pacific Northwest.

 

1.     There are all kinds of other noise coming from devices that are computers. I start at the motherboard and seek quiet at that level and work towards the DAC. So yes there are differences that can be measured and reduced.

2.     Like I’ve said in other responses I don’t spend much time with DSD. I tend to want to play the original resolution. The only way for me to play a native DSD of the music I like is to record myself and I’m satisfied with PCM.

3.     I got my first USB cable that was on spec in 2000 (built my an Intel engineer and golfing friend). A rare thing still. I don’t want a decrapifier. I’m a less stuff is more type of person. But I pay attention to power supplies but not in an audiophile way again I go to the gamer's.

4.     Therefore, I pay attention to the motherboard a good one for audio stops a lot of noise there.

 

Did you see Archimago’s comment about Jacintha’s Fire and Rain? The noise floor was higher than expected for DSD 128. Format is way down the list when making a good sounding recording.

 

But there is something going on with some DAC chips. Bob Stuart mentioned it and I will touch upon it as I wind up the vaporware thread.

 

Finally, if I find jitter not to be an issue, then its impact should be a nonissue out of my speakers. And so far, it is.

[Rt66indierock]

On 11/22/2018 at 7:58 AM, davide256 said:

An evaluation of audio gear not based on competent human evaluator is inherently flawed... our measurement tools can't predict observable differences

other than at the most basic level of audio performance.The difficulty is identifying the skill level of the human evaluator and their strengths and weaknesses.

I try to keep track of different reviewers, their strengths and biases. In general when I see 2 known good reviewers praising a piece of gear at the level

I'm interested in, it starts to get my attention, if 3 then it becomes a must to audition.

 

 

https://www.dailyaudiophile.com/

 

 

As I meet more reviewers face to face I'm finding myself relying on them less and less.  

[beerandmusic]

24 minutes ago, Rt66indierock said:

 

As I meet more reviewers face to face I'm finding myself relying on them less and less.  

 

+1 agreed...i go to local meetings and have met up with many professional reviewers (even some well known ones i won't mention).  It is evident that there are rarely "massive improvements" in most kits (esp at same price point), and that they have difficult time "choosing their words" in written reviews, and much more difficulty in person when pinned down.  One retired reviewer even admitted to an entire group that he has to be honest, that he is much happier now, where he can freely say what he thinks without concern for vendor relationships.

[Ralf11]

best word choice by a reviewer I can recall was lifting a blanket vs. lifting a veil - it was by a poster here who described DSP (which really is closest to a 'massive' SQ improvement)

[beerandmusic]

interesting listen:

https://darko.audio/2018/11/why-isnt-digital-audio-just-ones-and-zeroes/

 

Lots of interesting points, but to me, the most interesting point is that even those at the "top of the game" don't understand why...and you can even hear doubt in his own assessments.

[Ralf11]

don't get trapped in the Darko Darkness

[DLA123]

Great thread here. I just ordered a ultrarendu Ethernet >usb streamer on cyber Monday. My thinking is that if I can improve my current UX and eliminate most of all of the maintenance/tweaking/updating , while keeping SQ status quo, I’m a happy man. If I can improve in SQ then all the better. 

 

My current source is a little fanless form factor running Windows 7 with jriver mc. I never got tidal up and running bc jrmc didn’t support it so had to procure all the music I listen to on a drive that I connected to the pc. 

 

Im hoping this ultrarendu will be plug and play and require little to no tinkering while giving me ability to stream tidal. I love my current sound but there are too many dependencies involved in having the system up and running all the time and operating without any hiccups. 

 

UX is at least 75% of the equation to me when considering a source.