Fas42’s Stereo ‘Magic’

[opus101]

Just now, gmgraves said:

While you are right, RF interference with enough amplitude to be a problem would be easy to see on a ‘scope (with no audio signal). Most of the time there is none.

 

How high an amplitude in your experience becomes a problem? Unfortunately there's no way to see 'none' with a 'scope so how would you know there was indeed none?

[gmgraves]

Just now, opus101 said:

 

How high an amplitude in your experience becomes a problem? Unfortunately there's no way to see 'none' with a 'scope so how would you know there was indeed none?

When you can hear it!

[opus101]

Well I've heard some 'golden eared' claims before but yours is the first claim I've met to be able to hear RF. Dogs and bats, eat your hearts out.

[Summit]

On 7/27/2020 at 1:32 AM, fas42 said:

Noting another member on a similar journey to me, @dmance. His angle is stopping RF effects, which is a major part of the picture - has a business, Audiowise, which sells products which aid controlling this factor. His blog on the site uses the same language I do, in describing what one needs to do, and what is possible - he has a solution using a very efficient speaker driver driven directly by the high output DAC circuitry - straight from @ray-dude's songbook! 😁 - which delivers, "magic" sound. ... Yet Again, simplicity is a powerful tool for accessing the meat in this game, 😉.

 

Lol you must be kidding. First of all everyone here is trying to stop EMI/RF effects. Secondly @dmance provide concrete solutions to how to do that, something you never seems to do . 

[gmgraves]

9 hours ago, opus101 said:

Well I've heard some 'golden eared' claims before but yours is the first claim I've met to be able to hear RF. Dogs and bats, eat your hearts out.

Well, if one can’t “hear” the effects of RF interference in one’s system’s presentation, what difference would it make if the interference were present or not? You aren’t making a lot of sense here.

[kumakuma]

1 hour ago, gmgraves said:

Well, if one can’t “hear” the effects of RF interference in one’s system’s presentation, what difference would it make if the interference were present or not? You aren’t making a lot of sense here.

 

Wasn't it Mark Twain who said that "the reports of RF interference are greatly exaggerated"? It was either that or jitter.

[Allan F]

Mark Twain Quote Story.

2 hours ago, kumakuma said:

 

Wasn't it Mark Twain who said that "the reports of RF interference are greatly exaggerated"? It was either that or jitter.

 

That is an often misquoted version. Twain actually wrote, "The report of...was an exaggeration".

Mark Twain Quote Story.

[gmgraves]

4 hours ago, kumakuma said:

 

Wasn't it Mark Twain who said that "the reports of RF interference are greatly exaggerated"? It was either that or jitter.

That sounds like something Twain would say. I mean, he was a Mississippi river pilot, so that made him an expert on RFI and jitter, wouldn’t it?

[fas42]

13 hours ago, Summit said:

 

Lol you must be kidding. First of all everyone here is trying to stop EMI/RF effects. Secondly @dmance provide concrete solutions to how to do that, something you never seems to do . 

 

Dealing with EMI/RF is part of the battle, IME - I did nothing in this area with the first rig 30 years ago that was directly intended to help me in this, but it still was able to deliver capable SQ; albeit it was frustratingly unstable in how it performed. Turned out, in hindsight, that this was due to static factors, something I was completely unaware of at the time.

 

Buying someone's packaged solution for RF, say, may, or may not, be the vital step in your setup - I've always known that working on the overall integrity of a particular system is what produces "magic sound" - and what a particular rig needs is always going to be different. One from the next. Which is why I could never produce and deliver packaged "fixes" ... it just doesn't work that way ...

 

How it works is, tell me what a system is not doing right, build a picture of its distortion signature, by doing experiments - and that suggests one, or several approaches for improving the integrity of the setup.

 

 

[Teresa]

18 hours ago, opus101 said:

...first claim I've met to be able to hear RF...

 

Depends if it is in the audible range and at a high enough level. See below.

 

9 hours ago, gmgraves said:

Well, if one can’t “hear” the effects of RF interference in one’s system’s presentation, what difference would it make if the interference were present or not?...

 

None IMHO.

 

18 hours ago, gmgraves said:

...RF interference with enough amplitude to be a problem would be easy to see on a ‘scope (with no audio signal). Most of the time there is none.

 

Or in my experience, heard. I was hearing bad radio frequency interference (RFI) that actually sounded like a low level slightly mistuned radio station playing when I had no music playing or in between songs. I don’t own a tuner so I had no idea where this was coming from.
 
I bought a used Monster HDP1800 High Definition PowerCenter at a pawn shop for $60. I routed all my system power cords through the PowerCenter 1800 and the interference disappeared completely. The best $60 I ever spent.

 

I'm sure this is a worst case scenario, but shows RFI at least in some cases is audible and can be removed with a line conditioner.

[opus101]

10 hours ago, gmgraves said:

Well, if one can’t “hear” the effects of RF interference in one’s system’s presentation, what difference would it make if the interference were present or not? You aren’t making a lot of sense here.

 

You were talking about using a 'scope, now you've shifted to using ears. Could we please return to using instrumentation and may I have an answer on the 'scope question? Pretty please.

[Audiophile Neuroscience]

[sandyk]

33 minutes ago, Audiophile Neuroscience said:

Wrong thread, wrong sub forum .

[Audiophile Neuroscience]

17 minutes ago, sandyk said:

Wrong thread, wrong sub forum .

 

 

Nah, "Magic" is everywhere ! 🤣

[Summit]

10 hours ago, Teresa said:

 

Depends if it is in the audible range and at a high enough level. See below.

 

 

None IMHO.

 

 

Or in my experience, heard. I was hearing bad radio frequency interference (RFI) that actually sounded like a low level slightly mistuned radio station playing when I had no music playing or in between songs. I don’t own a tuner so I had no idea where this was coming from.
 
I bought a used Monster HDP1800 High Definition PowerCenter at a pawn shop for $60. I routed all my system power cords through the PowerCenter 1800 and the interference disappeared completely. The best $60 I ever spent.

 

I'm sure this is a worst case scenario, but shows RFI at least in some cases is audible and can be removed with a line conditioner.

 

Theresa my friend a power line conditioner is great for reducing Power-Line Noise but not for airborne RFI and to block radio broadcasting waves.

[Summit]

13 hours ago, fas42 said:

 

Dealing with EMI/RF is part of the battle, IME - I did nothing in this area with the first rig 30 years ago that was directly intended to help me in this, but it still was able to deliver capable SQ; albeit it was frustratingly unstable in how it performed. Turned out, in hindsight, that this was due to static factors, something I was completely unaware of at the time.

 

Buying someone's packaged solution for RF, say, may, or may not, be the vital step in your setup - I've always known that working on the overall integrity of a particular system is what produces "magic sound" - and what a particular rig needs is always going to be different. One from the next. Which is why I could never produce and deliver packaged "fixes" ... it just doesn't work that way ...

 

How it works is, tell me what a system is not doing right, build a picture of its distortion signature, by doing experiments - and that suggests one, or several approaches for improving the integrity of the setup.

 

 

 

Have you heard and understood the expression you do not have to reinvent the wheel? The things that generate EMI / RFI in our homes are more or less the same and do not differ much, as are good measures that are to prevent these from having a negative effect on sound.

[MarkusBarkus]

So I don't need my foil listening hat? Noggin will be running much cooler now...

[Summit]

22 minutes ago, MarkusBarkus said:

So I don't need my foil listening hat? Noggin will be running much cooler now...

 

What made you come to that conclusion?

 

The answer is out there my friend .

[Confused]

This is just for a bit of fun, plus I know Frank likes the occasional YouTube clip of unsorted systems.  (It is a rather nice rig though, and as an aside, I heard a demo of the Giya G2's once, and rather liked them) 

BTW - This one actually came up on another forum, which is what brought it to my attention.

 

A couple of questions....

 

1. What is wrong with this unsorted over ambitious audiophile rig?

2. Bonus off topic question - Who is singing on this version of the track.?

 

 

[fas42]

10 hours ago, Summit said:

 

Have you heard and understood the expression you do not have to reinvent the wheel? The things that generate EMI / RFI in our homes are more or less the same and do not differ much, as are good measures that are to prevent these from having a negative effect on sound.

 

Yes, but the wheels are not always put on the axles ... 😁.

 

Ummm, 30years ago there wasn't Internet, cordless phones, smart phones, etc - things have changed. With later setups, once all these goodies had invaded our space, I had to take measures - like our friend @dmance says, assume everything is an antenna, until proven otherwise.

[fas42]

5 hours ago, Confused said:

A couple of questions....

 

1. What is wrong with this unsorted over ambitious audiophile rig?

 

Ummm, everything?? I've hear this type of mess hundreds of times - how to turn non-audiophile people off getting into ambitious audio stuff, mighty fast ....😉

 

Not even @Audiophile Neuroscience's favourite speaker brand can save this 🙂 - no, Virginia, expensive speakers don't maketh the sound.

 

5 hours ago, Confused said:

2. Bonus off topic question - Who is singing on this version of the track.?

 

No idea.

 

5 hours ago, Confused said:

 

 

 

The gear here should do brilliantly - can't see the brands, but there are no excuses for the SQ ... apart from, err, lack of sorting, 🙂.

[Audiophile Neuroscience]

6 hours ago, Confused said:

This is just for a bit of fun, plus I know Frank likes the occasional YouTube clip of unsorted systems.  (It is a rather nice rig though, and as an aside, I heard a demo of the Giya G2's once, and rather liked them) 

BTW - This one actually came up on another forum, which is what brought it to my attention.

 

A couple of questions....

 

1. What is wrong with this unsorted over ambitious audiophile rig?

 

I can only vouch for the speakers which are world class 😉

Of course, the better the "rig", the less it will sound like Frank's favorite ghetto blaster🤷‍♂️🙄

 

 

 

6 hours ago, Confused said:

2. Bonus off topic question - Who is singing on this version of the track.?

 

 

The track is "All the things you are "  written by Jerome Kern but I don't know the artist.

here is Ella's version

 

[fas42]

1 hour ago, Audiophile Neuroscience said:

 

I can only vouch for the speakers which are world class 😉

Of course, the better the "rig", the less it will sound like Frank's favorite ghetto blaster🤷‍♂️🙄

 

 

Thanks to David, I now appreciate that Bryston and Dynaudio are junk brands - the poor fools who bought their gear, thinking they were getting something a touch better than ghetto blaster quality were certainly conned, 😉.

[Audiophile Neuroscience]

2 hours ago, fas42 said:

 

Thanks to David, I now appreciate that Bryston and Dynaudio are junk brands - the poor fools who bought their gear, thinking they were getting something a touch better than ghetto blaster quality were certainly conned, 😉.

Funny, I have never mentioned anything about either of those brands. I did own a bryston amplifier a long time ago. Do you own either of these "ambitious " products Frank? 

[opus101]

5 hours ago, fas42 said:

 

Ummm, 30years ago there wasn't Internet, cordless phones, smart phones, etc - 

 

Errr - Wikipedia not to be trusted on cordless phones then?

 

Inter alia, in their subsection on Frequencies :

 

43–50 MHz (Base: 43.72–46.97 MHz, Handset: 48.76–49.99 MHz, FM) Allocated in December 1983, and approved for use in mid-1984 for 10 channels. 15 additional channels allocated April 5, 1995.^[6]