Ralf11 Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 another car analogy: the difference you describe is like the one between a car mechanic and an engineering team... the_doc735 1 Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 28, 2018 Author Share Posted September 28, 2018 7 minutes ago, Ralf11 said: another car analogy: the difference you describe is like the one between a car mechanic and an engineering team... Yes, could be, I suppose? Link to comment
Popular Post jabbr Posted September 28, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted September 28, 2018 43 minutes ago, the_doc735 said: At this stage he asks if I am attempting to build LPSU myself to save on costs? I said: "yes". This is my issue over, and over, you should not worry that you will be missing out by using an SMPS to power your PC! I am not arguing against hobbyists who have money to spare, and who wish to experiment with LPS on their PC, or fancy AC power cables, or USB cables etc, but the idea that you are missing out on a great audio experience because you can't afford an expensive power supply, or AC power cable etc is just wrong. (I eat my own dog food btw: I have a range of cheap to top shelf equipment --- oops I just bought a pair of FirstWatt SIT-1 amps -- list price of $500/watt) On the other hand if you want to learn how to build an LPS, then learn... the_doc735, 4est and barrows 2 1 Custom room treatments for headphone users. Link to comment
Ralf11 Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 1 hour ago, jabbr said: I eat my own dog food btw... Orijen? Acana? the_doc735 1 Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 28, 2018 Author Share Posted September 28, 2018 2 hours ago, jabbr said: This is my issue over, and over, you should not worry that you will be missing out by using an SMPS to power your PC! I am not arguing against hobbyists who have money to spare, and who wish to experiment with LPS on their PC, or fancy AC power cables, or USB cables etc, but the idea that you are missing out on a great audio experience because you can't afford an expensive power supply, or AC power cable etc is just wrong. (I eat my own dog food btw: I have a range of cheap to top shelf equipment --- oops I just bought a pair of FirstWatt SIT-1 amps -- list price of $500/watt) On the other hand if you want to learn how to build an LPS, then learn... come on! - you are fully aware how many people state that LPSU are best in audio? you do know how many people advocate LPSU for audio? BUT! where are those advocates in this thread? Pity we can't do a pole (vote)? Thanks for your valued input! I do know there are pros and cons for both methods. Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 28, 2018 Author Share Posted September 28, 2018 1 hour ago, Ralf11 said: Orijen? Acana? Ah Ah - I prefer cat food! Link to comment
Popular Post 4est Posted September 28, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted September 28, 2018 6 hours ago, the_doc735 said: come on! - you are fully aware how many people state that LPSU are best in audio? you do know how many people advocate LPSU for audio? BUT! where are those advocates in this thread? Pity we can't do a pole (vote)? Thanks for your valued input! I do know there are pros and cons for both methods. Because most of those who "know", know there are better/easier methods than to attempt to put in an ATX LPS. Perhaps you should look into what we are doing in entirety, instead of blazing your own trail haphazardly. This is well trodden ground around here, perhaps more so than other forums. jabbr, look&listen and the_doc735 2 1 Forrest: Win10 i9 9900KS/GTX1060 HQPlayer4>Win10 NAA DSD>Pavel's DSC2.6>Bent Audio TAP> Parasound JC1>"Naked" Quad ESL63/Tannoy PS350B subs<100Hz Link to comment
Popular Post audiobomber Posted September 28, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted September 28, 2018 20 hours ago, the_doc735 said: can you give any example links where I won't just end up at another forum asking the same questions and left baffled. There's no point in just asking this again on another forum, only to end up yet again at the same place. Cheers! I beg to differ. There is a point to asking in another forum, specifically the diyAudio forum, which is all about building your own gear. You might start by reading some threads in the Power Supply Forum before posting your intended project. I'm certain you will get great advice from the people there: https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/power-supplies/ the_doc735, 4est and barrows 2 1 Main System: QNAP TS-451+ NAS > Silent Angel Bonn N8 > Sonore opticalModule Deluxe v2 > Corning SMF with Finisar FTLF1318P3BTL SFPs > Uptone EtherREGEN > exaSound PlayPoint and e32 Mk-II DAC > Meitner MTR-101 Plus monoblocks > Bamberg S5-MTM sealed standmount speakers. Crown XLi 1500 powering AV123 Rocket UFW10 stereo subwoofers Upgraded power on all switches, renderer and DAC. Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 28, 2018 Author Share Posted September 28, 2018 11 hours ago, 4est said: Because most of those who "know", know there are better/easier methods than to attempt to put in an ATX LPS. Perhaps you should look into what we are doing in entirety, instead of blazing your own trail haphazardly. This is well trodden ground around here, perhaps more so than other forums. please supply list of better/easier methods and I will certainly consider them. Thanks. Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 28, 2018 Author Share Posted September 28, 2018 7 hours ago, audiobomber said: I beg to differ. There is a point to asking in another forum, specifically the diyAudio forum, which is all about building your own gear. You might start by reading some threads in the Power Supply Forum before posting your intended project. I'm certain you will get great advice from the people there: https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/power-supplies/ Well, doesn't hurt to give it a go for free I suppose? Link to comment
davide256 Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 15 minutes ago, the_doc735 said: Well, doesn't hurt to give it a go for free I suppose? as long as you regard the money spent on materials as tuition on an education, with no expectation of a tangible return. the_doc735 1 Regards, Dave Audio system Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 28, 2018 Author Share Posted September 28, 2018 23 minutes ago, davide256 said: as long as you regard the money spent on materials as tuition on an education, with no expectation of a tangible return. What I have is now called "special needs". In the late 1960's they called it "thick/lazy" etc. I didn't learn much at conventional school up to 16 (UK), they just got frustrated when "the penny didn't drop". I learned things after school with paid for private lessons, because at school the teachers didn't have a clue, beyond standard teaching methods, they were hopeless! Now of course when they find someone like me at school, they now try to figure out the way you think, process and learn BEFORE they attempt to teach you anything, because that is pointless until they understand how your mind works. So a lot of the time standard learning books are no good without considerable extra back up! I am told I have an unusual way of processing information that doesn't conform to convention. They've never been able to discover a way (yet) to make me understand algebra - LOL, but then again lots of people don't. Link to comment
audiobomber Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 4 hours ago, the_doc735 said: Well, doesn't hurt to give it a go for free I suppose? Go for it. It's an awesome website for DIY. the_doc735 1 Main System: QNAP TS-451+ NAS > Silent Angel Bonn N8 > Sonore opticalModule Deluxe v2 > Corning SMF with Finisar FTLF1318P3BTL SFPs > Uptone EtherREGEN > exaSound PlayPoint and e32 Mk-II DAC > Meitner MTR-101 Plus monoblocks > Bamberg S5-MTM sealed standmount speakers. Crown XLi 1500 powering AV123 Rocket UFW10 stereo subwoofers Upgraded power on all switches, renderer and DAC. Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 29, 2018 Author Share Posted September 29, 2018 17 hours ago, audiobomber said: Go for it. It's an awesome website for DIY. A case of fact resistant humans perhaps? I did say a while back that I had attempted to use DIYaudio for a few issues some time ago, but was told "we are not a teaching forum, go buy a book, we like conversations with our equals, not baby sitting". Can't remember which ones said this sort of thing! Cheers for suggestion though! Link to comment
audiobomber Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 2 minutes ago, the_doc735 said: A case of fact resistant humans perhaps? I did say a while back that I had attempted to use DIYaudio for a few issues some time ago, but was told "we are not a teaching forum, go buy a book, we like conversations with our equals, not baby sitting". Can't remember which ones said this sort of thing! Cheers for suggestion though! That's a shame. That's not been my experience at all, but there are dickheads on every site. the_doc735 1 Main System: QNAP TS-451+ NAS > Silent Angel Bonn N8 > Sonore opticalModule Deluxe v2 > Corning SMF with Finisar FTLF1318P3BTL SFPs > Uptone EtherREGEN > exaSound PlayPoint and e32 Mk-II DAC > Meitner MTR-101 Plus monoblocks > Bamberg S5-MTM sealed standmount speakers. Crown XLi 1500 powering AV123 Rocket UFW10 stereo subwoofers Upgraded power on all switches, renderer and DAC. Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 29, 2018 Author Share Posted September 29, 2018 5 minutes ago, audiobomber said: but there are dickheads on every site. YES! Thanks! Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 29, 2018 Author Share Posted September 29, 2018 After reading this thread I am decidedly put off chinese el cheapo LPSU! Seems that some SMPS are better with audio at this level? But of course the thread doesn't compare SMPS to: uptone paul hynes paul pang ted pardo sean jacobs Baldwin thelinearsolution SOtM Mojo ....etc. That could be a whole other story? Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 29, 2018 Author Share Posted September 29, 2018 So, is everyone on here saying don't bother with cheap (or expensive) LPSU ,waste of time and money! SMPS is better? This is the impression I am getting from @jabbr . "you should not worry that you will be missing out by using an SMPS to power your PC! ....the idea that you are missing out on a great audio experience because you can't afford an expensive power supply, or AC power cable etc is just wrong. I don't own, have never built nor want a linear powered ATX supply because I focus on low powered boards/streamers next to my DACs" "the real issue here is that a LPS is not always better than a SMPS". "Because most of those who "know", know there are better/easier methods than to attempt to put in an ATX LPS. Perhaps you should look into what we are doing in entirety, instead of blazing your own trail haphazardly. This is well trodden ground around here, perhaps more so than other forums." How about this? "Up to ten times quieter than than iFi's already excellent ultra-low-noise stock AC/DC adapter, and 20 times quieter than conventional audiophile linear power supplies, iPower has a virtually nonexistent noise floor of 0.000001 Volts (1μV). " Link to comment
jabbr Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 14 minutes ago, the_doc735 said: So, is everyone on here saying don't bother with cheap (or expensive) LPSU ,waste of time and money! SMPS is better? This is the impression I am getting from @jabbr To be clear: this all depends on your budget — if you can afford then get an LPS and tell for yourself if it’s better. If you are on a budget then you can almost certainly improve your SQ more by upgrading your speakers/headphones or amp or DAC. You are also better off using a very low powered renderer — this has all been talked to death. If you have $$$ to experiment and you’ve already optimized everything else then get an LPS. I don’t have on in my server or NAS but do in my very low powered renderers. the_doc735 1 Custom room treatments for headphone users. Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 30, 2018 Author Share Posted September 30, 2018 22 minutes ago, jabbr said: To be clear: this all depends on your budget — if you can afford then get an LPS and tell for yourself if it’s better. If you are on a budget then you can almost certainly improve your SQ more by upgrading your speakers/headphones or amp or DAC. You are also better off using a very low powered renderer — this has all been talked to death. If you have $$$ to experiment and you’ve already optimized everything else then get an LPS. I don’t have on in my server or NAS but do in my very low powered renderers. I could afford one, maybe two really good LPSU's, BUT NOT SEVERAL all at once! The thing is I am now getting the impression from you and a few others that it is a pointless exercise to spend money on LPSU, i.e. completely unnecessary exercise? Yes, I am pretty settled with my amp, speakers & DAC for the moment. I am also happy with my PLAYER PC as a renderer & synology NAS. So, you're saying if everything else is optimised to a level I am happy with, then I can optimise further by adding LPSU's? Are you saying "I don't have LPS on my server/NAS, but DO for my renderer?" Thanks, but need a bit of clarification? You use both SMPS & LPSU? Do U have any advice on this: How about this? "Up to ten times quieter than than iFi's already excellent ultra-low-noise stock AC/DC adapter, and 20 times quieter than conventional audiophile linear power supplies, iPower has a virtually nonexistent noise floor of 0.000001 Volts (1μV). " Link to comment
sandyk Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 Doc Too many novice type questions are putting off many members from further replying. You need to do a little more reading yourself on the plus and minus aspects for both types of supplies. You will find plenty of discussions in other areas of the forum, especially the Uptone area with John Swenson. Please check your PMs Alex the_doc735 1 How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file. PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020 Link to comment
jabbr Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 45 minutes ago, the_doc735 said: Thanks, but need a bit of clarification? You use both SMPS & LPSU? Yes I use ATX PSUs in NAS and upsampling server — LPSU to power renderers/NAA the_doc735 1 Custom room treatments for headphone users. Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 30, 2018 Author Share Posted September 30, 2018 13 minutes ago, sandyk said: Doc Too many novice type questions are putting off many members from further replying. You need to do a little more reading yourself on the plus and minus aspects for both types of supplies. You will find plenty of discussions in other areas of the forum, especially the Uptone area with John Swenson. Please check your PMs Alex I'm Sorry! I apologise for being a novice. I'm just asking what members think of different power supplies, what they prefer (and maybe why they prefer it as well?). I don't know if its my novice style questions or the fact that not too many are willing to give or commit to definite answers? I mean right from when I joined this place, you can - to give one example, ask a question and receive several vague answers like "there are better choices" and when asked for examples of those better choices OR URL links, the request is ignored; and I have read other threads where the same has happened to other 'newbies'. Link to comment
the_doc735 Posted September 30, 2018 Author Share Posted September 30, 2018 9 minutes ago, jabbr said: Yes I use ATX PSUs in NAS and upsampling server — LPSU to power renderers/NAA Many Thanks! - So you advocate 'both' for different tasks! Well, in a way, my stripped down PLAYER PC is acting like a renderer (of sorts/not dedicated device) and (like you just said) I fancied seeing for myself if LPSU would make any difference to the sound, I mean, if not I could always sell it on, it's no big deal really! And that's when I came to asking the members about options and choices regarding el cheapo Vs. Supremo LSPU. I can't figure out why this community would object to that? I mean no one is forced to reply or join in initially, it's up to each member to make their own mind up - whether they choose to reply or not! Right? Link to comment
jabbr Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 3 minutes ago, the_doc735 said: Many Thanks! You should also realize that most boards — including motherboards and PCIe cards and drives have onboard DC/DC converters eg 3.3, 2.5, 1.8 and 1.1V so your quest to entirely eliminate SMPS may be rather difficult unless you move to a renderer. Custom room treatments for headphone users. Link to comment
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