MQA The Truth lies Somewhere in the Middle

[The Computer Audiophile]

I may have changed the spelling to throw you guys off the trail. I also removed the word lodestar ?

[rickca]

Where did MQA and its shills enthusiasts get the idea that CA is responsible for prejudicing its readers against MQA?  It is not.

 

I read the material MQA released including Bob's Q&A and some of the magazine articles.  Then I read the analysis done by guys like @Miska , @mansr and Charles Hansen.  Then I used my own judgment.  Archimago's article subsequently confirmed some of my conclusions.

 

It's so easy to simply dismiss the CA community as a mob mentality.  

 

 

 

[Shadorne]

18 minutes ago, rickca said:

Where did MQA and its shills enthusiasts get the idea that CA is responsible for prejudicing its readers against MQA?  It is not.

 

I read the material MQA released including Bob's Q&A and some of the magazine articles.  Then I read the analysis done by guys like @Miska , @mansr and Charles Hansen.  Then I used my own judgment.  Archimago's article subsequently confirmed some of my conclusions.

 

It's so easy to simply dismiss the CA community as a mob mentality.  

 

 

 

 

Yes I agree. I wasn’t aware of Archimago until a couple of weeks ago. I came to different conclusions than Archimago independently. My biggest beef is that minimum phase filters are a big mistake in audio. They ruin important harmonic relationships. My second criticism is the same as my criticism of SACD and DSD - there ain’t anything wrong with 24/96KHz so why do we even need these fancy formats like MQA which bring absolutely no benefitfrom a technical perspective. That said I have read Archimago’s blog and I am highly impressed. Thorough. Thoughtful. Accurate. Insightful. Archimago masterfully debunks several Cargo Cult Science beliefs by examining evidence and asking the right questions. Hopefully I can meet Archimago one day. I quite understand he/she may have a day job and does not want to be identified. Whistleblowers are universally despised and have trouble finding work after being exposed. Corporate Managers only want “Team Players” on “their team” - I have yet  to meet a President or CEO or C suite Executive that gives a hoot for the truth - they only care about whether you are part of their “tribe” or not.

[austinpop]

53 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

I may have changed the spelling to throw you guys off the trail. I also removed the word lodestar ?

 

What about "malign forces?" That would have been apt too. ?

[Hugo9000]

@The Computer AudiophileWasn't there also something in the email comparing you to Mr. Darcy, and BS to the perfidious Wickham?  

 

(So sue me, I love Jane Austen lmao)

[Indydan]

On 10/11/2018 at 12:05 AM, Lee Scoggins said:

Goodnight.

I've updated the chart Lee!

 

 

MQA "enthusiast"                        Reason for no longer posting on CA

Peter Veth                                                          BANNED

WitchDoctor                                                      BANNED

Lee Scoggins                              SCARED of his BS being called out

Michael Lavorgna                      BANNED for telling someone to go fuck his mother

Peter Veth (as Peter Markus)  BANNED for acting like a dick and being an MQA shill

Jim Austin                                         Had a little bit of a meltdown on CA

Andy Schaub as Galileo365     Threw a hissy fit and quit just as he was about to be banned

Lee Scoggins PART 2                                             ? 

[Ralf11]

I didn't realize that WitchDoctor was an MP3QA Enthusiast, but he also came back under the name Snowflake

[firedog]

3 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

This is all MQA. You can buy the original PCM as 24/44.1 from HDtracks. That’s the resolution of the recording. MQA is adding the noise and decoding it to 88.2. 

And this is exactly the point that Lee and others have often said isn't true. Lee will now deny it, I suggest he look back at previous writings and posts before he does. 

We all understand that MQA files have no content above 48k and everything above that is upsampling. They are basically  "fake hi-res"  for any file above 96k. Calling them "192" as MQA does is a lie. This case is more of the same, except it's an extreme example of their lack of honesty about what their product is and does. 

[Fokus]

11 hours ago, adamdea said:

incidentally can anyone (@Mansr?) tell me whether they have been able to reproduce archimago's findings with the hole in the spectrum for the bruno mars track?

 

Yes, totally, early in 2017.

[Fokus]

8 hours ago, adamdea said:

And the gap is because they were conventionally brickwalled at 20 kHz or so when originally produced? 

 

I would say unconventionally brickwalled, because most ADCs or SRC tools (used in default mode) would run up to 22.05kHz (and a bit beyond).

[Fokus]

38 minutes ago, firedog said:

We all understand that MQA files have no content above 48k and everything above that is upsampling.

 

No, that it not true at all.

 

MQA has the capability of passing a 2x file through a 1x channel more or less unscathed. This has been proven, no-one tries to deny that.

 

For a 4x original MQA passes the 2x part, and then extends back to 4x by upsampling, so that is part  fake, but in their mind it does not matter because only shallow filters were used, 'avoiding temporal distortion'.

 

For 1x originals MQA cannot do much to distinguish themselves, to they revert to very lazy, NOS-like upsampling for such files. This is what the spectral hole in Mars, Beyonce, ... is about. They call it master quality, we call it a fuzz box.

 

[adamdea]

1 hour ago, Fokus said:

 

Yes, totally, early in 2017.

 

1 hour ago, Fokus said:

 

I would say unconventionally brickwalled, because most ADCs or SRC tools (used in default mode) would run up to 22.05kHz (and a bit beyond).

Thanks. 

[mansr]

4 hours ago, Fokus said:

MQA has the capability of passing a 2x file through a 1x channel more or less unscathed. This has been proven, no-one tries to deny that.

This is done at the expense of some bit depth. Guess what determines the time resolution of a sampled signal. That's right, it's the bit depth.

[firedog]

4 hours ago, Fokus said:

MQA has the capability of passing a 2x file through a 1x channel more or less unscathed. This has been proven, no-one tries to deny that.

 My understanding is that when MQA encodes a file that is higher res than a 24-48, it only encodes material up to 48k, and throws the higher frequencies away as "perceptually lossless".  That's one of the reasons it is "lossy". So for a 88, 96,176, 192,etc., it is discarding material above 48k if it is there. 

[Don Hills]

12 hours ago, John_Atkinson said:

...  My fundamental instruction to would-be writers: don't write what you don't know.  ...

 

9 hours ago, Lee Scoggins said:

...  I simply write part-time for an audio magazine.  

 

[Fokus]

8 minutes ago, firedog said:

 My understanding is that when MQA encodes a file that is higher res than a 24-48, it only encodes material up to 48k, and throws the higher frequencies away as "perceptually lossless".  That's one of the reasons it is "lossy". So for a 88, 96,176, 192,etc., it is discarding material above 48k if it is there. 

 

Up to 48k payload, that is, 96k sample rate.

[bambadoo]

Not sure if it has been posted. 

The seminar filmed from the audience

Also captures the "aftermath"

 

[crenca]

You and @firedogare on the same page - he was referring to useful sampled frequencies and you are referring to sample rate (so X2)...

 

3 hours ago, Fokus said:

 

Up to 48k payload, that is, 96k sample rate.

 

[crenca]

11 hours ago, Shadorne said:

 

Yes I agree. I wasn’t aware of Archimago until a couple of weeks ago. I came to different conclusions than Archimago independently. My biggest beef is that minimum phase filters are a big mistake in audio. They ruin important harmonic relationships. My second criticism is the same as my criticism of SACD and DSD - there ain’t anything wrong with 24/96KHz so why do we even need these fancy formats like MQA which bring absolutely no benefitfrom a technical perspective. That said I have read Archimago’s blog and I am highly impressed. Thorough. Thoughtful. Accurate. Insightful. Archimago masterfully debunks several Cargo Cult Science beliefs by examining evidence and asking the right questions. Hopefully I can meet Archimago one day. I quite understand he/she may have a day job and does not want to be identified. Whistleblowers are universally despised and have trouble finding work after being exposed. Corporate Managers only want “Team Players” on “their team” - I have yet  to meet a President or CEO or C suite Executive that gives a hoot for the truth - they only care about whether you are part of their “tribe” or not.

 

This post reminds me of how we know the truth, any truth, of MQA.  It's not through the publications and that men like Scoggins and Atkinson are a part of.  On the contrary, they have done their best to obfuscate and justify the MQA marketing speak - they have worked hard these last 3 years or so to deny the truth.

 

Two cheers to mansr, archi, Chris, and all those around here who have questioned MQA from the very beginning and brought out what it really is about...

[lucretius]

3 hours ago, Odd Magnus Bjerkvik said:

Not sure if it has been posted. 

The seminar filmed from the audience

Also captures the "aftermath"

 

 

Never invite a salesman to a presentation.

[Brinkman Ship]

3 hours ago, Odd Magnus Bjerkvik said:

Not sure if it has been posted. 

The seminar filmed from the audience

Also captures the "aftermath"

 

Thank you sir for posting this. EVERYBODY here should watch this carefully. This is the Zapruder film of MQA RMAF.

 

You will see at the end, AS IF YOU DID NOT KNOW the true character of Scoggins when he claims there is "no meaningful debate" on CA about MQA. Then Derek Huges fully admits there is tremendous "technical expertise" on CA that is over his head. I loved the part when they were whining about Bob Stuart being called out as liar and con man.

 

MUST WATCH TV!!!

[semente]

On 10/9/2018 at 3:09 PM, Shadders said:

This is the MQA mob outside the venue lecture :

 

We want our Brexit!!!

[The Computer Audiophile]

11 minutes ago, Brinkman Ship said:

This is the Zapruder film of MQA RMFAF.

I almost fell off my chair when I read this. Too good. 

[semente]

On 10/10/2018 at 3:33 AM, Lee Scoggins said:

His pounding on the table was just for emphasis. It's not something I see a lot in the U.S. but I see it all the time in the UK so I think that's just a cultural thing.

 

After how many pints? ?

[kumakuma]

49 minutes ago, Brinkman Ship said:

 

You will see at the end, AS IF YOU DID NOT KNOW the true character of Scoggins when he claims there is "no meaningful debate" on CA about MQA. 

 

 

This says it all. 

 

Products that solve a genuine problem or add real value do not need to be sold through lies.

 

@Lee Scoggins