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Allo Digione Signature

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7 hours ago, ALLOaudio said:

@nbpf

 

we offer a 5.5 x 2.5 to 5.5 x 2.1 adapter.

it will be on the site soon and is included in each order.
regards\

I use two 5.5 x 2.5 to 5.5 x 2.1 adapters at the end of the cables that come with the DigiOne Signature. This is not an acceptable solution, in my view. One has effectively three terminations in a row (the 5.5 x 2.5 plug, the 5.5 x 2.5 to 5.5 x 2.1 adapter and the 5.5 x 2.1) for a total length of about 10cm. This is heavy, stiff, ugly and unnecessary. What Allo should do is to rethink the design of the board or at least provide cables with a  5.5 x 2.1 female plug. Everything else does not make any sense. If I'll keep the DigiOne Signature what I am going to do is to order a pair of https://www.ghentaudio.com/part/dc29.html cables of suitable length. 

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9 minutes ago, nbpf said:

I use two 5.5 x 2.5 to 5.5 x 2.1 adapters at the end of the cables that come with the DigiOne Signature. This is not an acceptable solution, in my view. One has effectively three terminations in a row (the 5.5 x 2.5 plug, the 5.5 x 2.5 to 5.5 x 2.1 adapter and the 5.5 x 2.1) for a total length of about 10cm. This is heavy, stiff, ugly and unnecessary. What Allo should do is to rethink the design of the board or at least provide cables with a  5.5 x 2.1 female plug. Everything else does not make any sense. If I'll keep the DigiOne Signature what I am going to do is to order a pair of https://www.ghentaudio.com/part/dc29.html cables of suitable length. 

 i bought two of these....

 

https://www.ebay.it/itm/DC-5-5MM-x-2-1MM-to-USB-3-1-TYPE-C-MALE-CONNECTOR-ADAPTER-ANDROID-SMARTPHONE-ETC/222720290834?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=521575623212&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649

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6 hours ago, rruffin said:

Including an battery adapter in each order is a great idea!!!

Oops, I misread the Allo post. They are including a 5.5 x 2.5 to 5.5 x 2.1 adapter with each order, not a battery adapter. I would suggest Allo at least remind folks that running the clean side from a batter pack is a great idea and then offer them the option of adding one to their cart. That way, after realizing that powering the clean side with an inexpensive battery pack is a vast improvement over any switching power supply, they will not have to pay the shipping charges from India again when they order it...


MacMini Quad i7/Audirvana Plus 3.5/DigiOne Signature Player/MSB Gold Link III DAC (external Monolithic PS)/Aragon Palladium 1 amplifiers/Stacked Energy 22 speakers (Reference Connoisseur on bottom & Pro 22 on top) set tweeter to tweeter/Kimber Monocle XL speaker wires/stereo Mordaunt Short 309 subwoofers

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7 hours ago, burmar said:

These are fine but make cable terminations longer and heavier. The USB C connectors on the DigiOne board seem reasonably robust but I would not want to put too much bending load on them. I would prefer using flexible cables with a light USB C plug.

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12 hours ago, nbpf said:

Sure, I understand that the only thing that matters is that the interface is powered when the RPi boots.

Thanks for asking, and for answering.  That's my working assumption too.  I'm a bit baffled that Allo don't quite seem to know though, or if they do they can't explain it here in anything but woolly terms.

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2 hours ago, RX8R3ROD said:

I imagine Allo is trying to simplify things so people like me don’t get terrified by technicalities? ??

The problem is that, for many users included myself, the DigiOne Signature is not a completely obvious design.

 

The DigiOne was powered by the connected RPi. The RPi + DigiOne combination had one single power input, namely that of the RPi.

 

Then many people (included myself) started asking for a DigiOne version with a dedicated dedicated power input.

 

With the DigiOne Signature, Allo has added to the DigiOne not one but two power inputs! 

 

As a consequence, a RPi + DigiOne Signature combination has now three power inputs.

 

Allo has made clear that the RPi power input is not meant to be connected to any power supply and that the clean input of the DigiOne Signature should be powered before its dirty input is powered.

 

That said, there have been some inconsistencies in the way these facts (and those about the voltages to be used in powering the clean side) have been communicated and the design of the DigiOne Signature is, for practical purposes, far from optimal.

 

I do not know how much of this design is dictated by technical and economical concerns.

 

But the fact that the two additional power inputs are at 90 degrees from the S/PDIF outputs and the usage of USB C to barrel adaptors inevitable leads to a cable mess and to an enormous waste of space: my DigiOne Signature with attached USB drive and connections to a Naim DAC and to the power supplies takes about the same space on a shelf than the Naim DAC itself. This is of course also due to the fact that S/PDIF cables tend to be very stiff. 

 

My personal take is that there are limits to what one can meaningfully put on the top of a RPi and that these limits are both of technical, practical and aesthetical nature.

 

In the future, perhaps Allo could consider solutions based on professional enclosures, like the one pioneered by Bryston with the BDP-Pi.

 

As an alternative, I also would not mind having the Pi and the transport in two different boxes connected by a GPIO ribbon cable.  

 

Pimoroni makes excellent cases for Rapsberry Pi devices. A Pi in a Pibow coupe ribbon-connected with a box hosting a Signature 2 and with professional connectors for power and S/PDIF outputs on the same side would in the end take less space and be easier to use than the current design.

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@RX8R3ROD: After about 10 days and many hours of listening the DigiOne Signature should be meanwhile burn in. It sounds indeed very, very good. In your reports, you have pointed out the importance of powering the clean side of the DigiOne Signature with a good power supply or battery. Have you noticed any impact of the power supply used for the dirty side on sound quality? Thanks, nbpf 

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Got my unit today. Just wanted to comment that I thought the packaging was perfectly fine. Lots of sturdy cardboard and foam inserts for the sensitive pieces, and even the case was wrapped up fine for transport across the world. Not sure why there are any complaints here. 

 

I appreciate the total number of adapters in the box. @allo.comI do think it would be very helpful to just show one photo on the product listing page or make it clear in the description what all is included when ordering a unit, seems like I'm not the only person that has experienced considerable confusion when trying to coordinate what all they need with a purchase of just the Signature unit with no add-ons other than a case. 

 

Got the case unwrapped, everything put together, and powered up in less than 30 minutes - very intuitive and straightforward without any instructions. I've got the clean side powered with a new Uptone LPS-1.2 and the dirty side powered with my repurposed iFi iPower left over from my original Digione. Didn't need to purchase any extra pieces or converters (everything needed was already in the Digione Signature box). Looking forward to letting everything run constantly for a week or so before really settling in with it.

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Got my unit today. Just wanted to comment that I thought the packaging was perfectly fine. Lots of sturdy cardboard and foam inserts for the sensitive pieces, and even the case was wrapped up fine for transport across the world. Not sure why there are any complaints here. 

 

Got the case unwrapped, everything put together, and powered up in less than 30 minutes. I've got the clean side powered with a new Uptone LPS-1.2 and the dirty side powered with my repurposed iFi iPower left over from my original Digione. Didn't need to purchase any extra pieces or converters (everything needed was already in the Digione Signature box). Looking forward to letting everything run constantly for a week or so before really settling in with it.

 

I appreciate the total number of adapters in the box. @allo I do think it would be very helpful to just show one photo on the product listing page or make it clear in the description what all is included when ordering a unit. One other concern at the moment: WiFi strength took a nosedive and I'm having a lot of issues maintainig any connectivity even after a couple of restarts. Do you know if there is a way to bump up power to WiFi? This problem didn't exist on the RPi 3B+ with my original Digione unit, I'm wondering if powering through the "dirty" board is causing this issue?

 

 

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7 hours ago, nbpf said:

@RX8R3ROD: After about 10 days and many hours of listening the DigiOne Signature should be meanwhile burn in. It sounds indeed very, very good. In your reports, you have pointed out the importance of powering the clean side of the DigiOne Signature with a good power supply or battery. Have you noticed any impact of the power supply used for the dirty side on sound quality? Thanks, nbpf 

Hi nbpf, great to hear you’re enjoying the Signature. ?

 

As to hearing SQ effects from different ways of powering the dirty side ... indeed I have! It doesn’t seem as significant to me as the clean side, but it does seem to me to make a difference.

 

And who knows why? It may be to do with how much crud the dirty side power supply and / or the Pi itself feeds back into the mains and how that interacts with the clean side, and / or it may be that providing a cleaner feed to the Pi somehow helps the Allo kit, despite the galvanic isolation, and / or ....

 

But in my system with my electricity supply, it does make a difference and if you have some spare supplies it might be worth a few experiments.

 

I’m currently using various things but best results so far have been iPower 9v > iPower Nano USB 3.0 > DC iPurifier 2.0. The iPurifier made quite a difference and that’s what makes me wonder whether the effect is caused by how much the Pi sends noise back into the mains.

 

i have also found that a couple of spare Jitterbugs I had lying around when stuffed into the Pi’s USB ports also make a useful improvement!

 

Have fun! ?

 

 

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58 minutes ago, RX8R3ROD said:

Hi nbpf, great to hear you’re enjoying the Signature. ?

 

As to hearing SQ effects from different ways of powering the dirty side ... indeed I have! It doesn’t seem as significant to me as the clean side, but it does seem to me to make a difference.

 

And who knows why? It may be to do with how much crud the dirty side power supply and / or the Pi itself feeds back into the mains and how that interacts with the clean side, and / or it may be that providing a cleaner feed to the Pi somehow helps the Allo kit, despite the galvanic isolation, and / or ....

 

But in my system with my electricity supply, it does make a difference and if you have some spare supplies it might be worth a few experiments.

 

I’m currently using various things but best results so far have been iPower 9v > iPower Nano USB 3.0 > DC iPurifier 2.0. The iPurifier made quite a difference and that’s what makes me wonder whether the effect is caused by how much the Pi sends noise back into the mains.

 

i have also found that a couple of spare Jitterbugs I had lying around when stuffed into the Pi’s USB ports also make a useful improvement!

 

Have fun! ?

 

 

Thanks!

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8 hours ago, maha0098 said:

...

 

@allo I do think it would be very helpful to just show one photo on the product listing page or make it clear in the description what all is included when ordering a unit. One other concern at the moment: WiFi strength took a nosedive and I'm having a lot of issues maintainig any connectivity even after a couple of restarts. Do you know if there is a way to bump up power to WiFi? This problem didn't exist on the RPi 3B+ with my original Digione unit, I'm wondering if powering through the "dirty" board is causing this issue?

 

 

I cannot confirm wireless strength problems with the DigiOne Signature. I am running the DigiOne and the DigiOne Signature side-by-side. The DigiOne and the dirty side of the Digione Signature are powered by the same ifi 5V/2.5A PSU. The clean side of the DigiOne Signature is powered by a LPS-1.2. In both cases I read the same signal strength (-71 dBm) and the same data rate (150 / 120 Mbit/s) in a 5GHz wireless.

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8 hours ago, maha0098 said:

Got my unit today. Just wanted to comment that I thought the packaging was perfectly fine. Lots of sturdy cardboard and foam inserts for the sensitive pieces, and even the case was wrapped up fine for transport across the world. Not sure why there are any complaints here. 

As explained, because the box I received was not in a mint state: it had a bump at one corner and looked as if it had been opened and closed many times. Not a big issue but something to keep in check if Allo want to avoid giving the impression that they do not care for details. There would be no point in doing so, in my view: they are really doing an exceptional work!

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9 hours ago, maha0098 said:

...

 @allo.comI do think it would be very helpful to just show one photo on the product listing page or make it clear in the description what all is included when ordering a unit, seems like I'm not the only person that has experienced considerable confusion when trying to coordinate what all they need with a purchase of just the Signature unit with no add-ons other than a case. 

...

Good points but if you scroll down to the bottom of https://www.allo.com/sparky/digione-signature.html, you'll find a FEATURES + TECH SPECS field with detailed information about what is needed to use the DigiOne Signature and what is included in the package. Perhaps Allo could make clear that the standoffs needed to connect the DigiOne Signature to a RPi are included in the package.

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@maha0098, all: I understand that you power the clean side of the DigiOne Signature with a LPS-1.2. Are you powering it with 5V, 7V or 9V? Does the voltage affect the sound quality? Is it better to power the clean side with 5V or with higher voltages?

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2 hours ago, RX8R3ROD said:

? so worth a try then ?

I'll give it a try later in the afternoon or during the weekend and report. You have tried feeding the clean side both with about 7V through batteries and with 5V. I have been wandering whether the differences that you have found relate more to the quality of the power supplies or to the different voltages.

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5 hours ago, nbpf said:

@maha0098, all: I understand that you power the clean side of the DigiOne Signature with a LPS-1.2. Are you powering it with 5V, 7V or 9V? Does the voltage affect the sound quality? Is it better to power the clean side with 5V or with higher voltages?

 

I haven't tried anything other than 5v on the LPS-1.2 yet. Both the LPS-1.2 and the Digione Signature have been running for less than 24 hours, I won't start playing around with any of the variables until another week has gone by. Just trying to run music through it 24/7 for now.

 

All: Do let us know what changes you notice if you bump up to 7v though!

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3 hours ago, allo.com said:

From a technical point of view...it should make no difference. Practically we find that any change results in a slightly changed sound.

Thanks! 

 

I have been wandering whether it would be meaningful to run the DigiOne Signature at some distance from the host Raspberry Pi. One could connect them with something like 

 

 https://www.amazon.de/40-40-GPIO-Flachbandkabel-für-Raspberry/dp/B00QE3KZQ6/ref=sr_1_fkmr1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1541166947&sr=8-2-fkmr1&keywords=Raspberry+Pi+Gpio+Ribbon+Cable+male+female.

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4 hours ago, nbpf said:

I'll give it a try later in the afternoon or during the weekend and report. You have tried feeding the clean side both with about 7V through batteries and with 5V. I have been wandering whether the differences that you have found relate more to the quality of the power supplies or to the different voltages.

You raise a veeery good question there! ?? Be really interested to see what you find!

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17 hours ago, RX8R3ROD said:

You raise a veeery good question there! ?? Be really interested to see what you find!

I have increased the voltage for the clean side to 7V. It is of course impossible to make direct comparisons. For the time being I cannot report any obvious difference. I will keep on powering the clean side with 7V for a couple of day and then switch back to 5V and see whether I notice any difference. If not, I am going to let the LPS-1.2 output at 5V to avoid damaging the DS if I happen to swap the clean and dirty side feeds by mistake. 

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After a few weeks of enjoying with  Signature in my audio system I must admit that Sig. worth every eur. But , here is my little problem :  from the very first day I use Sig.with Rpi2 b without any problem (Asus powerbank on clean side and Rpi stock psu for dirty side) and yesterday I tried to replace RPi2 b  with Rpi 3b+ but without success.Problem is const. undervoltage (red light blinking all the time).Tried with different psu (Ifi Ipower,etc.), tried with 3 psu as you mentioned : 

"Quick fix so you can listen to music ...feed RPi uUSB AND dirty side type C usb (clean side keep on feeding the batteries) . All inputs are protected by diodes so you can feed it 3 ways as well. This will get rid of the undervoltage"

 

No success.Without Sig . Rpi3b+  work fine , but with Sig.-nothing.Anyway, I put Sig back on Rpi2b and continue to enjoy in music.

Do you have any idea where the problem might be?

 

P.S. Sorry for my poor english.

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