New HDPLEX 200W LPS

[rickca]

1 hour ago, elan120 said:

I am now wondering how much impact would this have when EtherRegen is released.

Exactly, that's what I want to see as well.  Maybe the server will have less influence on the endpoint with an EtherREGEN in front of the endpoint.  Nobody knows for sure.

[Evo-No-Revo]

Deleted....

 

[sypderman88]

Hi,

 

 So far is there any comparison with SOTM SPS-500 especially when powering either SOTM 200 or Intel NUC player ?

 Thanks

 

[Lebouwsky]

7 hours ago, sypderman88 said:

Hi,

 

 So far is there any comparison with SOTM SPS-500 especially when powering either SOTM 200 or Intel NUC player ?

 Thanks

 

The customized hdplex 200W will take another 2 weeks before shipment to Europe. It will be compared with sps500 powering a motherboard.

 

The prototype atx cable from Ghent using all 4 rails is om it’s way btw.

[tboooe]

 

5 hours ago, Lebouwsky said:

The prototype atx cable from Ghent using all 4 rails is om it’s way btw.

 

Do tell....so what is Ghent doing to this cable that will make it different from a standard atx cable?  Is this the 20/24  pin mobo connector?  What about the 8 pin for the CPU?

[Lebouwsky]

I will report in detail when everything works and is tested properly. This is what we’ve agreed upon.

[rickca]

This is an introduction to an upcoming post I have in mind with implementation experiences.

 

The NUC7i7DNBE running AudioLinux is a popular choice as a server.  At 15W TDP, it can be powered by a Paul Hynes SR4 (either 12V or 19V model).  But that 15W TDP assumes you're running at base clock speeds (no turbo boost).  The NUC7i7DNBE has base/boost clocks of 1.9 GHz/4.2 GHz, so disabling turbo boost significantly constrains its performance potential.

 

What if you need a really powerful server with base clocks at 4 GHz like an i7-6700K for HQPlayer's most CPU intensive filters/modulators?  Now you have a CPU with 91W TDP.  If you also want to exploit CUDA offload with an Nvidia card like a GTX 1080 (180W) or GTX 2080 (215W), how do you power this machine?

 

Once you move from a NUC to a mini-ITX or ATX motherboard, you need an ATX power supply.  These motherboards typically have a 24-pin connector and an 8-pin EPS12V connector for the CPU.  Can we significantly improve sound quality by using an LPS in such a configuration?  

 

The HDPLEX 200W LPS ($485) can deliver up to 10A on its 19V fixed rail.  Together with an HDPLEX 400W DC-ATX ($95), we have a solution that's a good fit.  With 4 separately grounded rails including two adjustable voltage 2A rails using 4 x LT3045-1 each, we can also power some accessories like a JCAT USB card, an ISO REGEN, a network switch, etc.  It's a really versatile and cost effective solution.

 

I have an i7-6700K system running Windows 10 with music files on an internal hard drive.  I use it as a server for my NUC7PJYH/AL/SR4 endpoint connected via wifi.  I also use it as a standalone system with an iFi micro iDSD and Focal monitors, so it's got to sound good in its own right.  The server and endpoint are in different rooms.

 

Does the sound quality of the server affect the sound quality of the endpoint?  Many users who have experimented have emphatically concluded that it does.  Will this still be true with an EtherREGEN in front of a wired endpoint?  We don't know yet.

 

I'd been powering my Windows 10/i7-6700K system with a Seasonic X650 Gold.  It's a very good 650W PSU that got 9.1/10 from power supply review site JonnyGURU. 

 
With the HDPLEX 200W LPS/400W DC-ATX, my server sounds so much better that I'm planning to replace Windows 10 with either AudioLinux or Windows Server 2019/AO 3.  I'm confident a more streamlined/lower latency OS will benefit even more from the HDPLEX solution.

[lmitche]

1 hour ago, rickca said:

I'm planning to replace Windows 10 with either AudioLinux or Windows Server 2019/AO 3.

In the past 2 weeks I've worked to convert 2 different i7-6700k z270 machines to Audiolinux. In both cases the owners described a major increase in SQ from the software change alone.

[tboooe]

4 hours ago, rickca said:

The HDPLEX 200W LPS ($485) can deliver up to 10A on its 19V fixed rail.  Together with an HDPLEX 400W DC-ATX ($95), we have a solution that's a good fit

I wonder if this combination sounds better than powering the server directly with the HDPlex 400w AC to DC lps atx which I have?  I have the 200w lps on order and I have the first generation DC-atx so I can do a.comparison.  No exactly a perfect test because I don't the current version of the DC-atx but an interesting test nonetheless.  Based on specs alone, the 400w lps is better than the DC-atx in terms of ripple.

 

3 hours ago, lmitche said:

In the past 2 weeks I've worked to convert 2 different i7-6700k z270 machines to Audiolinux. In both cases the owners described a major increase in SQ from the software change alone.

Curious what OS where these people coming from?  I used audiolinux in the past for my NAA but preferred the sound of a Windows based one, perhaps because of the driver and settings.

[rickca]

11 minutes ago, tboooe said:

I wonder if this combination sounds better than powering the server directly with the HDPlex 400w AC to DC lps atx which I have?  I have the 200w lps on order and I have the first generation DC-atx so I can do a.comparison.  No exactly a perfect test because I don't the current version of the DC-atx but an interesting test nonetheless.  Based on specs alone, the 400w lps is better than the DC-atx in terms of ripple.

That would be a very interesting bit of feedback.

[austinpop]

5 hours ago, rickca said:

This is an introduction to an upcoming post I have in mind with implementation experiences.

 

The NUC7i7DNBE running AudioLinux is a popular choice as a server.  At 15W TDP, it can be powered by a Paul Hynes SR4 (either 12V or 19V model).  But that 15W TDP assumes you're running at base clock speeds (no turbo boost).  The NUC7i7DNBE has base/boost clocks of 1.9 GHz/4.2 GHz, so disabling turbo boost significantly constrains its performance potential.

 

What if you need a really powerful server with base clocks at 4 GHz like an i7-6700K for HQPlayer's most CPU intensive filters/modulators?  Now you have a CPU with 91W TDP.  If you also want to exploit CUDA offload with an Nvidia card like a GTX 1080 (180W) or GTX 2080 (215W), how do you power this machine?

 

Once you move from a NUC to a mini-ITX or ATX motherboard, you need an ATX power supply.  These motherboards typically have a 24-pin connector and an 8-pin EPS12V connector for the CPU.  Can we significantly improve sound quality by using an LPS in such a configuration?  

 

The HDPLEX 200W LPS ($485) can deliver up to 10A on its 19V fixed rail.  Together with an HDPLEX 400W DC-ATX ($95), we have a solution that's a good fit.  With 4 separately grounded rails including two adjustable voltage 2A rails using 4 x LT3045-1 each, we can also power some accessories like a JCAT USB card, an ISO REGEN, a network switch, etc.  It's a really versatile and cost effective solution.

 

I have an i7-6700K system running Windows 10 with music files on an internal hard drive.  I use it as a server for my NUC7PJYH/AL/SR4 endpoint connected via wifi.  I also use it as a standalone system with an iFi micro iDSD and Focal monitors, so it's got to sound good in its own right.  The server and endpoint are in different rooms.

 

Does the sound quality of the server affect the sound quality of the endpoint?  Many users who have experimented have emphatically concluded that it does.  Will this still be true with an EtherREGEN in front of a wired endpoint?  We don't know yet.

 

I'd been powering my Windows 10/i7-6700K system with a Seasonic X650 Gold.  It's a very good 650W PSU that got 9.1/10 from power supply review site JonnyGURU. 

 
With the HDPLEX 200W LPS/400W DC-ATX, my server sounds so much better that I'm planning to replace Windows 10 with either AudioLinux or Windows Server 2019/AO 3.  I'm confident a more streamlined/lower latency OS will benefit even more from the HDPLEX solution.

 

Thanks for that great summary!

 

1 hour ago, tboooe said:

I wonder if this combination sounds better than powering the server directly with the HDPlex 400w AC to DC lps atx which I have?  I have the 200w lps on order and I have the first generation DC-atx so I can do a.comparison.  No exactly a perfect test because I don't the current version of the DC-atx but an interesting test nonetheless.  Based on specs alone, the 400w lps is better than the DC-atx in terms of ripple.

 

Yes, this is a burning question in my mind too. What is the penalty in SQ of the DC-ATX adapter fed from a single 19V rail, vs. using 4 independent rails directly driving the ATX and EPS voltages.

[tboooe]

17 minutes ago, austinpop said:

Yes, this is a burning question in my mind too. What is the penalty in SQ of the DC-ATX adapter fed from a single 19V rail, vs. using 4 independent rails directly driving the ATX and EPS voltages.

Once I get the HdPlex 200w lps I will compare.  Interesting comments I recently read on other threads about powering the mobo and cpu from separate rails.  I've been doing this with my 400w HdPlex lps for years now.  Maybe I've been doing it right the whole time without really knowing what the heck I was doing!

[rickca]

@austinpop and @tboooe you may want to read this post from @lmitche again.  He has already made some progress in answering this question with his configuration #3.  I don't have the cable necessary to try this myself.

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/55247-audiolinux-server-configurations-software-hardware-and-listening-impressions/?do=findComment&comment=924226

 

[austinpop]

1 minute ago, rickca said:

@austinpop and @tboooe you may want to read this post from @lmitche again.  He has already made some progress in answering this question with his configuration #3.  I don't have the cable necessary to try this myself.

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/55247-audiolinux-server-configurations-software-hardware-and-listening-impressions/?do=findComment&comment=924226

 

 

Yes, Rick, Larry's result is very promising, but is limited to the use of separate 12V rails for ATX and EPS.

 

One wonders now whether separating out the 3.3, 5, and 12V still remaining on the ATX to their own rails makes a further difference?

[tboooe]

7 minutes ago, rickca said:

@austinpop and @tboooe you may want to read this post from @lmitche again.  He has already made some progress in answering this question with his configuration #3.  I don't have the cable necessary to try this myself.

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/55247-audiolinux-server-configurations-software-hardware-and-listening-impressions/?do=findComment&comment=924226

 

I saw that but he is still powering the Mobo through the DC ATX which has worse specs than the 400w HDPlex lps.  The 200w lps has better specs than the 400w however.  When I get my 200w lps I can try all sorts of different configurations.  Perhaps the ideal would be to use the 400w lps for the Mobo and the 200w for the CPU????

[rickca]

Just now, austinpop said:

 

Yes, Rick, Larry's result is very promising, but is limited to the use of separate 12V rails for ATX and EPS.

 

One wonders now whether separating out the 3.3, 5, and 12V still remaining on the ATX to their own rails makes a further difference?

Yes.  I think we'll get some more data points from @Lebouwsky and @tboooe.  The 200W LPS/400W DC-ATX is definitely a good move.  We'll see how much more refinement is possible.

[rickca]

2 minutes ago, tboooe said:

I saw that but he is still powering the Mobo through the DC ATX which has worse specs than the 400w HDPlex lps.  The 200w lps has better specs than the 400w however.  When I get my 200w lps I can try all sorts of different configurations.  Perhaps the ideal would be to use the 400w lps for the Mobo and the 200w for the CPU????

I like your idea of actually listening to the different configurations rather than relying on specs.  We also need to keep cost and complexity in the calculus ... or we're going to end up with a custom SR7. 🙄

[frederick184]

On 2/9/2019 at 12:22 PM, tboooe said:

I wonder if this combination sounds better than powering the server directly with the HDPlex 400w AC to DC lps atx which I have?  I have the 200w lps on order and I have the first generation DC-atx so I can do a.comparison.  No exactly a perfect test because I don't the current version of the DC-atx but an interesting test nonetheless.  Based on specs alone, the 400w lps is better than the DC-atx in terms of ripple.

 

Curious what OS where these people coming from?  I used audiolinux in the past for my NAA but preferred the sound of a Windows based one, perhaps because of the driver and settings.

As one of the above mentioned owners (thanks Larry!), I came from using Win 2016 server core with AO.  I also have an i7 DNBE NUC endpoint with AL.  The endpoint was done first with excellent results, but converting the server made a large and noticeable difference.  I have an HDPLEX 200W and DC ATX on order to power my motherboard/CPU and Startech USB 3.1 card.

 

Colin

[henke]

My first unit of the new hdplex 200w did not have earth ground connection and I had an replacement for an new hdplex 200w unit that I yesterday opened up and discovered that it didnt have the ELNA caps 3300uf 50v instead it had Rubycon yxf 3300uf caps rated only for 35v. So this is not good. I wonder what voltage those caps are exposed to? This could be dangerous if it is over 35v or even if it is 35 there could be problem if there is a spike?

They seem to have done this because the lead time is long for ELNA and the price is the same for Rubycon according to an email I got. 

[Lebouwsky]

1 hour ago, henke said:

My first unit of the new hdplex 200w did not have earth ground connection and I had an replacement for an new hdplex 200w unit that I yesterday opened up and discovered that it didnt have the ELNA caps 3300uf 50v instead it had Rubycon yxf 3300uf caps rated only for 35v. So this is not good. I wonder what voltage those caps are exposed to? This could be dangerous if it is over 35v or even if it is 35 there could be problem if there is a spike?

They seem to have done this because the lead time is long for ELNA and the price is the same for Rubycon according to an email I got. 

Thank you for the info. Can you please share some pictures so others with less electro-Engineering skills like myself can check / recoignize?

[tboooe]

6 hours ago, henke said:

My first unit of the new hdplex 200w did not have earth ground connection and I had an replacement for an new hdplex 200w unit that I yesterday opened up and discovered that it didnt have the ELNA caps 3300uf 50v instead it had Rubycon yxf 3300uf caps rated only for 35v. So this is not good. I wonder what voltage those caps are exposed to? This could be dangerous if it is over 35v or even if it is 35 there could be problem if there is a spike?

They seem to have done this because the lead time is long for ELNA and the price is the same for Rubycon according to an email I got. 

Hmmmmm this doesn't sit well with me. I would prefer to stick with the ELNA caps.  

[rickca]

9 hours ago, henke said:

My first unit of the new hdplex 200w did not have earth ground connection and I had an replacement for an new hdplex 200w unit that I yesterday opened up and discovered that it didnt have the ELNA caps 3300uf 50v instead it had Rubycon yxf 3300uf caps rated only for 35v. So this is not good. I wonder what voltage those caps are exposed to? This could be dangerous if it is over 35v or even if it is 35 there could be problem if there is a spike?

They seem to have done this because the lead time is long for ELNA and the price is the same for Rubycon according to an email I got. 

I sent your post to HDPLEX.  Here is their response.

 

The highest voltage we use is 25V for 19V rail.

Your original unit is the only one that was missing the yellow earth cable.

A small batch of the 200W LPSU use Rubycon due to long lead time of ELNA.  Their performance and spec are similar.

New batch will have ELNA.

 

 

[henke]

3 hours ago, rickca said:

I sent your post to HDPLEX.  Here is their response.

 

The highest voltage we use is 25V for 19V rail.

Your original unit is the only one that was missing the yellow earth cable.

This must mean that it is verified that there is no other unit out there that is not earthed.  So all who bought an unit  controlled that it is connected to earth?

3 hours ago, rickca said:

A small batch of the 200W LPSU use Rubycon due to long lead time of ELNA.  Their performance and spec are similar.

New batch will have ELNA.

 

 

I have never heard anything special about Rubycon yxf reagarding audio and also if the unit is heavily advertised to be using ELNA caps should it not be so? I mean it is the second statement on the product page:

 

It is also in the specs right there at the top:

 

This mean a batch can contain arbitrarily components based upon what is available at the given momement of production. If LT3045 has long lead time there might be LT3042 in an batch and so on. The way it is let known to the users is if they open the unit and check carefully.

 

[henke]

But is good that the voltage is only 25V across the caps at least. 

[LTG2010]

6 minutes ago, henke said:

But is good that the voltage is only 25V across the caps at least.

Voltage is fine - but I would send it back and get the power supply as specified or get your money back.