EtherREGEN: The long development thread. [Some Gen2 dev. pics and update starting on page 92.]

[FileMakerDev]

Hi Alex, thanks for providing so much information. As a happy customer of many of your products, I can't wait to hear the EtherRegen. I know this doesn't add a whole lot to the conversation, but I figured I'd chime in on behalf of the "lurking majority".

[_JL_]

Hi Alex,

 

Congratulations for the imminent release of the EtherRegen! Many of us have been waiting super eagerly for it.

 

I know you think external clock won't help and it might as well be the case but we want to try it anyway. So my questions are the followings:

 

1. Is the clock freq 25Mhz?

2. I'll be ordering the 50 ohm input so what kind of connector is needed? I intend to use the newclassd neutron star clock which came with a 50 ohm coaxial cable. I'll have to solder the connector to connect to the EtherRegen so would like to gather parts now.

 

Thanks!

[LowMidHigh]

46 minutes ago, _JL_ said:

Hi Alex,

 

Congratulations for the imminent release of the EtherRegen! Many of us have been waiting super eagerly for it.

 

I know you think external clock won't help and it might as well be the case but we want to try it anyway. So my questions are the followings:

 

1. Is the clock freq 25Mhz?

2. I'll be ordering the 50 ohm input so what kind of connector is needed? I intend to use the newclassd neutron star clock which came with a 50 ohm coaxial cable. I'll have to solder the connector to connect to the EtherRegen so would like to gather parts now.

 

Thanks!

 

I think Alex is off for a week. Let me share what I know:

 

1. 10HZ Ref clock  (this is well established in this thread. You can do a search).

2. BNC 50 Ohm. (As far as I know, they're distinct from their 75 Ohm brethren).

[octaviars]

59 minutes ago, _JL_ said:

I'll have to solder the connector to connect to the EtherRegen so would like to gather parts now.

 

If you are going to connect a external clock that "shoud outperform in theory" the internal clock you most certanly will have to use good quality cable with crimped (soldering is not a good way of doing BNC connections) BNC connectors so the cable and contact dont affect the 10MHz signal (this will still be hard to do as the external clock is connected single ended with a cable and BNC connectors) and the internal Crystek clock is connected as a LVDS signal on the circuitboard.

 

@Superdad wrote this on page 43 #1043

 

But ALL clock lines on the EtherREGEN are differential (LVDS), and for the parts that take SE clocks we place high-quality LVDS>SE clock buffers within a few millimeters of the chips they feed.  There are 4 on the board. 

And as mentioned before, EtherREGEN is a 6-layer board--which gives a lot of extra control over ground and power planes and impedance control.

[Cable Monkey]

10Mhz, 50 ohm is the same specification as the Teac CG-10M. One of the factors which made me interested in this over possible alternatives. It will be interesting to see what impact the clock will have on the overall experience. 

[_JL_]

@LowMidHigh: Thank you for the information!

@octaviars: Thanks for the crimping tip. I'll see if I can find the right BNC connector for this.

 

I don't know if external clock will be any better. Only one way to find out ...

[jos]

On 9/28/2019 at 2:52 PM, Cable Monkey said:

This may be the best £0.01 I ever spent! 😉

MeToo, I ordered one month ago at Audiostore, so I guess to be part of the first 20 devices as Superdad wrote before. 🙏

[Morph]

10 minutes ago, jos said:

MeToo, I ordered one month ago at Audiostore, so I guess to be part of the first 20 devices as Superdad wrote before. 🙏

Having read Superdad's post I clicked the link to Audiostore and there were five left to order, four once I'd done so. Next morning they were all gone. 

[octaviars]

21 minutes ago, Morph said:

Having read Superdad's post I clicked the link to Audiostore and there were five left to order, four once I'd done so. Next morning they were all gone. 

 

Today there is 22 "in stock" at Audiostores priority list.

 

https://www.vortexbox.co.uk/Uptone_EtherREGEN_priority_list/p317978_19934674.aspx

 

I am still a bit concerned what will happen with Brexit if that occurs at 31 of October.

[Morph]

9 minutes ago, octaviars said:

 

Today there is 22 "in stock" at Audiostores priority list.

 

https://www.vortexbox.co.uk/Uptone_EtherREGEN_priority_list/p317978_19934674.aspx

 

I am still a bit concerned what will happen with Brexit if that occurs at 31 of October.

Hmmm that’s odd. Definitely said none left the next day. Oh well we’ll just have to see how it pans out.

[octaviars]

5 minutes ago, Morph said:

Oh well we’ll just have to see how it pans out.

 

Well I made the reservation a couple of minutes ago without any problem.

[afrancois]

41 minutes ago, Morph said:

Hmmm that’s odd. Definitely said none left the next day. Oh well we’ll just have to see how it pans out.

20 units remaining before my registration and 19 after, so the counter seems to be working.

 

[Superdad]

28 minutes ago, afrancois said:

20 units remaining before my registration and 19 after, so the counter seems to be working.

 

That's good, but I am not convinced of the accuracy of that counter.  I recall Martin telling me he already had about 10 reservations--and that was weeks ago.  He is on vacation--traveling here in the USA--until mid-October, so no chance of answers until his return.

Unfortunately, the dealer allotments from the first production run are fixed at the numbers I gave: 20 for AudioStore/Vortebox UK, 60 for AfterDark. in Hong Kong.

They can both take reservations beyond those, but delivery would be from the second run--which we are going to work hard towards being shippable by early-December. (There is quite a lot of work and coordination that must occur to pull this all off, but I am very optimistic.) 

[afrancois]

14 minutes ago, Superdad said:

 

That's good, but I am not convinced of the accuracy of that counter.  I recall Martin telling me he already had about 10 reservations--and that was weeks ago.  He is on vacation--traveling here in the USA--until mid-October, so no chance of answers until his return.

Unfortunately, the dealer allotments from the first production run are fixed at the numbers I gave: 20 for AudioStore/Vortebox UK, 60 for AfterDark. in Hong Kong.

They can both take reservations beyond those, but delivery would be from the second run--which we are going to work hard towards being shippable by early-December. (There is quite a lot of work and coordination that must occur to pull this all off, but I am very optimistic.) 

No problem, second run is also good for me 🙂 I've gone to great lengths improving my network, so I'm quite curious to hear whether the EtherREGEN will still be able to improve things.

[Foggie]

This may have been asked already so apologies in advance, but just a general question - the ER is fixed at 100MB speed I believe (as opposed to 1GB or greater), is there any situation where this may pose a problem down the road?  I understand 100MB provides plenty of bandwidth, and I can't think of anything really, just curious.

[Confused]

1 hour ago, Superdad said:

 

That's good, but I am not convinced of the accuracy of that counter.  I recall Martin telling me he already had about 10 reservations--and that was weeks ago.  He is on vacation--traveling here in the USA--until mid-October, so no chance of answers until his return.

Unfortunately, the dealer allotments from the first production run are fixed at the numbers I gave: 20 for AudioStore/Vortebox UK, 60 for AfterDark. in Hong Kong.

They can both take reservations beyond those, but delivery would be from the second run--which we are going to work hard towards being shippable by early-December. (There is quite a lot of work and coordination that must occur to pull this all off, but I am very optimistic.) 

I checked on Saturday morning and the AudioStore counter was at zero, I checked again, it was at 25.  So it looks like it runs to zero then recounts from 25.  This begs a question, how many units will be in the second batch sent to AudioStore?  They might have more preorders than you think!

[Superdad]

15 minutes ago, Foggie said:

....the ER is fixed at 100MB speed I believe (as opposed to 1GB or greater), is there any situation where this may pose a problem down the road?

 

The EtherREGEN’s 4 ‘A’-side copper ports and its SFP port are all Gigabit.  It is the ‘B’-side port—on the other side of the differentially isolated/reclocked moat—which is 100Mbps only.  

 

Even stereo DSD512 uses only about half that bandwidth.  Maybe if you were attempting 8 channels at very high rates might you run into an issue.  

[Superdad]

2 minutes ago, Confused said:

I checked on Saturday morning and the AudioStore counter was a zero, I checked again, it was at 25.  So it looks like it runs to zero then recounts from 25.  This begs a question, how many units will be in the second batch sent to AudioStore?  They might have more preorders than you think!

Yikes!  That’s sort of funny and a bit funky. But as indicated, we will crank into the second run as quickly as possible.  You have all waited this long, a few extra weeks should not be a big deal.  

 

We promise it will be worth it!

[Confused]

1 minute ago, Superdad said:

Yikes!  That’s sort of funny and a bit funky. But as indicated, we will crank into the second run as quickly as possible.  You have all waited this long, a few extra weeks should not be a big deal.  

 

We promise it will be worth it!

If it’s under my Christmas tree this year I’ll be more than happy! 😊 

[Superdad]

7 minutes ago, Confused said:

If it’s under my Christmas tree this year I’ll be more than happy! 😊 

It will sound better under your audio rack than under your tree. 

[Celts88]

1 hour ago, Superdad said:

It will sound better under your audio rack than under your tree. 

😂👍

[Superdad]

Been writing stuff for the web page this weekend, but took a break to take a few snap shots of the board--with heatsinks positioned.  Here's one that is not too bad.

[Nenon]

9 hours ago, Superdad said:

Even stereo DSD512 uses only about half that bandwidth.  Maybe if you were attempting 8 channels at very high rates might you run into an issue.  

 

Those of us who use Euphony and cache the track before playing would have to wait hefty 2+ minutes before a DSD512 track is downloaded at 100 Mbps. But we would still buy an ER. I keep trying to make that point, but it keeps getting ignored with comments about streaming. Streaming and caching are two completely different strategies, and so far caching has sounded best to my ears (unless it's analog). 

[Jud]

29 minutes ago, Nenon said:

 

Those of us who use Euphony and cache the track before playing would have to wait hefty 2+ minutes before a DSD512 track is downloaded at 100 Mbps. But we would still buy an ER. I keep trying to make that point, but it keeps getting ignored with comments about streaming. Streaming and caching are two completely different strategies, and so far caching has sounded best to my ears (unless it's analog). 

 

Depending on the OS, there are players that cache the upsampled result before playing that don't require waiting. Audirvana does this up to DSD512 on Windows and DSD256 on MacOS. Just an FYI.

[Bernstein]

On 9/29/2019 at 6:28 PM, Superdad said:

Been writing stuff for the web page this weekend, but took a break to take a few snap shots of the board--with heatsinks positioned.

 

Will the heat sink touch the case for heat transfer?