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Article: dCS Rossini DAC Review


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I'm with Chris on his approach -- lights out and listen.  Don't let other senses (especially visual) get in the way of the music and how it overtakes you.  And like partaking of a fine wine, it's about the moment, a sensual snapshot in time.  His reviews are that way, and unlike many others, not predicated on some scale or comparison with other components, but more about how the current experience moves him.  

 

Each of us has our own "tastes" in musical experience and listen for often very different things.  Some for soundstage, some dynamics, some purity and articulation, etc.  And it would appear that our choice of speakers often is the most revealing in what turns us on, as it is often the most colored component (apart from the room itself).  

 

I've got three different systems of varied components and value propositions and in varied "environments".  There's the downstairs "reaching for the stars" system, the "hand-me-down" home theater (bits and pieces of prior systems), and desktop iMac/3-way speaker/DAC-receiver type.  All driven by Roon on the network.  I enjoy each, though they clearly present a different musical experience.  

 

I liken reviewers I return to again and again, like Chris, to those in film and music and the other arts.  Over time, if I find a high level of congruency with one based on my own personal experience, they gain my trust.  However the caveat, as others have said here, is that these are just components in systems, so its always best to bring one home for a try-and-buy in your own environment.

Steve Schaffer

Grimm MU1 / dCS Vivaldi Upsampler - APEX DAC - Clock / Spectral DMC-30SV preamp / Spectral Anniversary monoblocks / Wilson Audio Alexia V /  Wilson Lōkē subs / Shunyata Everest / Shunyata Omega interconnects, power cables, Ethernet / Shunyata Altaira / Uptone EtherREGEN switch / Cybershaft OP21A-D / Uptone JS2 LPS / HRS racks - Vortex footers - damping plates

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3 hours ago, BMCG said:

Might want to update on the dCS experience...

 

having owned Delius/Elgar/Scarlatti and now the Vivaldi DACs......musicality has been a distinct gain through those generations....

 

I would not slam the Scarlatti ...but it is valid to point out that its hardware design is now a decade in the rear view.....

 

 

I think Vivaldi is the same dCS sound but with more refinement to scarlatti.

they will not change the basic

 

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2 hours ago, Priaptor said:

I will just add to some of the comments here.  I have a very "high end" DAC a direct competitor to the dCS Vivaldi big stack.  I have had people to my listening room (which by the way is now burning in the amazing new Gobel Epoque Aeon Fine speakers that have replaced the older Gobel Fine as a friend of mine has become the North American Distributor for these) who own the full stack Vivaldi and have walked away saying they love my system BUT they like their Vivaldi better.  I ignore these comments.  Not because I have my "audiophile head" up my rear end or feel I have to defend my choice but because these kind of comments are absurd.

 

Why absurd?  First you can't do a flyby analysis of what you heard on a system that has no semblance to yours.  Second, unless you actually live with a component you have no idea what that component is all about.  Third when you hear something you are hearing the system and not an individual component.  Lastly, ownership bias, for most, takes center stage.  Personally, my philosophy is as DiNiro said in the movie Heat, "never get attached to something you can't walk away from in 30 seconds" and that is how I view audio.  I was a strict believer in tubes with my NOLA Concert Grand Golds and lo and behold, I decided to try some of the latest solid state stuff and was blown away and now have the CH Precision M1 in my system.  However, this evaluation of mine was after LIVING with the piece in my system.  

 

So I think the generalizations about the dCS being made on this thread by some, in this case the Rossini are a little absurd.  dCS makes amazing stuff and one shouldn't get caught up in the dogmatic flyby evaluation as compared to Chris who in his review has actually lived with the unit within his system for awhile.  

 

I have no tendecy to convince you or other guys that dCS is bad. 

Please let me describe my view about scoring audio equipments.

I listen to dcs dac and audio note dac in two systems :

1. Kharma

2. Living voice

I will find more contrast by Audio Note . It means if you play Audio note then you will hear more difference between two speakets.

dCS mask low level dynamics and cause less contrast.

 

i think some audiophiles can detect sound signature of equipments and i believe it is possible to score dCS with no relation to complete system.

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1 hour ago, rando said:

What might be absurd is 90% of what you wrote justifying the other 10%.  I don't need to live with a friend's wife to know her cooking is better than I get at home.  It might, and probably does, get better the more one experiences it.  Doesn't absolve that first bite  of merit.  (I get both sides married well outside this analogy.)

 

This of course assumes taste.  Which I won't go so far as to comment on the surplus or starvation ranks of those possessing it attendant to this discussion.  x-D

I think your comparison of living with another wife to determine the merits of her cooking to that of a “component” in a stereo system is 100% utterly absurd as compared to your determination that my comments being 90% absurd. 

 

So if my comment is so absurd to you please explain how, unless you possess some uncanny ability beyond all others, you could possibly evaluate a “component” in a system that you #1 don’t own and are unfamiliar with and #2 haven’t lived with to understand that “component” in your own system instead of some foreign system. Additionally when you are doing your evaluation it’s not even in the same room or setup as you might have heard among different systems. 

 

The 100% absurd thing is your failure to understand ALL the different variables that are likely different among the different systems you are evaluating when trying to make a drive by analysis of just one component. 

 

 

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36 minutes ago, Priaptor said:

Give me a break. 

 

Good for your opinion and live with it but to think that your speakers are necessary because of sensitivity or some other factors to be able to determine the audio buzzwords of “micro dynamics” or level dynamics makes no sense. Or to think you can evaluate a “component” in a system you are clueless about is nonsense. 

 

I dont own dCS, but have heard it in enough systems I am familiar with to know they make fantastic equipment. 

 

Chris’s system, while I haven’t heard or experienced his setup is more than capable of hearing the sound signature and capabilities of the dCS and he had many references of which to compare. 

 

Maybe be the reason the dCS didn’t move you is because the system and setup you heard it with sucked??

 

like I said, I own the competitor to the Vivaldi stack and have no dog in this fight other than to put the drive by “reviews” into perspective which in my opinion has little if any legitimacy 

I have heard dCS over 100 times in tehran in good condition.

i just recommend you to test dCS in two system and the result is yours.

i know so many audiophiles think dCS is perfect and i have no problem , i just recommend you to hear dCS in those system 

.

excuse me for long discussion

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2 hours ago, rando said:

What might be absurd is 90% of what you wrote justifying the other 10%.  I don't need to live with a friend's wife to know her cooking is better than I get at home.  It might, and probably does, get better the more one experiences it.  Doesn't absolve that first bite  of merit.  (I get both sides married well outside this analogy.)

 

This of course assumes taste.  Which I won't go so far as to comment on the surplus or starvation ranks of those possessing it attendant to this discussion.  x-D

It depends... The point is in most cases the changes are subtle and I find it the same as Priaptor: I need to listen to the piece in my system for a little time to understand what it is all about. And at that I might not even be able to give you a concrete reason why I do or don't like it as in what gets said in reviews.

NUC10i7 + Roon ROCK > dCS Rossini APEX DAC + dCS Rossini Master Clock 

SME 20/3 + SME V + Dynavector XV-1s or ANUK IO Gold > vdH The Grail or Kondo KSL-SFz + ANK L3 Phono 

Audio Note Kondo Ongaku > Avantgarde Duo Mezzo

Signal cables: Kondo Silver, Crystal Cable phono

Power cables: Kondo, Shunyata, van den Hul

system pics

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1 hour ago, amir57bs said:

dCS mask low level dynamics and cause less contrast.

Could it be that the Audio Note is a NOS DAC and as such is creating a tremendous amount of images making it sound better in systems that deal better with this kind of noise?

NUC10i7 + Roon ROCK > dCS Rossini APEX DAC + dCS Rossini Master Clock 

SME 20/3 + SME V + Dynavector XV-1s or ANUK IO Gold > vdH The Grail or Kondo KSL-SFz + ANK L3 Phono 

Audio Note Kondo Ongaku > Avantgarde Duo Mezzo

Signal cables: Kondo Silver, Crystal Cable phono

Power cables: Kondo, Shunyata, van den Hul

system pics

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1 hour ago, Priaptor said:

like I said, I own the competitor to the Vivaldi stack and have no dog in this fight other than to put the drive by “reviews” into perspective which in my opinion has little if any legitimacy 

And what is that? MSB?

NUC10i7 + Roon ROCK > dCS Rossini APEX DAC + dCS Rossini Master Clock 

SME 20/3 + SME V + Dynavector XV-1s or ANUK IO Gold > vdH The Grail or Kondo KSL-SFz + ANK L3 Phono 

Audio Note Kondo Ongaku > Avantgarde Duo Mezzo

Signal cables: Kondo Silver, Crystal Cable phono

Power cables: Kondo, Shunyata, van den Hul

system pics

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1 hour ago, Priaptor said:

I think your comparison of living with another wife to determine the merits of her cooking to that of a “component” in a stereo system is 100% utterly absurd as compared to your determination that my comments being 90% absurd. 

 

So if my comment is so absurd to you please explain how, unless you possess some uncanny ability beyond all others, you could possibly evaluate a “component” in a system that you #1 don’t own and are unfamiliar with and #2 haven’t lived with to understand that “component” in your own system instead of some foreign system. Additionally when you are doing your evaluation it’s not even in the same room or setup as you might have heard among different systems. 

 

The 100% absurd thing is your failure to understand ALL the different variables that are likely different among the different systems you are evaluating when trying to make a drive by analysis of just one component. 

 

 

 

Say I go to multiple symphonic concerts in multiple venues multiple times a month.  Lovely performances all, yet somehow I make use of what mental capacity I've been graced with and experience as a listener to overrule emotion.  To make a solid considered decision whether that performance I just walked out of was, despite the brief time I spent taking it in, absolutely spectacular or just one of many at a high level.

 

I think you see where I'm going with this and should consider expelling whatever bad air you think my previous post injected.  Fair enough?

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2 minutes ago, miguelito said:

And what is that? MSB?

Yes the Select II. 

 

I happen to love it. I will be the first one to critique my buying habits. The main reason I purchased it was because the V I had was a end of line product and MSB gave a great upgrade path (great in this case is relative). 

 

I happen to really like every MSB product I have ever had in my system including the Analog I got to audition, the IV plus I owned and upgraded to the V and now the Select II which is the best I have ever had in my system. 

 

One of the other nice nice things about my upgrade to the Select II was my ability to get rid of my Ref10 preamp as the pre stage on the Select II is that good. I was very skeptical before I took delivery but it didn’t take long to see direct to amp bypassing any preamp was superior to my ref10. 

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Gee, the description of Bobby D's "Freewheelin'" makes the digital version appear to sound better than the original, hell better than sitting in the room and hearing it live.  Better than CD, better than vinyl.  

 

I guess $25K and half a dozen filters are worth somethin'.

In any dispute the intensity of feeling is inversely proportional to the value of the issues at stake ~ Sayre's Law

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@Priaptor In recent weeks Chris has expressed in very explicit terms examples of how to bring forth a set of thoughts into a conversation.  A means to examine a grain slightly higher or lower than one running in the same direction being given a higher level of attention.  Very few here have the level of equipment DCS represents in the currently available market.  I for one have never heard the DCS system.

 

Absurdity may not have been a good choice to lift and extend upon.  Brought about with greater care, the idea I hoped to convey should have been democratizing.    Looking further afield after reaching a great height in one place can bring forth new directions to improve upon whence returning.  What I feel underpinned this review was intimacy with a wide range of other equipment.  Time and access to other systems of this level simply do not approach the level of ease finding live music in a large city does.  This is a fact of life not likely to be overcome by imperfect analogies.

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2 hours ago, Priaptor said:

One of the other nice nice things about my upgrade to the Select II was my ability to get rid of my Ref10 preamp as the pre stage on the Select II is that good.

Interestingly, this is one of the features I actually ended up loving in the Rossini: The volume control.

 

My Kondo Ongaku does not have a remote, so volume adjustment - I find it critical to listen at the right volume - was a pain. What I do now is set the range of volume in Roon between -15dB and 0dB, set a moderately high volume on Ongaku, and then I can fine tune right from my iPad. It is absolutely great. And works with MQA as well since it is done after rendering. 

NUC10i7 + Roon ROCK > dCS Rossini APEX DAC + dCS Rossini Master Clock 

SME 20/3 + SME V + Dynavector XV-1s or ANUK IO Gold > vdH The Grail or Kondo KSL-SFz + ANK L3 Phono 

Audio Note Kondo Ongaku > Avantgarde Duo Mezzo

Signal cables: Kondo Silver, Crystal Cable phono

Power cables: Kondo, Shunyata, van den Hul

system pics

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2 hours ago, rando said:

Say I go to multiple symphonic concerts in multiple venues multiple times a month.  Lovely performances all, yet somehow I make use of what mental capacity I've been graced with and experience as a listener to overrule emotion.  To make a solid considered decision whether that performance I just walked out of was, despite the brief time I spent taking it in, absolutely spectacular or just one of many at a high level.

 

I think you see where I'm going with this and should consider expelling whatever bad air you think my previous post injected.  Fair enough?

Sort of side comment... I've been to a lot of concerts/jazz venues where, frankly, the sound was subpar, and in many cases the sound has been more involving at home than at the venues! But it is truly a different experience...

NUC10i7 + Roon ROCK > dCS Rossini APEX DAC + dCS Rossini Master Clock 

SME 20/3 + SME V + Dynavector XV-1s or ANUK IO Gold > vdH The Grail or Kondo KSL-SFz + ANK L3 Phono 

Audio Note Kondo Ongaku > Avantgarde Duo Mezzo

Signal cables: Kondo Silver, Crystal Cable phono

Power cables: Kondo, Shunyata, van den Hul

system pics

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1 hour ago, NOMBEDES said:

Gee, the description of Bobby D's "Freewheelin'" makes the digital version appear to sound better than the original, hell better than sitting in the room and hearing it live.  Better than CD, better than vinyl.  

 

I guess $25K and half a dozen filters are worth somethin'.

No idea... But I can tell you the DSD download is mesmerizing... And way better than the CD (it is a remaster).

NUC10i7 + Roon ROCK > dCS Rossini APEX DAC + dCS Rossini Master Clock 

SME 20/3 + SME V + Dynavector XV-1s or ANUK IO Gold > vdH The Grail or Kondo KSL-SFz + ANK L3 Phono 

Audio Note Kondo Ongaku > Avantgarde Duo Mezzo

Signal cables: Kondo Silver, Crystal Cable phono

Power cables: Kondo, Shunyata, van den Hul

system pics

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11 minutes ago, miguelito said:

Interestingly, this is one of the features I actually ended up loving in the Rossini: The volume control.

 

My Kondo Ongaku does not have a remote, so volume adjustment - I find it critical to listen at the right volume - was a pain. What I do now is set the range of volume in Roon between -15dB and 0dB, set a moderately high volume on Ongaku, and then I can fine tune right from my iPad. It is absolutely great. And works with MQA as well since it is done after rendering. 

The MSB has a wonderful pre stage and one of the nice things about the CH Precision M1 amp is that it has adjustable gain remotely so too can get optimal output. 

 

Pertaining to your comment about live concerts I couldn’t agree more. I have been to some horrible sounding venues despite the performers being amazing. 

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4 minutes ago, Ron Scubadiver said:

$24k?  There has got to be something which works as well for about 10% of what it costs.  

There are plenty of things that work well for 10% the cost. The same can be said about just about everything and hence why I think we should stick to the merits of the product under review. 

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Since Chris mentioned the use of music as soothing, I will tell you guys a little story.

 

In May 1998 I was a student and went to Tokyo for a few weeks to assist in a high energy physics experiment. I was on IRC's audio groups and I had interacted with Jonathan Carr, of Lyra Cartridges fame. I told him I was coming and he invited me to a listening session at his apartment.

 

I arrived to his apartment on Saturday after lunch. His business partner was there, can't remember his name, a dutch fella or something. He had a few beauties... The turntable was what I seem to recall was a brand that now escapes me, fairly nice but not something off the charts. His Connosieur preamp, fully opened, was the phono stage and volume control. Amp was solid state but do not recall either. He also has a prototype Sony SACD player, a massive beast, which was opened up. We only listened to records.

 

When I arrived, I was actually sick. I had picked up a cold and was not feeling great. After 4-5 hours of listening to records, and having some of his capuccinno (sp?) I felt like a new man! Amazing. We went out for dinner to some restaurant at like 9-10pm. It was absolutely amazing. And absolutely gracious for Jon to do that to a poor student who could not possibly afford any of hist stuff...  

NUC10i7 + Roon ROCK > dCS Rossini APEX DAC + dCS Rossini Master Clock 

SME 20/3 + SME V + Dynavector XV-1s or ANUK IO Gold > vdH The Grail or Kondo KSL-SFz + ANK L3 Phono 

Audio Note Kondo Ongaku > Avantgarde Duo Mezzo

Signal cables: Kondo Silver, Crystal Cable phono

Power cables: Kondo, Shunyata, van den Hul

system pics

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9 minutes ago, Priaptor said:

There are plenty of things that work well for 10% the cost. The same can be said about just about everything and hence why I think we should stick to the merits of the product under review. 

You are free to spend $24k on a DAC.  I easily spend more than that each year on things you would consider to be frivolous.   Not too many of us can discuss the merits of a product we don't have access to.

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1 minute ago, Ron Scubadiver said:

You are free to spend $24k on a DAC.  I easily spend more than that each year on things you would consider to be frivolous.   Not too many of us can discuss the merits of a product we don't have access to.

Ok, so do you suggest not discussing them at all?

 

And to be honest, to make a $24k DAC be in the right system, you're going to have to be talking about $100k+ system at the minimum in my opinion (unless it is a headphone setup).

NUC10i7 + Roon ROCK > dCS Rossini APEX DAC + dCS Rossini Master Clock 

SME 20/3 + SME V + Dynavector XV-1s or ANUK IO Gold > vdH The Grail or Kondo KSL-SFz + ANK L3 Phono 

Audio Note Kondo Ongaku > Avantgarde Duo Mezzo

Signal cables: Kondo Silver, Crystal Cable phono

Power cables: Kondo, Shunyata, van den Hul

system pics

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